Interesting reads
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@kirwan said in Interesting reads:
I was referring to actual scientific data (which if I get time later I will source) that shows that weight is a factor in health. Short version is it increases your likelihood of getting many diseases.
HuffPost is trying to justify that it’s ok to be fat. It’s not if you want to live well, and for a long time.
Nobody is saying that weight isn't a factor in health. What the article says is that is just that, a factor.
That is one part of the issue.
The other is the overwhelming failure of any and all initiatives designed to reduce the obesity rate.
Simply saying 'eat less' or 'exercise more' isn't working. And that's not just because fat people really like chocolate.
There needs to be far more nuance in the discussion than what is happening at the moment.
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@kirwan said in Interesting reads:
I don't disagree about the rest of your post.
I do. There's an unbelievable amount of information available for people to digest (snigger). It's close to a $70 billion industry in America.
It's like quitting smoking; all comes down to willpower. The only thing that helps enormously fat people is concentration camps. But they're free to eat themselves back into a sumo suit as soon as they leave no matter how much you educate them to eat in moderation.
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@antipodean many of them dont genuinely want to lose the weight, they are often only doing so because thier family want them to.
Mrs TR watches some programme with hugely overweight people (>400lb) who move to Texas to enable them to be near a clinic that will do surgery on them once they get to a certain weight.
Now they (and vast majority of others on weight loss programmes) being grossly overweight, cant work out why after a month or 2 they have lost like 10 or 20 pounds...yet when they delve into what changes they have made, they barely do anything they were told they needed to do. They think cutting out a donut or 2 will be enough.
I'm 95kg, and I could drop 5kg in a few weeks easy, yet someone well over twice my size, cant lose more than me in twice the time...
Like you say, it's like smokers, until they really want to do it, they are wasting everyones time.
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Precisely. When they're lying to you about what they eat, you know they're not serious. When they take affront to expert medical opinion, you know they're not serious.
Emily, a counselor in Eastern Washington, went to a gynecological surgeon to have an ovarian cyst removed. The physician pointed out her body fat on the MRI, then said, “Look at that skinny woman in there trying to get out.”
“I was worried I had cancer,” Emily says, “and she was turning it into a teachable moment about my weight.”Probably because obesity increases your risk of cancer:
The International Agency for Research on Cancer has determined that, based on results from epidemiological studies, people who are overweight or obese are at increased risk of developing several cancer types, including adenocarcinoma of the oesophagus, colon cancer, breast cancer (in postmenopausal women), endometrial cancer and kidney (renal-cell) cancer.
I know of a bloke who was morbidly obese. Walking short distances left him wheezing from the exertion. He decided to starve himself and the key point of difference between a fat person doing it and a skinny person is the fat person has energy stores their body can draw from. Whales like Corissa Enneking make a false equivalence that starving themselves is unhealthy and hence doctors who encourage them to go into calorie deficit are somehow unprofessional.
this work colleague started walking short distances and within a year was half his original weight and had taking up jogging. When asked by fatties if he was unhappy denying himself food and putting his body through all this exertion, his answer was "sometimes yes, but nowhere near as unhappy as I was when making the problem worse by eating".
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Eating less genuinely leads to weight loss.
also, this was really interesting
https://cristivlad.com/total-starvation-382-days-without-food-study/ -
@kirwan said in Interesting reads:
@barbarian said in Interesting reads:
@mariner4life said in Interesting reads:
i don't understand the conclusion?
Is that people who are already fat are fucked? And we should just accept that? And being a blimp isn't necessarily a bad thing?
That we need to redefine the focus away from weight and towards health.
When you focus unerringly on weight, it tends to lead to negative outcomes.
It is possible to be both fat and healthy, and the reverse is also true.
Crash diets generally don't work in the long term.
The medical profession tend to be poor at dealing with these issues in a considered, productive fashion.
You can’t be fat and healthy.
Chamnelling your inner Bartman
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booboo said:
@kirwan said in Interesting reads:
@barbarian said in Interesting reads:
@mariner4life said in Interesting reads:
i don't understand the conclusion?
Is that people who are already fat are fucked? And we should just accept that? And being a blimp isn't necessarily a bad thing?
That we need to redefine the focus away from weight and towards health.
When you focus unerringly on weight, it tends to lead to negative outcomes.
It is possible to be both fat and healthy, and the reverse is also true.
Crash diets generally don't work in the long term.
The medical profession tend to be poor at dealing with these issues in a considered, productive fashion.
You can’t be fat and healthy.
Chamnelling your inner Bartman
As are you with that sort of typing.
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Kirwan said:
booboo said:
@kirwan said in Interesting reads:
@barbarian said in Interesting reads:
@mariner4life said in Interesting reads:
i don't understand the conclusion?
Is that people who are already fat are fucked? And we should just accept that? And being a blimp isn't necessarily a bad thing?
That we need to redefine the focus away from weight and towards health.
When you focus unerringly on weight, it tends to lead to negative outcomes.
It is possible to be both fat and healthy, and the reverse is also true.
Crash diets generally don't work in the long term.
The medical profession tend to be poor at dealing with these issues in a considered, productive fashion.
You can’t be fat and healthy.
Chamnelling your inner Bartman
As are you with that sort of typing.
Hahahaha
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I sympathise with them fatties though, i fucking love food. and beer. and wine.
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@mariner4life said in Interesting reads:
I sympathise with them fatties though, i fucking love food. and beer. and wine.
That's it, we all love that stuff also laying around watching movies, playing video games etc. The amount of times I've had a larger person say I've got it so easy with 'good genes'..well those genes don't get me to the gym 5 days a week and make me watch what I eat.
Far be it for me to judge the journalistic integrity of the Huffpo..but that seems like a huge load of bollocks. The anecdotal evidence of morbidly obese people who eat healthy and are active..well I call BS. I've known people to claim the same crap but when you dig a little deeper their 'regular' exercise is 'last week on the exercycle..had to miss this week as I had way too much work on..or too hungover' and their healthy eating is salads for lunch all week but anything goes on weekends or any night I work late.
Articles like this serve to push the idea that people are not responsible for their own lives. There is an absolute wealth of information out there on nutrition and weight loss but many simply just want to take shortcuts and avoid exercise at all costs hence the dumb-as-all-hell crash diets.
Staying healthy is damn hard and it isn't just a project with a start and end date, it is a lifestyle commitment.
There is a lot of talk about 'fat shaming' well what about shaming friends, loved ones and medical professionals for actually caring that you may be eating yourself to death?
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It references that song I believe, my mate had a job that involved wearing earmuffs most of the day . He used to sing it while everyone was getting their overalls etc on so that his co workers would have it stuck in their head all day.
That’s an aspirational level of bastardry right there.How Auto-Tune Revolutionized the Sound of Popular Music
An in-depth history of the most important pop innovation of the last 20 years, from Cher’s “Believe” to Kanye West to Migos
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jegga said:
@rembrandt for you to judge the journalistic integrity of the huff post wouldn’t they have to have some to judge in the first place?
Well I was being a little more tactful than my initial impulse
"Ah the Huffpo, almost as much journalistic integrity as my regular as clockwork 11am daily dump"
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But again, some of the comments on this thread go to the issue of the debate - just saying 'have some discipline and put down the donut' doesn't work.
There is now a large body of evidence (pardon the pun) that diets don't really work. Or not the way we are currently doing them. It's incredibly unlikely that you will lose weight and keep it off for a long period of time.
Yes, willpower plays a role, but there are other genetic and biological factors at play too.
There has been billions of dollars spent on advertising and education about the benefits of healthy lifestyles. And yet this fact remains:
Since 1980, the obesity rate has doubled in 73 countries and increased in 113 others. And in all that time, no nation has reduced its obesity rate. Not one.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that fat people need to be lauded, or celebrated, or that they shouldn't try and lose weight and live a healthier lifestyle.
It's a problem for Government, but also the medical profession, the food industry, the diet industry and many more.
But there needs to be an acceptance that our current approach to the issue isn't really working, from top to tail.
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At no time in our history has food been as available, as cheap and as calorie dense.
The reason diets don't work is because people don't stick to them. They see them as temporary. I dieted. I lost weight. Now I'll go back to eating the way I did before I dieted. And they blame the diet for not working.
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barbarian said:
Since 1980, the obesity rate has doubled in 73 countries and increased in 113 others. And in all that time, no nation has reduced its obesity rate. Not one.
I'd argue that at no other point in recent history have people been encouraged as much as they are now to place the responsibility of their own lives on others.
Obesity is the unanticipated consequence of the overwhelming success of capitalism..still this is at the expense of starvation so on balance probably a better situation to contend with.
We could of course continue the ideological trajectory of placing responsibility of our lives to the state, that too would bring down the obesity rate for sure.
Venezuelans report big weight losses in 2017 as hunger hits
Venezuelans reported losing on average 11 kilograms (24 lbs) in body weight last year and almost 90 percent now live in poverty, according to a new university study on the impact of a devastating economic crisis and food shortages.
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barbarian said:
But again, some of the comments on this thread go to the issue of the debate - just saying 'have some discipline and put down the donut' doesn't work.
There is now a large body of evidence (pardon the pun) that diets don't really work. Or not the way we are currently doing them. It's incredibly unlikely that you will lose weight and keep it off for a long period of time.
Yes, willpower plays a role, but there are other genetic and biological factors at play too.
There has been billions of dollars spent on advertising and education about the benefits of healthy lifestyles. And yet this fact remains:
Since 1980, the obesity rate has doubled in 73 countries and increased in 113 others. And in all that time, no nation has reduced its obesity rate. Not one.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that fat people need to be lauded, or celebrated, or that they shouldn't try and lose weight and live a healthier lifestyle.
It's a problem for Government, but also the medical profession, the food industry, the diet industry and many more.
But there needs to be an acceptance that our current approach to the issue isn't really working, from top to tail.
I see what you're trying to do here and normalising obesity isn't necessarily going to help the amount of front rowers available for your super rugby teams.
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mariner4life said:
I sympathise with them fatties though, i fucking love food. and beer. and wine.
I agree, we shouldn't be too harsh on them, they've already got enough on their plate.
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taniwharugby said:
Like you say, it's like smokers, until they really want to do it, they are wasting everyones time.
mariner4life said:
I sympathise with them fatties though, i fucking love food. and beer. and wine.
I 'm quoting both of these as I think they both are on the mark.
Morbidly obese people have the same issues as alcoholics, drug addicts etc. It's a mental illness.
