Foster, Robertson, Rennie etc
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The senior players (and Shand) would have been asked for feedback and I doubt this decision would have been made now if their opinions were overwhelmingly negative.
@bovidae said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
The senior players (and Shand) would have been asked for feedback and I doubt this decision would have been made now if their opinions were overwhelmingly negative.
I'm not sure of this. The evidence is that Foster is an extremely likeable person and players like him. He never faced any issues with the Chiefs, even when they came second last.
In some cases there have been useless coaches that get player support precisely because it allows the players to do what they want.
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@bovidae said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
The senior players (and Shand) would have been asked for feedback and I doubt this decision would have been made now if their opinions were overwhelmingly negative.
As the press release mentions alot about building culture and stuff, I am sure the echo chamber that is the ABs (where it's relly hard to get dropped) is positive to Foster. However he has been barely tested with his opponents, and even then lost to Argetina in a dire effort - which should have been a firing result
@machpants Shand is higher up the food chain at NZR than Foster (and Hansen was) as he is part of the Executive Team. His job security is not dependent on Foster keeping his position.
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@hooroo said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@canes4life said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@hooroo I didn't say it would suck winning the WC, I was eluding to the fact that if we win the World Cup we will have to endure another lengthy period of shit selections and underwhelming coaching if he carries on in the role.
I know. But it will all be the right choices made if he wins the WC, therefore deserving of extension.
Kind of like rewarding good results....
England 2007 were a couple of centimeters away from winning the thing, despite being an absolute pile of steaming, negative, shit. RWC performance doesn't always correlate with actual quality of the team or coaching.
@nzzp said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@hooroo said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@canes4life said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@hooroo I didn't say it would suck winning the WC, I was eluding to the fact that if we win the World Cup we will have to endure another lengthy period of shit selections and underwhelming coaching if he carries on in the role.
I know. But it will all be the right choices made if he wins the WC, therefore deserving of extension.
Kind of like rewarding good results....
England 2007 were a couple of centimeters away from winning the thing, despite being an absolute pile of steaming, negative, shit. RWC performance doesn't always correlate with actual quality of the team or coaching.
Yeah but we live and die by it nowadays (Not that I like that)
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@machpants Shand is higher up the food chain at NZR than Foster (and Hansen was) as he is part of the Executive Team. His job security is not dependent on Foster keeping his position.
@bovidae said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@machpants Shand is higher up the food chain at NZR than Foster (and Hansen was) as he is part of the Executive Team. His job security is not dependent on Foster keeping his position.
I was more talking about the players, as mentioned a good environment does not mean good coach. Still the proof will be in the pudding if SA turn up full bore to the RC, and France play to their max.
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@bovidae said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
The senior players (and Shand) would have been asked for feedback and I doubt this decision would have been made now if their opinions were overwhelmingly negative.
As the press release mentions alot about building culture and stuff, I am sure the echo chamber that is the ABs (where it's relly hard to get dropped) is positive to Foster. However he has been barely tested with his opponents, and even then lost to Argetina in a dire effort - which should have been a firing result
@machpants said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@bovidae said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
The senior players (and Shand) would have been asked for feedback and I doubt this decision would have been made now if their opinions were overwhelmingly negative.
As the press release mentions alot about building culture and stuff, I am sure the echo chamber that is the ABs (where it's relly hard to get dropped) is positive to Foster. However he has been barely tested with his opponents, and even then lost to Argetina in a dire effort - which should have been a firing result
It's a farcical decision.
So far Foster's been 'tested' by the weakest & most inexperienced Wallabies 23's in his own entire lifetime & an 8th ranked Argentinian side.
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@bovidae said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@machpants Shand is higher up the food chain at NZR than Foster (and Hansen was) as he is part of the Executive Team. His job security is not dependent on Foster keeping his position.
I was more talking about the players, as mentioned a good environment does not mean good coach. Still the proof will be in the pudding if SA turn up full bore to the RC, and France play to their max.
@machpants thing is, these guys are all elite rugby players having worked with multiple coaches getting to this point, I expect if he is a shit coach but a great guy, they would know the difference.
We can all sit here and point fingers, but you have to assume there has been a fair bit of work done behind the scenes despite us thinking it is Robinson, Fozzie and Shand getting it sorted over some beers
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@machpants thing is, these guys are all elite rugby players having worked with multiple coaches getting to this point, I expect if he is a shit coach but a great guy, they would know the difference.
We can all sit here and point fingers, but you have to assume there has been a fair bit of work done behind the scenes despite us thinking it is Robinson, Fozzie and Shand getting it sorted over some beers
@taniwharugby said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@machpants thing is, these guys are all elite rugby players having worked with multiple coaches getting to this point, I expect if he is a shit coach but a great guy, they would know the difference.
We can all sit here and point fingers, but you have to assume there has been a fair bit of work done behind the scenes despite us thinking it is Robinson, Fozzie and Shand getting it sorted over some beers
Yeah I do, but the results are not good enough and culture is pointless if the results don't follow. Sure if th ABs clean sweep with physicality and directness for the rest of the year, they were right. But if the ABs play like they have under Foster, and the last few years of Hansen, flaky, fluffy, and fucking inconsistant then it was the wrong decision. Leaving the decision until the end of the year would have been the right option, even after SA as every other opponent we have faced since the RWC has been shit.
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I think he deserves a chance to see where he can take this side. Its been a tad underwhelming since far, but there have been some improvements within the side and we're slowly but surely heading in the right direction imo.
I feel like no matter what he does, he'll always be disliked.
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I think he deserves a chance to see where he can take this side. Its been a tad underwhelming since far, but there have been some improvements within the side and we're slowly but surely heading in the right direction imo.
I feel like no matter what he does, he'll always be disliked.
@african-monkey not sure about 'deserves' a chance, but by the same token, I think there have been alot of disruptions to his time that it would be pretty harsh to can him before he has had a good chance to really 'own' things
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His chance is this tour, a 15 weeks block together, that is like RWC level prep. At the end of the tour is when he should be judged, but now it's too late
To be fair to Foster he does have experience, under the master tutelage of Hansen. In losing important RWC matches, oh and for historic losses to teams that never beat us before. So there is that.
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@african-monkey not sure about 'deserves' a chance, but by the same token, I think there have been alot of disruptions to his time that it would be pretty harsh to can him before he has had a good chance to really 'own' things
@taniwharugby said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@african-monkey not sure about 'deserves' a chance, but by the same token, I think there have been alot of disruptions to his time that it would be pretty harsh to can him before he has had a good chance to really 'own' things
it cuts both ways though-arguably the ABs have been less distrupted than other teams.
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I think he deserves a chance to see where he can take this side. Its been a tad underwhelming since far, but there have been some improvements within the side and we're slowly but surely heading in the right direction imo.
I feel like no matter what he does, he'll always be disliked.
@african-monkey said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
I think he deserves a chance to see where he can take this side. Its been a tad underwhelming since far, but there have been some improvements within the side and we're slowly but surely heading in the right direction imo.
I feel like no matter what he does, he'll always be disliked.
I think kiwis like a fair playing field. Unlike England or France for example, where factors such as class, which university you went to etc often have a direct impact on job opportunities, we tend to give everyone a fair go and pick the best person not the most well connected. I think what grates with foster is that he has no personal record to speak of, and basically got in on Hansen’s shirt tails, shirt tails which were very underwhelming in the last 2 years of his tenure. Feels like foster is using the ABs to try and prove he can coach rather than already being proven.
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@taniwharugby said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@african-monkey not sure about 'deserves' a chance, but by the same token, I think there have been alot of disruptions to his time that it would be pretty harsh to can him before he has had a good chance to really 'own' things
it cuts both ways though-arguably the ABs have been less distrupted than other teams.
@nostrildamus said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@taniwharugby said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@african-monkey not sure about 'deserves' a chance, but by the same token, I think there have been alot of disruptions to his time that it would be pretty harsh to can him before he has had a good chance to really 'own' things
it cuts both ways though-arguably the ABs have been less distrupted than other teams.
There is really no excuse at all to losing, for the first time ever, to an Argentine team straight out of a year of no rugby and 2 weeks of lockdown. Oh, and covid positive members recently. That should have been the nail.
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@stargazer you'd like to think, that had we lost to Fiji and Aus they wouldn't have re-signed him.
But I've been of the view the decision was made weeks/months ago to re-sign him (or not, turns out it was to re-sign)
What happens if we lose to SA, Arg, Wales?
His record is shakey already, and makes NZR look unprofessional again re-signing him, while he still has half a dozen or so games to win/lose
@taniwharugby said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@stargazer you'd like to think, that had we lost to Fiji and Aus they wouldn't have re-signed him.
But I've been of the view the decision was made weeks/months ago to re-sign him (or not, turns out it was to re-sign)
What happens if we lose to SA, Arg, Wales?
His record is shakey already, and makes NZR look unprofessional again re-signing him, while he still has half a dozen or so games to win/lose
SA a distinct possibility (if they ever play it) but no shame in that.
Argentina
Wales
It’s outside the test window so no guarantees we’ll be able to field our best 23And even then, it’s unlikely
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@machpants said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@canes4life said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
The thing is, if we win the World Cup he will most likely be reinstated again. Ffs.
More than happy with that hairy, I will eat humble pie and apologise
I will be pleased for Fozzie to prove us wrong by going on to win Le Coupe du Monde
@canefan said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@machpants said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@canes4life said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
The thing is, if we win the World Cup he will most likely be reinstated again. Ffs.
More than happy with that hairy, I will eat humble pie and apologise
I will be pleased for Fozzie to prove us wrong by going on to win Le Coupe du Monde
I know gender-fluid is very PC.
But La Coupe du Monde.
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@taniwharugby said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@stargazer you'd like to think, that had we lost to Fiji and Aus they wouldn't have re-signed him.
But I've been of the view the decision was made weeks/months ago to re-sign him (or not, turns out it was to re-sign)
What happens if we lose to SA, Arg, Wales?
His record is shakey already, and makes NZR look unprofessional again re-signing him, while he still has half a dozen or so games to win/lose
SA a distinct possibility (if they ever play it) but no shame in that.
Argentina
Wales
It’s outside the test window so no guarantees we’ll be able to field our best 23And even then, it’s unlikely
@mikethesnow said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@taniwharugby said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@stargazer you'd like to think, that had we lost to Fiji and Aus they wouldn't have re-signed him.
But I've been of the view the decision was made weeks/months ago to re-sign him (or not, turns out it was to re-sign)
What happens if we lose to SA, Arg, Wales?
His record is shakey already, and makes NZR look unprofessional again re-signing him, while he still has half a dozen or so games to win/lose
SA a distinct possibility (if they ever play it) but no shame in that.
Argentina
Wales
It’s outside the test window so no guarantees we’ll be able to field our best 23And even then, it’s unlikely
France and SA are likely losses
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@canefan said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@machpants said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@canes4life said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
The thing is, if we win the World Cup he will most likely be reinstated again. Ffs.
More than happy with that hairy, I will eat humble pie and apologise
I will be pleased for Fozzie to prove us wrong by going on to win Le Coupe du Monde
I know gender-fluid is very PC.
But La Coupe du Monde.
@billy-tell said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@canefan said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@machpants said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@canes4life said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
The thing is, if we win the World Cup he will most likely be reinstated again. Ffs.
More than happy with that hairy, I will eat humble pie and apologise
I will be pleased for Fozzie to prove us wrong by going on to win Le Coupe du Monde
I know gender-fluid is very PC.
But La Coupe du Monde.
That's not gender. That's grammar
