6N 2018
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@antipodean said in 6N 2018:
@billy-tell said in 6N 2018:
It wasn’t a clear knock on.
Are you trying to become a TMO?
Nah you come on here saying it was a clear knock on like it’s an undisputed fact. It may have been a knock on. It may have not.
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@billy-tell said in 6N 2018:
@antipodean said in 6N 2018:
@billy-tell said in 6N 2018:
It wasn’t a clear knock on.
Are you trying to become a TMO?
Nah you come on here saying it was a clear knock on like it’s an undisputed fact. It may have been a knock on. It may have not.
I'd suggest watching it again; if you can't see it coming off Kearney's hand and moving towards England's backline, then you're well suited to being a TMO...
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Ok. I’m woke.
Are we still champions.....?
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It's understandably being heaped on Jones, but boy that laboured passing by England was devastating to them and cringe worthy to watch. Who are the skills or attack coaches?
Passes 2 feet overhead, a metre behind, at the feet. It was very rare to see any "bread baskets". They were worse than the ABs last season.
The English Lions must have been hanging on Howley's every word last summer
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@pot-hale Nope
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An interesting article on ESPN, Care's comment is what stood out to me
"We are a team that in the last couple of years hasn't had to handle losing," Care said. "It has all been quite rosy and we have got all the 50-50 decisions and bounces of the ball. That is what happens when you are riding the wave. Now we are on the other side of it. We have full confidence that we will bounce back from this."
So dominance is all down to luck. ABs are a very lucky bunch! I'm not saying there isn;t swings and roundabouts on luck/50-50/bounces/ref calls; but that is not what dominance is built on.
Jones must re-energise England before South Africa
England coach Eddie Jones is refusing to panic following his side's third successive defeat but as Sir Clive Woodward has noted his team are "staring down the barrel" as a summer tour to South Africa looms.
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@kiwiinmelb said in 6N 2018:
Fair to say Ireland are the real deal , but most knowledgeable kiwis knew that anyway , so it shouldnt be that much of a surprise .
I think England are probably the bigger story right now ....... more bark than bite ?
Hang on. No one’s mentioned knowledgeable Kiwis before. Do any of them come on here?
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@pot-hale more than sober Irishmen
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Looks like the British press are pushing for Dave Rennie as England Rugby's next saviour.
Good call. They got it right when they pushed for Martin Johnson, Stuart Lancaster, Eddie Jones....
Is there really only one Eddie Jones out there? Is there no one else with the ability to grasp this group of players and give them an edge as the Australian did the Lancaster group? The obvious name to spring to mind is Rob Baxter but perhaps a better bet would be Glasgow’s David Rennie. Formerly of the Chiefs, he has an outstanding record of success and an ability to quickly bring the best from players, something England need. An outside bet to pull together a successful short-term team is Dean Richards.
If Jones ran the RFU, he would sack himself as coach
It seems so long ago. Eddie the saviour. From the dust of England’s World Cup ruins to a phoenix-like resurrection and a grand slam. Perhaps topping it all, there was a 3-0 series win in Australia. It looked as though the northern hemisphere had a team that could live with the traditional southern p
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The press seem to be buying more and more into excusing the 6N because of the Lions tour combined with the demands of the premiership.
There's some truth in that but it isn't as big a factor as they think IMO. The sluggish play isn't due to bieng tired (Eddie reckons they were posting record fitness results) it looks like they lack sharpness because they are over coached. No ability to think for themselves either tactically or as instinct because no room has been left for thinking. -
@crucial Jones is a good coach. No one gets England to win 18 in a row simply by making them fitter, let alone getting Japan to beat South Africa if they're a bad coach.
A lot of these England players are in need of a rest. It's not the only issue, but it's certainly a contributing one. The difference in workload compared to Ireland's centrally contracted players is illuminating. Compare Farrell with Sexton since the Lions Tour for example.
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@antipodean and yet there are some sections of our media (and on here) unhappy with NZR having players in camps instead of playing super rugby, which is all about managing workload as well.
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@antipodean said in 6N 2018:
A lot of these England players are in need of a rest. It's not the only issue, but it's certainly a contributing one. The difference in workload compared to Ireland's centrally contracted players is illuminating. Compare Farrell with Sexton since the Lions Tour for example.
Are there some stats on this? I was wondering myself how the respective gametime compared between English and Irish/Welsh players post Lions tour.
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@bovidae It was a Stuff article on data driven science in Irish rugby:
The relevant paragraph I recalled was this one:
One example of that contrast is the two playmakers, Jonathan Sexton and Owen Farrell. Since the Lions tour last summer, Sexton has played just 435 minutes for Leinster. In the same time, Farrell has amassed a staggering 1,084 minutes of action for Saracens.
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@antipodean said in 6N 2018:
A lot of these England players are in need of a rest. It's not the only issue, but it's certainly a contributing one. The difference in workload compared to Ireland's centrally contracted players is illuminating. Compare Farrell with Sexton since the Lions Tour for example.
Are there some stats on this? I was wondering myself how the respective gametime compared between English and Irish/Welsh players post Lions tour.
Here’s some stats I started to compile but then lost interest. We’ve been telling English rugby this for years. In 2012 Premiership club chairmen - loudly assisted by the UK media - were complaining that Ireland were resting their players too much in advance of European games and test matches and wanted them to play more PRO12 league matches - so they changed the rules on qualification to make it ‘harder’ to qualify. IRFU just shrugged their shoulders and carried on doing their same programme - the Irish teams still continued to qualify. Six years later, with 3 PRO12 teams in the European quarters and 1 English team, and Ireland on a Grand Slam, the UK media have now discovered what the real problem might be and are enlightening everyone....
Pulleeeeeeze - as the young whippersnappers say these days.
Edit: Can’t find them, so here’s a short summary.
Irish players 300-350 minutes (PRO14) + 440 minutes (Euro Cup) + 200 minutes Nov tests + 350 minutes 6N - 1350 minutes averageEnglish players 700 minutes (Premiership) + 450 + 550 tests.
Very broad figures averaged. Sexton only played 3 European games compared to 6 for Farrell. Leinster won all their matches even with the high-profile 10, Ross Byrne, at the helm. ( I think Ross wants to have Stuart Lancaster’s babies, and will happily have Joe’s as well if he picks him for Australia).
Summary headlines:
Daily Telegraph: British sport historians after painstaking research have discovered that Irish rugby players have actually had central contracts and reduced playing time since 2004.
Irish Independent: WE FUCKEN KNOW ALREADY! JEEZ!!
Ps well they mightn’t say Jeez cos that would be blasphemy and a sin.
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Found them - incomplete but you get the gist
League games (time) + Euro games (time) + 6 N. Didn’t include Nov tests. You could probably safely assume that they played all 6 Euro games (except Itoje who was injured)English player clocks maxed at 32 games (2,560) and Irish Player clocks maxed at 25 games (2000 minutes)
Farrell 9-605 + 6(460)+ tests
Itoje 8-(572) +4 (310) + tests
Kruis 11-(815 ) + 460+ tests
Hartley 8-(513) + 400+ tests
Vunipola 10-(594) + 400+ tests
Robshaw 10- (761) + 400+ tests
Daly 6-(430) + 400+ tests
Watson 10-(793) +400 + tests
Cole 11 (741) +400 + tests
Sinckler 14 735 +400 + tests
Haskell 10 661 + 400 + tests
Ford 11 880 mn. + 5-400 + tests 300Cronin 12-(567) + 6 (307) = 874
Furlong 5-(242) + 6 (402) = 644
Healy 6-(242) + 6-(260) = 502
Henshaw 3-(240) +6-(455) = 695
Leavy 6-(330) + 4-(145) = 475
Kearney 4-(267) + 4-(243) = 510 + tests 549
McGrath 6-(312) + 6-(219) =531 + tests 218
Porter 11-(402) + 3-(42) =444 + tests 237
Ringrose 4-(264) +2-(160)= 424 + tests 160
Sexton 4-(247) + 4-(193) = 440 + tests 491
Toner 7-(525) + 6-(440) = 965 + tests 426
Earls 4-(320) + 4-(303) = 623 + tests 364
Murray 5-(373) + 6-(452) = 825 + tests 499
O’Mahony 4-(315) + 6-(447) = 762 + tests 478
Stander 5-(400) + 6-(480) = 880 + tests 538
Henderson 5-(400) + 6-(480) =880 + tests 380
Best 3-(210) + 3-(240) = 450 + tests 472
Aki 6-(463) + 5-(347) = 810 + tests 560
