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Winger

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="hydro11" data-cid="514108" data-time="1441626510">
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Winger if you were picking 4 flags you would at least have to pick the most popular flag with the public.
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But they didn't. From what I understand it was a different blue and black + SC fern flag
 
But that would have been my fourth pick (my 4th above was of course not being serious)
 
But then another three that work as flags, are different (so only 1 fern of the 4 not three FFS) and not just crowd favourites.
 
Then market each one. Including what it means plus a number of photos supporting the flag. As is being done with the Red Peak flag. I would have allowed a good budget and a minimum of 3 months for the 4 team to market their flags. And fly the 4 flags in many different locations around NZ.
 
And the selected 4 flags should also have been available to buy straight away at a reduced price.

red terror

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="canefan" data-cid="513899" data-time="1441577542">
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I don't think it will be loved straight off. But its been pointed out earlier that the Canadian flag by example was not universally liked, in fact there were many that hated it. Yet it is iconic now, and loved
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It's beloved in Canada because for over a century the maple leaf has always been the symbol of Canada, and was recognized the world over.
 
The "red peak" flag by comparison makes it look like Kiwis are heavily-heavily into triangles.

Winger

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="red terror" data-cid="514119" data-time="1441637398">
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It's beloved in Canada because for over a century the maple leaf has always been the symbol of Canada, and was recognized the world over.
 
The "red peak" flag by comparison makes it look like Kiwis are heavily-heavily into triangles.
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The 3 fern flags in the final 4 are rubbish (they are almost embarrassingly bad that NZ could not do much better). I really don't think any have a hope of being selected as a new flag
 
And the red peak looks good
 
But I'm willing to leave it up to the public. Is John willing to accept the selections are not right. And to add one and make it 5. Or drop one of the ferns?

Hooroo

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Winger" data-cid="514056" data-time="1441614016">I worked in a commercial Interior company many years back 
The head male designer was a little outrageous but did outstanding work. He knew what the companies wanted. So he would wear a certain type of clothes or choose a certain design for his house but knew that what he would do for himself was not appropriate for everyone 
The office we worked in (designed by this designer) was easily the best laid out and best colour schemes by miles that I have worked in. Even those that didn't like him agreed that he was top class. Many (or most that I have worked in) office color schemes are boring or clash. 
This is the sort of person that I'm referring to. But with an interest in flags.</blockquote>
To me that is the equivalent of saying GJ Gardner should have designed the flag because they designed a nice house

jegga

This sums up the people like Manhire behind the red peak and their sad behaviour recently quite nicely, the part about the abs is true. I've seen leftards saying theres a rift in the team because McCaw is close to Key and Kaino and Mealamu are staunch labour men and Key commercialised the beehive allowing adidas to use it to promote their brand. Get a life ffs.
 
<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/opinion/71791596/tiny-minority-has-its-say-far-too-late-in-flag-debate'>http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/opinion/71791596/tiny-minority-has-its-say-far-too-late-in-flag-debate</a>
 
Winger be sure to read this one and have a think about the company you're keeping 
 
<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/opinion/71783746/a-purrfect-example-of-why-politics-and-sport-dont-mix'>http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/opinion/71783746/a-purrfect-example-of-why-politics-and-sport-dont-mix</a>

Hooroo

Personally, if designers designed a decent flag it would have been chosen. 
The fact that the selectors were rather diverse in their backgrounds is probably the best reason they were chosen. Most New Zealanders can identify with at least one of them.

taniwharugby

What about all those professional flag pickers that went to Flag Picking University to obtain their masters in Flag Pickingology, it is criminal none of them were selected on the panel!

jegga

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="taniwharugby" data-cid="514134" data-time="1441652600">
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What about all those professional flag pickers that went to Flag Picking University to obtain their masters in Flag Pickingology, it is criminal none of them were selected on the panel!
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Tell me about it, we were trying to pick a flag the other night and we called the professional flag pickers company and judging by the voice on the end of the line they'd outsourced their flag picking to the Phillipines! Personally I think the decline of the flag picking industry can be blamed on the neoliberal agenda of the Key government and it saddens me to see this once thriving industry dying. My grandfather was a flag picker you know, I'm glad he's not around to see this.

Mokey

I'm not a fan of the peak at all. It's all very well to have paragraph after paragraph of explanation - this represents dawn, earth, southern alps blah blah blah, but that context will never be anywhere near the flagpole. Are we saying that dawn and earth and mountains are unique to NZ?
 
The fern is instantly recognisable as New Zealand. No paragraphs required. Saying a criteria is easily drawn, what a crock of shit (a fern is still much easier than the bird of paradise on the Papua New Guinea flag for example - instantly recognisable, don't hear them bitching about how hard it is to draw.)

Donsteppa

If we lost the current flag for the peak flag I'd be highly unimpressed. I'm very happy that it didn't make the top four.

JC

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Winger" data-cid="514095" data-time="1441623466">
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This is from PR. Agree 100%
 
The top 4 show just how clueless this panel was
 
<img src="https://scontent-lax3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpf1/t31.0-8/11950287_10153221845087672_8504148472277993304_o.jpg" alt="11950287_10153221845087672_8504148472277">
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The other day I was trying to explain to my nephew what a Straw Man argument is. But this is a far better example than anything I could have come up with. Outstanding work.

Winger

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="jegga" data-cid="514128" data-time="1441650898">
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This sums up the people like Manhire behind the red peak and their sad behaviour recently quite nicely, the part about the abs is true. I've seen leftards saying theres a rift in the team because McCaw is close to Key and Kaino and Mealamu are staunch labour men and Key commercialised the beehive allowing adidas to use it to promote their brand. Get a life ffs.
 
<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/opinion/71791596/tiny-minority-has-its-say-far-too-late-in-flag-debate'>http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/opinion/71791596/tiny-minority-has-its-say-far-too-late-in-flag-debate</a>
 
Winger be sure to read this one and have a think about the company you're keeping 
 
<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/opinion/71783746/a-purrfect-example-of-why-politics-and-sport-dont-mix'>http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/opinion/71783746/a-purrfect-example-of-why-politics-and-sport-dont-mix</a>
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Couldn't care in the slightest
 
The 4 final selections are crap. Three fern. Why three ferns FFS (only 1 was needed) and not even the best fern options
 
And the only non fern is not great. The flag selection committee didn't have a clue. Either how to generate more interest before the selections were made, select the flags or to market the flag when selected (it seems as an observer from the UK).
 
But I'm surprised more aren't backing a vote where people have a greater variety of choice. Rather than 3 ferns and an option that has got no show of either winning or replacing the current flag. Add at least one good alternative and give the public a sensible option to a fern.

Kirwan

Even it comes down to four or five designs, I think it's clear that NZ is going to vote to keep the current flag.
 
I like the Red Peak one, I can separate the crazy leftards from my own opinion on simplicity being better for a flag. Personally, I think we should ignore the ISIS issue and have a black flag with a white fern on it.

jegga

Have Robyn Malcolm or Lucy Lawless endorsed the red peak yet?

No Quarter

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Mokey" data-cid="514144" data-time="1441659711">
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I'm not a fan of the peak at all. It's all very well to have paragraph after paragraph of explanation - this represents dawn, earth, southern alps blah blah blah, but that context will never be anywhere near the flagpole. Are we saying that dawn and earth and mountains are unique to NZ?
 
The fern is instantly recognisable as New Zealand. No paragraphs required. Saying a criteria is easily drawn, what a crock of shit (a fern is still much easier than the bird of paradise on the Papua New Guinea flag for example - instantly recognisable, don't hear them bitching about how hard it is to draw.)
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If we are going to have the Fern then I would rather it look like an actual Fern, not a bloody feather like the Lockwood designs do.
 
The guy that did the AB Fern said he would be happy to help redesign it to make it look better - let's hope he gets taken up on that offer if we vote to change.
 
Edit - the comparison to the PNG flag is a good one. Very difficult to draw but I think they have one of the most beautiful flags of any nation. :)

Winger

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Hooroo" data-cid="514127" data-time="1441650849">
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To me that is the equivalent of saying GJ Gardner should have designed the flag because they designed a nice house
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The design process was good
 
But the process part from seems very poor. Esp the membership of the Flag Consideration Panel

Winger

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Kirwan" data-cid="514156" data-time="1441661725">
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Even it comes down to four or five designs, I think it's clear that NZ is going to vote to keep the current flag.
 
I like the Red Peak one, I can separate the crazy leftards from my own opinion on simplicity being better for a flag. Personally, I think we should ignore the ISIS issue and have a black flag with a white fern on it. 
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Agree. That should have been one of the options. And maybe only one more fern option.
 
Then let the public decide. Is the ISIS issue really an issue or not.

Baron Silas Greenback

The vast majority of the peak flag nonsense is driven by politics. Just another ill conceived attempt by the social media left in NZ to sabotage the process.
Firstly they whinged about the cost, then they whinged about the desire to change the flag at all, then they whinged about the final 4 options, then they whinged about the process.
It is now just a way that the left in NZ can justify the hypocrisy of their position, they campaigned on changing the flag... then they reliased John Key was going to do it.. so they strew a strop...now they want back in again... but with their own option.
 
Sorry fellas..

No Quarter

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Kirwan" data-cid="514156" data-time="1441661725">
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Even it comes down to four or five designs, I think it's clear that NZ is going to vote to keep the current flag.
 
I like the Red Peak one, I can separate the crazy leftards from my own opinion on simplicity being better for a flag. Personally, I think we should ignore the ISIS issue and have a black flag with a white fern on it. 
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The ISIS argument is such bullshit. We are actually going to let a group of fucking nutjobs from the other side of the world have an influence on what flag we choose to represent our nation?
 
And I don't care if people say it looks like a pirates flag either, I've always quite liked the idea of being a pirate searching for treasure. I had the epic collection of pirates lego when I was a kid.

taniwharugby

if they were to amend the process to allow the Red Peak, whats to stop another campaign to include a black flag with the white fern? Where does it stop?

The Silver Fern

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