Foster, Robertson, Rennie etc
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@crucial said in Foster, Robertson, Other Options etc:
@mariner4life said in Foster, Robertson, Other Options etc:
To be fair, from our 2nd try right up until the intercept i thought we would win on Sunday.
The week before we were a couple of degrees on a forward pass from winning.
Our loss to SA was a very late penalty (so was our win to be fair)
so for all our wailing and gnashing of teeth, and issues we can all see, a couple of better moments from players and we are unbeaten all year.
Thanks Ian.
nah, he has a point. Despite us being pants, we could have burgled a few wins from the losses. It wouldn't represent the game, but it would be a great escape. Kinda like England 2019 -- we weren't in that game, but had a chance to actually snatch it.
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@nzzp would that be enough though?
@kiwiwomble said in Foster, Robertson, Other Options etc:
@nzzp would that be enough though?
what? winning? holy shit maybe it right what everyone says about us
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To be fair, from our 2nd try right up until the intercept i thought we would win on Sunday.
The week before we were a couple of degrees on a forward pass from winning.
Our loss to SA was a very late penalty (so was our win to be fair)
so for all our wailing and gnashing of teeth, and issues we can all see, a couple of better moments from players and we are unbeaten all year.
@mariner4life said in Foster, Robertson, Other Options etc:
To be fair, from our 2nd try right up until the intercept i thought we would win on Sunday.
24-6 down at halftime is the issue. It's all well and good talking about the 3rd quarter fightback but 24-6 down at halftime is unacceptable and ultimately costs you the match as the opposition are going to get momentum in the second half and by being 24-6 down you are leaving no room for error and no able to apply scoreboard pressure as were so far back were never able to get in front.
There's been a lot of chat about the intercept and the Mounga missed tackle but how about the shitshow that was the first 40?
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To be fair, from our 2nd try right up until the intercept i thought we would win on Sunday.
The week before we were a couple of degrees on a forward pass from winning.
Our loss to SA was a very late penalty (so was our win to be fair)
so for all our wailing and gnashing of teeth, and issues we can all see, a couple of better moments from players and we are unbeaten all year.
@mariner4life ABs were still well beaten by better sides with superior game plans regardless of the "ifs" and "buts". On the other hand, if Ireland had taken all its chances....
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@kiwiwomble said in Foster, Robertson, Other Options etc:
@nzzp would that be enough though?
what? winning? holy shit maybe it right what everyone says about us
@mariner4life said in Foster, Robertson, Other Options etc:
@kiwiwomble said in Foster, Robertson, Other Options etc:
@nzzp would that be enough though?
what? winning? holy shit maybe it right what everyone says about us
dont get me wrong, not saying i wouldn't taken it, im just asking if that would have been enough to think Fozzie was doing a good job? on paper do we think the current team is only a whisker above some of these teams?
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@canefan said in Foster, Robertson, Other Options etc:
We were well beaten on the field. Dominated at times. That is a major concern
two weeks in a row where the majority of our tries came from moments of individual brilliance rather than real dominance
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@mariner4life said in Foster, Robertson, Other Options etc:
@kiwiwomble said in Foster, Robertson, Other Options etc:
@nzzp would that be enough though?
what? winning? holy shit maybe it right what everyone says about us
dont get me wrong, not saying i wouldn't taken it, im just asking if that would have been enough to think Fozzie was doing a good job? on paper do we think the current team is only a whisker above some of these teams?
@kiwiwomble said in Foster, Robertson, Other Options etc:
@mariner4life said in Foster, Robertson, Other Options etc:
@kiwiwomble said in Foster, Robertson, Other Options etc:
@nzzp would that be enough though?
what? winning? holy shit maybe it right what everyone says about us
dont get me wrong, not saying i wouldn't taken it, im just asking if that would have been enough to think Fozzie was doing a good job? on paper do we think the current team is only a whisker above some of these teams?
yes
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Highlander, over on theroar.com.au has pointed out that our blueprint of Lions 1, playing (smashing) off 9 worked so very well. I seem to remember a similar thing putting us back on top against the French for a 1/4 or so. Why is it not used more often? Why is the tactic fling it around the backs? Clueless gameplans is what annoys me, we have the layers to be winning but not the tactics and org. It is 100% coaching problems, not learning
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@mariner4life said in Foster, Robertson, Other Options etc:
To be fair, from our 2nd try right up until the intercept i thought we would win on Sunday.
24-6 down at halftime is the issue. It's all well and good talking about the 3rd quarter fightback but 24-6 down at halftime is unacceptable and ultimately costs you the match as the opposition are going to get momentum in the second half and by being 24-6 down you are leaving no room for error and no able to apply scoreboard pressure as were so far back were never able to get in front.
There's been a lot of chat about the intercept and the Mounga missed tackle but how about the shitshow that was the first 40?
@kiwimurph said in Foster, Robertson, Other Options etc:
@mariner4life said in Foster, Robertson, Other Options etc:
To be fair, from our 2nd try right up until the intercept i thought we would win on Sunday.
24-6 down at halftime is the issue. It's all well and good talking about the 3rd quarter fightback but 24-6 down at halftime is unacceptable and ultimately costs you the match as the opposition are going to get momentum in the second half and by being 24-6 down you are leaving no room for error and no able to apply scoreboard pressure as were so far back were never able to get in front.
There's been a lot of chat about the intercept and the Mounga missed tackle but how about the shitshow that was the first 40?
again, as a coach can you imagine sitting in the box, and the game is barely under way when Jordie kicks the ball, under no pressure, out on the 5m?? Or Barnes allowing a linebreak from an accidental offside/obstruction? Or Mounga for some ungodly reason following a lead runner in and leaving a yawning hole. Or Smith throwing one of the worst passes of his career?
We get down teh other end, the line is open, and Coles drops it
Individual errors cost us so badly in that first half.
To me the Ireland performance was so much worse because we were bullied out of it. Errors killed us against the French. Bad, individual skill errors.
I've made a massive post about my view on where we are at, i don't need to say it all again. But i am not convinced things are as bad as we are making out.
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@kiwimurph said in Foster, Robertson, Other Options etc:
@mariner4life said in Foster, Robertson, Other Options etc:
To be fair, from our 2nd try right up until the intercept i thought we would win on Sunday.
24-6 down at halftime is the issue. It's all well and good talking about the 3rd quarter fightback but 24-6 down at halftime is unacceptable and ultimately costs you the match as the opposition are going to get momentum in the second half and by being 24-6 down you are leaving no room for error and no able to apply scoreboard pressure as were so far back were never able to get in front.
There's been a lot of chat about the intercept and the Mounga missed tackle but how about the shitshow that was the first 40?
again, as a coach can you imagine sitting in the box, and the game is barely under way when Jordie kicks the ball, under no pressure, out on the 5m?? Or Barnes allowing a linebreak from an accidental offside/obstruction? Or Mounga for some ungodly reason following a lead runner in and leaving a yawning hole. Or Smith throwing one of the worst passes of his career?
We get down teh other end, the line is open, and Coles drops it
Individual errors cost us so badly in that first half.
To me the Ireland performance was so much worse because we were bullied out of it. Errors killed us against the French. Bad, individual skill errors.
I've made a massive post about my view on where we are at, i don't need to say it all again. But i am not convinced things are as bad as we are making out.
@mariner4life i think some of us feel that those errors at least partially come from things like uncertainty on gameplan or some moving around different positions, some over played and other underplayed, maybe being surprised by how the opposition are playing, all things that the coach has a major influence on
I hope you're right though and we're close to "clicking"
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@kiwimurph said in Foster, Robertson, Other Options etc:
@mariner4life said in Foster, Robertson, Other Options etc:
To be fair, from our 2nd try right up until the intercept i thought we would win on Sunday.
24-6 down at halftime is the issue. It's all well and good talking about the 3rd quarter fightback but 24-6 down at halftime is unacceptable and ultimately costs you the match as the opposition are going to get momentum in the second half and by being 24-6 down you are leaving no room for error and no able to apply scoreboard pressure as were so far back were never able to get in front.
There's been a lot of chat about the intercept and the Mounga missed tackle but how about the shitshow that was the first 40?
again, as a coach can you imagine sitting in the box, and the game is barely under way when Jordie kicks the ball, under no pressure, out on the 5m?? Or Barnes allowing a linebreak from an accidental offside/obstruction? Or Mounga for some ungodly reason following a lead runner in and leaving a yawning hole. Or Smith throwing one of the worst passes of his career?
We get down teh other end, the line is open, and Coles drops it
Individual errors cost us so badly in that first half.
To me the Ireland performance was so much worse because we were bullied out of it. Errors killed us against the French. Bad, individual skill errors.
I've made a massive post about my view on where we are at, i don't need to say it all again. But i am not convinced things are as bad as we are making out.
@mariner4life Yeah I think a huge part of the problem comes down to our defence.
The pattern sucks. I'd rather see us commit to a rush defence even if it resulted in more penalties. Same story for the breakdown - our breakdown work is poor which means teams can rack up phase after phase.
Our defence simply doesn't put pressure on the opposition.
To put it in NFL terms in the Ireland game our defence was bend but don't break defence but doesn't generate enough turnovers (or punts). So what ended up happening was the time of possession was hugely in Ireland's favour which ended up telling in the second half.
In the French game we did break and leaked 40 points (33 if you take away the intercept).
We conceded 40 points to France, 29 to Ireland, 31 to the Boks, 23 to Fiji and didn't keep the Wallabies under 20 in any of the three Bledisloe games.
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@mariner4life i think some of us feel that those errors at least partially come from things like uncertainty on gameplan or some moving around different positions, some over played and other underplayed, maybe being surprised by how the opposition are playing, all things that the coach has a major influence on
I hope you're right though and we're close to "clicking"
@kiwiwomble said in Foster, Robertson, Other Options etc:
I hope you're right though and we're close to "clicking"
i didn't say that, at all
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@kiwiwomble said in Foster, Robertson, Other Options etc:
I hope you're right though and we're close to "clicking"
i didn't say that, at all
@mariner4life said in Foster, Robertson, Other Options etc:
@kiwiwomble said in Foster, Robertson, Other Options etc:
I hope you're right though and we're close to "clicking"
i didn't say that, at all
sorry, must have misunderstood, i asked if we'd pinched a few wins would that be enough for fozzie to be considered to be doing a good job and you said yes, i took that as being only close to being acceptable
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@mariner4life said in Foster, Robertson, Other Options etc:
@kiwiwomble said in Foster, Robertson, Other Options etc:
I hope you're right though and we're close to "clicking"
i didn't say that, at all
sorry, must have misunderstood, i asked if we'd pinched a few wins would that be enough for fozzie to be considered to be doing a good job and you said yes, i took that as being only close to being acceptable
@kiwiwomble said in Foster, Robertson, Other Options etc:
@mariner4life said in Foster, Robertson, Other Options etc:
@kiwiwomble said in Foster, Robertson, Other Options etc:
I hope you're right though and we're close to "clicking"
i didn't say that, at all
sorry, must have misunderstood, i asked if we'd pinched a few wins would that be enough for fozzie to be considered to be doing a good job and you said yes, i took that as being only close to being acceptable
Winning lots is his only remit. The only metric that counts. The manner of those wins counts to fans and fuck all else.
So yeah, if we burgled those wins i would say he did pretty well
I never said we were close to clicking though. Beating Ireland that day would have been a robbery.
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@kiwiwomble said in Foster, Robertson, Other Options etc:
@mariner4life said in Foster, Robertson, Other Options etc:
@kiwiwomble said in Foster, Robertson, Other Options etc:
I hope you're right though and we're close to "clicking"
i didn't say that, at all
sorry, must have misunderstood, i asked if we'd pinched a few wins would that be enough for fozzie to be considered to be doing a good job and you said yes, i took that as being only close to being acceptable
Winning lots is his only remit. The only metric that counts. The manner of those wins counts to fans and fuck all else.
So yeah, if we burgled those wins i would say he did pretty well
I never said we were close to clicking though. Beating Ireland that day would have been a robbery.
@mariner4life said in Foster, Robertson, Other Options etc:
@kiwiwomble said in Foster, Robertson, Other Options etc:
@mariner4life said in Foster, Robertson, Other Options etc:
@kiwiwomble said in Foster, Robertson, Other Options etc:
I hope you're right though and we're close to "clicking"
i didn't say that, at all
sorry, must have misunderstood, i asked if we'd pinched a few wins would that be enough for fozzie to be considered to be doing a good job and you said yes, i took that as being only close to being acceptable
Winning lots is his only remit. The only metric that counts. The manner of those wins counts to fans and fuck all else.
So yeah, if we burgled those wins i would say he did pretty well
I never said we were close to clicking though. Beating Ireland that day would have been a robbery.
It is better this way. If we had burgled wins vs Ireland or France it would have given the NZRFU and the AB coaches priceless breathing room. And a chance to paper over our flaws
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@kiwimurph said in Foster, Robertson, Other Options etc:
@mariner4life said in Foster, Robertson, Other Options etc:
To be fair, from our 2nd try right up until the intercept i thought we would win on Sunday.
24-6 down at halftime is the issue. It's all well and good talking about the 3rd quarter fightback but 24-6 down at halftime is unacceptable and ultimately costs you the match as the opposition are going to get momentum in the second half and by being 24-6 down you are leaving no room for error and no able to apply scoreboard pressure as were so far back were never able to get in front.
There's been a lot of chat about the intercept and the Mounga missed tackle but how about the shitshow that was the first 40?
again, as a coach can you imagine sitting in the box, and the game is barely under way when Jordie kicks the ball, under no pressure, out on the 5m?? Or Barnes allowing a linebreak from an accidental offside/obstruction? Or Mounga for some ungodly reason following a lead runner in and leaving a yawning hole. Or Smith throwing one of the worst passes of his career?
We get down teh other end, the line is open, and Coles drops it
Individual errors cost us so badly in that first half.
To me the Ireland performance was so much worse because we were bullied out of it. Errors killed us against the French. Bad, individual skill errors.
I've made a massive post about my view on where we are at, i don't need to say it all again. But i am not convinced things are as bad as we are making out.
@mariner4life said in Foster, Robertson, Other Options etc:
@kiwimurph said in Foster, Robertson, Other Options etc:
@mariner4life said in Foster, Robertson, Other Options etc:
To be fair, from our 2nd try right up until the intercept i thought we would win on Sunday.
24-6 down at halftime is the issue. It's all well and good talking about the 3rd quarter fightback but 24-6 down at halftime is unacceptable and ultimately costs you the match as the opposition are going to get momentum in the second half and by being 24-6 down you are leaving no room for error and no able to apply scoreboard pressure as were so far back were never able to get in front.
There's been a lot of chat about the intercept and the Mounga missed tackle but how about the shitshow that was the first 40?
again, as a coach can you imagine sitting in the box, and the game is barely under way when Jordie kicks the ball, under no pressure, out on the 5m?? Or Barnes allowing a linebreak from an accidental offside/obstruction? Or Mounga for some ungodly reason following a lead runner in and leaving a yawning hole. Or Smith throwing one of the worst passes of his career?
We get down teh other end, the line is open, and Coles drops it
Individual errors cost us so badly in that first half.
To me the Ireland performance was so much worse because we were bullied out of it. Errors killed us against the French. Bad, individual skill errors.
I've made a massive post about my view on where we are at, i don't need to say it all again. But i am not convinced things are as bad as we are making out.
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Highlander, over on theroar.com.au has pointed out that our blueprint of Lions 1, playing (smashing) off 9 worked so very well. I seem to remember a similar thing putting us back on top against the French for a 1/4 or so. Why is it not used more often? Why is the tactic fling it around the backs? Clueless gameplans is what annoys me, we have the layers to be winning but not the tactics and org. It is 100% coaching problems, not learning
@machpants said in Foster, Robertson, Other Options etc:
Highlander, over on theroar.com.au has pointed out that our blueprint of Lions 1, playing (smashing) off 9 worked so very well. I seem to remember a similar thing putting us back on top against the French for a 1/4 or so. Why is it not used more often? Why is the tactic fling it around the backs? Clueless gameplans is what annoys me, we have the layers to be winning but not the tactics and org. It is 100% coaching problems, not learning
Yep, I don't get this. It's like they found the perfect recipe and then for some inexplicable reason decided to bin it. It may be that it's more attritional but it's not like the opposition teams are saving themselves at any point during the game. We have the players for it so let's farking do it, rather than this fan across field, hot potato bullshit to George Bridge.
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Ouch
All Blacks set a new record
Not so much the 101 tries, more the unprecedented number of excuses rolled out by Foster...
https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/on-the-inside/456375/the-end-of-year-tours-what-we-learned
