Alternative needed from the absolute crap of stuff.co.nz

Donsteppa

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="dogmeat" data-cid="585884" data-time="1465451261">
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Don - if I'd raped someone I'd have been more scared of my Dad's reaction / punishment than any courts.
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THIS!

Baron Silas Greenback

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Donsteppa" data-cid="585882" data-time="1465450943">
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The Stanford kid is a cretin, and should be going away for six to ten years, and the father at the very least needs a clip around the ears.
 
However, when my Facebook page starts filling up with posts with headlines like: "Dear Dads: this is what rape culture looks like, and you're responsible", and following ones suggesting that if you "roll your eyes it's [some form of] privilege"... well, I start to roll my eyes.
 
On the whole, Terrible Two Year Old will learn far more about life from how I treat Mrs Steppa and my attitudes towards women than he will from any set of words that I use with him.
 
If I somehow fail, and the Toddler Steppa does go wrong later in life, unlike Stanford cretins, there'll be no defence argued from this Dad about his subsequent punishment. 
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The problem is.. that you roll your eyes.. but some brain dead mothers take that seriously and start talking to small boys about rape and making them feel inherently bad just for having a penis.

Donsteppa

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="dogmeat" data-cid="585884" data-time="1465451261">
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Don - if I'd raped someone I'd have been more scared of my Dad's reaction / punishment than any courts.
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... on reflection, this may be where deadbeat or deliberately absent from their life Dads enter the equation to an extent.

canefan

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="dogmeat" data-cid="585884" data-time="1465451261">
Don - if I'd raped someone I'd have been more scared of my Dad's reaction / punishment than any courts.</blockquote>If the guy was well raised but just happened to be a sicko bad seed it is terrible for the parents too. But based on the dad's statement I think it is more likely the kid was raised in an environment with a lack of accountability. If I did something out of line CF Snr punished me for it and I knew I'd done wrong. The same goes for CF jnr, if I think he's behaved poorly I punish him accordingly. You could assume the rapist had got away with a lot through his life for him to think what he did was a good idea

Donsteppa

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="canefan" data-cid="585899" data-time="1465453907">
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If the guy was well raised but just happened to be a sicko bad seed it is terrible for the parents too. But based on the dad's statement I think it is more likely the kid was raised in an environment with a lack of accountability. If I did something out of line CF Snr punished me for it and I knew I'd done wrong. The same goes for CF jnr, if I think he's behaved poorly I punish him accordingly. You could assume the rapist had got away with a lot through his life for him to think what he did was a good idea
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Yep. In this particular case, the Father's comment makes me wonder if he could somehow be charged and jailed for a severe case of Being a Cretin.

Baron Silas Greenback

If being a cretin is punishable by jail time, TSF had better hope jails have good interweb

dK

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="MN5" data-cid="585864" data-time="1465447681">
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As a Dad to two young sons I'm kinda terrified that in just over ten years time I could be getting the call that one of them has gotten up to no good. I agree, it's very easy to point the finger at that Douchebag Dad but if any of us were in that situation would we not defend our kids too ?
 
Doesn't fucken bear thinking about really. I mean we've all done dumb shit on the piss as young fellas but 999 times out of 1000 it's silly hi jinks that can be laughed off in the cold light of sobriety.......
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No, I wouldn't defend them if they were convicted of such a heinous crime, BUT, I would still support them and love them and expect them to take responsibility for their "actions"

Donsteppa

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Baron Silas Greenback" data-cid="585905" data-time="1465454458">
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If being a cretin is punishable by jail time, TSF had better hope jails have good interweb
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Is that why we've lost a few posters in recent times?

antipodean

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="No Quarter" data-cid="585783" data-time="1465428174"><img src="

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="jegga" data-cid="585785" data-time="1465428243">How are these fuckwits newsworthy? <a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='http://i.stuff.co.nz/life-style/well-good/80539917/freelee-the-banana-girl-and-vegan-youtubers-are-the-next-kardashians'>http://i.stuff.co.nz/life-style/well-good/80539917/freelee-the-banana-girl-and-vegan-youtubers-are-the-next-kardashians</a></blockquote> I saw stuff.co.nz and kardashina in the link, so I didn't click on it.

canefan

In Brock Turner's home town, we're raising kids who are never told 'no'

By Kate Geiselman
<div>8:43 AM Thursday Jun 9, 2016</div>
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COMMENT: An alternate version of the Brock Turner sexual assault story has been spinning in my imagination since last January, when I first heard of his arrest.
In my version, he recognises that what happened on Stanford's campus behind that dumpster was rape. He comes to understand that intoxication is not consent. He takes responsibility for his violent "action" that irreparably harmed another human being, instead of blaming them on alcohol. Rather than spending a year and a half honing his story, making excuses and lawyering up, he pleads guilty. He looks his victim squarely in the eyes and says, "I'm sorry. I had no business putting my hands on or in you after you were no longer able to give consent. I should have helped you to safety instead of running and lying about why I did. I will do everything I can to spare you any further pain. I will spend the rest of my life educating young people about consent and sexual violence."
<div> </div>
Then he serves his punishment - perhaps even a sentence mitigated by his understanding of the crime, his taking responsibility, even his character references - because he gets it. He bears the weight of his guilt, and in doing so eases the burden of his victim.
But that's not what happened. And because I live in the community that spawned Brock Turner, I have known on some level for many months that my version would never be reality.
Oakwood, Ohio, is about as idyllic a Midwestern community as one could imagine. The streets are tree-lined, the houses charming. The kids walk to school and go home for lunch. The schools are nationally recognised. In fact, the nickname for Oakwood is "The Dome," so sheltered are its residents from violence, poverty and inconvenient truths. I have lived here for over 20 years.
Communities like this one have a dark side, though: the conflation of achievement with being "a good kid;" the pressure to succeed; the parents who shrug when the party in their basement gets out of control (or worse yet, when they host it) because "kids are gonna drink;" the tacit understanding that rules don't necessarily apply. The cops won't come. The axe won't fall.
Yet now it has.
Invariably, when I tell someone who knows Dayton that I live in Oakwood, they will assume that I am rich, narrow-minded, a Republican or some combination thereof. If most residents were just the stereotype, though, I would not have been happy here as long as I have. For the most part, I have loved raising my kids here. But I have struggled, too. My closest friends and I have a long-standing joke about needing to remember to "lower the bar" around here - about not falling prey to the pressures to conform and compete, not buying the line that the schools or the kids here are special. Most of us understand our privilege and good fortune. Many do not.
There is an Oakwood in every city; there's a Brock Turner in every Oakwood: the "nice," clean-cut, "happy-go-lucky," hyper-achieving kid who's never been told "no." There's nothing he can't have, do, or be, because he is special. Fortunately, most kids like this will march into their predictably bright futures without victimising anyone along the way. Many will do good in the world.
 
But it's not hard to draw a straight line from this little 'burb (or a hundred like it) to that dumpster at Stanford. What does being told "no" mean to that kid? If the world is his for the taking, isn't an unconscious woman's body? When he gets caught, why wouldn't his first impulse be to run, make excuses - blame the Fireball, or the girl or the campus drinking culture? That is entitlement. That is unchecked privilege.
When the news of Turner's arrest broke a year and a half ago, it was met in this community with a fair amount of shock and denial. Before details emerged, the whispered sentiments at Starbucks and in the aisles of the local grocery were compassion for his parents and hopes for a fair trial. In light of his conviction and sentencing, though, I find that I'm hiding from social media and avoiding conversations on this subject, lest I have to listen to someone defend him. I don't want to hear anyone start in about the nice family or the good kid. My kids went to high school with him. I ran the community center swim team he was on. No, I don't "know" Brock Turner like his friends or neighbors do. But I do know what he did, and so do we all, based on the unanimous verdict of a jury and two eyewitnesses.
We now also know exactly what his victim suffered, and we know that he doesn't own any of it. Neither do his apologists. Letters of support - his father's and at least one of his friends' - are making the rounds online, and they are shockingly tone-deaf. His father has blamed alcohol and promiscuity. His friend said, "Rape on campus isn't always because people are rapists." That either of these letters cut ice with the judge is just further proof of how broken the system is.
I thought the outrage over this story would start before now, but it took a victim's statement going viral to bring it the attention it deserves. At every turn, I've thought of how things could have gone differently. I've wondered if all of this was the attorney's doing - that Turner and his family were manipulated into denial because their lawyer told them there was no other alternative. But his father's letter and his own lame "apology" make it seem clear that they truly believe that bad timing and alcohol - not Turner himself - were to blame.
Ultimately, there is no happy ending to a story like this one, not in the version I imagined months ago or in the one that actually came to pass. I take some solace in the fact that the victim's brave, eloquent statement has brought more attention to rape culture than any single indictment or verdict could.
It's cold comfort, to be sure.
Geiselman is a writer and professor of English at Sinclair Community College in Dayton, Ohio.
- <a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='http://www.washingtonpost.com/'>Washington Post</a>
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MN5

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="dK" data-cid="585906" data-time="1465454834">
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No, I wouldn't defend them if they were convicted of such a heinous crime, BUT, I would still support them and love them and expect them to take responsibility for their "actions"
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Fair call, better choice of words.

jegga

I saw stuff.co.nz and kardashina in the link, so I didn't click on it.
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The headline I saw was "the worst person on the internet" and was expecting another article about another moron who had wrecked their life in 140 or less characters. Instead its about two scrawny chicks one of which eats nothing but bananas [about 50 or so a day] and their internet shitfights, nothing about the Kardashians.

taniwharugby

I think teaching your kids right from wrong is the best way for them to grow up knowing what is and isnt acceptable...I dont think highlighting a particular crime will make them more/less suceptible to committing it.

antipodean

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="taniwharugby" data-cid="585918" data-time="1465457148">
I think teaching your kids right from wrong is the best way for them to grow up
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 You say that, but the <a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://www.facebook.com/AllBlacks/videos/10153714330776915/'>NZRU welcome Gatorade as a sponsor</a> and every fuckwit on Facebook is having a cry because apparently it's not their job to teach their kids about nutrition, it's the All Blacks'.

Baron Silas Greenback

<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='http://www.stuff.co.nz/stuff-nation/assignments/share-your-news-and-views/14975898/An-open-letter-to-women-Never-settle'>http://www.stuff.co.nz/stuff-nation/assignments/share-your-news-and-views/14975898/An-open-letter-to-women-Never-settle</a>
 
Is Stuff just turning into a feminists dream?

Donsteppa

Have been on the Stats site for a bit today, and decided to have a look at the crime stats:
 
<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='http://nzdotstat.stats.govt.nz/wbos/Index.aspx?DataSetCode=TABLECODE7411'>http://nzdotstat.stats.govt.nz/wbos/Index.aspx?DataSetCode=TABLECODE7411</a>
 
There were 4,137 recorded victims of sexual assault in the year to March 2016 by NZ Police (those 4,137 people may have been victims more than once, but are recorded once for the particular 12 month period). Then there's the estimate (?) of one in five women on campus being victims of sexual assault, which I hear Joe Biden has also quoted in an open letter today. Those two numbers probably set a low and a high point for stats.
 
Whatever the actual figure is, sexual assault is an under reported crime. One of the (various) disturbing aspects of that sentencing decision that was in an article today: when a victim goes through all that and the end result is the perpetrator in prison for six months of less - future victims will be less likely to come forward.Going to the police and through the court system is a heck of an ordeal, and if the end of it is a wet bus ticket... 
 
So however widespread the problem is, dodgy decisions like this Judge has may take us even further away from knowing...
 
Do stats actually matter? Probably not, given one is too many. But the better measured (and prosecuted) something is, the more likely it is that society will move for the better.

Baron Silas Greenback

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Donsteppa" data-cid="586080" data-time="1465524884">
<div>
Have been on the Stats site for a bit today, and decided to have a look at the crime stats:
 
<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='http://nzdotstat.stats.govt.nz/wbos/Index.aspx?DataSetCode=TABLECODE7411'>http://nzdotstat.stats.govt.nz/wbos/Index.aspx?DataSetCode=TABLECODE7411</a>
 
There were 4,137 recorded victims of sexual assault in the year to March 2016 by NZ Police (those 4,137 people may have been victims more than once, but are recorded once for the particular 12 month period). Then there's the estimate (?) of one in five women on campus being victims of sexual assault, which I hear Joe Biden has also quoted in an open letter today. Those two numbers probably set a low and a high point for stats.
 
Whatever the actual figure is, sexual assault is an under reported crime. One of the (various) disturbing aspects of that sentencing decision that was in an article today: when a victim goes through all that and the end result is the perpetrator in prison for six months of less - future victims will be less likely to come forward.Going to the police and through the court system is a heck of an ordeal, and if the end of it is a wet bus ticket... 
 
So however widespread the problem is, dodgy decisions like this Judge has may take us even further away from knowing...
 
Do stats actually matter? Probably not, given one is too many. But the better measured (and prosecuted) something is, the more likely it is that society will move for the better. 
</div>
</blockquote>
 
 
I provided a link earlier as to why that 1 in 5 claim is bogus. It just shouldn't be involved in the discussion at all. 
The fact is that reported sexual assaults is a decreasing crime, and any claim that it because it is too hard to prosecute/ report doesnt really stack up, I have yet to see any evidence that rape is taken less seriously now than it was in the past. In fact I would say that rape has never been taken more seriously. Does that make it perfect, or even close to it? No. But it does show that decreasing sexual assault stats (at least in the US) are reflective of change.
 
I have no issue with criticism of the sentences, but the narrative that is starting to gain traction about guilty until proven innocent is a dangerous thing for everyone. 
The fact that one case is being used to criticise the entire system is typical of the politicization of the issue. One judge got it wrong. Where is the stats for the average rape sentences? IS that amount to low? How does it compare to other serious crimes? No analysis of that gets the media spotlight. Mainly as it probably does not fit the narrative that men are evil bastards that are running amok raping women and getting diversion form judges that laugh about it.
 
The fact someone like Biden is using one case to make political mileage should ring alarm bells. Where is his open letter about the Duke Lacrosse team and the false rape accusation that ruined their lives? Nah .. that wouldn't have won votes.

jegga

Now if I wrote the headline it would something along the lines of,
 
Machete weilding feral shot by heroic officers. Equally feral partner tragically survives
 
<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/80923765/shooting-in-paeroa'>http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/80923765/shooting-in-paeroa</a>

canefan

	Mum shares shocking chickenpox photos of son who was 'too young to vaccinate'
<p  class="">By Vanessa Brown</p>
<div><span>10:05 AM Friday Jun 10, 2016</span></div>

<div>
<div>
<img height="310" src="http://media.nzherald.co.nz/webcontent/image/jpg/201624/a3d165a37841dfe390fb0332ac698b15_620x310.jpg" width="620" alt="a3d165a37841dfe390fb0332ac698b15_620x310">Elijah's ordeal with chickenpox has prompted his mum to speak out about vaccination. Photo / Facebook, Kayley Burke</div>
WARNING: Graphic images
They are the horrifying pictures posted by a desperate mother who doesn't want other parents to go through the same trauma she's had to endure.
Queensland woman Kayley Burke shared confronting images of her 11-month-old son Elijah, who is visibly covered in scabs and blisters caused by chickenpox.
Ms Burke revealed in a Facebook post, which has been shared more than 27,000 times, that her son contracted chickenpox because he was "too young to be immunised".
"Vaccinate your kids people," the post started.
"The pictures below show you exactly why.
"Our poor baby boy who is too young to be immunised has caught the chickenpox.
<div> </div>
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"It has almost been a week since they showed up."
After her son was admitted to hospital one-week ago, Ms Burke told theSunshine Coast Daily her son had been crying and trying to itch the sores that now cover his entire head.
"It's horrible I can't think of anything worse (than watching him go through this)," she said.
"I'm very annoyed that he's sick. I'm a strong believer in vaccinations and I'm sure if he was old enough to have the shot he wouldn't be so sick."
 
Little Elijah was admitted to Ipswich Hospital on Thursday with a secondary infection.
Ms Burke revealed that both she and her other child, three-year-old Kaliah also contracted chickenpox. It is understood her daughter had been recently immunised.
"Kaliah and myself also have the chickenpox," she wrote.
"Fortunately since Kaliah hasn't long been immunised she has a few spots and blisters but is well in herself."
<img src="http://media.nzherald.co.nz/webcontent/image/jpg/201624/baby1.jpg" alt="baby1.jpg">Photo / Facebook, Kayley BurkeShe admitted that adult chickenpox was "horrible and painful" and that she would "rather give birth with no pain relief".
Ms Burke said the chickenpox she had contracted had spread inside her mouth and down her throat, causing significant pain. When her son stopped drinking his bottle, she assumed the same had happened to him.
Ms Burke pleaded with other parents to not be "a bloody idiot" and ignore vaccination.
<img src="http://media.nzherald.co.nz/webcontent/image/jpg/201624/baby2.jpg" alt="baby2.jpg">Photo / Facebook, Kayley Burke"Think about the risk you are putting on other helpless kids that are too young or who actually can't be vaccinated," she said.
Shocked parents who came across Ms Burke's desperate plea sent their love, and wished the little boy a "speedy recovery".
"Can't stand hearing about stupid selfish people not vaccinating their children," one Facebook user posted.
"Poor little guy. My hearts breaking for you guys. It's just horrible watching their tiny helpless bodies lying there and not been able to do anything about it. Thinking of you guys and hoping you all have a quick and speedy recovery."
According to medical professionals, groups most at risk of chickenpox are infants, pregnant women, people undergoing chemotherapy and those with a low immune system.
<img src="http://media.nzherald.co.nz/webcontent/image/jpg/201624/fam.jpg" alt="fam.jpg">Photo / Facebook, Kayley BurkeIpswich Hospital director of pediatrics John Gavranich said the only way to reduce catching the disease was for parents to immunise their children.
"The only way of reducing the risk is ensuring as many people as possible are vaccinated," Dr Gavranich said.
"It is a ... preventable illness and we should have high rates of vaccination."
News.com.au has contacted Kayley Burke for comment.
- <a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='http://news.com.au'>news.com.au</a>
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<div>
By Vanessa Brown
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jegga

Winger informed us all that chickenpox was a harmless childhood malady and it was over the top to immunise against it . 
That baby's got shifty eyes, probably a shill to big Pharma and scratched himself raw on purpose.

The Silver Fern

Alternative needed from the absolute crap of stuff.co.nz