All Blacks v Pumas
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@Rocky-Rockbottom said in All Blacks v Pumas:
Justin Fucking Marshall shrieking at us like his frosted tips have just caught fire and melted down into his tiny fucken brain.
I just belly laughed at this. Cheers.
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Barely heard SBWs name. What a difference when Lima came on, the back line seemed to settle, and his goalkicking was excellent.
Didn't like the look of Moody's injury.
Happy with the win, but going to be next level at Albany. The Boks will have the back line the Argies don't.@Mokey said in All Blacks v Pumas:
Barely heard SBWs name. What a difference when Lima came on, the back line seemed to settle, and his goalkicking was excellent.
Didn't like the look of Moody's injury.
Happy with the win, but going to be next level at Albany. The Boks will have the back line the Argies don't.Agree with most if that Mokes but even if SBW was quiet I thought he was solid
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Three problems tonight:
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Our kicking game was poor. Argentina regathered too many kicks (4 in the first ten minutes of the half against McKenzie). I think McKenzie is probably too small to be a 15 but I would like to be wrong about that. Barrett also missed kicks at goal and some of his chip kicks were poorly timed.
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We got muscled at the ruck. I think Romano is just a class below our other locks (including Scott Barrett). Ardie Savea is an interesting case. I should point out that he did make 14 tackles which was the most of any player in the game and he only played 43 minutes. I don't think I have seen a player get through that much defensive work in such a short space of time. Fifita was great but I'm still not convinced by him. We all knew he was a good ball runner - it's the other aspects of his game where he needs to put in the work.
3). We made too many mistakes. Some of the passes were poor but we did put the Argies under a lot of pressure.
The Positives:
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We were terrific with ball in hand when we kept the ball. Argentina missed a third of their tackles and we ran three times as many metres.
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Our set piece was fantastic. We lost one lineout (which turned out to be critical) but won the rest. Ofa came on and scrummed very well which is pleasing given we have a few injury problems.
@hydro11 said in All Blacks v Pumas:
Three problems tonight:
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Our kicking game was poor. Argentina regathered too many kicks (4 in the first ten minutes of the half against McKenzie). I think McKenzie is probably too small to be a 15 but I would like to be wrong about that. Barrett also missed kicks at goal and some of his chip kicks were poorly timed.
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We got muscled at the ruck. I think Romano is just a class below our other locks (including Scott Barrett). Ardie Savea is an interesting case. I should point out that he did make 14 tackles which was the most of any player in the game and he only played 43 minutes. I don't think I have seen a player get through that much defensive work in such a short space of time. Fifita was great but I'm still not convinced by him. We all knew he was a good ball runner - it's the other aspects of his game where he needs to put in the work.
3). We made too many mistakes. Some of the passes were poor but we did put the Argies under a lot of pressure.
The Positives:
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We were terrific with ball in hand when we kept the ball. Argentina missed a third of their tackles and we ran three times as many metres.
-
Our set piece was fantastic. We lost one lineout (which turned out to be critical) but won the rest. Ofa came on and scrummed very well which is pleasing given we have a few injury problems.
If I can add a negative for us/positive for them: their aork at the breakdown was awesome especially Creevy
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@hydro11 said in All Blacks v Pumas:
Three problems tonight:
-
Our kicking game was poor. Argentina regathered too many kicks (4 in the first ten minutes of the half against McKenzie). I think McKenzie is probably too small to be a 15 but I would like to be wrong about that. Barrett also missed kicks at goal and some of his chip kicks were poorly timed.
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We got muscled at the ruck. I think Romano is just a class below our other locks (including Scott Barrett). Ardie Savea is an interesting case. I should point out that he did make 14 tackles which was the most of any player in the game and he only played 43 minutes. I don't think I have seen a player get through that much defensive work in such a short space of time. Fifita was great but I'm still not convinced by him. We all knew he was a good ball runner - it's the other aspects of his game where he needs to put in the work.
3). We made too many mistakes. Some of the passes were poor but we did put the Argies under a lot of pressure.
The Positives:
-
We were terrific with ball in hand when we kept the ball. Argentina missed a third of their tackles and we ran three times as many metres.
-
Our set piece was fantastic. We lost one lineout (which turned out to be critical) but won the rest. Ofa came on and scrummed very well which is pleasing given we have a few injury problems.
If I can add a negative for us/positive for them: their aork at the breakdown was awesome especially Creevy
@booboo said in All Blacks v Pumas:
@hydro11 said in All Blacks v Pumas:
Three problems tonight:
-
Our kicking game was poor. Argentina regathered too many kicks (4 in the first ten minutes of the half against McKenzie). I think McKenzie is probably too small to be a 15 but I would like to be wrong about that. Barrett also missed kicks at goal and some of his chip kicks were poorly timed.
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We got muscled at the ruck. I think Romano is just a class below our other locks (including Scott Barrett). Ardie Savea is an interesting case. I should point out that he did make 14 tackles which was the most of any player in the game and he only played 43 minutes. I don't think I have seen a player get through that much defensive work in such a short space of time. Fifita was great but I'm still not convinced by him. We all knew he was a good ball runner - it's the other aspects of his game where he needs to put in the work.
3). We made too many mistakes. Some of the passes were poor but we did put the Argies under a lot of pressure.
The Positives:
-
We were terrific with ball in hand when we kept the ball. Argentina missed a third of their tackles and we ran three times as many metres.
-
Our set piece was fantastic. We lost one lineout (which turned out to be critical) but won the rest. Ofa came on and scrummed very well which is pleasing given we have a few injury problems.
If I can add a negative for us/positive for them: their aork at the breakdown was awesome especially Creevy
... although that's effectively point 2
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All-in-all, an odd performance from the ABs.
Hansen set the ball in motion, by selecting a team that's a fair way short of the top line-up. Fair enough, he doesn't have Ben Smith or Owen Franks and apparently Kaino is away fixing his life - but, he sent a pretty clear message that he doesn't rate the Argies as a legitimate threat by also resting Sam Whitelock, Liam Squire, Aaron Smith, Ryan Crotty and Rieko Ioane - and benching Sam Cane.
From his post-match comments, it seems like Beauden's arsing about with silly little kicks in his own 22 in the early minutes were largely BB's invention and not part of the gameplan - you'd certainly hope not. Maybe the main thing he did was unsettle himself, because his goal-kicking went to the pack. He used to be a dead-eye dick goal-kicker but, on current form, you could certainly see him costing us a RWC knock-out game. People suggesting the reigning World Rugby Player of the Year should be shifted to fullback and I'm inclined to agree with them. Longer-term, maybe Jordie has to play fullback and kick the goals - Ben Smith to finish back on the wing?
More question marks over Romano, Ardie, SBW and DMac.
Winners tonight - Moody (apart from the broken arm), Fifita, Sopoaga - and a bunch of guys who didn't play.
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@Rocky-Rockbottom said in All Blacks v Pumas:
Tough getting used to this new post 2007-2015 team. Nonu and Conrad, Mccaw and ffs MCCAW. Now we’ve got these Lienert Browns and Dmacs and Ardies and the contrails of whatever it is SBW & Dagg do and they’re just not as fucken good as before. Yes, takes time, blah blah but
And, don't forget Danny-Boy Carter and those goals he kicked when we needed them.
Right now, we've got "Groin-pulled Piri" as our starting kicker!
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That was an enjoyable test, spirited opposition playing their asses off for 60 minutes again. I hope Sanchez finds those Argentinean girls in the Leopard suits later.
Just quickly:
- Don't kick it, pass it.
- Fifita is our new hashtag beastmode.
- You can spot the point every time that Dmac finally thinks "Hey! I'm an All Black! I shouldn't be running sideways!". He just looks inexperienced, not ready for this level. He's genuinely exciting but shithouse decisions and ATD, that kick off the side of the boot was substitution-level I reckon.
- Moody was amazing, arm looked bad though.
- SBW didn't stand out because he didn't fuck up so much, he did jack shit else, his place in in serious threat, back to not being able to box very well either, possibly Warriors? Food Bill.
- Read and Dagg should be the second and third choices for most people in the frustrating POM thread.
- How long do we put up Beauden's kicking before it becomes a Spencer-level problem?
- We got better when we changed halfbacks again, I don't know whether to blame Perenara or Smith or the game, TKB went well.
- I was swearing a lot at Angus Gardiner, at one stage demanded to know where he lived.
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I struggle to see how Savea got close to 14 tackles, unless they're counting missed tackles and putting your hand on a player someone else is tackling.
I decided to watch him closely in the first half and despite being ineffective at the breakdown a lot, as I already said his ability to not have to make tackles was remarkable for an openside. Was noticeable he would often be in the second wave of pressure if Argies got sent backwards and or spilled the ball in a previous phase. But not always effect that pressure more.
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Watched the game while babysitting my 2 year old granddaughter so was a bit distracted,
But is it my imagination or has our game become more error ridden ? It's starting to become habitual.
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Geez, they just replayed several of those Argies' high balls. That looked really bad for Dmac. Missed all of them. If opposition teams do their homework, expect him being targeted in every game he plays.
@Stargazer said in All Blacks v Pumas:
Geez, they just replayed several of those Argies' high balls. That looked really bad for Dmac. Missed all of them. If opposition teams do their homework, expect him being targeted in every game he plays.
I actually think on at least 2 of those other ABs who were close to the ball should have called and taken them - it was odd that the guy furtherest from the ball was coming in to take those kicks.
That was pretty much a B and a half team and they ran in lots of tries so I'm satisfied with the win.
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Pretty weird game as others have mentioned. Sort of Par for the course since the RWC though.
Lots of error, plenty of frustration but then some good bits to show what they are capable of.Fifita was my MOTM. Hopefully this is the start of him playing to his potential because IMO he hasn't even really done it at Super level yet. Couple of those runs were great to watch though.
Was nice to see Sop's come on and nail a few hard kicks. BB has got to the level where im more surprised if it goes over. Surely he needs to come up with a new technique. There must be a good kicking coach somewhere in the world that can fix it.
Agree with others SBW was pretty invisible and really doesn't help the flow of our backs. ALB has turned to shit this year too. Have lost count of the amount of times he is running around in circles or throwing basketball passes to the ground. Hopefully Crotty can find a way to not get broken every game and Laumape can keep developing. I wonder when Ngatai will get another shot.
Dmac is fast running out of opportunities IMO. He was dire tonight. He HAS to take those high balls. I haven't seen someone run across field so much since Lote Tuqiri. He might look good in big wins against minnows but he is not a player you want in a tight test on that display.
As much as im an Ardie Savea fan he just isn't offering anything at test level. Really needs to bulk up to have more impact. It's noticeable when Cane isn't on the field. Starting to thing either Todd or a 6 is better cover on the bench. Not as if our 7's are hard on the ball fetchers these days so a 6 could cover injuries to our 7 pretty well.
Not sure what the deal with the ABs is overall. Some silly rushed stuff just adding to the problems. Lineout not going too well this year and in general the plays from set piece have looked rushed and messy or just low percentage plays like Reads grubber from an attacking scrum. That lineout turnover on half time was criminal.
It will never happen but I would be tempted to give the captaincy to Sam Whitelock. Let Read concentrate on getting back to his best form.
Would also be tempted to move BB to 15 with Sopoaga starting at 10. Ioane at 11 and Dagg at 14. If Dagg is out then NMS to 14. Don't want to see Havili anywhere near the team. He must be about 5th or 6th choice FB and is still prone to throwing shitty offloads in Super rugby. -
Pretty weird game as others have mentioned. Sort of Par for the course since the RWC though.
Lots of error, plenty of frustration but then some good bits to show what they are capable of.Fifita was my MOTM. Hopefully this is the start of him playing to his potential because IMO he hasn't even really done it at Super level yet. Couple of those runs were great to watch though.
Was nice to see Sop's come on and nail a few hard kicks. BB has got to the level where im more surprised if it goes over. Surely he needs to come up with a new technique. There must be a good kicking coach somewhere in the world that can fix it.
Agree with others SBW was pretty invisible and really doesn't help the flow of our backs. ALB has turned to shit this year too. Have lost count of the amount of times he is running around in circles or throwing basketball passes to the ground. Hopefully Crotty can find a way to not get broken every game and Laumape can keep developing. I wonder when Ngatai will get another shot.
Dmac is fast running out of opportunities IMO. He was dire tonight. He HAS to take those high balls. I haven't seen someone run across field so much since Lote Tuqiri. He might look good in big wins against minnows but he is not a player you want in a tight test on that display.
As much as im an Ardie Savea fan he just isn't offering anything at test level. Really needs to bulk up to have more impact. It's noticeable when Cane isn't on the field. Starting to thing either Todd or a 6 is better cover on the bench. Not as if our 7's are hard on the ball fetchers these days so a 6 could cover injuries to our 7 pretty well.
Not sure what the deal with the ABs is overall. Some silly rushed stuff just adding to the problems. Lineout not going too well this year and in general the plays from set piece have looked rushed and messy or just low percentage plays like Reads grubber from an attacking scrum. That lineout turnover on half time was criminal.
It will never happen but I would be tempted to give the captaincy to Sam Whitelock. Let Read concentrate on getting back to his best form.
Would also be tempted to move BB to 15 with Sopoaga starting at 10. Ioane at 11 and Dagg at 14. If Dagg is out then NMS to 14. Don't want to see Havili anywhere near the team. He must be about 5th or 6th choice FB and is still prone to throwing shitty offloads in Super rugby. -
Missed game due to kids rugby breakup and am watching now. Up to 26th minute and pretty solid other than a pitiful attempted clean out by Ardie. DMacs been good so I assume things go awry very soon.
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And he goes ahead with a shitty kick under zero pressure.
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Missed 3 high balls but he shouldn't have challenged for at least 2 of them. He was too far away.
Reckon Romano has been OK. Doesn't have the engine of Whitallick (Rhitelock?) but getting the job done.
Those missed kicks by BB were ugly. They were all hard but he struck them like a bitch.
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Fifita makes multiple people on SF look like farking idiots.
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Barely heard SBWs name. What a difference when Lima came on, the back line seemed to settle, and his goalkicking was excellent.
Didn't like the look of Moody's injury.
Happy with the win, but going to be next level at Albany. The Boks will have the back line the Argies don't.@Mokey said in All Blacks v Pumas:
Barely heard SBWs name. What a difference when Lima came on, the back line seemed to settle, and his goalkicking was excellent.
Didn't like the look of Moody's injury.
Happy with the win, but going to be next level at Albany. The Boks will have the back line the Argies don't.I mentioned to my mates the other day that BB was the best player who played 10 for the ABs, but not the best 10. For me game management was much better once Lima was in the driver's seat.
Said this before, but 10-12 combo can be additive or dysfunctional.
Crudes-SBW bought out the best in both, likewise Carter-Nonu, whereas Carter-SBW and Crudes-Nonu never seemed to gel.
Likewise BB-Crotty is great for both, whereas BB-SBW seems 'clunky'. I, too, thought Lima-SBW seemed to work better.
Would be keen to see A.Smith-Lima-SBW-Crotty start against Boks, with BB at 15. Rieko at 11, with real competition for 14.
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I was impressed with Fifita's first start. Equally underwhelmed yet again with Savea at openside and McKenzie at fullback.
