Possible All Blacks 2020
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@mariner4life said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@mariner4life said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@mariner4life said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Stargazer said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@cgrant I'm still on the fence. Rieko Ioane has to improve a lot to come into the ABs midfield (other than as an emergency injury cover). He was terrible against the Stormers, but it's early days. He needs to play there consistently to improve, so give him time.
I didn't name Aso, yet, for the same reason (e.g. not quite there, yet), but IMO he's ahead of Ioane at the moment for a spot in the ABs midfield.
He was far from terrible, that's not accurate at all. Also, he's player centre a few times for the All Blacks already.
but he's behind proven midfield test players like Jordie Barrett...
I don't get the Jordie hate either, very useful to have a player that can play 15,wing,12 and 10 at a pinch. Not mention his goalkicking.
If we had dumped Nonu when he was at the same stage of his career making all his mistakes we'd have missed out on one of the greats. These players are in their early 20s!
we did dump Ma'a, and he came back a much better player.
There is a huge difference between "not good enough now" and "should never play tests again" and i don't get how on here saying one automatically means the other. J Barrett has all the talent in the world, and should still have a good test career, but i am not sure he should be in the team yet.
And we have done the same for Jordie, yet he gets used as punch line here quite often. Quite seperate from how he's actually performing.
That happens to a few players, you get a Fern reputation then it just gets repeated ad nauseum.
oh i freely admit to going waaaay over the top with that, it's become a thing
but in my admittedly feeble defense, it's as a reaction to the over the top hype the kid gets, and the rating compared to performance.
This place is getting boring enough with the constant bringing up of facts rather than just allowing a discussion to generate. Over the top discussions about players is all we have left. I rag on the Barretts, others see everything named Ioane as being dogshit. Let us have some pub discussions, or we may as well just turn this place in to google.
"just refer to the front page"
Conversations on a forum are more interesting when there is more depth than "He sucks". Over and over again.
Or the Akira is fat jokes.
Especially when players like Jordie are actually playing well this year. Things change.
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@mariner4life said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@mariner4life said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@mariner4life said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Stargazer said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@cgrant I'm still on the fence. Rieko Ioane has to improve a lot to come into the ABs midfield (other than as an emergency injury cover). He was terrible against the Stormers, but it's early days. He needs to play there consistently to improve, so give him time.
I didn't name Aso, yet, for the same reason (e.g. not quite there, yet), but IMO he's ahead of Ioane at the moment for a spot in the ABs midfield.
He was far from terrible, that's not accurate at all. Also, he's player centre a few times for the All Blacks already.
but he's behind proven midfield test players like Jordie Barrett...
I don't get the Jordie hate either, very useful to have a player that can play 15,wing,12 and 10 at a pinch. Not mention his goalkicking.
If we had dumped Nonu when he was at the same stage of his career making all his mistakes we'd have missed out on one of the greats. These players are in their early 20s!
we did dump Ma'a, and he came back a much better player.
There is a huge difference between "not good enough now" and "should never play tests again" and i don't get how on here saying one automatically means the other. J Barrett has all the talent in the world, and should still have a good test career, but i am not sure he should be in the team yet.
And we have done the same for Jordie, yet he gets used as punch line here quite often. Quite seperate from how he's actually performing.
That happens to a few players, you get a Fern reputation then it just gets repeated ad nauseum.
oh i freely admit to going waaaay over the top with that, it's become a thing
but in my admittedly feeble defense, it's as a reaction to the over the top hype the kid gets, and the rating compared to performance.
This place is getting boring enough with the constant bringing up of facts rather than just allowing a discussion to generate. Over the top discussions about players is all we have left. I rag on the Barretts, others see everything named Ioane as being dogshit. Let us have some pub discussions, or we may as well just turn this place in to google.
"just refer to the front page"
Conversations on a forum are more interesting when there is more depth than "He sucks". Over and over again.
Or the Akira is fat jokes.
Especially when players like Jordie are actually playing well this year. Things change.
fair comment
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It’s really difficult change the initial perception of a player
It happened with Nonu, to a lesser extent it happened with Crockett. But it is rare.
I think Tuipulotu might be doing this now.
Jordie probably needs a season as a starter for things to change. So it may not happen at all
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@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@mariner4life said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@mariner4life said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@mariner4life said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Stargazer said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@cgrant I'm still on the fence. Rieko Ioane has to improve a lot to come into the ABs midfield (other than as an emergency injury cover). He was terrible against the Stormers, but it's early days. He needs to play there consistently to improve, so give him time.
I didn't name Aso, yet, for the same reason (e.g. not quite there, yet), but IMO he's ahead of Ioane at the moment for a spot in the ABs midfield.
He was far from terrible, that's not accurate at all. Also, he's player centre a few times for the All Blacks already.
but he's behind proven midfield test players like Jordie Barrett...
I don't get the Jordie hate either, very useful to have a player that can play 15,wing,12 and 10 at a pinch. Not mention his goalkicking.
If we had dumped Nonu when he was at the same stage of his career making all his mistakes we'd have missed out on one of the greats. These players are in their early 20s!
we did dump Ma'a, and he came back a much better player.
There is a huge difference between "not good enough now" and "should never play tests again" and i don't get how on here saying one automatically means the other. J Barrett has all the talent in the world, and should still have a good test career, but i am not sure he should be in the team yet.
And we have done the same for Jordie, yet he gets used as punch line here quite often. Quite seperate from how he's actually performing.
That happens to a few players, you get a Fern reputation then it just gets repeated ad nauseum.
oh i freely admit to going waaaay over the top with that, it's become a thing
but in my admittedly feeble defense, it's as a reaction to the over the top hype the kid gets, and the rating compared to performance.
This place is getting boring enough with the constant bringing up of facts rather than just allowing a discussion to generate. Over the top discussions about players is all we have left. I rag on the Barretts, others see everything named Ioane as being dogshit. Let us have some pub discussions, or we may as well just turn this place in to google.
"just refer to the front page"
Conversations on a forum are more interesting when there is more depth than "He sucks". Over and over again.
Or the Akira is fat jokes.
Especially when players like Jordie are actually playing well this year. Things change.
fair comment
@mariner4life said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@mariner4life said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@mariner4life said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@mariner4life said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Stargazer said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@cgrant I'm still on the fence. Rieko Ioane has to improve a lot to come into the ABs midfield (other than as an emergency injury cover). He was terrible against the Stormers, but it's early days. He needs to play there consistently to improve, so give him time.
I didn't name Aso, yet, for the same reason (e.g. not quite there, yet), but IMO he's ahead of Ioane at the moment for a spot in the ABs midfield.
He was far from terrible, that's not accurate at all. Also, he's player centre a few times for the All Blacks already.
but he's behind proven midfield test players like Jordie Barrett...
I don't get the Jordie hate either, very useful to have a player that can play 15,wing,12 and 10 at a pinch. Not mention his goalkicking.
If we had dumped Nonu when he was at the same stage of his career making all his mistakes we'd have missed out on one of the greats. These players are in their early 20s!
we did dump Ma'a, and he came back a much better player.
There is a huge difference between "not good enough now" and "should never play tests again" and i don't get how on here saying one automatically means the other. J Barrett has all the talent in the world, and should still have a good test career, but i am not sure he should be in the team yet.
And we have done the same for Jordie, yet he gets used as punch line here quite often. Quite seperate from how he's actually performing.
That happens to a few players, you get a Fern reputation then it just gets repeated ad nauseum.
oh i freely admit to going waaaay over the top with that, it's become a thing
but in my admittedly feeble defense, it's as a reaction to the over the top hype the kid gets, and the rating compared to performance.
This place is getting boring enough with the constant bringing up of facts rather than just allowing a discussion to generate. Over the top discussions about players is all we have left. I rag on the Barretts, others see everything named Ioane as being dogshit. Let us have some pub discussions, or we may as well just turn this place in to google.
"just refer to the front page"
Conversations on a forum are more interesting when there is more depth than "He sucks". Over and over again.
Or the Akira is fat jokes.
Especially when players like Jordie are actually playing well this year. Things change.
fair comment
Agreement.
Fuck it's getting boring on here...
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Interesting article it puts this stupid AB rest scenario in perspective
[link text](link url)https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/all-blacks/120029168/super-rugby-all-blacks-rest-plans-reach-absurd-levels-as-braydon-ennor-misses-out
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@broughie said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Victor-Meldrew While I agree Cane should have been selected he would not have made the difference. We were man handled in the forwards and this has been an ongoing weakness exposed by Oz in Perth. Mariner has it right that we have too many fit buggers and not enough mongrel and size.
Now Fosters teams have never been known for their forward packs so maybe we are screwed. So I got the obligatory stab at our new AB coach out of the way. He is just too happy with life. Someone should hit him the shins with a 9 iron.
I think we are set at prop. So many options and Karl is playing himself back in the mix. Cane has been a good servant of NZ rugby but is it time to move on. Ginger and Papalii have been good and Sotutu the flavor on the month for good reason. PT has lifted his work rate and is looking good. Through in a token Cantab and we should be good despite Foster.
Blues win a couple of games and the fans start to get cocky. -
@Victor-Meldrew While I agree Cane should have been selected he would not have made the difference. We were man handled in the forwards and this has been an ongoing weakness exposed by Oz in Perth. Mariner has it right that we have too many fit buggers and not enough mongrel and size.
Now Fosters teams have never been known for their forward packs so maybe we are screwed. So I got the obligatory stab at our new AB coach out of the way. He is just too happy with life. Someone should hit him the shins with a 9 iron.
I think we are set at prop. So many options and Karl is playing himself back in the mix. Cane has been a good servant of NZ rugby but is it time to move on. Ginger and Papalii have been good and Sotutu the flavor on the month for good reason. PT has lifted his work rate and is looking good. Through in a token Cantab and we should be good despite Foster.
@broughie said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Victor-Meldrew While I agree Cane should have been selected he would not have made the difference. We were man handled in the forwards and this has been an ongoing weakness exposed by Oz in Perth. Mariner has it right that we have too many fit buggers and not enough mongrel and size.
I disagree because Cane tackles better than anyone in rugby. His presence is immense - our issue is he can't do it alone. We need a lock who does it (and Pat is looking good there) and a blindside like we've had during our golden period.
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@sparky said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
Akira Ioane.
Watching the way England, France and RSA have just battered their opposition into submission at various stages over the last 12 months have highlighted just how valuable a bruiser like Akira is likely to be for us. This is particularly the case where we are without Retallick (our hard man) and there are already concerns about our lack of physicality in the big matches.
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@sparky said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
Akira Ioane.
Watching the way England, France and RSA have just battered their opposition into submission at various stages over the last 12 months have highlighted just how valuable a bruiser like Akira is likely to be for us. This is particularly the case where we are without Retallick (our hard man) and there are already concerns about our lack of physicality in the big matches.
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Tuipulotu can provide some of that. He’s dominating collisions and maintaining standards over 80mins.
@Duluth said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
Tuipulotu can provide some of that. He’s dominating collisions and maintaining standards over 80mins.
I agree with that and I suspect we will not just him to perform that role but also A. N. Other. Part of the reason why England, RSA etc. are having so much success with their bludgeoning approach is because they have so many bludgeons - they are not reliant on one person to provide that extra physicality
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@Duluth said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
Tuipulotu can provide some of that. He’s dominating collisions and maintaining standards over 80mins.
I agree with that and I suspect we will not just him to perform that role but also A. N. Other. Part of the reason why England, RSA etc. are having so much success with their bludgeoning approach is because they have so many bludgeons - they are not reliant on one person to provide that extra physicality
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@mariner4life said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@mariner4life said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@mariner4life said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@mariner4life said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Stargazer said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@cgrant I'm still on the fence. Rieko Ioane has to improve a lot to come into the ABs midfield (other than as an emergency injury cover). He was terrible against the Stormers, but it's early days. He needs to play there consistently to improve, so give him time.
I didn't name Aso, yet, for the same reason (e.g. not quite there, yet), but IMO he's ahead of Ioane at the moment for a spot in the ABs midfield.
He was far from terrible, that's not accurate at all. Also, he's player centre a few times for the All Blacks already.
but he's behind proven midfield test players like Jordie Barrett...
I don't get the Jordie hate either, very useful to have a player that can play 15,wing,12 and 10 at a pinch. Not mention his goalkicking.
If we had dumped Nonu when he was at the same stage of his career making all his mistakes we'd have missed out on one of the greats. These players are in their early 20s!
we did dump Ma'a, and he came back a much better player.
There is a huge difference between "not good enough now" and "should never play tests again" and i don't get how on here saying one automatically means the other. J Barrett has all the talent in the world, and should still have a good test career, but i am not sure he should be in the team yet.
And we have done the same for Jordie, yet he gets used as punch line here quite often. Quite seperate from how he's actually performing.
That happens to a few players, you get a Fern reputation then it just gets repeated ad nauseum.
oh i freely admit to going waaaay over the top with that, it's become a thing
but in my admittedly feeble defense, it's as a reaction to the over the top hype the kid gets, and the rating compared to performance.
This place is getting boring enough with the constant bringing up of facts rather than just allowing a discussion to generate. Over the top discussions about players is all we have left. I rag on the Barretts, others see everything named Ioane as being dogshit. Let us have some pub discussions, or we may as well just turn this place in to google.
"just refer to the front page"
Conversations on a forum are more interesting when there is more depth than "He sucks". Over and over again.
Or the Akira is fat jokes.
Especially when players like Jordie are actually playing well this year. Things change.
fair comment
Agreement.
Fuck it's getting boring on here...
@booboo said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@mariner4life said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@mariner4life said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@mariner4life said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@mariner4life said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Stargazer said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@cgrant I'm still on the fence. Rieko Ioane has to improve a lot to come into the ABs midfield (other than as an emergency injury cover). He was terrible against the Stormers, but it's early days. He needs to play there consistently to improve, so give him time.
I didn't name Aso, yet, for the same reason (e.g. not quite there, yet), but IMO he's ahead of Ioane at the moment for a spot in the ABs midfield.
He was far from terrible, that's not accurate at all. Also, he's player centre a few times for the All Blacks already.
but he's behind proven midfield test players like Jordie Barrett...
I don't get the Jordie hate either, very useful to have a player that can play 15,wing,12 and 10 at a pinch. Not mention his goalkicking.
If we had dumped Nonu when he was at the same stage of his career making all his mistakes we'd have missed out on one of the greats. These players are in their early 20s!
we did dump Ma'a, and he came back a much better player.
There is a huge difference between "not good enough now" and "should never play tests again" and i don't get how on here saying one automatically means the other. J Barrett has all the talent in the world, and should still have a good test career, but i am not sure he should be in the team yet.
And we have done the same for Jordie, yet he gets used as punch line here quite often. Quite seperate from how he's actually performing.
That happens to a few players, you get a Fern reputation then it just gets repeated ad nauseum.
oh i freely admit to going waaaay over the top with that, it's become a thing
but in my admittedly feeble defense, it's as a reaction to the over the top hype the kid gets, and the rating compared to performance.
This place is getting boring enough with the constant bringing up of facts rather than just allowing a discussion to generate. Over the top discussions about players is all we have left. I rag on the Barretts, others see everything named Ioane as being dogshit. Let us have some pub discussions, or we may as well just turn this place in to google.
"just refer to the front page"
Conversations on a forum are more interesting when there is more depth than "He sucks". Over and over again.
Or the Akira is fat jokes.
Especially when players like Jordie are actually playing well this year. Things change.
fair comment
Agreement.
Fuck it's getting boring on here...
Like you even know what they were arguing about...
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@broughie said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Victor-Meldrew While I agree Cane should have been selected he would not have made the difference. We were man handled in the forwards and this has been an ongoing weakness exposed by Oz in Perth. Mariner has it right that we have too many fit buggers and not enough mongrel and size.
I disagree because Cane tackles better than anyone in rugby. His presence is immense - our issue is he can't do it alone. We need a lock who does it (and Pat is looking good there) and a blindside like we've had during our golden period.
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@antipodean I agree with you regarding PT. Just watching Kane I feel like he’s showing the effects of all the knocks he’s taking and I don’t doubt him is a warrior. To me he’s not have an impact he used to have.
@broughie said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@antipodean I agree with you regarding PT. Just watching Kane I feel like he’s showing the effects of all the knocks he’s taking and I don’t doubt him is a warrior. To me he’s not have an impact he used to have.
Kane?
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@Bones said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@junior outside of Tuilagi and Sinckler they don't really seem all that bludgeony.
Vunipolas are quite good at getting Poms on front foot.
@pakman said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Bones said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@junior outside of Tuilagi and Sinckler they don't really seem all that bludgeony.
Vunipolas are quite good at getting Poms on front foot.
They weren't on Saturday.
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@broughie said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@antipodean I agree with you regarding PT. Just watching Kane I feel like he’s showing the effects of all the knocks he’s taking and I don’t doubt him is a warrior. To me he’s not have an impact he used to have.
Kane?
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@broughie said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@mofitzy_ You must be an English teacher. Ever heard of auto correct.?
Of all the things you're getting wrong about Cane, spelling his name is the least of them
- but I assume you type Kane Williamson more than Sam Cane/Canes if you're getting autocorrected to Kane. -
Every test I have seen with Cane since 2018, he has been an absolute monster at the collisions. His absence in the semi-final was obvious.
Back on track, Lomax has been one of the stand out forwards of the competition. Core duties plus work rate are top notch. A bit careless on Sat. but best NZ tight head by a mile IMHO. -
@broughie said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@mofitzy_ You must be an English teacher. Ever heard of auto correct.?
Of all the things you're getting wrong about Cane, spelling his name is the least of them
- but I assume you type Kane Williamson more than Sam Cane/Canes if you're getting autocorrected to Kane.
