AB Captain
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I feel it appears Gats has bought a defection of blame culture to the Chiefs
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I feel it appears Gats has bought a defection of blame culture to the Chiefs
@taniwharugby said in AB Captain:
I feel it appears Gats has bought a defection of blame culture to the Chiefs
Not sure it is that bad, there's a fair bit of media beat up going on. Gats is a good coach, but just hasn't managed to get the team moving cohesively this year. Injuries haven't helped, and neither have referees. Kinda like what I said about the Blues for years - we often weren't good enough to overcome a few bad calls or pieces of bad luck. Relaly good sides (ABs, Crusaders) can get past that - so they only need a sniff to kick the door down and snatch the win.
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@taniwharugby said in AB Captain:
I feel it appears Gats has bought a defection of blame culture to the Chiefs
Not sure it is that bad, there's a fair bit of media beat up going on. Gats is a good coach, but just hasn't managed to get the team moving cohesively this year. Injuries haven't helped, and neither have referees. Kinda like what I said about the Blues for years - we often weren't good enough to overcome a few bad calls or pieces of bad luck. Relaly good sides (ABs, Crusaders) can get past that - so they only need a sniff to kick the door down and snatch the win.
@nzzp yea I agree, but I think he will have a different attitude towards that sort of thing, not the main issue, just one of them
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Clearly, something is going wrong at the Chiefs, but Sam Cane doesn’t appear to be the problem.
A quick look at his defensive stats for the last few games shows he is putting in the Mahi:
Canes: 5 tackles (in 26 minutes, 2 misses)
Crusaders: 18 (2 missed)
Blues: 18 (no misses)
Landers: 12 (1 miss)In those last three games, he led the team too. Edit: I should add that in one of those games where he gets 18, the next best is like 11. He’s out in front - he’s just not getting enough help.
That’s not counting the ways in which they’ve used him as a battering ram on attack either.
I imagine he’ll look forward to getting a bit more help when we get to see some All Black shirts running around.
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i havent seen enough of the chiefs to really comment on whats going on, the two games against us could have gone either way though
i did feel announcing him so early was just setting him up for these kinds of questions, announcing a captain along with a squad right before an AB's game at least gives them the best chance to show why they got the job
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was Cane announced prior to the world collapsing?
If so then i can definitely understand it. Super Rugby was its old meaningless self, Sam would have been on a management plan leading up to the incoming tours. The Chiefs would have bagged wins against overseas team, and the narrative from the RWC semi would have continued on
it looks like a dicey play now because literally everything is different.
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was Cane announced prior to the world collapsing?
If so then i can definitely understand it. Super Rugby was its old meaningless self, Sam would have been on a management plan leading up to the incoming tours. The Chiefs would have bagged wins against overseas team, and the narrative from the RWC semi would have continued on
it looks like a dicey play now because literally everything is different.
@mariner4life I thought he was announced during or just after our lockdown wasnt he? Which I (along with others) thought odd given at the time the possibility of any rugby was still up in the air.
edit - 5 May, so still in L3 here.
https://www.allblacks.com/news/sam-cane-named-all-blacks-captain/
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@mariner4life I thought he was announced during or just after our lockdown wasnt he? Which I (along with others) thought odd given at the time the possibility of any rugby was still up in the air.
edit - 5 May, so still in L3 here.
https://www.allblacks.com/news/sam-cane-named-all-blacks-captain/
@taniwharugby said in AB Captain:
@mariner4life I thought he was announced during or just after our lockdown wasnt he? Which I (along with others) thought odd given at the time the possibility of any rugby was still up in the air.
edit - 5 May, so still in L3 here.
https://www.allblacks.com/news/sam-cane-named-all-blacks-captain/
that late? Then that's retarded.
EDIT: Based on the post below, then i retract this statement, please refer to my earlier one
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There's a difference between when it was announced and when Cane was told.
Cane was told way earlier than that.
Sam Cane said the hardest part about being named All Blacks captain was keeping it a secret for three months. -
@taniwharugby said in AB Captain:
@mariner4life I thought he was announced during or just after our lockdown wasnt he? Which I (along with others) thought odd given at the time the possibility of any rugby was still up in the air.
edit - 5 May, so still in L3 here.
https://www.allblacks.com/news/sam-cane-named-all-blacks-captain/
that late? Then that's retarded.
EDIT: Based on the post below, then i retract this statement, please refer to my earlier one
@mariner4life I guess you think back to pre-lockdown (mid March) and 1st AB test not until June...I guess if not for CV they were probably on the verge of announcing it anyway.
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it just seems to early....although im a fan of picking your captain from your first choice XV...earn your spot first
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it just seems to early....although im a fan of picking your captain from your first choice XV...earn your spot first
@Kiwiwomble said in AB Captain:
it just seems to early....although im a fan of picking your captain from your first choice XV...earn your spot first
These days the captain's role is as much off field as on though. Part of the management/leadership of the group as a whole with a lot of influence.
You need to pick one that can carry those duties on their shoulders as well as the playing. Some young hot shot may outplay them one day but you would lose much more than you gain by swapping them out. -
@Kiwiwomble said in AB Captain:
it just seems to early....although im a fan of picking your captain from your first choice XV...earn your spot first
These days the captain's role is as much off field as on though. Part of the management/leadership of the group as a whole with a lot of influence.
You need to pick one that can carry those duties on their shoulders as well as the playing. Some young hot shot may outplay them one day but you would lose much more than you gain by swapping them out.@Crucial dont get me wrong, i get that, and they have leadership groups etc
...its just the loosies have been such hotly contested positions...deciding so early...if that guy gets outplayed over the whole super season...it doesn't look good
It reminds me of the Randell, Thorne, Blackadder era...too much talk about if they deserved to be there to start with
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@Crucial dont get me wrong, i get that, and they have leadership groups etc
...its just the loosies have been such hotly contested positions...deciding so early...if that guy gets outplayed over the whole super season...it doesn't look good
It reminds me of the Randell, Thorne, Blackadder era...too much talk about if they deserved to be there to start with
@Kiwiwomble said in AB Captain:
@Crucial dont get me wrong, i get that, and they have leadership groups etc
...its just the loosies have been such hotly contested positions...deciding so early...if that guy gets outplayed over the whole super season...it doesn't look good
It reminds me of the Randell, Thorne, Blackadder era...too much talk about if they deserved to be there to start with
Who is the open side playing better than Cane? Not many, if any.
Kirifi would be the closest but I still wouldn’t swap -
@Kiwiwomble said in AB Captain:
@Crucial dont get me wrong, i get that, and they have leadership groups etc
...its just the loosies have been such hotly contested positions...deciding so early...if that guy gets outplayed over the whole super season...it doesn't look good
It reminds me of the Randell, Thorne, Blackadder era...too much talk about if they deserved to be there to start with
Who is the open side playing better than Cane? Not many, if any.
Kirifi would be the closest but I still wouldn’t swap@Crucial
Sotutu would be worth a look at 7 I think. Not generally a fan of 'get the best guys on the field, then sort the positions out', but I would like to see him have a crack there for the Blues, with Akira at 8 and Robinson at 6, Dalton covering the bench.I like Cane, I think dropping him in the WC was a terrible decision. Leadership group for sure, but captaincy I'm not sure of. The Chiefs have looked pretty headless.
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captaincy aside?
i think lots would at least consider Savea (26), D Hunt (25) or Papalii (22) just off the top of my head, based on current form...all younger than Cane (28) too
@Kiwiwomble said in AB Captain:
captaincy aside?
i think lots would at least consider Savea (26), D Hunt (25) or Papalii (22) just off the top of my head, based on current form...all younger than Cane (28) too
Consider? Yes.
Replace? Not for me.What's age got to do with it anyway?
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@Crucial
Sotutu would be worth a look at 7 I think. Not generally a fan of 'get the best guys on the field, then sort the positions out', but I would like to see him have a crack there for the Blues, with Akira at 8 and Robinson at 6, Dalton covering the bench.I like Cane, I think dropping him in the WC was a terrible decision. Leadership group for sure, but captaincy I'm not sure of. The Chiefs have looked pretty headless.
@reprobate said in AB Captain:
@Crucial
Sotutu would be worth a look at 7 I think.Now we're getting into crazy. (for the ABs discussion)
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When I read people suggesting Cane not have the captaincy of the All Blacks and his position is under pressure I wonder what games they're watching.
"Oh the Chiefs are terrible". What's he supposed to do, select and coach them too?
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@Kiwiwomble said in AB Captain:
captaincy aside?
i think lots would at least consider Savea (26), D Hunt (25) or Papalii (22) just off the top of my head, based on current form...all younger than Cane (28) too
Consider? Yes.
Replace? Not for me.What's age got to do with it anyway?
@Crucial you have to ask? long term planning, continuity in leadership in the case of a captain or building that shorthand between players in the case of the actual rugby
