AB EOYT 2018
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@act-crusader said in AB EOYT 2018:
@samurai-jack it was winter tests when he was 25. He experienced the disappointment of missing the 2005 Lions tour, 3Ns and EOYT of 2006, and the 2007 RWC despite having obvious talent at the tender age of 21-22.
There were more than a few posters surprised that other loosies were selected ahead of him back then. I even recall Holah playing on the blindside during that time...
JC and Rodders didn't hit their straps until they were about 25 (IIRC Rodders debuted at 23, then dropped out for 18 months to a year before forcing his way back). If Akira is patient he will get his chance
@canefan said in AB EOYT 2018:
@act-crusader said in AB EOYT 2018:
@samurai-jack it was winter tests when he was 25. He experienced the disappointment of missing the 2005 Lions tour, 3Ns and EOYT of 2006, and the 2007 RWC despite having obvious talent at the tender age of 21-22.
There were more than a few posters surprised that other loosies were selected ahead of him back then. I even recall Holah playing on the blindside during that time...
JC and Rodders didn't hit their straps until they were about 25 (IIRC Rodders debuted at 23, then dropped out for 18 months to a year before forcing his way back). If Akira is patient he will get his chance
Yeah Rodders was one of my favourite players and when he hit the scene at provincial level and playing 7s I thought he was going to be an AB straight away. He debuted at 23 but then was really only a squaddie for the 2003 RWC. It wasn’t until 2005 (at 25yo) that he really solidified his spot and the rest is history.
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@antipodean said in AB EOYT 2018:
Well if it's true he's a dickhead, no amount of coaching will fix that.
Dickheads generally aren’t popular in the teams they play for. Akira gets the players awards.
This is why it sucks that the coaches aren’t being clearer about why they aren’t selecting him, it opens the doors to people just making shit up.
He and his brother top the defensive and attacking stats for Blues, and have done for a couple of years. If he has thinks to work on they should back themselves as coaches to fix them. In other words, treat him like they are with several other players in the squad.
All them with less shown upside than this player.
Says it all that Foster didn’t want Rieko either. Remember he only got in because of injury and Hanson overruling Foster about Naholo playing 11.
They get stuck in their ways, and certainly play favourites.
To put a 90s spin on it, they are favouring Arron Pene over ZinZan Brooke.
@kirwan Reiko was pretty raw at the time with some holes in his game, particularly defensively. But I think it has worked out for him. Sometimes an injury is the opening that reveals a gem. Not the first time that has happened. Reiko has been a revelation because he is still improving, which is what you want from a young player.
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@kirwan Reiko was pretty raw at the time with some holes in his game, particularly defensively. But I think it has worked out for him. Sometimes an injury is the opening that reveals a gem. Not the first time that has happened. Reiko has been a revelation because he is still improving, which is what you want from a young player.
@act-crusader said in AB EOYT 2018:
@kirwan Reiko was pretty raw at the time with some holes in his game, particularly defensively. But I think it has worked out for him. Sometimes an injury is the opening that reveals a gem. Not the first time that has happened. Reiko has been a revelation because he is still improving, which is what you want from a young player.
It is easier to break through as a winger too. He has the pace, and the space to play his natural game
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So no room for Charlie Ngatai then...
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Tickets to Rome game purchased and accommodation booked.
Just need to get there now.For anyone interested, this is the official sales site https://www.listicket.com/ticketing/acquisto/acquistoStep1/42229/ITALIA-VS-ALL-BLACKS-Cattolica-Test-Match-2018
(at least I hope it is. It was the one linked through the Italy Rugby website) -
Thanks @number-10
@Derm-McCrum so @Crucial is right. Very similar.@booboo said in AB EOYT 2018:
Thanks @number-10
@Derm-McCrum so @Crucial is right. Very similar.Errr
Wayne Barnes as Ref
NZ P16 W 10 L5 - 69% wins
IRL P15 W5 L10 - 33% wins -
@booboo said in AB EOYT 2018:
Thanks @number-10
@Derm-McCrum so @Crucial is right. Very similar.Errr
Wayne Barnes as Ref
NZ P16 W 10 L5 - 69% wins
IRL P15 W5 L10 - 33% wins@derm-mccrum said in AB EOYT 2018:
@booboo said in AB EOYT 2018:
Thanks @number-10
@Derm-McCrum so @Crucial is right. Very similar.Errr
Wayne Barnes as Ref
NZ P16 W 10 L5 - 69% wins
IRL P15 W5 L10 - 33% winsSince Barnes started reffing tests the ABs have a losing rate of 16%. Ireland have a losing rate of 33%.
So he has almost doubled our losing rate and has doubled yours.
Pretty similar
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@derm-mccrum said in AB EOYT 2018:
@booboo said in AB EOYT 2018:
Thanks @number-10
@Derm-McCrum so @Crucial is right. Very similar.Errr
Wayne Barnes as Ref
NZ P16 W 10 L5 - 69% wins
IRL P15 W5 L10 - 33% winsSince Barnes started reffing tests the ABs have a losing rate of 16%. Ireland have a losing rate of 33%.
So he has almost doubled our losing rate and has doubled yours.
Pretty similar@crucial said in AB EOYT 2018:
@derm-mccrum said in AB EOYT 2018:
@booboo said in AB EOYT 2018:
Thanks @number-10
@Derm-McCrum so @Crucial is right. Very similar.Errr
Wayne Barnes as Ref
NZ P16 W 10 L5 - 69% wins
IRL P15 W5 L10 - 33% winsSince Barnes started reffing tests the ABs have a losing rate of 16%. Ireland have a losing rate of 33%.
So he has almost doubled our losing rate and has doubled yours.
Pretty similarErrr I’d love to think that’s the case, but eh, erm, how shall I put it....
No!
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@crucial said in AB EOYT 2018:
@derm-mccrum said in AB EOYT 2018:
@booboo said in AB EOYT 2018:
Thanks @number-10
@Derm-McCrum so @Crucial is right. Very similar.Errr
Wayne Barnes as Ref
NZ P16 W 10 L5 - 69% wins
IRL P15 W5 L10 - 33% winsSince Barnes started reffing tests the ABs have a losing rate of 16%. Ireland have a losing rate of 33%.
So he has almost doubled our losing rate and has doubled yours.
Pretty similarErrr I’d love to think that’s the case, but eh, erm, how shall I put it....
No!
@derm-mccrum said in AB EOYT 2018:
@crucial said in AB EOYT 2018:
@derm-mccrum said in AB EOYT 2018:
@booboo said in AB EOYT 2018:
Thanks @number-10
@Derm-McCrum so @Crucial is right. Very similar.Errr
Wayne Barnes as Ref
NZ P16 W 10 L5 - 69% wins
IRL P15 W5 L10 - 33% winsSince Barnes started reffing tests the ABs have a losing rate of 16%. Ireland have a losing rate of 33%.
So he has almost doubled our losing rate and has doubled yours.
Pretty similarErrr I’d love to think that’s the case, but eh, erm, how shall I put it....
No!
The numbers don’t lie
We lose twice our normal rate under Waynie and so does Ireland. What’s the dispute?
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Thinking about the Brett Cameron selection.
I think this is the biggest left-field wtf selection since Brett Wilson was selected for the 1983 tour to Scotland and England.
Wilson was the reserve Counties hooker. Counties No.1 hooker was All Black captain Andy Dalton - who was unavailable for that tour. Hika Reid toured as number 1.
Cameron as third choice in his Super Rugby franchise (and second choice for Canterbury if Mo'ouga wasn't elevated to ABs fits that pattern)
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Interesting that Fox says Perofeta was orginal 4th choice.
Perofeta - looks to me like a young kids who still needs to be playing fullback at the higher level (lie Robbie Robinson and Gareth Anscomber were when still his age).
I would have taken Hunt, and I would have been interested in Black but not seen him much of either yet at SR level.
The drop from 3rd choice 10 to 4th choice is an absolute chasm at the moment.
If all NZ 10s were available in a world with no exoduses, what would Cameron's ranking be? Probably somewhere between 9th or 11th on a realistic list - but about 14th on mine
Barrett
Mo'ouga
McKenzie
Cruden
Sopoaga
Slade
Taylor
Banks
Perofeta
Parker
.
.
Hunt
Black
Is Anscombe good yet at 10?
.
.
CameronI don't actually not rate Cameron, I just simply haven't seen much of him at all - and what I have seen has been Mitre 10.
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Interesting that Fox says Perofeta was orginal 4th choice.
Perofeta - looks to me like a young kids who still needs to be playing fullback at the higher level (lie Robbie Robinson and Gareth Anscomber were when still his age).
I would have taken Hunt, and I would have been interested in Black but not seen him much of either yet at SR level.
The drop from 3rd choice 10 to 4th choice is an absolute chasm at the moment.
If all NZ 10s were available in a world with no exoduses, what would Cameron's ranking be? Probably somewhere between 9th or 11th on a realistic list - but about 14th on mine
Barrett
Mo'ouga
McKenzie
Cruden
Sopoaga
Slade
Taylor
Banks
Perofeta
Parker
.
.
Hunt
Black
Is Anscombe good yet at 10?
.
.
CameronI don't actually not rate Cameron, I just simply haven't seen much of him at all - and what I have seen has been Mitre 10.
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I think the selectors ARE being clear on Akira. Just because you don't believe them doesn't they aren't explaining clearly.
IF he was to be in the main squad he would be there as training field fodder and a green backup 8. Hardly likely to get gametime as Read plays out the game if not injured.
IF he was to be in the extras going to Japan then again, I think the plan is to use Luke W at 8 for experience and leadership. He may get a bench run.
IF he goes with the Maori AB he will be a starter and important part of the pack.Pretty simple decision if the idea is to give him playing opportunities.
@crucial said in AB EOYT 2018:
I think the selectors ARE being clear on Akira. Just because you don't believe them doesn't they aren't explaining clearly.
IF he was to be in the main squad he would be there as training field fodder and a green backup 8. Hardly likely to get gametime as Read plays out the game if not injured.
IF he was to be in the extras going to Japan then again, I think the plan is to use Luke W at 8 for experience and leadership. He may get a bench run.
IF he goes with the Maori AB he will be a starter and important part of the pack.Pretty simple decision if the idea is to give him playing opportunities.
I think there's a fair bit of spin in the explanations. Everyone else in the nineteen is "going to benefit from working with the AB coaches", but Akira is better off being away with the Maori? If that was really true, wouldn't Tyrel Lomax also get more out of starting for the Maori, than being on the bench vs Japan?
I certainly know where I would rather be if I were Akira!
To me, it looks like they're going out of their way to not pick him. The last player I thought that about was Hika Elliott.
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@rapido Cameron is only young to be fair I must admit I am a little surprised by his elevation to the black jersey ,
the young guy I rate big time is Kaleb Trask from the Bay only 19,watch this kid go moving forward.@steven-harris said in AB EOYT 2018:
@rapido Cameron is only young to be fair I must admit I am a little surprised by his elevation to the black jersey ,
the young guy I rate big time is Kaleb Trask from the Bay only 19,watch this kid go moving forward.Yeah, I think I'm being reasonably fair.
I'm not bagging him. I simply don't know how good he is or isn't, or have a handle on his potential.
I then move on to point out how the exodus has absolutely gutted our first-five stocks below 3rd choice.
I'd say we only have our 1st, 2nd, 4th, then 9th then 11th best options available due to the overseas selection policy. With Cameron at best in that 11th spot.
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@crucial said in AB EOYT 2018:
I think the selectors ARE being clear on Akira. Just because you don't believe them doesn't they aren't explaining clearly.
IF he was to be in the main squad he would be there as training field fodder and a green backup 8. Hardly likely to get gametime as Read plays out the game if not injured.
IF he was to be in the extras going to Japan then again, I think the plan is to use Luke W at 8 for experience and leadership. He may get a bench run.
IF he goes with the Maori AB he will be a starter and important part of the pack.Pretty simple decision if the idea is to give him playing opportunities.
I think there's a fair bit of spin in the explanations. Everyone else in the nineteen is "going to benefit from working with the AB coaches", but Akira is better off being away with the Maori? If that was really true, wouldn't Tyrel Lomax also get more out of starting for the Maori, than being on the bench vs Japan?
I certainly know where I would rather be if I were Akira!
To me, it looks like they're going out of their way to not pick him. The last player I thought that about was Hika Elliott.
@chris-b said in AB EOYT 2018:
@crucial said in AB EOYT 2018:
I think the selectors ARE being clear on Akira. Just because you don't believe them doesn't they aren't explaining clearly.
IF he was to be in the main squad he would be there as training field fodder and a green backup 8. Hardly likely to get gametime as Read plays out the game if not injured.
IF he was to be in the extras going to Japan then again, I think the plan is to use Luke W at 8 for experience and leadership. He may get a bench run.
IF he goes with the Maori AB he will be a starter and important part of the pack.Pretty simple decision if the idea is to give him playing opportunities.
I think there's a fair bit of spin in the explanations. Everyone else in the nineteen is "going to benefit from working with the AB coaches", but Akira is better off being away with the Maori? If that was really true, wouldn't Tyrel Lomax also get more out of starting for the Maori, than being on the bench vs Japan?
I certainly know where I would rather be if I were Akira!
To me, it looks like they're going out of their way to not pick him. The last player I thought that about was Hika Elliott.
Absolutely. Crucial is lapping up the explanation too unquestionably, IMO.
Akira has huge potential and undoubtedly some non-test quality aspects to his game currently, which I would expect to be ironed out in camps. But these combined with likely maturity and attitude issues mean he isn't getting that opportunity. The management aren't spelling that out and I don't have a problem with that if you don't want the media crawling over a young fellas character and maturity (if true). But the flip-side is the rumours and social media theories ..... like this one.
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Interesting that Fox says Perofeta was orginal 4th choice.
Perofeta - looks to me like a young kids who still needs to be playing fullback at the higher level (lie Robbie Robinson and Gareth Anscomber were when still his age).
I would have taken Hunt, and I would have been interested in Black but not seen him much of either yet at SR level.
The drop from 3rd choice 10 to 4th choice is an absolute chasm at the moment.
If all NZ 10s were available in a world with no exoduses, what would Cameron's ranking be? Probably somewhere between 9th or 11th on a realistic list - but about 14th on mine
Barrett
Mo'ouga
McKenzie
Cruden
Sopoaga
Slade
Taylor
Banks
Perofeta
Parker
.
.
Hunt
Black
Is Anscombe good yet at 10?
.
.
CameronI don't actually not rate Cameron, I just simply haven't seen much of him at all - and what I have seen has been Mitre 10.
@rapido said in AB EOYT 2018:
The drop from 3rd choice 10 to 4th choice is an absolute chasm at the moment.
If all NZ 10s were available in a world with no exoduses, what would Cameron's ranking be? Probably somewhere between 9th or 11th on a realistic list - but about 14th on mine
I haven't seen him play recently, but Dan Carter would surely still slide into the list in the top 10? Mike Delany was actually very good for the Crusaders in the couple of games he played this year - arguably better than Mitch Hunt.
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@chris-b said in AB EOYT 2018:
@crucial said in AB EOYT 2018:
I think the selectors ARE being clear on Akira. Just because you don't believe them doesn't they aren't explaining clearly.
IF he was to be in the main squad he would be there as training field fodder and a green backup 8. Hardly likely to get gametime as Read plays out the game if not injured.
IF he was to be in the extras going to Japan then again, I think the plan is to use Luke W at 8 for experience and leadership. He may get a bench run.
IF he goes with the Maori AB he will be a starter and important part of the pack.Pretty simple decision if the idea is to give him playing opportunities.
I think there's a fair bit of spin in the explanations. Everyone else in the nineteen is "going to benefit from working with the AB coaches", but Akira is better off being away with the Maori? If that was really true, wouldn't Tyrel Lomax also get more out of starting for the Maori, than being on the bench vs Japan?
I certainly know where I would rather be if I were Akira!
To me, it looks like they're going out of their way to not pick him. The last player I thought that about was Hika Elliott.
Absolutely. Crucial is lapping up the explanation too unquestionably, IMO.
Akira has huge potential and undoubtedly some non-test quality aspects to his game currently, which I would expect to be ironed out in camps. But these combined with likely maturity and attitude issues mean he isn't getting that opportunity. The management aren't spelling that out and I don't have a problem with that if you don't want the media crawling over a young fellas character and maturity (if true). But the flip-side is the rumours and social media theories ..... like this one.
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@rapido said in AB EOYT 2018:
The drop from 3rd choice 10 to 4th choice is an absolute chasm at the moment.
If all NZ 10s were available in a world with no exoduses, what would Cameron's ranking be? Probably somewhere between 9th or 11th on a realistic list - but about 14th on mine
I haven't seen him play recently, but Dan Carter would surely still slide into the list in the top 10? Mike Delany was actually very good for the Crusaders in the couple of games he played this year - arguably better than Mitch Hunt.
@chris-b said in AB EOYT 2018:
@rapido said in AB EOYT 2018:
The drop from 3rd choice 10 to 4th choice is an absolute chasm at the moment.
If all NZ 10s were available in a world with no exoduses, what would Cameron's ranking be? Probably somewhere between 9th or 11th on a realistic list - but about 14th on mine
I haven't seen him play recently, but Dan Carter would surely still slide into the list in the top 10? Mike Delany was actually very good for the Crusaders in the couple of games he played this year - arguably better than Mitch Hunt.
I did think about Delaney, but assumed this year was his final swansong so omitted him, just an assumption.
If the world cup was this year and we needed to go down to our 4th choice 10, I would absolutely pick Delaney.
With the world cup next year, and if no major change in our 10 prospects (Cameron stays un-played at the Crusaders, Black gets no game time, Perofeta still looks like a fullback and can't hit the side of the barn) then I'd want them to break their own rule and get Cruden back. Not Sopoaga though, he jacked on his mates after stealing Mo'ouga's development time last November. Fuck that guy.
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@chris-b said in AB EOYT 2018:
@rapido said in AB EOYT 2018:
The drop from 3rd choice 10 to 4th choice is an absolute chasm at the moment.
If all NZ 10s were available in a world with no exoduses, what would Cameron's ranking be? Probably somewhere between 9th or 11th on a realistic list - but about 14th on mine
I haven't seen him play recently, but Dan Carter would surely still slide into the list in the top 10? Mike Delany was actually very good for the Crusaders in the couple of games he played this year - arguably better than Mitch Hunt.
I did think about Delaney, but assumed this year was his final swansong so omitted him, just an assumption.
If the world cup was this year and we needed to go down to our 4th choice 10, I would absolutely pick Delaney.
With the world cup next year, and if no major change in our 10 prospects (Cameron stays un-played at the Crusaders, Black gets no game time, Perofeta still looks like a fullback and can't hit the side of the barn) then I'd want them to break their own rule and get Cruden back. Not Sopoaga though, he jacked on his mates after stealing Mo'ouga's development time last November. Fuck that guy.
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@antipodean said in AB EOYT 2018:
Well if it's true he's a dickhead, no amount of coaching will fix that.
Dickheads generally aren’t popular in the teams they play for. Akira gets the players awards.
This is why it sucks that the coaches aren’t being clearer about why they aren’t selecting him, it opens the doors to people just making shit up.
He and his brother top the defensive and attacking stats for Blues, and have done for a couple of years. If he has thinks to work on they should back themselves as coaches to fix them. In other words, treat him like they are with several other players in the squad.
All them with less shown upside than this player.
Says it all that Foster didn’t want Rieko either. Remember he only got in because of injury and Hanson overruling Foster about Naholo playing 11.
They get stuck in their ways, and certainly play favourites.
To put a 90s spin on it, they are favouring Arron Pene over ZinZan Brooke.
@kirwan said in AB EOYT 2018:
Dickheads generally aren’t popular in the teams they play for. Akira gets the players awards.
Perhaps being a dickhead is popular in a team that under performs.
