Japan vs All Blacks
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@chris-b said in Japan vs All Blacks:
@nepia FABJohnny just never got cut a break!
Because he didn't deserve one. Being a white guy from Christchurch doesn't guarantee an AB spot (despite some evidence to the contrary).
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@taniwharugby said in Japan vs All Blacks:
I must be missing somethign, there is nothing about JB's game that makes me think he should be playing elsewhere, let alone 12.
12/13 are farking tough posiitions to play, both offensively and defensively, no way would I want JB there.
What chance does he have of getting time at 12 in the Hurricanes with Laumape there?
You're missing the fact that he played his age grade rugby at 12, and then his debut (breakout) season at 12 for Canterbury where he was one of their best players. That's where the "Jordie to 12" comes from - he's had great success there at a high level but has never been given the chance to develop at the top level.
Agree with Laumape his time may be limited. In hindsight he was probably better to play for the Crusaders and form a partnership with Goodhue while Crotty spends 90% of the season injured.
@no-quarter I'm not missing that he played there at age group, I'm missing seeing naything in his game at present that leads me to believe he is capable of making the transition now.
With the mid-field options for the Hurricanes, I cant see him getting any more than 10 or so minutes here and there, so cant see him even being a realistic option there any time in the next few years.
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@no-quarter said in Japan vs All Blacks:
@nepia said in Japan vs All Blacks:
@no-quarter said in Japan vs All Blacks:
There's an awful lot of hate on this board for such a young and obviously talented prospect.
I don't think that is true in the slightest - he's just not in great form and getting called on it. The 'hate' directed at him has been no worse than that directed at DMac at various times.
The hate directed at both players has been pretty irrational at times, it's not a competition. Certain posters do seem to take some pleasure in seeing Jordie struggle, with some in this thread even calling for an end to his AB career.
ooh ooh that's me!!
Call it a direct response the ridiculous hype he got early where he wasn't that great, but was made out to be the great white hope.
And i did say "in the short term". Right now he doesn't deserve a test spot, based on his whole body of 2018 work at both levels. I don't think it's an outlandish thing to say. He only plays one position, and at the moment he looks 3rd in line for that spot.
But, as has been repeatedly said on this thread, he's just a baby, and has all the time in the world. He has pretty good instincts, but his skills and decision making need some polish. Plenty of time to work on that, providing he sticks around.
@mariner4life said in Japan vs All Blacks:
@no-quarter said in Japan vs All Blacks:
@nepia said in Japan vs All Blacks:
@no-quarter said in Japan vs All Blacks:
There's an awful lot of hate on this board for such a young and obviously talented prospect.
I don't think that is true in the slightest - he's just not in great form and getting called on it. The 'hate' directed at him has been no worse than that directed at DMac at various times.
The hate directed at both players has been pretty irrational at times, it's not a competition. Certain posters do seem to take some pleasure in seeing Jordie struggle, with some in this thread even calling for an end to his AB career.
ooh ooh that's me!!
Call it a direct response the ridiculous hype he got early where he wasn't that great, but was made out to be the great white hope.
And i did say "in the short term". Right now he doesn't deserve a test spot, based on his whole body of 2018 work at both levels. I don't think it's an outlandish thing to say. He only plays one position, and at the moment he looks 3rd in line for that spot.
But, as has been repeatedly said on this thread, he's just a baby, and has all the time in the world. He has pretty good instincts, but his skills and decision making need some polish. Plenty of time to work on that, providing he sticks around.
You damn right that was you, you fucking Canesaphobe.
I actually agree with most of that, though I think he was better in Super rugby than people give him credit for; he was a pretty key part of our success for much of the season. Think @Chris-B has it right, young bloke that's played a lot of minutes this year probably needs a bit of a break.
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@mariner4life said in Japan vs All Blacks:
@no-quarter said in Japan vs All Blacks:
@nepia said in Japan vs All Blacks:
@no-quarter said in Japan vs All Blacks:
There's an awful lot of hate on this board for such a young and obviously talented prospect.
I don't think that is true in the slightest - he's just not in great form and getting called on it. The 'hate' directed at him has been no worse than that directed at DMac at various times.
The hate directed at both players has been pretty irrational at times, it's not a competition. Certain posters do seem to take some pleasure in seeing Jordie struggle, with some in this thread even calling for an end to his AB career.
ooh ooh that's me!!
Call it a direct response the ridiculous hype he got early where he wasn't that great, but was made out to be the great white hope.
And i did say "in the short term". Right now he doesn't deserve a test spot, based on his whole body of 2018 work at both levels. I don't think it's an outlandish thing to say. He only plays one position, and at the moment he looks 3rd in line for that spot.
But, as has been repeatedly said on this thread, he's just a baby, and has all the time in the world. He has pretty good instincts, but his skills and decision making need some polish. Plenty of time to work on that, providing he sticks around.
You damn right that was you, you fucking Canesaphobe.
I actually agree with most of that, though I think he was better in Super rugby than people give him credit for; he was a pretty key part of our success for much of the season. Think @Chris-B has it right, young bloke that's played a lot of minutes this year probably needs a bit of a break.
@no-quarter said in Japan vs All Blacks:
@mariner4life said in Japan vs All Blacks:
@no-quarter said in Japan vs All Blacks:
@nepia said in Japan vs All Blacks:
@no-quarter said in Japan vs All Blacks:
There's an awful lot of hate on this board for such a young and obviously talented prospect.
I don't think that is true in the slightest - he's just not in great form and getting called on it. The 'hate' directed at him has been no worse than that directed at DMac at various times.
The hate directed at both players has been pretty irrational at times, it's not a competition. Certain posters do seem to take some pleasure in seeing Jordie struggle, with some in this thread even calling for an end to his AB career.
ooh ooh that's me!!
Call it a direct response the ridiculous hype he got early where he wasn't that great, but was made out to be the great white hope.
And i did say "in the short term". Right now he doesn't deserve a test spot, based on his whole body of 2018 work at both levels. I don't think it's an outlandish thing to say. He only plays one position, and at the moment he looks 3rd in line for that spot.
But, as has been repeatedly said on this thread, he's just a baby, and has all the time in the world. He has pretty good instincts, but his skills and decision making need some polish. Plenty of time to work on that, providing he sticks around.
You damn right that was you, you fucking Canesaphobe.
I actually agree with most of that, though I think he was better in Super rugby than people give him credit for; he was a pretty key part of our success for much of the season. Think @Chris-B has it right, young bloke that's played a lot of minutes this year probably needs a bit of a break.
did he play lots of NPC? because since the Super rugby season he's pretty much been on holiday. Aussies in August, Saffers in September, and then Saturday. Must work fucking hard in training.
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@kiwiinmelb said in Japan vs All Blacks:
I think one of the biggest concerns for Jordie ,
Right now , he is a fullback only ,
And for a player down the pecking order as he is atm , not in the top 23 , maybe that spot is better going to a utility
Yep. Totally agree. He clearly isn't a 13 and for whatever farking reason he's not been played in the position that won him Mitre10 Cup player of the year as a 19 year old.
I think his skills in the air make him a better test 15 than DMac, but DMac would have to be the better bench option.
Will be interesting to see how he's used next year. While I'm happy to have him at the Canes I think career wise he should have gone to the Saders. With Crotty broken every second game he'd have had a thousand chances at 12.
@rancid-schnitzel Maybe they are waiting on him to further develop his lanky ass frame before moving him closer to the action. I personally think 12 would be his best position aswell and because the Canes have Laumape there, playing really well I might add, means that he will have to wait until injury strikes. The other option is starting Jordie at 12 and have Laumape reek havoc as an impact sub later on in matches.
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@no-quarter said in Japan vs All Blacks:
@mariner4life said in Japan vs All Blacks:
@no-quarter said in Japan vs All Blacks:
@nepia said in Japan vs All Blacks:
@no-quarter said in Japan vs All Blacks:
There's an awful lot of hate on this board for such a young and obviously talented prospect.
I don't think that is true in the slightest - he's just not in great form and getting called on it. The 'hate' directed at him has been no worse than that directed at DMac at various times.
The hate directed at both players has been pretty irrational at times, it's not a competition. Certain posters do seem to take some pleasure in seeing Jordie struggle, with some in this thread even calling for an end to his AB career.
ooh ooh that's me!!
Call it a direct response the ridiculous hype he got early where he wasn't that great, but was made out to be the great white hope.
And i did say "in the short term". Right now he doesn't deserve a test spot, based on his whole body of 2018 work at both levels. I don't think it's an outlandish thing to say. He only plays one position, and at the moment he looks 3rd in line for that spot.
But, as has been repeatedly said on this thread, he's just a baby, and has all the time in the world. He has pretty good instincts, but his skills and decision making need some polish. Plenty of time to work on that, providing he sticks around.
You damn right that was you, you fucking Canesaphobe.
I actually agree with most of that, though I think he was better in Super rugby than people give him credit for; he was a pretty key part of our success for much of the season. Think @Chris-B has it right, young bloke that's played a lot of minutes this year probably needs a bit of a break.
did he play lots of NPC? because since the Super rugby season he's pretty much been on holiday. Aussies in August, Saffers in September, and then Saturday. Must work fucking hard in training.
@mariner4life said in Japan vs All Blacks:
@no-quarter said in Japan vs All Blacks:
@mariner4life said in Japan vs All Blacks:
@no-quarter said in Japan vs All Blacks:
@nepia said in Japan vs All Blacks:
@no-quarter said in Japan vs All Blacks:
There's an awful lot of hate on this board for such a young and obviously talented prospect.
I don't think that is true in the slightest - he's just not in great form and getting called on it. The 'hate' directed at him has been no worse than that directed at DMac at various times.
The hate directed at both players has been pretty irrational at times, it's not a competition. Certain posters do seem to take some pleasure in seeing Jordie struggle, with some in this thread even calling for an end to his AB career.
ooh ooh that's me!!
Call it a direct response the ridiculous hype he got early where he wasn't that great, but was made out to be the great white hope.
And i did say "in the short term". Right now he doesn't deserve a test spot, based on his whole body of 2018 work at both levels. I don't think it's an outlandish thing to say. He only plays one position, and at the moment he looks 3rd in line for that spot.
But, as has been repeatedly said on this thread, he's just a baby, and has all the time in the world. He has pretty good instincts, but his skills and decision making need some polish. Plenty of time to work on that, providing he sticks around.
You damn right that was you, you fucking Canesaphobe.
I actually agree with most of that, though I think he was better in Super rugby than people give him credit for; he was a pretty key part of our success for much of the season. Think @Chris-B has it right, young bloke that's played a lot of minutes this year probably needs a bit of a break.
did he play lots of NPC? because since the Super rugby season he's pretty much been on holiday. Aussies in August, Saffers in September, and then Saturday. Must work fucking hard in training.
I don't think backs are ever really physically burnt out (depending how they play the game), was talking more mentally. He's had a heap of pressure put on him and his confidence appears to be way down right now.
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I finally got to watch the Japan/AB game. I wrote down some thoughts here:
http://www.thesilverfern.com/2018/11/05/abs-versus-japan-how-was-fifita/
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Great stuff
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I finally got to watch the Japan/AB game. I wrote down some thoughts here:
http://www.thesilverfern.com/2018/11/05/abs-versus-japan-how-was-fifita/
@gt12 said in Japan vs All Blacks:
I finally got to watch the Japan/AB game. I wrote down some thoughts here:
http://www.thesilverfern.com/2018/11/05/abs-versus-japan-how-was-fifita/
Awesome effort. The last time I can remember a ferner doing on of these it was for Thorne in the lead up to the 2007 RWC - the conclusion was the same... drop him.
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@rocky-rockbottom said in Japan vs All Blacks:
Sorry, I've yet to warm to Jordie. The privileged path, surname opening doors
And we all know that if Akira makes the ABs it will only be because of Reiko
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@rocky-rockbottom said in Japan vs All Blacks:
Sorry, I've yet to warm to Jordie. The privileged path, surname opening doors
And we all know that if Akira makes the ABs it will only be because of Reiko
@act-crusader said in Japan vs All Blacks:
@rocky-rockbottom said in Japan vs All Blacks:
Sorry, I've yet to warm to Jordie. The privileged path, surname opening doors
And we all know that if Akira makes the ABs it will only be because of Reiko
Come on @ACT-Crusader you are well aware that it is the lack of red on his jersey that is holding Akira back
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@act-crusader said in Japan vs All Blacks:
@rocky-rockbottom said in Japan vs All Blacks:
Sorry, I've yet to warm to Jordie. The privileged path, surname opening doors
And we all know that if Akira makes the ABs it will only be because of Reiko
Come on @ACT-Crusader you are well aware that it is the lack of red on his jersey that is holding Akira back
@crucial said in Japan vs All Blacks:
@act-crusader said in Japan vs All Blacks:
@rocky-rockbottom said in Japan vs All Blacks:
Sorry, I've yet to warm to Jordie. The privileged path, surname opening doors
And we all know that if Akira makes the ABs it will only be because of Reiko
Come on @ACT-Crusader you are well aware that it is the lack of red on his jersey that is holding Akira back
Aukira wouldn't be seen dead in red!
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Not much to add.
In backs, I continue to LOVE Mo'unga's taking pill very flat and superb control of short passing. Extra men running off him are given Rolls Royce distribution, which allows them to do maximum damage (also thinking of Frizzell against Argies). SBW on form could do brain damage outside Ritchie, especially if he's receiving fast ball from Nugget.
In forwards, GREAT to have Cole back on wing. Hard to take much away for tighties. In loose, thought Papali'i looked the part and Whitelock (L) very tidy -- apart from that non-block! Turnover effectiveness lifted very noticeably with Hunt (who I though had an excellent cameo) and Evans on.
Hemopo radiated the enthusiasm which was so obviously missing from Fifita. -
I finally got to watch the Japan/AB game. I wrote down some thoughts here:
http://www.thesilverfern.com/2018/11/05/abs-versus-japan-how-was-fifita/
@gt12 said in Japan vs All Blacks:
I finally got to watch the Japan/AB game. I wrote down some thoughts here:
http://www.thesilverfern.com/2018/11/05/abs-versus-japan-how-was-fifita/
Re this bit:
Fifita was there, and you could say he is unlucky that play didn’t come his way, but perhaps that is the point – he’ll make an impact when others provide him with opportunities. But, Fifita doesn’t seem to seek them out – he’s always two out from the ruck looking for the break– even when we need him doing the hard yards closer in and making strong cleans – and, he just isn’t that guy.
Isn't that where we want him?
It's a change from the tight 6 like Kaino with Read playing wide in the 1-3-3-1.
But with Read now the captain and playing a central role instead of the flank, wouldn't the obvious replacement be that our 6 then goes to the inside right flank? Fifita would seem an idea candidate for that, given his speed, but I do have doubts on his off-loading.
This is me just voicing my thoughts out loud. I've not worked out who plays the right 1 in the 1-3-3-1 since Read bcame captain 3 years ago .... maybe I should watch a replay and work it out ..... , whoever it is has been they haven't been very visible over the last few years. We've seen Squire and Dixon out there (and Fifita v Argentina in New PLymouth).
I think people on here see Kaino as the model, but I don't think out current 6s will 100% play the peak-kaino role due to Read's change of role since taking over the captaincy.
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@tim he could have died!
@crazy-horse said in Japan vs All Blacks:
@tim he could have died!
He did die and aura brought him back to life
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@gt12 said in Japan vs All Blacks:
I finally got to watch the Japan/AB game. I wrote down some thoughts here:
http://www.thesilverfern.com/2018/11/05/abs-versus-japan-how-was-fifita/
Awesome effort. The last time I can remember a ferner doing on of these it was for Thorne in the lead up to the 2007 RWC - the conclusion was the same... drop him.
@rotated said in Japan vs All Blacks:
@gt12 said in Japan vs All Blacks:
I finally got to watch the Japan/AB game. I wrote down some thoughts here:
http://www.thesilverfern.com/2018/11/05/abs-versus-japan-how-was-fifita/
Awesome effort. The last time I can remember a ferner doing on of these it was for Thorne in the lead up to the 2007 RWC - the conclusion was the same... drop him.
Haha nice try. Yet Henry was clear that Thorne was the only decent 6/lock going around. No one else in the squad was playing that role.
If only Henry didn’t save Thorne, Mauger and Ellis for the semi....
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@gt12 said in Japan vs All Blacks:
I finally got to watch the Japan/AB game. I wrote down some thoughts here:
http://www.thesilverfern.com/2018/11/05/abs-versus-japan-how-was-fifita/
Re this bit:
Fifita was there, and you could say he is unlucky that play didn’t come his way, but perhaps that is the point – he’ll make an impact when others provide him with opportunities. But, Fifita doesn’t seem to seek them out – he’s always two out from the ruck looking for the break– even when we need him doing the hard yards closer in and making strong cleans – and, he just isn’t that guy.
Isn't that where we want him?
It's a change from the tight 6 like Kaino with Read playing wide in the 1-3-3-1.
But with Read now the captain and playing a central role instead of the flank, wouldn't the obvious replacement be that our 6 then goes to the inside right flank? Fifita would seem an idea candidate for that, given his speed, but I do have doubts on his off-loading.
This is me just voicing my thoughts out loud. I've not worked out who plays the right 1 in the 1-3-3-1 since Read bcame captain 3 years ago .... maybe I should watch a replay and work it out ..... , whoever it is has been they haven't been very visible over the last few years. We've seen Squire and Dixon out there (and Fifita v Argentina in New PLymouth).
I think people on here see Kaino as the model, but I don't think out current 6s will 100% play the peak-kaino role due to Read's change of role since taking over the captaincy.
@rapido said in Japan vs All Blacks:
This is me just voicing my thoughts out loud. I've not worked out who plays the right 1 in the 1-3-3-1 since Read bcame captain 3 years ago .... maybe I should watch a replay and work it out ..... , whoever it is has been they haven't been very visible over the last few years. We've seen Squire and Dixon out there (and Fifita v Argentina in New PLymouth).
It's been Taylor hasn't it?
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Not much to add.
In backs, I continue to LOVE Mo'unga's taking pill very flat and superb control of short passing. Extra men running off him are given Rolls Royce distribution, which allows them to do maximum damage (also thinking of Frizzell against Argies). SBW on form could do brain damage outside Ritchie, especially if he's receiving fast ball from Nugget.
In forwards, GREAT to have Cole back on wing. Hard to take much away for tighties. In loose, thought Papali'i looked the part and Whitelock (L) very tidy -- apart from that non-block! Turnover effectiveness lifted very noticeably with Hunt (who I though had an excellent cameo) and Evans on.
Hemopo radiated the enthusiasm which was so obviously missing from Fifita.@pakman said in Japan vs All Blacks:
Not much to add.
In backs, I continue to LOVE Mo'unga's taking pill very flat and superb control of short passing. Extra men running off him are given Rolls Royce distribution, which allows them to do maximum damage (also thinking of Frizzell against Argies). SBW on form could do brain damage outside Ritchie, especially if he's receiving fast ball from Nugget.
In forwards, GREAT to have Cole back on wing. Hard to take much away for tighties. In loose, thought Papali'i looked the part and Whitelock (L) very tidy -- apart from that non-block! Turnover effectiveness lifted very noticeably with Hunt (who I though had an excellent cameo) and Evans on.
Hemopo radiated the enthusiasm which was so obviously missing from Fifita.Mo'unga threw a few passes to the back shoulder which stunted a couple of our attacks, but i agree, they way he attacks should play in to the hands of our midfield more.
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@rotated said in Japan vs All Blacks:
@gt12 said in Japan vs All Blacks:
I finally got to watch the Japan/AB game. I wrote down some thoughts here:
http://www.thesilverfern.com/2018/11/05/abs-versus-japan-how-was-fifita/
Awesome effort. The last time I can remember a ferner doing on of these it was for Thorne in the lead up to the 2007 RWC - the conclusion was the same... drop him.
Haha nice try. Yet Henry was clear that Thorne was the only decent 6/lock going around. No one else in the squad was playing that role.
If only Henry didn’t save Thorne, Mauger and Ellis for the semi....
@act-crusader said in Japan vs All Blacks:
Yet Henry was clear that Thorne was the only decent 6/lock going around.
Quite the opposite. He was literally in a heads up battle that year against Flavell for the spot that season. Thorne edged according to Henry in part because a 6/lock was preferred to a lock/6 for squad balance as they already have four locks.
Anyway the initial post got picked up on Radio Sport and everything I want to say it was a Mr Mike contribution, but can't be sure - was a long time ago.
