Blues 2021
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@snowy said in SRA Round 10: Blues v Chiefs:
@nzzp said in SRA Round 10: Blues v Chiefs:
@bovidae second year syndrome - suddenly you get marked, and you lift your game
Yep. Use the extra attention to distribute / offload and find the space that is created elsewhere. Maybe that is why he keeps heading infield rather than trying to go outside? Trying to link up, rather than go over or through a couple of defenders.
yeah but it helps if you have the ball..
overall impression I get is the Blues have talent, not always in the right position, but skill-wise and tactically have stalled or gone backwards.
That suggests limitations in coaching. -
overall impression I get is the Blues have talent, not always in the right position, but skill-wise and tactically have stalled or gone backwards.
That suggests limitations in coaching.@nostrildamus said in SRA Round 10: Blues v Chiefs:
overall impression I get is the Blues have talent, not always in the right position, but skill-wise and tactically have stalled or gone backwards.
That suggests limitations in coaching.The talent is actually what is obscuring the other issues in a way. In a number of Blues games they give the overall impression of being rabble but then you look at the scoreboard and they are performing as well as the more organised looking opposition. They are second highest on the try tally, top in the metres carried tally and offloads, yet bottom in the defenders beaten ranks.
Opposition teams have to work hard to score as well.
However something just doesn't seem right. It could be just a confidence/headspace thing. Visible frustration from coaches is usually a good indicator that the players aren't following the plans or that they aren't executing as well as they train.
Personnel clarity from coaches hasn't helped but is that desperate attempts to get players out there that will follow instructions? -
overall impression I get is the Blues have talent, not always in the right position, but skill-wise and tactically have stalled or gone backwards.
That suggests limitations in coaching.@nostrildamus said in SRA Round 10: Blues v Chiefs:
overall impression I get is the Blues have talent, not always in the right position, but skill-wise and tactically have stalled or gone backwards.
That suggests limitations in coaching./shrugs. I'd agree, if you hadn't seen major improvements in the last couple of years under Leon. What I think we're lacking is leadership and rugby nous out there. BB probably papered over those cracks last year with confidence from fullback, and you saw it losing Parsons and then Tuipolotu and Robinson this year. We didn't have leaders out there for most of the season, and we lacked the rugby IQ to really drive the team into the right places.
Three good games, followed by 5 poor ones. Hopefully SRTT gives the team a chance to get some confidence, hit their straps and work their butts off. I'm still reasonably confident about our medium term future - we're attracting and keepign decent players, we've got a decent coach, and we are miles away from the rabble we had in the past.
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@nostrildamus said in SRA Round 10: Blues v Chiefs:
overall impression I get is the Blues have talent, not always in the right position, but skill-wise and tactically have stalled or gone backwards.
That suggests limitations in coaching./shrugs. I'd agree, if you hadn't seen major improvements in the last couple of years under Leon. What I think we're lacking is leadership and rugby nous out there. BB probably papered over those cracks last year with confidence from fullback, and you saw it losing Parsons and then Tuipolotu and Robinson this year. We didn't have leaders out there for most of the season, and we lacked the rugby IQ to really drive the team into the right places.
Three good games, followed by 5 poor ones. Hopefully SRTT gives the team a chance to get some confidence, hit their straps and work their butts off. I'm still reasonably confident about our medium term future - we're attracting and keepign decent players, we've got a decent coach, and we are miles away from the rabble we had in the past.
@nzzp said in SRA Round 10: Blues v Chiefs:
@nostrildamus said in SRA Round 10: Blues v Chiefs:
overall impression I get is the Blues have talent, not always in the right position, but skill-wise and tactically have stalled or gone backwards.
That suggests limitations in coaching./shrugs. I'd agree, if you hadn't seen major improvements in the last couple of years under Leon. What I think we're lacking is leadership and rugby nous out there. BB probably papered over those cracks last year with confidence from fullback, and you saw it losing Parsons and then Tuipolotu and Robinson this year. We didn't have leaders out there for most of the season, and we lacked the rugby IQ to really drive the team into the right places.
Three good games, followed by 5 poor ones. Hopefully SRTT gives the team a chance to get some confidence, hit their straps and work their butts off. I'm still reasonably confident about our medium term future - we're attracting and keepign decent players, we've got a decent coach, and we are miles away from the rabble we had in the past.
I agree regards overall improvements. Then we only differ on skills. I'm not saying he's a bad coach, fundamentally, but they need to consistently get to the next stage, and there needs to be leadership and rugby nous in the backs (and replacement forwards).
My suggestion (and having BB at 15 is too far from the action for this) is at 10 or 12 a genuine, intelligent, astute playmaker.Oh and the 9-10 weekly lolly scrambles aren't helping. Alternate pairings, not just position.
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@nzzp said in SRA Round 10: Blues v Chiefs:
@nostrildamus said in SRA Round 10: Blues v Chiefs:
overall impression I get is the Blues have talent, not always in the right position, but skill-wise and tactically have stalled or gone backwards.
That suggests limitations in coaching./shrugs. I'd agree, if you hadn't seen major improvements in the last couple of years under Leon. What I think we're lacking is leadership and rugby nous out there. BB probably papered over those cracks last year with confidence from fullback, and you saw it losing Parsons and then Tuipolotu and Robinson this year. We didn't have leaders out there for most of the season, and we lacked the rugby IQ to really drive the team into the right places.
Three good games, followed by 5 poor ones. Hopefully SRTT gives the team a chance to get some confidence, hit their straps and work their butts off. I'm still reasonably confident about our medium term future - we're attracting and keepign decent players, we've got a decent coach, and we are miles away from the rabble we had in the past.
I agree regards overall improvements. Then we only differ on skills. I'm not saying he's a bad coach, fundamentally, but they need to consistently get to the next stage, and there needs to be leadership and rugby nous in the backs (and replacement forwards).
My suggestion (and having BB at 15 is too far from the action for this) is at 10 or 12 a genuine, intelligent, astute playmaker.Oh and the 9-10 weekly lolly scrambles aren't helping. Alternate pairings, not just position.
@nostrildamus said in SRA Round 10: Blues v Chiefs:
10 or 12 a genuine, intelligent, astute playmaker
this looks like the key
based on watching last year, and the highlights and threads for this year, the difference between winning and losing SRA is having a guy who can break a game open touch the ball a lot.
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righto, a quick comment on SRA.
Overall, I'd give us a pass mark, but only just. We didn't deliver results-wise, but we put some decent effort.
Top of my head thoughts
Tight 5 B+/A-
One of the stronger packs in the comp. Didn't deliver at some critical times. Massive improvements in defence of mauls and actually in setting mauls too. Still plenty to work on though - rugby nous isn't quite there. Scrum was a weapon in the early rounds, but seemed to struggle later ... not sure why.The prop rotation should have been one of our big strengths. Not much mobility outside Ofa though.
Plenty of minutes for Darry (who should keep building nicely), and we really missed Pat T. GCT was consistently good for us, without being outstanding.Hookers improved on last year, and went fine, just not outstanding.
Would score higher, but didn't dominate like they should have given the talent.
Loosies A
Strength area with significant depth. Dalton was immense, Choat looked good at the end, and Tom R was massive for us. HOskins took a few games to come up to speed. Akira was good without being the massively dominant figure of the last few years.Halfbacks D
Too much changing, not enough game plan clarity to allow any one of them to succeed. I think all the halfbacks have clear work-ons.10s D
Marginally harsh perhaps. Otere needs to get his mojo back (from games 1-2) and learn to goal kick. Plummer just needs to lift his game.Midfield C
Rieko B to B+, 12s consistently D. Distribution a big issue. Combinations an issue. Plenty to work on. Rieko is building nicely I think. 12 was a real issue for us. Really not sure why TJ woudln't be keeping that backline togetherBack 3 D
Workrate too low, finishing too low, creation too low. Defence OK. Didn't create much at all, or feel super dangerous. Shut down consistently.Coaching C
Forwards went OK in general, backs were very average this season. Leadership and IQ on the field not great.Moment of the season: disallowed maul try against the Chiefs. The ref and TMO don't overturn it (wrongly, in my view) and you've got a winning season and are off to the final.
So, yeah. Promised plenty, didn't deliver enough. Still better than we've been, but (hopefully) not nearly as good as we're going to be.
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well, damn.
Just wrote a long post on 2021 so far, and it got lost. Unless the mods can work some magic, you get the 30 second version, not the 500 word monster.
Tight 5 A- didn't dominate when they should have
Loosies A outstanding depth, consistently good
Halfbacks D poor selections, poor consistency, etc
10s D didn't do nearly enough to steer the fatties around
Midfield C Rieko B+, everyone else at 12 D. Didn't do enough offensively, defence was OK
back 3 D. didn't create much at all. Defensively OK. not exciting enough. workrate coudl be better.
Coaching C. Did enough in the forwards, but backs were poor. Tactics were average. needs to get confidence back into the team and support some folk with rugby IQ to make decisions out there -
righto, a quick comment on SRA.
Overall, I'd give us a pass mark, but only just. We didn't deliver results-wise, but we put some decent effort.
Top of my head thoughts
Tight 5 B+/A-
One of the stronger packs in the comp. Didn't deliver at some critical times. Massive improvements in defence of mauls and actually in setting mauls too. Still plenty to work on though - rugby nous isn't quite there. Scrum was a weapon in the early rounds, but seemed to struggle later ... not sure why.The prop rotation should have been one of our big strengths. Not much mobility outside Ofa though.
Plenty of minutes for Darry (who should keep building nicely), and we really missed Pat T. GCT was consistently good for us, without being outstanding.Hookers improved on last year, and went fine, just not outstanding.
Would score higher, but didn't dominate like they should have given the talent.
Loosies A
Strength area with significant depth. Dalton was immense, Choat looked good at the end, and Tom R was massive for us. HOskins took a few games to come up to speed. Akira was good without being the massively dominant figure of the last few years.Halfbacks D
Too much changing, not enough game plan clarity to allow any one of them to succeed. I think all the halfbacks have clear work-ons.10s D
Marginally harsh perhaps. Otere needs to get his mojo back (from games 1-2) and learn to goal kick. Plummer just needs to lift his game.Midfield C
Rieko B to B+, 12s consistently D. Distribution a big issue. Combinations an issue. Plenty to work on. Rieko is building nicely I think. 12 was a real issue for us. Really not sure why TJ woudln't be keeping that backline togetherBack 3 D
Workrate too low, finishing too low, creation too low. Defence OK. Didn't create much at all, or feel super dangerous. Shut down consistently.Coaching C
Forwards went OK in general, backs were very average this season. Leadership and IQ on the field not great.Moment of the season: disallowed maul try against the Chiefs. The ref and TMO don't overturn it (wrongly, in my view) and you've got a winning season and are off to the final.
So, yeah. Promised plenty, didn't deliver enough. Still better than we've been, but (hopefully) not nearly as good as we're going to be.
@nzzp Back 3 D
Workrate too low, finishing too low, creation too low. Defence OK. Didn't create much at all, or feel super dangerous. Shut down consistently.on the above
Was Reiko responsible for some of this,Going by himself too much not looking to create space for the outsides.When Reiko gets the ball his first instinct is a wings mind set Run without looking wide the cut back inside is a wingers instinct to link up and not have the touchline as an extra defender.
Or is Reiko a product of what is happening inside from 9 to 12, 10 & 12 Drifting to Reiko taking the defence with them and leaving him no options.
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@nzzp Back 3 D
Workrate too low, finishing too low, creation too low. Defence OK. Didn't create much at all, or feel super dangerous. Shut down consistently.on the above
Was Reiko responsible for some of this,Going by himself too much not looking to create space for the outsides.When Reiko gets the ball his first instinct is a wings mind set Run without looking wide the cut back inside is a wingers instinct to link up and not have the touchline as an extra defender.
Or is Reiko a product of what is happening inside from 9 to 12, 10 & 12 Drifting to Reiko taking the defence with them and leaving him no options.
@chris I don't think you can lay the blame at the feet of Rieko. I'm thinking of a back 3 that gets back and counterattacks strongly, returns kicks well, kicks well for territory.
Perofeta was solid at times doing some of those, but frankly I expected more from those lads. Rieko wasn't amazing yet, but solid enough with distribution.
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@chris I don't think you can lay the blame at the feet of Rieko. I'm thinking of a back 3 that gets back and counterattacks strongly, returns kicks well, kicks well for territory.
Perofeta was solid at times doing some of those, but frankly I expected more from those lads. Rieko wasn't amazing yet, but solid enough with distribution.
@nzzp said in Blues 2021:
@chris I don't think you can lay the blame at the feet of Rieko. I'm thinking of a back 3 that gets back and counterattacks strongly, returns kicks well, kicks well for territory.
Perofeta was solid at times doing some of those, but frankly I expected more from those lads. Rieko wasn't amazing yet, but solid enough with distribution.
My other point is Reiko a product of what is happening from 9 to 12,
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@nzzp said in Blues 2021:
@chris I don't think you can lay the blame at the feet of Rieko. I'm thinking of a back 3 that gets back and counterattacks strongly, returns kicks well, kicks well for territory.
Perofeta was solid at times doing some of those, but frankly I expected more from those lads. Rieko wasn't amazing yet, but solid enough with distribution.
My other point is Reiko a product of what is happening from 9 to 12,
@chris said in Blues 2021:
@nzzp said in Blues 2021:
@chris I don't think you can lay the blame at the feet of Rieko. I'm thinking of a back 3 that gets back and counterattacks strongly, returns kicks well, kicks well for territory.
Perofeta was solid at times doing some of those, but frankly I expected more from those lads. Rieko wasn't amazing yet, but solid enough with distribution.
My other point is Reiko a product of what is happening from 9 to 12,
2/8/9/10 ... and then 12
Seriously, though, I think Rieko's B+ and knocking on the door of the ABs. He brings solid defence and a speed opportunity that is rare. He's on the way up. Distribution took a step up again, and I'd say is one of the easier things for a good coaching group to keep improving. If you have to trade off an inexperienced 12 or 13 at the top level, I prefer ALB/RIoane to Havili/ALB... but ultimately it's up to the coaches.
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@nostrildamus said in SRA Round 10: Blues v Chiefs:
overall impression I get is the Blues have talent, not always in the right position, but skill-wise and tactically have stalled or gone backwards.
That suggests limitations in coaching./shrugs. I'd agree, if you hadn't seen major improvements in the last couple of years under Leon. What I think we're lacking is leadership and rugby nous out there. BB probably papered over those cracks last year with confidence from fullback, and you saw it losing Parsons and then Tuipolotu and Robinson this year. We didn't have leaders out there for most of the season, and we lacked the rugby IQ to really drive the team into the right places.
Three good games, followed by 5 poor ones. Hopefully SRTT gives the team a chance to get some confidence, hit their straps and work their butts off. I'm still reasonably confident about our medium term future - we're attracting and keepign decent players, we've got a decent coach, and we are miles away from the rabble we had in the past.
@nzzp said in Blues 2021:
/shrugs. I'd agree, if you hadn't seen major improvements in the last couple of years under Leon. What I think we're lacking is leadership and rugby nous out there. BB probably papered over those cracks last year with confidence from fullback, and you saw it losing Parsons and then Tuipolotu and Robinson this year. We didn't have leaders out there for most of the season, and we lacked the rugby IQ to really drive the team into the right places.
Tuipulotu was missed in the second half of the season.
The Blues conceded about the same number of penalties/turnovers as the opposition. For whatever reason the timing of them hurt really them in certain games. Sotutu's yellow or Papali'i's drop against the Highlanders for instance.
Second best team on points scored, second best on points conceded. The decision making is just slightly down on 2020.. improving that, plus a couple of selection changes should have a big impact
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@chris said in Blues 2021:
@nzzp said in Blues 2021:
@chris I don't think you can lay the blame at the feet of Rieko. I'm thinking of a back 3 that gets back and counterattacks strongly, returns kicks well, kicks well for territory.
Perofeta was solid at times doing some of those, but frankly I expected more from those lads. Rieko wasn't amazing yet, but solid enough with distribution.
My other point is Reiko a product of what is happening from 9 to 12,
2/8/9/10 ... and then 12
Seriously, though, I think Rieko's B+ and knocking on the door of the ABs. He brings solid defence and a speed opportunity that is rare. He's on the way up. Distribution took a step up again, and I'd say is one of the easier things for a good coaching group to keep improving. If you have to trade off an inexperienced 12 or 13 at the top level, I prefer ALB/RIoane to Havili/ALB... but ultimately it's up to the coaches.
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@taniwharugby said in Blues 2021:
@chris-b it isnt quite as bad when you have 2 9s alternating starting/bench roles, but the Blues do it with 3 halves, and while Ruru has a longer rope than the other 2, none really have had much chance to get going, as I think only Christie has had an injury but that was in the 1st game.
After game 1, Ruru has had 4 starts in 6 games and came off the bench in the other two - so he's arguably had a pretty decent run. I'd guess he'd have a similar pattern of starts to Hall and Drummond, who have switched around a fair bit - and maybe even Smith and Fakatava.
The other two have had a decent amount of game time, so neither can sit there like Ere Enari thinking, "I'm clearly number 3, I think I'll try my luck elsewhere".
@chris-b this is what I don’t get. Why would Enari be willing to stay at the Crusaders when he’s behind two other halfbacks. The Crusaders are really good at keeping guys in their squad even when they aren’t getting a run. Surely he will be looking elsewhere for next year, Blues being the obvious choice if there is room. Landers are sorted at halfback, the Canes are looking good there with Roigard coming through and the possibility of Perenara returning. The Chiefs are solid without being spectacular, so it really only leaves the Blues or overseas as a real option for Enari going forward.
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@nzzp said in Blues 2021:
ALB/RIoane
It went well in the North/South match. Shame we didn't see it more
@duluth RIoane isn’t a centre for christ sake. He doesn’t pass the ball. Just look at how ineffective Caleb Clarke has been all year because of Ioane’s inability to turn his blinkers off. I wouldn’t even have Ioane in the AB 23 to be quite honest.
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@duluth RIoane isn’t a centre for christ sake. He doesn’t pass the ball. Just look at how ineffective Caleb Clarke has been all year because of Ioane’s inability to turn his blinkers off. I wouldn’t even have Ioane in the AB 23 to be quite honest.
@canes4life said in Blues 2021:
RIoane isn’t a centre for christ sake. He doesn’t pass the ball.
Yes he is. Yes he does.
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@canes4life said in Blues 2021:
RIoane isn’t a centre for christ sake. He doesn’t pass the ball.
Yes he is. Yes he does.
@duluth no he isn’t and no he doesn’t. He lacks the intelligence and skill set required to be an international caliber centre.
Every time he makes a break he hardly ever looks to his outsides because he has the wingers mentality of having a crack himself. He’s been doing it all season.
By all means though the Blues should keep playing him there, they are less dangerous because of it.
