Worst All Black RWC exits
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- If ever a squad was destined to win it was that.
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@booboo said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
@rapido said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
@dogmeat said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
@rotated Other than that we 'd beaten the Boks in SA in 92 and in NZ in 94,beaten the Lions in 93, had a record against Oz of 2-1-2 since the 91 RWC having drawn the last match in Sydney , had lost narrowly to England away with an under strength team and should have drawn the series against France in 04 but for the "try from the ends of the earth"
95 was probably the most even comp (pre the tournament) there's ever been. I still rated OZ the #1 because they'd given us the hardest matches and were reigning champs, SA at home were going to be a threat but I still fancied us. I didn't rate the Poms at all (the year didn't end in a 3). France were France and should have been in the final.
The reality was Lomu came good, Bachop came back and the debutants, Mehrts, Kronfeld and Osborne were the missing components that made for an outstanding team.
We'd lost our last test matches (or drawn in SA case) against every one of the other 1995 favourites. 1994 was the 3rd worst year in NZ rugby history up to that point (probably still is). (Edit: No, 1998 bumps it down to 4th worse)
NZ were a shambles who started to get it right about 1 month before the tournament.
I agree it was an even comp, though. But only the more anorak of NZ fans could have felt an inkling of something good in about April 1995. For most fans and media, it was more revisionist.
I was one of those anoraks, but I knew only one other bloke at work or the rugby club who shared my optimism.
My thoughts were based around excitement about the noobs like Osborne, Lomu, Mehrts, Kronfeld ...
Me too. And it had nothing to do with the new guns. That second half against Aus in 1994 was absolutely incredible. It was played at a pace which blew Aus out of the water. If it wasn’t for that miracle Gregan tackle we win. I was then feeling even more optimistic when the new guns came around and when Lomu was selected. I reckon anyone who saw they trials must have realised something special was brewing.
I had a special edition RWC rugby magazine and I remember so well Scottish coach Jim Telfer writing that NZ couldn’t challenge Aus and England anymore. I was sure he was going to be made to look the fool and he certainly was.
At the end of the day it was absolutely bizarre that NZ we’re not fancied. Yes that first up loss against France was horrible but they then beat the Boks twice and were a Gregan tackle away from beating the world champions in Sydney. That’s probably why we’ve been perennial favourites since. The bookies furked up badly in 95.
@rancid-schnitzel said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
I had a special edition RWC rugby magazine and I remember so well Scottish coach Jim Telfer writing that NZ couldn’t challenge Aus and England anymore. I was sure he was going to be made to look the fool and he certainly was.
I didn't watch much rugby from 92-95, but England beat NZ in 1993 I had call after call from long-lost English acquaintances asking me if I'd seen the rugby.
Though I didn't keep a complete list, after the '95 RWC semi I managed to reciprocate their kindness in reaching out to me.
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@rancid-schnitzel said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
I had a special edition RWC rugby magazine and I remember so well Scottish coach Jim Telfer writing that NZ couldn’t challenge Aus and England anymore. I was sure he was going to be made to look the fool and he certainly was.
I didn't watch much rugby from 92-95, but England beat NZ in 1993 I had call after call from long-lost English acquaintances asking me if I'd seen the rugby.
Though I didn't keep a complete list, after the '95 RWC semi I managed to reciprocate their kindness in reaching out to me.
@victor-meldrew said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
@rancid-schnitzel said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
I had a special edition RWC rugby magazine and I remember so well Scottish coach Jim Telfer writing that NZ couldn’t challenge Aus and England anymore. I was sure he was going to be made to look the fool and he certainly was.
I didn't watch much rugby from 92-95, but England beat NZ in 1993 I had call after call from long-lost English acquaintances asking me if I'd seen the rugby.
Though I didn't keep a complete list, after the '95 RWC semi I managed to reciprocate their kindness in reaching out to me.
You should do the same with your bank manager. After all the times over the years he's called you to let you know you were overdrawn, perhaps now is the time to start calling him to tell him he's got your money.
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@canefan @Rapido
I was with @booboo - Mains' team only lacked a first 5 nd I hoped that Mehrts was the man - although I still favoured Oz.NZ are always going to be favourites because ithose reports are based on TAB oddsa and they reflect the money going on the AB's not their relative strength.
I had us as favourites in 07, 11 and 15.
87 - hadn't a clue. Was overseas and didn't know much about NZ rugby state
91 and 95 Oz
99 - after 98 No way but gave us a shout
03 Poms
19 Like 99 Hope rather than expectation. Hopes that rose after QF - Expected a SA / NZ final that could go either way.@dogmeat said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
@canefan @Rapido
I was with @booboo - Mains' team only lacked a first 5 nd I hoped that Mehrts was the man - although I still favoured Oz.NZ are always going to be favourites because ithose reports are based on TAB oddsa and they reflect the money going on the AB's not their relative strength.
I had us as favourites in 07, 11 and 15.
87 - hadn't a clue. Was overseas and didn't know much about NZ rugby state
91 and 95 Oz
99 - after 98 No way but gave us a shout
03 Poms
19 Like 99 Hope rather than expectation. Hopes that rose after QF - Expected a SA / NZ final that could go either way.03 is an interesting one. England certainly had form, but the fact the tournament was in OZ had that unknown factor for England. England had beaten a pretty green AB side in June. Oz and the Boks had copped a couple of hidings from the ABs and this is before the days of resting players before RWC’s.
But OZ at home with some stalwarts still there had them as ever so slight favourites to me. I thought on our day we could beat them and if it came an arm wrestle England could beat them. So it wasn’t our day and England won the arm wrestle.
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@rancid-schnitzel said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
I had a special edition RWC rugby magazine and I remember so well Scottish coach Jim Telfer writing that NZ couldn’t challenge Aus and England anymore. I was sure he was going to be made to look the fool and he certainly was.
I didn't watch much rugby from 92-95, but England beat NZ in 1993 I had call after call from long-lost English acquaintances asking me if I'd seen the rugby.
Though I didn't keep a complete list, after the '95 RWC semi I managed to reciprocate their kindness in reaching out to me.
@victor-meldrew said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
@rancid-schnitzel said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
I had a special edition RWC rugby magazine and I remember so well Scottish coach Jim Telfer writing that NZ couldn’t challenge Aus and England anymore. I was sure he was going to be made to look the fool and he certainly was.
I didn't watch much rugby from 92-95, but England beat NZ in 1993 I had call after call from long-lost English acquaintances asking me if I'd seen the rugby.
Though I didn't keep a complete list, after the '95 RWC semi I managed to reciprocate their kindness in reaching out to me.
Ha, I remember that test. Ferners complaining about last weekends first half, yet that 93 test vs England at Twickers is probably one of, if not the worst first half I can recall from an AB side. And we had some quality players in that side - Fitzy, Zinny, Bunce, Goldie, Olo, Dowd, Inga
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@victor-meldrew said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
@rancid-schnitzel said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
I had a special edition RWC rugby magazine and I remember so well Scottish coach Jim Telfer writing that NZ couldn’t challenge Aus and England anymore. I was sure he was going to be made to look the fool and he certainly was.
I didn't watch much rugby from 92-95, but England beat NZ in 1993 I had call after call from long-lost English acquaintances asking me if I'd seen the rugby.
Though I didn't keep a complete list, after the '95 RWC semi I managed to reciprocate their kindness in reaching out to me.
Ha, I remember that test. Ferners complaining about last weekends first half, yet that 93 test vs England at Twickers is probably one of, if not the worst first half I can recall from an AB side. And we had some quality players in that side - Fitzy, Zinny, Bunce, Goldie, Olo, Dowd, Inga
@act-crusader said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
@victor-meldrew said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
@rancid-schnitzel said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
I had a special edition RWC rugby magazine and I remember so well Scottish coach Jim Telfer writing that NZ couldn’t challenge Aus and England anymore. I was sure he was going to be made to look the fool and he certainly was.
I didn't watch much rugby from 92-95, but England beat NZ in 1993 I had call after call from long-lost English acquaintances asking me if I'd seen the rugby.
Though I didn't keep a complete list, after the '95 RWC semi I managed to reciprocate their kindness in reaching out to me.
Ha, I remember that test. Ferners complaining about last weekends first half, yet that 93 test vs England at Twickers is probably one of, if not the worst first half I can recall from an AB side. And we had some quality players in that side - Fitzy, Zinny, Bunce, Goldie, Olo, Dowd, Inga
Would probably have been a different story if Jeff Wilson had his kicking boots on. Not a memorable day for him IIRC.
Very memorable for Keiran Bracken's ankle though...
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@act-crusader said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
@victor-meldrew said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
@rancid-schnitzel said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
I had a special edition RWC rugby magazine and I remember so well Scottish coach Jim Telfer writing that NZ couldn’t challenge Aus and England anymore. I was sure he was going to be made to look the fool and he certainly was.
I didn't watch much rugby from 92-95, but England beat NZ in 1993 I had call after call from long-lost English acquaintances asking me if I'd seen the rugby.
Though I didn't keep a complete list, after the '95 RWC semi I managed to reciprocate their kindness in reaching out to me.
Ha, I remember that test. Ferners complaining about last weekends first half, yet that 93 test vs England at Twickers is probably one of, if not the worst first half I can recall from an AB side. And we had some quality players in that side - Fitzy, Zinny, Bunce, Goldie, Olo, Dowd, Inga
Would probably have been a different story if Jeff Wilson had his kicking boots on. Not a memorable day for him IIRC.
Very memorable for Keiran Bracken's ankle though...
@catogrande said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
Very memorable for Keiran Bracken's ankle though...
Not to mention John Timu's head.
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@catogrande said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
Very memorable for Keiran Bracken's ankle though...
Not to mention John Timu's head.
Can't be that memorable - I can't remember it! Joking aside though I really don't remember anything untoward happening to Timu except for the disallowed try or was that another game?
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Can't be that memorable - I can't remember it! Joking aside though I really don't remember anything untoward happening to Timu except for the disallowed try or was that another game?
Recall a bit of a ruckus about the England no.8 (Dean Richards?) kicking Timu in the head. May be wrong & could be another game.
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Recall a bit of a ruckus about the England no.8 (Dean Richards?) kicking Timu in the head. May be wrong & could be another game.
@victor-meldrew said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
Recall a bit of a ruckus about the England no.8 (Dean Richards?) kicking Timu in the head. May be wrong & could be another game.
Richards only played NZ three times for England, ‘91 RWC, ‘93 and ‘95 RWC and Timu had gone by ‘95. There was the ‘93Lions tour though.
My guess is that it would have been that ‘93 game at Twickenham though as I remember it as being a bit niggly.
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@victor-meldrew said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
Recall a bit of a ruckus about the England no.8 (Dean Richards?) kicking Timu in the head. May be wrong & could be another game.
Richards only played NZ three times for England, ‘91 RWC, ‘93 and ‘95 RWC and Timu had gone by ‘95. There was the ‘93Lions tour though.
My guess is that it would have been that ‘93 game at Twickenham though as I remember it as being a bit niggly.
Must have been '93. Yeah really niggly game & crowd was a bit of a disgrace IIRC.
Seem to recall Richards as having a reputation akin to Richard Loe. Was it was him or Dean Ryan who used fake blood to get a replacement in some championship match?
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Must have been '93. Yeah really niggly game & crowd was a bit of a disgrace IIRC.
Seem to recall Richards as having a reputation akin to Richard Loe. Was it was him or Dean Ryan who used fake blood to get a replacement in some championship match?
@victor-meldrew said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
Must have been '93. Yeah really niggly game & crowd was a bit of a disgrace IIRC.
Seem to recall Richards as having a reputation akin to Richard Loe. Was it was him or Dean Ryan who used fake blood to get a replacement in some championship match?
Deano’s rep as a player was generally hard but fair but he did dish out the odd bit of filth in retaliation, a couple of times out of proportion but on the whole not a really dirty player. Yeah, Bloodgate was him. A bloody disgrace but he’s served his time for that. Doing a good job up at Newcastle.
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@victor-meldrew said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
Must have been '93. Yeah really niggly game & crowd was a bit of a disgrace IIRC.
Seem to recall Richards as having a reputation akin to Richard Loe. Was it was him or Dean Ryan who used fake blood to get a replacement in some championship match?
Deano’s rep as a player was generally hard but fair but he did dish out the odd bit of filth in retaliation, a couple of times out of proportion but on the whole not a really dirty player. Yeah, Bloodgate was him. A bloody disgrace but he’s served his time for that. Doing a good job up at Newcastle.
@catogrande said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
@victor-meldrew said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
Must have been '93. Yeah really niggly game & crowd was a bit of a disgrace IIRC.
Seem to recall Richards as having a reputation akin to Richard Loe. Was it was him or Dean Ryan who used fake blood to get a replacement in some championship match?
Deano’s rep as a player was generally hard but fair but he did dish out the odd bit of filth in retaliation, a couple of times out of proportion but on the whole not a really dirty player. Yeah, Bloodgate was him. A bloody disgrace but he’s served his time for that. Doing a good job up at Newcastle.
I still laugh at Dallaglio putting his knee into Lomu's neck when he scored on RWC '99. Never seen a forward run so fast back to his team when Jonah got up and started giving him the eye...
Worked in the same office as him at Serco - seemed a decent bloke.
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@catogrande said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
@victor-meldrew said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
Must have been '93. Yeah really niggly game & crowd was a bit of a disgrace IIRC.
Seem to recall Richards as having a reputation akin to Richard Loe. Was it was him or Dean Ryan who used fake blood to get a replacement in some championship match?
Deano’s rep as a player was generally hard but fair but he did dish out the odd bit of filth in retaliation, a couple of times out of proportion but on the whole not a really dirty player. Yeah, Bloodgate was him. A bloody disgrace but he’s served his time for that. Doing a good job up at Newcastle.
I still laugh at Dallaglio putting his knee into Lomu's neck when he scored on RWC '99. Never seen a forward run so fast back to his team when Jonah got up and started giving him the eye...
Worked in the same office as him at Serco - seemed a decent bloke.
@victor-meldrew said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
@catogrande said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
@victor-meldrew said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
Must have been '93. Yeah really niggly game & crowd was a bit of a disgrace IIRC.
Seem to recall Richards as having a reputation akin to Richard Loe. Was it was him or Dean Ryan who used fake blood to get a replacement in some championship match?
Deano’s rep as a player was generally hard but fair but he did dish out the odd bit of filth in retaliation, a couple of times out of proportion but on the whole not a really dirty player. Yeah, Bloodgate was him. A bloody disgrace but he’s served his time for that. Doing a good job up at Newcastle.
I still laugh at Dallaglio putting his knee into Lomu's neck when he scored on RWC '99. Never seen a forward run so fast back to his team when Jonah got up and started giving him the eye...
Worked in the same office as him at Serco - seemed a decent bloke.
Wouldn’t you?
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@victor-meldrew said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
@catogrande said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
@victor-meldrew said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
Must have been '93. Yeah really niggly game & crowd was a bit of a disgrace IIRC.
Seem to recall Richards as having a reputation akin to Richard Loe. Was it was him or Dean Ryan who used fake blood to get a replacement in some championship match?
Deano’s rep as a player was generally hard but fair but he did dish out the odd bit of filth in retaliation, a couple of times out of proportion but on the whole not a really dirty player. Yeah, Bloodgate was him. A bloody disgrace but he’s served his time for that. Doing a good job up at Newcastle.
I still laugh at Dallaglio putting his knee into Lomu's neck when he scored on RWC '99. Never seen a forward run so fast back to his team when Jonah got up and started giving him the eye...
Worked in the same office as him at Serco - seemed a decent bloke.
Wouldn’t you?
@catogrande said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
@victor-meldrew said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
@catogrande said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
@victor-meldrew said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
Must have been '93. Yeah really niggly game & crowd was a bit of a disgrace IIRC.
Seem to recall Richards as having a reputation akin to Richard Loe. Was it was him or Dean Ryan who used fake blood to get a replacement in some championship match?
Deano’s rep as a player was generally hard but fair but he did dish out the odd bit of filth in retaliation, a couple of times out of proportion but on the whole not a really dirty player. Yeah, Bloodgate was him. A bloody disgrace but he’s served his time for that. Doing a good job up at Newcastle.
I still laugh at Dallaglio putting his knee into Lomu's neck when he scored on RWC '99. Never seen a forward run so fast back to his team when Jonah got up and started giving him the eye...
Worked in the same office as him at Serco - seemed a decent bloke.
Wouldn’t you?
I wouldn't be so dumb...
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@victor-meldrew said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
@rancid-schnitzel said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
I had a special edition RWC rugby magazine and I remember so well Scottish coach Jim Telfer writing that NZ couldn’t challenge Aus and England anymore. I was sure he was going to be made to look the fool and he certainly was.
I didn't watch much rugby from 92-95, but England beat NZ in 1993 I had call after call from long-lost English acquaintances asking me if I'd seen the rugby.
Though I didn't keep a complete list, after the '95 RWC semi I managed to reciprocate their kindness in reaching out to me.
Ha, I remember that test. Ferners complaining about last weekends first half, yet that 93 test vs England at Twickers is probably one of, if not the worst first half I can recall from an AB side. And we had some quality players in that side - Fitzy, Zinny, Bunce, Goldie, Olo, Dowd, Inga
@act-crusader said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
@victor-meldrew said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
@rancid-schnitzel said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
I had a special edition RWC rugby magazine and I remember so well Scottish coach Jim Telfer writing that NZ couldn’t challenge Aus and England anymore. I was sure he was going to be made to look the fool and he certainly was.
I didn't watch much rugby from 92-95, but England beat NZ in 1993 I had call after call from long-lost English acquaintances asking me if I'd seen the rugby.
Though I didn't keep a complete list, after the '95 RWC semi I managed to reciprocate their kindness in reaching out to me.
Ha, I remember that test. Ferners complaining about last weekends first half, yet that 93 test vs England at Twickers is probably one of, if not the worst first half I can recall from an AB side. And we had some quality players in that side - Fitzy, Zinny, Bunce, Goldie, Olo, Dowd, Inga
Yes, but with a halves pairing of Forster and Ellis and a 19-year old taking the kicks.
But yes it was a pretty shitty performance, particularly after the pastings given to the Lions, Aus and Scotland.
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@act-crusader said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
@victor-meldrew said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
@rancid-schnitzel said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
I had a special edition RWC rugby magazine and I remember so well Scottish coach Jim Telfer writing that NZ couldn’t challenge Aus and England anymore. I was sure he was going to be made to look the fool and he certainly was.
I didn't watch much rugby from 92-95, but England beat NZ in 1993 I had call after call from long-lost English acquaintances asking me if I'd seen the rugby.
Though I didn't keep a complete list, after the '95 RWC semi I managed to reciprocate their kindness in reaching out to me.
Ha, I remember that test. Ferners complaining about last weekends first half, yet that 93 test vs England at Twickers is probably one of, if not the worst first half I can recall from an AB side. And we had some quality players in that side - Fitzy, Zinny, Bunce, Goldie, Olo, Dowd, Inga
Yes, but with a halves pairing of Forster and Ellis and a 19-year old taking the kicks.
But yes it was a pretty shitty performance, particularly after the pastings given to the Lions, Aus and Scotland.
@rancid-schnitzel Still had 6 of the pack that would play in 95 RWC Final and 96 SA tour so should have won IMO.
Fox had retired and Little broke his leg so options were limited I guess. Mains should have selected Preston but for some reason despite him being halfback against the Lions he never made the tour.
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@act-crusader said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
@victor-meldrew said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
@rancid-schnitzel said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
I had a special edition RWC rugby magazine and I remember so well Scottish coach Jim Telfer writing that NZ couldn’t challenge Aus and England anymore. I was sure he was going to be made to look the fool and he certainly was.
I didn't watch much rugby from 92-95, but England beat NZ in 1993 I had call after call from long-lost English acquaintances asking me if I'd seen the rugby.
Though I didn't keep a complete list, after the '95 RWC semi I managed to reciprocate their kindness in reaching out to me.
Ha, I remember that test. Ferners complaining about last weekends first half, yet that 93 test vs England at Twickers is probably one of, if not the worst first half I can recall from an AB side. And we had some quality players in that side - Fitzy, Zinny, Bunce, Goldie, Olo, Dowd, Inga
Yes, but with a halves pairing of Forster and Ellis and a 19-year old taking the kicks.
But yes it was a pretty shitty performance, particularly after the pastings given to the Lions, Aus and Scotland.
@rancid-schnitzel said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
@act-crusader said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
@victor-meldrew said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
@rancid-schnitzel said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
I had a special edition RWC rugby magazine and I remember so well Scottish coach Jim Telfer writing that NZ couldn’t challenge Aus and England anymore. I was sure he was going to be made to look the fool and he certainly was.
I didn't watch much rugby from 92-95, but England beat NZ in 1993 I had call after call from long-lost English acquaintances asking me if I'd seen the rugby.
Though I didn't keep a complete list, after the '95 RWC semi I managed to reciprocate their kindness in reaching out to me.
Ha, I remember that test. Ferners complaining about last weekends first half, yet that 93 test vs England at Twickers is probably one of, if not the worst first half I can recall from an AB side. And we had some quality players in that side - Fitzy, Zinny, Bunce, Goldie, Olo, Dowd, Inga
Yes, but with a halves pairing of Forster and Ellis and a 19-year old taking the kicks.
Welcome to the days of Mains and Thorburn.
Matt Cooper would have been the 2nd 5 and goal kicker in the England test but was injured a week before against Scotland.
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@dogmeat said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
@canefan @Rapido
I was with @booboo - Mains' team only lacked a first 5 nd I hoped that Mehrts was the man - although I still favoured Oz.NZ are always going to be favourites because ithose reports are based on TAB oddsa and they reflect the money going on the AB's not their relative strength.
I had us as favourites in 07, 11 and 15.
87 - hadn't a clue. Was overseas and didn't know much about NZ rugby state
91 and 95 Oz
99 - after 98 No way but gave us a shout
03 Poms
19 Like 99 Hope rather than expectation. Hopes that rose after QF - Expected a SA / NZ final that could go either way.03 is an interesting one. England certainly had form, but the fact the tournament was in OZ had that unknown factor for England. England had beaten a pretty green AB side in June. Oz and the Boks had copped a couple of hidings from the ABs and this is before the days of resting players before RWC’s.
But OZ at home with some stalwarts still there had them as ever so slight favourites to me. I thought on our day we could beat them and if it came an arm wrestle England could beat them. So it wasn’t our day and England won the arm wrestle.
@act-crusader said in Worst All Black RWC exits:
03 is an interesting one. England certainly had form, but the fact the tournament was in OZ had that unknown factor for England. England had beaten a pretty green AB side in June. Oz and the Boks had copped a couple of hidings from the ABs and this is before the days of resting players before RWC’s.
But OZ at home with some stalwarts still there had them as ever so slight favourites to me. I thought on our day we could beat them and if it came an arm wrestle England could beat them. So it wasn’t our day and England won the arm wrestle.
Do you mean before the tournament you saw Australia as favourites or just in the final? If you mean prior to the tournament you would have been a brave man given England had just beaten them home and away in the 12 months prior and we had just won the Bleidsloe back and put 50 on them at the semi-final venue.
