Flag

Billy Tell

Brilliant by Key I must say. He's said he'd add a 5th flag (ie red peak) if Labour support the move. Your move Labour...

Winger

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Billy Tell" data-cid="515721" data-time="1442222344">
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Brilliant by Key I must say. He's said he'd add a 5th flag (ie red peak) if Labour support the move. Your move Labour...
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Is Little as bad as he comes across in this article
 
John has made a fair offer and then Little comes across as a complete fool. Playing a childish political games. Just agree to adding the 5th flag and then lets have the vote. The choice of an alternative flag must come first as then people know what they are voting for in a keep the flag vote
 
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote">
<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/political/284190/a-flutter-of-hope-for-red-peak'>http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/political/284190/a-flutter-of-hope-for-red-peak</a>
 
Mr Key said there would have to be agreement from the whole Parliament.
"And if Labour want to publicly come out and support the process and the change, that it's an appropriate thing to do and argue that it's an appropriate thing to do... then we might, but that hasn't been what they've done so far."
Labour Party leader Andrew Little said John Key did not need Labour's support to add the Red Peak design to the flag referendum.
He said John Key wanted broad support for purely political reasons, not because he needed it.
"I'm prepared to support what he wants provided he changes the order of the questions in the referendum, providing he makes the first referendum 'Do you want a flag change or not?', and then then if the question is answered positively, then we're going to choose the flag that we want.
"That's what a lot of New Zealanders want, they're telling us they are concerned about the flawed process."
Mr Little said personally he was keen on the Red Peak design.
Mr Key said it was not just about the Red Peak option, it's about the whole process.
"I'm not just going to play games over one thing, if they're going to actually honour their policy and go out there and say, we now support a free vote, we're going to participate, we'll be fully engaged and we'll stop all this mindless bagging, on political grounds, and have a proper debate, then yeah we'll see how it goes."
He said a law change would be required to add the flag to the referendum, and New Zealand First was totally opposed to any law change, so he would not require its support.
Mr Key said if there was broad political support to change the law, then he could consider it.
 
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canefan

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Winger" data-cid="515725" data-time="1442223560">Is Little as bad as he comes across in this article 
 
John has made a fair offer and then Little comes across as a complete fool. Playing a childish political games. Just agree to adding the 5th flag and then lets have the vote. The choice of an alternative flag must come first as then people know what they are voting for in a keep the flag vote</blockquote>Just like the early opening story of the RWC the right offers a seemingly reasonable proposition and given enough rope the forces on the left have been left looking petty

Billy Tell

I've already said I'd vote for pretty much any new flag, including red peak. But John Key has nicely called Little's bluff. He knows Labour are opposed to Key himself not the flag. So this little offer puts them in a bit of a pickle. He's right though, lots of people poo-pooing the process, sniping from the sidelines, then all of a sudden rallying behind a flag that the due process didn't choose...but if they really want that flag, then they will need to agree to change the law through parliament. Key is totally right imo that he can't let social media make him add an extra flag, especially as he is not actually on the flag committee. As for the idea of first asking whether you want a change or not, that is patently stupid - you are asking people to choose between the flag they know, and a mysterious but as yet unannounced flag.

Winger

Red peak petition. Over 45,000 now. Vote to support NZ'ers having a real alternative to a fern flag
 
<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://www.change.org/p/prime-minister-john-key-red-peaks-for-new-zealand-flag'>https://www.change.org/p/prime-minister-john-key-red-peaks-for-new-zealand-flag</a>
 
I'm confident that if it is added as the 5th flag and people get to see the flag flying outside it will get good support
 
<img src="http://www.stuff.co.nz/content/dam/images/1/6/q/9/g/d/image.related.StuffLandscapeSixteenByNine.620x349.16q8ww.png/1441679906915.jpg" alt="1441679906915.jpg">

Billy Tell

There is no way I'd vote on that. Send the petition instead to the opposition MPs to support a legal change to the process. But that isn't what they really want is it? Anyway I'm going to join the rest of the forum in leaving you to your "red peak" crusade there winger. The topic gets a bit boring quickly.

canefan

I find it amusing that the plagiarising bastard couldn't even think of a different name, Peak Engineering and Red Peak

No Quarter

Yup Peak Engineering already using the design is a deal breaker. We can't be the country that adopted the logo of a company to use as our flag, no matter how nice the explanation of it may be. 
If they are going to add another flag I'd much prefer it to be Silver Fern on black.

Winger

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="No Quarter" data-cid="515744" data-time="1442227987">
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Yup Peak Engineering already using the design is a deal breaker. We can't be the country that adopted the logo of a company to use as our flag, no matter how nice the explanation of it may be. 
If they are going to add another flag I'd much prefer it to be Silver Fern on black.
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So have 4 ferns out of 5. Why not drop the only non fern option and make it 4 out of 4

red terror

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Winger" data-cid="515755" data-time="1442231214">
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So have 4 ferns out of 5. Why not drop the only non fern option and make it 4 out of 4
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Yeah, imagine that? - making one of the choices the option that many Kiwis are already using to identify themselves.
 
I reckon if you put a silver-fern-on-black flag in a head-to-head vote against "red peak," the latter would get it's ass kicked.

Winger

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="red terror" data-cid="515764" data-time="1442237742">
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Yeah, imagine that? - making one of the choices the option that many Kiwis are already using to identify themselves.
 
I reckon if you put a silver-fern-on-black flag in a head-to-head vote against "red peak," the latter would get it's ass kicked.
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Ive said above that two of the flags should have been the red peak and white fern on black. But its too late for another fern flag now. There's already 3 out of 4
 
And I would think the opposite
 
We already have the fern on black for sporting events. Its fine and would still be used for this but not for the main flag. And if that was the only choice and people had the chance to see them outside side by side over time (say flying at many locations around NZ) then the red peak would win.

TeWaio

I've run out of likes, but the theory that Winger is a bot was one of the funniest things I've ever read on here...

Billy Tell

<img src="https://scontent-vie1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xlf1/v/t1.0-9/11987163_10153629165472002_5264081547924207462_n.jpg?oh=8a9573526737e52f63038b04a2ee235a&oe=566E14E3" alt="11987163_10153629165472002_5264081547924">
 
This is actually quite funny...

taniwharugby

so Labour (Little) claim that Key offering them the opportunity to endorse it is just a ruse...he said they can make the change very easily if they removed one of the existing 4 and replaced it with RP, he also wants to save some $$$ by having the whole shebang done on the same ballot...cant just remove one option as this was picked following the process, if you want to simply remove an option, you may as well start the selection process again, adding an option due to social media pressure...?
 
Not sure how this would work, if you have too many options, as in which of these flags do you like best, and then a Yes or no to change question, it muddies things.
 
I think this is the best way to do it, asking up fornt for change yes or no wont work because it is easy to go with the status quo if you don't have something to go with.
 
Choose the flag, then ask the question, keep this flag or change to this flag, is the best way to go.

Virgil

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Winger" data-cid="515736" data-time="1442226001">
Red peak petition. Over 45,000 now. Vote to support NZ'ers having a real alternative to a fern flag <a class="bbc_url" href="https://www.change.org/p/prime-minister-john-key-red-peaks-for-new-zealand-flag">https://www.change.org/p/prime-minister-john-key-red-peaks-for-new-zealand-flag</a> 
I'm confident that if it is added as the 5th flag and people get to see the flag flying outside it will get good support <img src="http://www.stuff.co.nz/content/dam/images/1/6/q/9/g/d/image.related.StuffLandscapeSixteenByNine.620x349.16q8ww.png/1441679906915.jpg" alt="1441679906915.jpg"></blockquote>
Any flag shown in that setting would look spectacular, but in the cold harsh light of day it looks batshit boring as fuck and as a logo. 
I'd go far as to say the supposed ground swell in favour of peak engineering is due solely to that picture.

Kirwan

Not so much, I was persuaded by that design because of the simplicity of it, and the fact it looks like a flag. Flags need to look good small and large, and the current fern designs look too busy IMO.

WillieTheWaiter

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Virgil" data-cid="515800" data-time="1442264656">
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Any flag shown in that setting would look spectacular, but in the cold harsh light of day it looks batshit boring as fuck and as a logo. 
I'd go far as to say the supposed ground swell in favour of peak engineering is due solely to that picture.
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every time I see that flag I'm just reminded of a british airways plane tail.
 
does nothing for me.

red terror

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="WillieTheWaiter" data-cid="515819" data-time="1442270345">
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every time I see that flag I'm just reminded of a british airways plane tail.
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I wish I was so lucky.
 
Every time I see "red peak," I see this:
 
<img src="http://www.bible-study-lessons.com/images/Dianetics-1.jpg" alt="Dianetics-1.jpg">
 
 
And lest you think I'm ridiculous, yes I am, the Sea Org uses a symbolic triangle to represent their volcano, too.
 
<img src="http://www.dianeticsredwoodcity.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/08/5square1.jpg" alt="5square1.jpg">
 
 
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote">...the theory that Winger is a bot was one of the funniest things I've ever read on here...</blockquote>
 
(I was beginning to think maybe an Operating Thetan, Level III.)

Winger

<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://www.change.org/p/prime-minister-john-key-red-peaks-for-new-zealand-flag'>https://www.change.org/p/prime-minister-john-key-red-peaks-for-new-zealand-flag</a>
Just hit 50,000

No Quarter

Just hit the only 50,000 people that give a shit. 
Well I drove past a bar that was flying the AB Silver Fern flag next to another countries. And it looked fucking bad ass. I'm sold.

The Silver Fern

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