AB all time pro-era XXIII
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@Tim said in AB all time pro-era XXIII:
Maybe one the more interesting aspects of picking a team like this is where the pro-era cut-off is, and what players make it. In my opinion, Zinzan Brooke and Sean Fitzpatrick were good enough and had sufficiently significant careers in 1996 and 97 to justify their inclusion.
I guess it depends on quite how you're assessing people - if it is one absolute peak performance, then maybe these guys qualify from that South African series win - I can't remember.
But, if it's more related to their body of work, I wouldn't pick any of the guys who've been suggested who were in the tail ends of their careers - Fitzy, Brooke (these two have been Englishmen for most of the pro era -
), Bunce, Brown or Jones.Fitzy was a cripple on the 1997 EOYT, so he only played 18 months of pro rugby. I recall Zinny was heavily criticized for taking a farewell tour on the same trip - can't remember whether that was reflected in his play or just because he'd already signed offshore. Brown and Jones' pro careers include the dire 1998 performances. And Hart was prepared to dump Bunce on the flimsiness of being late back from an overseas trip.
Mealamu or Coles for Fitzy
Read for Brooke (Reado might win that one looking at career on career)
Hayman or Franks over Brown
Whitelock over Jones
Conrad over Bunce -
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T.Woodcock
K.Mealamu
O.Brown
I.Jones
S.Whitelock
J.Kaino
R.McCaw
Z.Brooke
A.Smith
D.Carter
J.Savea
M.Nonu
C.Smith
J.Wilson
C.CullenI would love to have The like of Bunce,Fitzy, Howlett and Muliania in the team but unfortunately someone has to miss out.
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@mikey07 said in AB all time pro-era XXIII:
T.Woodcock
K.Mealamu
O.Brown
I.Jones
S.Whitelock
J.Kaino
R.McCaw
Z.Brooke
A.Smith
D.Carter
J.Savea
M.Nonu
C.Smith
J.Wilson
C.CullenI would love to have The like of Bunce,Fitzy, Howlett and Muliania in the team but unfortunately someone has to miss out.
This is a decent side. I’d probably have Rok ahead of Savea. Add a bench of
S. Fitzpatrick, C. Hayman, O. Franks, B. Retallick, K. Read, J. Marshall, C. Spencer, D. Howlett
Cullen covering centre
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I couldnt pick an all-time AB side and not put Lomu on the wing, as good as Savea, Rok, Sivi, Ioane might have been at thier peak, Lomu was something else
Only player I'd consider over him, would be peak Rupeni, but he aint available for this team.
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@taniwharugby said in AB all time pro-era XXIII:
I couldnt pick an all-time AB side and not put Lomu on the wing, as good as Savea, Rok, Sivi, Ioane might have been at thier peak, Lomu was something else
Only player I'd consider over him, would be peak Rupeni, but he aint available for this team.
Same, even if a part of his career was in the (sh)amateur era, it's hard to go past Jonah at 11.
I'd be inclined to select Cullen and Wilson as the rest of the outside backs because they were all sublime especially as a group.
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@Godder said in AB all time pro-era XXIII:
@taniwharugby said in AB all time pro-era XXIII:
I couldnt pick an all-time AB side and not put Lomu on the wing, as good as Savea, Rok, Sivi, Ioane might have been at thier peak, Lomu was something else
Only player I'd consider over him, would be peak Rupeni, but he aint available for this team.
Same, even if a part of his career was in the (sh)amateur era, it's hard to go past Jonah at 11.
I'd be inclined to select Cullen and Wilson as the rest of the outside backs because they were all sublime especially as a group.
@Godder said in AB all time pro-era XXIII:
@taniwharugby said in AB all time pro-era XXIII:
I couldnt pick an all-time AB side and not put Lomu on the wing, as good as Savea, Rok, Sivi, Ioane might have been at thier peak, Lomu was something else
Only player I'd consider over him, would be peak Rupeni, but he aint available for this team.
Same, even if a part of his career was in the (sh)amateur era, it's hard to go past Jonah at 11.
I'd be inclined to select Cullen and Wilson as the rest of the outside backs because they were all sublime especially as a group.
Imagine them in the modern game, with conditioning etc advancements. They meet all the requirements too, with two power runners, all have pace, and there is plenty of highball ability (I'm sure that Lomu would get tested, but he'd get much more expert coaching now too). Plus Cullen's swerve/step and Goldie's chip/chase.
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@ACT-Crusader I figured if it’s peak Savea his strength would come in handy yeah Rokocoko was another name I forgot.
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@mikey07 said in AB all time pro-era XXIII:
@ACT-Crusader I figured if it’s peak Savea his strength would come in handy yeah Rokocoko was another name I forgot.
Jonah was stronger than Savea
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@MN5 said in AB all time pro-era XXIII:
@mikey07 said in AB all time pro-era XXIII:
@ACT-Crusader I figured if it’s peak Savea his strength would come in handy yeah Rokocoko was another name I forgot.
Jonah was stronger than Savea
And I’d say Rok was quicker than both Jonah and Savea. Given the tempo this team would be playing with Aaron Smith and Carter I’ll take Rok.
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@ACT-Crusader said in AB all time pro-era XXIII:
@MN5 said in AB all time pro-era XXIII:
@mikey07 said in AB all time pro-era XXIII:
@ACT-Crusader I figured if it’s peak Savea his strength would come in handy yeah Rokocoko was another name I forgot.
Jonah was stronger than Savea
And I’d say Rok was quicker than both Jonah and Savea. Given the tempo this team would be playing with Aaron Smith and Carter I’ll take Rok.
Rok was great going forward but was crap under the high ball. Once opposing sides worked that out he became a big of a liability.
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@ACT-Crusader said in AB all time pro-era XXIII:
@mikey07 said in AB all time pro-era XXIII:
T.Woodcock
K.Mealamu
O.Brown
I.Jones
S.Whitelock
J.Kaino
R.McCaw
Z.Brooke
A.Smith
D.Carter
J.Savea
M.Nonu
C.Smith
J.Wilson
C.CullenI would love to have The like of Bunce,Fitzy, Howlett and Muliania in the team but unfortunately someone has to miss out.
This is a decent side. I’d probably have Rok ahead of Savea. Add a bench of
S. Fitzpatrick, C. Hayman, O. Franks, B. Retallick, K. Read, J. Marshall, C. Spencer, D. Howlett
Cullen covering centre
J Moody
C Taylor
O Franks
B Thorn
S Whitelock
T Blue
R McCaw
K Read
T Lander
D Carter
T Blue-Chief-Cane
S BW
T Cane
T Otherlander
L MacDonald -
@Bones said in AB all time pro-era XXIII:
@cgrant said in AB all time pro-era XXIII:
Alternative team :
Dowd
Coles
Meeuws
Thorne
Jack
Collins
Holah
Read
Marshall
Mehrtens
Rokocoko / Savea
Little
Bunce
Howlett
OsborneI'm intrigued as to what this is the alternative to...
Woodcock
Fitzpatrick
Brown / Hayman
Retallick
Whitelock
Kaino
McCaw
Brooke
Smith
Carter
Lomu
Nonu
Smith / Umaga
Smith / Wilson
CullenI could have written Kronfeld instead of Holah and Robin Brooke instead of Thorn in my "alternative" team.
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@sparky said in AB all time pro-era XXIII:
@ACT-Crusader said in AB all time pro-era XXIII:
@MN5 said in AB all time pro-era XXIII:
@mikey07 said in AB all time pro-era XXIII:
@ACT-Crusader I figured if it’s peak Savea his strength would come in handy yeah Rokocoko was another name I forgot.
Jonah was stronger than Savea
And I’d say Rok was quicker than both Jonah and Savea. Given the tempo this team would be playing with Aaron Smith and Carter I’ll take Rok.
Rok was great going forward but was crap under the high ball. Once opposing sides worked that out he became a big of a liability.
And Lomu and Bus under the high ball were...
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@cgrant said in AB all time pro-era XXIII:
@Bones said in AB all time pro-era XXIII:
@cgrant said in AB all time pro-era XXIII:
Alternative team :
Dowd
Coles
Meeuws
Thorne
Jack
Collins
Holah
Read
Marshall
Mehrtens
Rokocoko / Savea
Little
Bunce
Howlett
OsborneI'm intrigued as to what this is the alternative to...
Woodcock
Fitzpatrick
Brown / Hayman
Retallick
Whitelock
Kaino
McCaw
Brooke
Smith
Carter
Lomu
Nonu
Smith / Umaga
Smith / Wilson
CullenI could have written Kronfeld instead of Holah and Robin Brooke instead of Thorn in my "alternative" team.
I liked Holah, but Kronfeld and Cane are easy automatic selections over him. Hell, I think maybe even Ardie would get in ahead of him.
Speaking of Savea's, I can't believe people are pushing Fatty Savea's case. Joe Roks was better for longer and Lomu was just better. Is there some rose tinting going on with Fatty? Dude was awesome for a brief period then his form fell off a cliff and now he gets selected in Super teams because his last name is Savea.
@Rancid-Schnitzel said in AB all time pro-era XXIII:
And won a Lions series.....oh wait!
Ah well, he wasn't perfect, two RWC and a drawn Lions series is probably a better return than the traffic conductor Mauger's no RWC and one Lions series.
Weirdly Ma'a has a Lions series win under his belt .... from 7 minutes of play in the DC match.
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Speaking of Savea's, I can't believe people are pushing Fatty Savea's case. Joe Roks was better for longer and Lomu was just better. Is there some rose tinting going on with Fatty? Dude was awesome for a brief period then his form fell off a cliff and now he gets selected in Super teams because his last name is Savea.
Weird he still scored 46 test tries when he was “awesome for a brief period” he scored those tries in 54 tests yet Rokockoko only got that in 63 and Lomu got even less in 72 games...
