TRC: The All Blacks against the Springboks (version 98)
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Ofa T is a good all round player but at scrum time he got folded like a tent twice by Trevor Nyakane
I would worry big time for Ofa T against European scrums especially if he play LH prop
TBH only AB prop I'd have full confidence in going into RWC is Franks against European sides
@Jaguares4real said in TRC: The All Blacks against the Springboks (version 98):
Ofa T is a good all round player but at scrum time he got folded like a tent twice by Trevor Nyakane
I would worry big time for Ofa T against European scrums especially if he play LH prop
TBH only AB prop I'd have full confidence in going into RWC is Franks against European sides
That only happened after Brodie left the field. Before that the scrum went great, pushing them off their ball.
Fifita is not a lock.
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@Rapido said in TRC: The All Blacks against the Springboks (version 98):
I though Moouga was good after shaky start.
Actually one of the few bright spots for me.
Dark spots are forward grunt lacking, tactics, some selections, and just getting old. Oh, and shit skills for entire first half .... and shit game management while such shit skills were putting us under pressure.
I thought our forwards looked much better after Angus and Ofa came on. The ability of those two with ball in hand (and in Ofa's case when he doesn't drop it) and in defence went a long way to us looking much more dynamic in attack in the 2nd half.
While Frizell went ok, better in the 2nd half, he still had minimal impact for such a unit.
Yes, he actually did quite a lot in that match (particularly in the 2nd half) but didn't do any of it with any real force. Maybe he's too nice a guy?
That said, I don't think selection issues does anything to deal with the real problem, which is dealing with the rush defence.
It appeared to me that we set-up our attack much differently to what we did last week against Argie, who also employ the rush D. Our runners seemd much more one-out, whereas against Argie, we ran in two-man pods and sent a lot of balls behind the decoy runners close to the ruck. (Someone posted a rugbypass article highlighting the new set-up in the Argie match - I wonder if they'll do something similar for this match.)
@junior said in TRC: The All Blacks against the Springboks (version 98):
@Rapido said in TRC: The All Blacks against the Springboks (version 98):
I though Moouga was good after shaky start.
Actually one of the few bright spots for me.
Dark spots are forward grunt lacking, tactics, some selections, and just getting old. Oh, and shit skills for entire first half .... and shit game management while such shit skills were putting us under pressure.
I thought our forwards looked much better after Angus and Ofa came on. The ability of those two with ball in hand (and in Ofa's case when he doesn't drop it) and in defence went a long way to us looking much more dynamic in attack in the 2nd half.
While Frizell went ok, better in the 2nd half, he still had minimal impact for such a unit.
Yes, he actually did quite a lot in that match (particularly in the 2nd half) but didn't do any of it with any real force. Maybe he's too nice a guy?
That said, I don't think selection issues does anything to deal with the real problem, which is dealing with the rush defence.
It appeared to me that we set-up our attack much differently to what we did last week against Argie, who also employ the rush D. Our runners seemd much more one-out, whereas against Argie, we ran in two-man pods and sent a lot of balls behind the decoy runners close to the ruck. (Someone posted a rugbypass article highlighting the new set-up in the Argie match - I wonder if they'll do something similar for this match.)
Sonny Bill’s attacking runs were very much one-out and that has been the case ever since he first started. It’s both a good and bad thing.
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@junior said in TRC: The All Blacks against the Springboks (version 98):
@Rapido said in TRC: The All Blacks against the Springboks (version 98):
I though Moouga was good after shaky start.
Actually one of the few bright spots for me.
Dark spots are forward grunt lacking, tactics, some selections, and just getting old. Oh, and shit skills for entire first half .... and shit game management while such shit skills were putting us under pressure.
I thought our forwards looked much better after Angus and Ofa came on. The ability of those two with ball in hand (and in Ofa's case when he doesn't drop it) and in defence went a long way to us looking much more dynamic in attack in the 2nd half.
While Frizell went ok, better in the 2nd half, he still had minimal impact for such a unit.
Yes, he actually did quite a lot in that match (particularly in the 2nd half) but didn't do any of it with any real force. Maybe he's too nice a guy?
That said, I don't think selection issues does anything to deal with the real problem, which is dealing with the rush defence.
It appeared to me that we set-up our attack much differently to what we did last week against Argie, who also employ the rush D. Our runners seemd much more one-out, whereas against Argie, we ran in two-man pods and sent a lot of balls behind the decoy runners close to the ruck. (Someone posted a rugbypass article highlighting the new set-up in the Argie match - I wonder if they'll do something similar for this match.)
Sonny Bill’s attacking runs were very much one-out and that has been the case ever since he first started. It’s both a good and bad thing.
@ACT-Crusader said in TRC: The All Blacks against the Springboks (version 98):
@junior said in TRC: The All Blacks against the Springboks (version 98):
@Rapido said in TRC: The All Blacks against the Springboks (version 98):
I though Moouga was good after shaky start.
Actually one of the few bright spots for me.
Dark spots are forward grunt lacking, tactics, some selections, and just getting old. Oh, and shit skills for entire first half .... and shit game management while such shit skills were putting us under pressure.
I thought our forwards looked much better after Angus and Ofa came on. The ability of those two with ball in hand (and in Ofa's case when he doesn't drop it) and in defence went a long way to us looking much more dynamic in attack in the 2nd half.
While Frizell went ok, better in the 2nd half, he still had minimal impact for such a unit.
Yes, he actually did quite a lot in that match (particularly in the 2nd half) but didn't do any of it with any real force. Maybe he's too nice a guy?
That said, I don't think selection issues does anything to deal with the real problem, which is dealing with the rush defence.
It appeared to me that we set-up our attack much differently to what we did last week against Argie, who also employ the rush D. Our runners seemd much more one-out, whereas against Argie, we ran in two-man pods and sent a lot of balls behind the decoy runners close to the ruck. (Someone posted a rugbypass article highlighting the new set-up in the Argie match - I wonder if they'll do something similar for this match.)
Sonny Bill’s attacking runs were very much one-out and that has been the case ever since he first started. It’s both a good and bad thing.
I don't care how good a ball-runner he is - or ever was - it's not a good strategy to send a guy up one-out and straight into 2-3 big Bok loose forwards. He's only ever going to go backwards. Even Ma'a would really battle in that role. Additionally, the offloading game only works if there are supporting player there to receive the offload. In either case, the way they used SBW on Saturday made very little sense to me.
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@ACT-Crusader said in TRC: The All Blacks against the Springboks (version 98):
@junior said in TRC: The All Blacks against the Springboks (version 98):
@Rapido said in TRC: The All Blacks against the Springboks (version 98):
I though Moouga was good after shaky start.
Actually one of the few bright spots for me.
Dark spots are forward grunt lacking, tactics, some selections, and just getting old. Oh, and shit skills for entire first half .... and shit game management while such shit skills were putting us under pressure.
I thought our forwards looked much better after Angus and Ofa came on. The ability of those two with ball in hand (and in Ofa's case when he doesn't drop it) and in defence went a long way to us looking much more dynamic in attack in the 2nd half.
While Frizell went ok, better in the 2nd half, he still had minimal impact for such a unit.
Yes, he actually did quite a lot in that match (particularly in the 2nd half) but didn't do any of it with any real force. Maybe he's too nice a guy?
That said, I don't think selection issues does anything to deal with the real problem, which is dealing with the rush defence.
It appeared to me that we set-up our attack much differently to what we did last week against Argie, who also employ the rush D. Our runners seemd much more one-out, whereas against Argie, we ran in two-man pods and sent a lot of balls behind the decoy runners close to the ruck. (Someone posted a rugbypass article highlighting the new set-up in the Argie match - I wonder if they'll do something similar for this match.)
Sonny Bill’s attacking runs were very much one-out and that has been the case ever since he first started. It’s both a good and bad thing.
I don't care how good a ball-runner he is - or ever was - it's not a good strategy to send a guy up one-out and straight into 2-3 big Bok loose forwards. He's only ever going to go backwards. Even Ma'a would really battle in that role. Additionally, the offloading game only works if there are supporting player there to receive the offload. In either case, the way they used SBW on Saturday made very little sense to me.
@junior agree. Saturday was poor. In the past he’s at least been able to run angles when he ran, whereas he was just doing hit ups into massive traffic.
I still think Crotty-ALB gives us the best balance.
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@ACT-Crusader said in TRC: The All Blacks against the Springboks (version 98):
@junior said in TRC: The All Blacks against the Springboks (version 98):
@Rapido said in TRC: The All Blacks against the Springboks (version 98):
I though Moouga was good after shaky start.
Actually one of the few bright spots for me.
Dark spots are forward grunt lacking, tactics, some selections, and just getting old. Oh, and shit skills for entire first half .... and shit game management while such shit skills were putting us under pressure.
I thought our forwards looked much better after Angus and Ofa came on. The ability of those two with ball in hand (and in Ofa's case when he doesn't drop it) and in defence went a long way to us looking much more dynamic in attack in the 2nd half.
While Frizell went ok, better in the 2nd half, he still had minimal impact for such a unit.
Yes, he actually did quite a lot in that match (particularly in the 2nd half) but didn't do any of it with any real force. Maybe he's too nice a guy?
That said, I don't think selection issues does anything to deal with the real problem, which is dealing with the rush defence.
It appeared to me that we set-up our attack much differently to what we did last week against Argie, who also employ the rush D. Our runners seemd much more one-out, whereas against Argie, we ran in two-man pods and sent a lot of balls behind the decoy runners close to the ruck. (Someone posted a rugbypass article highlighting the new set-up in the Argie match - I wonder if they'll do something similar for this match.)
Sonny Bill’s attacking runs were very much one-out and that has been the case ever since he first started. It’s both a good and bad thing.
I don't care how good a ball-runner he is - or ever was - it's not a good strategy to send a guy up one-out and straight into 2-3 big Bok loose forwards. He's only ever going to go backwards. Even Ma'a would really battle in that role. Additionally, the offloading game only works if there are supporting player there to receive the offload. In either case, the way they used SBW on Saturday made very little sense to me.
SBW was ineffective last night
He had 11 runs for 14m with no defenders beaten, no clean breaks and no offloads
When he carried it up he was handled with ease
Pollard along with Farrell is one of the physical fly half in the game & tackle ferociously -
Ofa T is a good all round player but at scrum time he got folded like a tent twice by Trevor Nyakane
I would worry big time for Ofa T against European scrums especially if he play LH prop
TBH only AB prop I'd have full confidence in going into RWC is Franks against European sides
@Jaguares4real said in TRC: The All Blacks against the Springboks (version 98):
Ofa T is a good all round player but at scrum time he got folded like a tent twice by Trevor Nyakane
I would worry big time for Ofa T against European scrums especially if he play LH prop
TBH only AB prop I'd have full confidence in going into RWC is Franks against European sides
I think we agree about Ofa at LH. Nyakane seems VERY effective against taller LHs.
Moody and Franks have been solid as against all comers in past few years. Moody has airlifted Puma LHs and only one I recall him having problems with was Antonio. Karl T and Nepo are also first rate, albeit with the occasional wobble.
Nepo and Franks don't have a second gear, which limits them around park.
After yesterday, for me Karl and Joe are locks at LH. Ofa best utility. Two of Franks/Nepo/Angus for TH. Angus is OK at TH but has much more around the park than other two, so will come down to what TWM are looking for.
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@Jaguares4real said in TRC: The All Blacks against the Springboks (version 98):
Ofa T is a good all round player but at scrum time he got folded like a tent twice by Trevor Nyakane
I would worry big time for Ofa T against European scrums especially if he play LH prop
TBH only AB prop I'd have full confidence in going into RWC is Franks against European sides
I think we agree about Ofa at LH. Nyakane seems VERY effective against taller LHs.
Moody and Franks have been solid as against all comers in past few years. Moody has airlifted Puma LHs and only one I recall him having problems with was Antonio. Karl T and Nepo are also first rate, albeit with the occasional wobble.
Nepo and Franks don't have a second gear, which limits them around park.
After yesterday, for me Karl and Joe are locks at LH. Ofa best utility. Two of Franks/Nepo/Angus for TH. Angus is OK at TH but has much more around the park than other two, so will come down to what TWM are looking for.
I wouldn't take too much stock into crushing Pumas props with the exception of Chip Figallo These are not the Pumas who crushed all other opposing props in recent times
Moody and Franks are fine Beyond that there're ????
Karl being match fit and handling Irish/Eng props
Nepo being the same guy againI highly rate Ta'avao and Moli seems a good talent
TBH I'd take 6 props to RWC 2019 - Franks Moody Moli Ta'avo Ofa T Big Karl
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@Jaguares4real said in TRC: The All Blacks against the Springboks (version 98):
Clearout was fine
First time I've seen the vision.
You have an interesting idea about what constitutes "fine". Cleanout was the very definition of illegal.
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@Machpants said in TRC: The All Blacks against the Springboks (version 98):
@pakman how much was losing BBBR in that? I can't remember exactly
From memory Fifita was only LH lock in second poor scrum. But on hit Ofa's shoulders got bent to the right and once he was at 45 degrees who was behind him at lock probably didn't matter. Could have done with a good shove from his flanker, which by then was Papali'i.
@pakman said in TRC: The All Blacks against the Springboks (version 98):
@Machpants said in TRC: The All Blacks against the Springboks (version 98):
@pakman how much was losing BBBR in that? I can't remember exactly
From memory Fifita was only LH lock in second poor scrum. But on hit Ofa's shoulders got bent to the right and once he was at 45 degrees who was behind him at lock probably didn't matter. Could have done with a good shove from his flanker, which by then was Papali'i.
BBBR is the TH lock when he plays and I would have expected Whitelock to switch sides once Brodie was replaced by Fifita.
After yesterday, for me Karl and Joe are locks at LH. Ofa best utility. Two of Franks/Nepo/Angus for TH. Angus is OK at TH but has much more around the park than other two, so will come down to what TWM are looking for.
You really want something different from your reserve props so Ta'avao is a more sensible option than Laulala. The fact Angus was picked ahead of Nepo might suggest the coaches are thinking the same. Selection for the Perth test might provide some clarity on their pecking order. Karl needs to play to force his case because you can't pick him on June 2018 form. His EOYT form was very average.
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@booboo whoever posted that and wrote the tweet is really naff. So the clean out is fine cause Retallick was in on the side. So the cleanout which came from even further from the side was legal???
@Rebound said in TRC: The All Blacks against the Springboks (version 98):
@booboo whoever posted that and wrote the tweet is really naff. So the clean out is fine cause Retallick was in on the side. So the cleanout which came from even further from the side was legal???
He's a South African.
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@ACT-Crusader said in TRC: The All Blacks against the Springboks (version 98):
@junior said in TRC: The All Blacks against the Springboks (version 98):
@Rapido said in TRC: The All Blacks against the Springboks (version 98):
I though Moouga was good after shaky start.
Actually one of the few bright spots for me.
Dark spots are forward grunt lacking, tactics, some selections, and just getting old. Oh, and shit skills for entire first half .... and shit game management while such shit skills were putting us under pressure.
I thought our forwards looked much better after Angus and Ofa came on. The ability of those two with ball in hand (and in Ofa's case when he doesn't drop it) and in defence went a long way to us looking much more dynamic in attack in the 2nd half.
While Frizell went ok, better in the 2nd half, he still had minimal impact for such a unit.
Yes, he actually did quite a lot in that match (particularly in the 2nd half) but didn't do any of it with any real force. Maybe he's too nice a guy?
That said, I don't think selection issues does anything to deal with the real problem, which is dealing with the rush defence.
It appeared to me that we set-up our attack much differently to what we did last week against Argie, who also employ the rush D. Our runners seemd much more one-out, whereas against Argie, we ran in two-man pods and sent a lot of balls behind the decoy runners close to the ruck. (Someone posted a rugbypass article highlighting the new set-up in the Argie match - I wonder if they'll do something similar for this match.)
Sonny Bill’s attacking runs were very much one-out and that has been the case ever since he first started. It’s both a good and bad thing.
I don't care how good a ball-runner he is - or ever was - it's not a good strategy to send a guy up one-out and straight into 2-3 big Bok loose forwards. He's only ever going to go backwards. Even Ma'a would really battle in that role. Additionally, the offloading game only works if there are supporting player there to receive the offload. In either case, the way they used SBW on Saturday made very little sense to me.
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@pakman said in TRC: The All Blacks against the Springboks (version 98):
@Machpants said in TRC: The All Blacks against the Springboks (version 98):
@pakman how much was losing BBBR in that? I can't remember exactly
From memory Fifita was only LH lock in second poor scrum. But on hit Ofa's shoulders got bent to the right and once he was at 45 degrees who was behind him at lock probably didn't matter. Could have done with a good shove from his flanker, which by then was Papali'i.
BBBR is the TH lock when he plays and I would have expected Whitelock to switch sides once Brodie was replaced by Fifita.
After yesterday, for me Karl and Joe are locks at LH. Ofa best utility. Two of Franks/Nepo/Angus for TH. Angus is OK at TH but has much more around the park than other two, so will come down to what TWM are looking for.
You really want something different from your reserve props so Ta'avao is a more sensible option than Laulala. The fact Angus was picked ahead of Nepo might suggest the coaches are thinking the same. Selection for the Perth test might provide some clarity on their pecking order. Karl needs to play to force his case because you can't pick him on June 2018 form. His EOYT form was very average.
You really want something different from your reserve props so Ta'avao is a more sensible option than Laulala. The fact Angus was picked ahead of Nepo might suggest the coaches are thinking the same. Selection for the Perth test might provide some clarity on their pecking order. Karl needs to play to force his case because you can't pick him on June 2018 form. His EOYT form was very average.
Karl T nees a run?! Seems TWM leaning towards Ta'avao...
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@junior I don’t think Hansen was happy with SBWs effort. Dragged early. Back to Counties. Indicating to me that he didn’t do what was planned.
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@pakman Yep, he looked lethal. I also thought his option-taking was excellent and, IMO, he didn't look at "stressed" as he often does playing in the 10 jersey.
And as I said before it’s all a knock on effect of BB flaky goalkicking. ABs are not scoring enough tries to count on BB kicking goals. Mounga has to be the goal kicker and BB has to go to 15 and Bender has to be on the wing. That said not sure I have seen a game where our wings posed zero threat on attack.
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@KiwiMurph well the info is a bit contradictory. it's all 'SBW just needs to play as much footy as possible, that's why he's going to counties', and at the same time 'sub!'.
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@Duluth said in TRC: The All Blacks against the Springboks (version 98):
@Snowy said in TRC: The All Blacks against the Springboks (version 98):
Nah. He is an AB fullback to me. He has been shifted to wing when it suits, but he is a full back.
Smith offers so much more at fullback. He’s ok on the wing, but I want him touching the ball more often and making more decisions
Want Bender in the team as wise heads are essential come knock out time. That said, Beaudy looked deadly at 15 and was my MOTM. Bender available at 14 OR 15 is for me a good arrow to have in the quiver.
@pakman said in TRC: The All Blacks against the Springboks (version 98):
@Duluth said in TRC: The All Blacks against the Springboks (version 98):
@Snowy said in TRC: The All Blacks against the Springboks (version 98):
Nah. He is an AB fullback to me. He has been shifted to wing when it suits, but he is a full back.
Smith offers so much more at fullback. He’s ok on the wing, but I want him touching the ball more often and making more decisions
Want Bender in the team as wise heads are essential come knock out time. That said, Beaudy looked deadly at 15 and was my MOTM. Bender available at 14 OR 15 is for me a good arrow to have in the quiver.
I've been dead against the BB at 15 brigade, mostly because he's the best 10 and I have doubts about RM at 10. But after the other night I'm starting to change my tune. He isn't just a good 15, he could be a great 15. We only need RM not to fark up and to kick goals. I think it's worth giving another shot. The worst case is that BB just goes back to 10.
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I think we miss Dmac.
Him at 15 kicking goals, BB at 10, and RM off the bench, and we’d be far more dangerous (or any other combination that doesn’t involve Dmac starting at 10 as well).
Given the cattle we’ve got, I think we should start Barrett at 10, get Smith back to 15, and go full out attack. Bring Richie (and probably ALB, although it would be Laumape or Ennor in my team) off the bench with 20 to go, and try to run wild. The kicking has and will be a problem, and may be the losing of a game, but I don’t see how we’ll beat teams kicking penalties anyway.
If we do want to play Barrett at FB, then Smith’s position has to be under threat ala Mils in 2011. Luckily for Smith, Bridge was lost on defense, which may be his savior.
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I think we miss Dmac.
Him at 15 kicking goals, BB at 10, and RM off the bench, and we’d be far more dangerous (or any other combination that doesn’t involve Dmac starting at 10 as well).
Given the cattle we’ve got, I think we should start Barrett at 10, get Smith back to 15, and go full out attack. Bring Richie (and probably ALB, although it would be Laumape or Ennor in my team) off the bench with 20 to go, and try to run wild. The kicking has and will be a problem, and may be the losing of a game, but I don’t see how we’ll beat teams kicking penalties anyway.
If we do want to play Barrett at FB, then Smith’s position has to be under threat ala Mils in 2011. Luckily for Smith, Bridge was lost on defense, which may be his savior.
@gt12 said in TRC: The All Blacks against the Springboks (version 98):
I think we miss Dmac.
Him at 15 kicking goals, BB at 10, and RM off the bench, and we’d be far more dangerous (or any other combination that doesn’t involve Dmac starting at 10 as well).
Given the cattle we’ve got, I think we should start Barrett at 10, get Smith back to 15, and go full out attack. Bring Richie (and probably ALB, although it would be Laumape or Ennor in my team) off the bench with 20 to go, and try to run wild. The kicking has and will be a problem, and may be the losing of a game, but I don’t see how we’ll beat teams kicking penalties anyway.
If we do want to play Barrett at FB, then Smith’s position has to be under threat ala Mils in 2011. Luckily for Smith, Bridge was lost on defense, which may be his savior.
So if DMac was available Ben Smith wouldn’t be in the starting lineup?
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@gt12 said in TRC: The All Blacks against the Springboks (version 98):
I think we miss Dmac.
Him at 15 kicking goals, BB at 10, and RM off the bench, and we’d be far more dangerous (or any other combination that doesn’t involve Dmac starting at 10 as well).
Given the cattle we’ve got, I think we should start Barrett at 10, get Smith back to 15, and go full out attack. Bring Richie (and probably ALB, although it would be Laumape or Ennor in my team) off the bench with 20 to go, and try to run wild. The kicking has and will be a problem, and may be the losing of a game, but I don’t see how we’ll beat teams kicking penalties anyway.
If we do want to play Barrett at FB, then Smith’s position has to be under threat ala Mils in 2011. Luckily for Smith, Bridge was lost on defense, which may be his savior.
So if DMac was available Ben Smith wouldn’t be in the starting lineup?
He’d be under the same pressure he is now.
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I think we miss Dmac.
Him at 15 kicking goals, BB at 10, and RM off the bench, and we’d be far more dangerous (or any other combination that doesn’t involve Dmac starting at 10 as well).
Given the cattle we’ve got, I think we should start Barrett at 10, get Smith back to 15, and go full out attack. Bring Richie (and probably ALB, although it would be Laumape or Ennor in my team) off the bench with 20 to go, and try to run wild. The kicking has and will be a problem, and may be the losing of a game, but I don’t see how we’ll beat teams kicking penalties anyway.
If we do want to play Barrett at FB, then Smith’s position has to be under threat ala Mils in 2011. Luckily for Smith, Bridge was lost on defense, which may be his savior.
@gt12 said in TRC: The All Blacks against the Springboks (version 98):
The kicking has and will be a problem, and may be the losing of a game, but I don’t see how we’ll beat teams kicking penalties anyway.That's dangerously close to what Robbie Deans said in 2003. I think his words were, "Goal kicking won't be a point of difference".
I thought at the time that wasn't his sharpest observation.
Lots of scenarios where kicking the extra goal can prove crucial.
