All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3

Nepia

@Rancid-Schnitzel said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

@nzzp said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

@Rancid-Schnitzel said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

@Rapido said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

@Rancid-Schnitzel said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

Should maybe make this a separate poll, but who do people prefer/feel less terrified about at 15? The giraffe (Jordie) or Bastian Schweinsteiger (DMac)?

I'm thinking Giraffe because of his ability under the high ball. But Schweini is a better kicker.

I think I'd prefer to be having this conversation next year or in 2 years but it has been thrust upon us now.

I'm very interested to see how Jordie goes, had a nagging doubt about the ages of B Smith and Dagg looking ahead to 2019. Unexpected bonus to get this opportunity, although I'd prefer Ben to go through to 2019.

Capping a 20 year old is always a risk, particularly when he's only in his first season of Super rugby and not playing in his strongest position. Oh yeah, and its the deciding test against the Lions.

http://stats.espnscrum.com/scrum/rugby/records/player/youngest_appearance.html?id=8;type=team

19 and 20 year olds capped in the professional era listed below. A bloody good list - only Zac stands out as not having a decent impact at the professional level.

19:
Lomu
Reiko Ioane
Toeava
20:
Rokocoko
Jeff Wilson
Cullen
Jordie Barrett
Sam Cane
Jerry Collins
Zac Guildford
Richie McCaw
Aaron Mauger

Those are some damn good players, but bit of a mixed bag in terms of initial returns. Lets hope Jordie does a Cully. Fark that would be good.

Not really a mixed bag, most are an unqualified success, Toeava and Guildford had some decent tests and alongside them I'd say only Mauger failed to fulfil his potential - he was outstanding as a 20/21 year old but never truly dominated after that.

Canerbry

@Nepia Rancid bait.

nzzp

@Nepia said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

Not really a mixed bag, 90n% unqualified success,

Kind of my point I guess- everyone who has been picked young has been there for good reason. You can't see Shag and the boys picking on a hope - he must be delivering at trainings to do this.

Still a massive thing to start in the intensity of a deciding Lions test. This selection panel is brave, they are not conservative, and it pays off in the long run.

Nepia

@Canerbry said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

@Nepia Rancid bait.

Nope, Mauger should have been up with the Cullens, Wilsons etc after his first year yet he's only remembered as a good AB at best (outside of your province).

Bovidae

@Rancid-Schnitzel said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

Lets hope Jordie does a Cully. Fark that would be good.

I was at Cullen's debut test in Napier and will be at Eden Park.

That has to be a good omen, right? :fingers_crossed:

Bovidae

@Nepia Don't forget that Mauger carried Umaga.

Rancid Schnitzel

@Nepia said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

@Rancid-Schnitzel said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

@nzzp said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

@Rancid-Schnitzel said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

@Rapido said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

@Rancid-Schnitzel said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

Should maybe make this a separate poll, but who do people prefer/feel less terrified about at 15? The giraffe (Jordie) or Bastian Schweinsteiger (DMac)?

I'm thinking Giraffe because of his ability under the high ball. But Schweini is a better kicker.

I think I'd prefer to be having this conversation next year or in 2 years but it has been thrust upon us now.

I'm very interested to see how Jordie goes, had a nagging doubt about the ages of B Smith and Dagg looking ahead to 2019. Unexpected bonus to get this opportunity, although I'd prefer Ben to go through to 2019.

Capping a 20 year old is always a risk, particularly when he's only in his first season of Super rugby and not playing in his strongest position. Oh yeah, and its the deciding test against the Lions.

http://stats.espnscrum.com/scrum/rugby/records/player/youngest_appearance.html?id=8;type=team

19 and 20 year olds capped in the professional era listed below. A bloody good list - only Zac stands out as not having a decent impact at the professional level.

19:
Lomu
Reiko Ioane
Toeava
20:
Rokocoko
Jeff Wilson
Cullen
Jordie Barrett
Sam Cane
Jerry Collins
Zac Guildford
Richie McCaw
Aaron Mauger

Those are some damn good players, but bit of a mixed bag in terms of initial returns. Lets hope Jordie does a Cully. Fark that would be good.

Not really a mixed bag, 90n% unqualified success, Toeava and Guildford had some decent tests and alongside them I'd say only Mauger failed to fulfil his potential - he was outstanding as a 20/21 year old but never truly dominated after that.

I meant initial returns. Some were dropped pretty early, including Lomu, Wilson and now Ioane (was he really ill?). Jerry broke his leg. Cane, Guildford and Ice were projects. The ones who really smashed it from the start and kept on going are God, Joe Rok and Cullen. As you mentioned, Mauger was ridiculously good early on, but unfortunately never really excelled long term.

mariner4life

@Canerbry said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

@Nepia Rancid bait.

He's right. When i first saw him in black i thought he would go on to be a great. But he never really kicked on, and wasn't even first choice by the end. Sort of blends in to the plethora of no more than decent 12s between Little and the good Nonu

Probably suffers from such high expectations, and good early form.

kiwiinmelb

@nzzp said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

@Canerbry said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

@nzzp you'd rate Toeava's "impact" over Guidford?

At the professional level, every day of the week and twice on sunday.

Toeava played 35 tests for the ABs; Guildford 11.

Guildford's self destructed. We still miss Isiah. He was a hell of a player, with untapped potential

I wonder if Davidav still reads this forum , out there somewhere ?

booboo

@Canerbry said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

@nzzp you'd rate Toeava's "impact" over Guidford?

I would

Nepia

@booboo said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

@Canerbry said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

@nzzp you'd rate Toeava's "impact" over Guidford?

I would

As would I, and Guildford's a Magpie, although sullied by the fact he also played for the Crusaders and Tahs ... in fact we can probably disregard my thoughts in that case.

JC

What the actual fuck are you guys wittering on about? George Nepia is on that list. George Fucking Nepia, and you're talking about Zac Guildford? I don't want to live anymore...

kiwiinmelb

@Bovidae said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

@Nepia Don't forget that Mauger carried Umaga.

I actually think they complimented each other pretty well , each sort of provided what the other lacked ,

And funny enough , when Umaga retired , Mauger seem to slide out of favor ,

Probably form as well but he didnt seem as appealing when paired with Conrad or Mils as he did with Tana IMO .

ACT Crusader

@JC not even a list with Nepia on it can stop a bit of Cantab bashing

ACT Crusader

@kiwiinmelb said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

@Bovidae said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

@Nepia Don't forget that Mauger carried Umaga.

I actually think they complimented each other pretty well , each sort of provided what the other lacked ,

And funny enough , when Umaga retired , Mauger seem to slide out of favor ,

Probably form as well but he didnt seem as appealing when paired with Conrad or Mils as he did with Tana IMO .

It was an interesting time when Henry came in. Mauger had a knee injury and that first series Henry went with Carter and Umaga.

Henry tried a heap of different midfield combinations from 2004-2007. Some of the ones I recall are:

Carter/Umaga
Tuitupo/Umaga
Mauger/Umaga
Umaga/Smith
Mauger/Smith
Umaga/Nonu
Mauger/Nonu
Mauger/Gear
Luke/Smith
Luke/Nonu
Luke/Mils
Mauger/Luke
Mauger/Toeava
Luke/Toeava
Nonu/Smith

Kruse

Norway's estimated rainfall for Saturday has been decreasing day-by-day, and they're now predicting ZERO mm all day.
Metservice still reckons rain though.

mooshld

An I the only one who thinks we will pump them?

We did in the first test, and then if not for a dodgy penalty, and a try with more obstruction then an Enron lawyer we nearly beat them with 14.

I feel more confident for this match then most others it seems.

canefan

@mooshld said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

An I the only one who thinks we will pump them?

We did in the first test, and then if not for a dodgy penalty, and a try with more obstruction then an Enron lawyer we nearly beat them with 14.

I feel more confident for this match then most others it seems.

SSSHHHHH!!!! We don't want to appear arrogant....

Kruse

@mooshld said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:

An I the only one who thinks we will pump them?

We did in the first test, and then if not for a dodgy penalty, and a try with more obstruction then an Enron lawyer we nearly beat them with 14.

I feel more confident for this match then most others it seems.

I'm having wild mood swings between arrogant "yep, we'll pump them", and "fuck I'm worried, and if we lose I'm leaving town". Zero middle ground.

Bones

I'm worried about JB on defence and that midfield could be shaky, ALB has been out of sorts and somewhat sluggish on defence and Laumape is green. Not ideal against a side which has been finding space. Excited to see how they go though.

The Silver Fern

All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3