All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test
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@MrDenmore I don’t think the World Cup is out of the question. It’s a tournament that really doesn’t have much bearing on what happens prior to it starting.
Teams that have made the final or even won it have had varied success in the year or two leading up.
And in these tournaments, unpredictable stuff happens that can turn for better or worst.
I’m more in the camp that there are too many factors at play to judge the here and now and equate that to success or failure at a tournament next year.
@ACT-Crusader said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
Teams that have made the final or even won it have had varied success in the year or two leading up.
England in 07 were dreadful - lost 36-0 against SA in the pool phase, but were a dragging foot away from winning the final. Knockout rugby is weird.
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@KiwiMurph bodies in motion gets used alot, just not by us.
It reminds me of when I was coaching U14s and trying to get them to take the ball at pace, and line speed on defence (crucial for when you have a smaller guy defending the larger one, cut down his space and options)
Yet so much of our play is passive, waiting for the ball, waiting for the defence, by contrast the rush defence that we cant break, and clearly not even replicate.
I have tried not to be too hard or critical of Fozzie and his team, cos, well it is no doubt a tougher job than Gats portrayed it as when he said anyone could do it, but by the same token, there appears little actual coaching, innovation or learning.
@booboo mentioned above taking a tap kick at penalty time that we did last night, was that thought out as a tactic, replicated from what the Irish did last week, or just a team and leader devoid of ideas?
@taniwharugby said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@booboo mentioned above taking a tap kick at penalty time that we did last night, was that thought out as a tactic, replicated from what the Irish did last week, or just a team and leader devoid of ideas?
Where is our innovation? We just seem to play the same, decrepit gameplan. There was a time when it felt like we led the world in innovative thinking about Rugby, but now it's just risnse and repeat with braindead tactics.
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@KiwiMurph bodies in motion gets used alot, just not by us.
It reminds me of when I was coaching U14s and trying to get them to take the ball at pace, and line speed on defence (crucial for when you have a smaller guy defending the larger one, cut down his space and options)
Yet so much of our play is passive, waiting for the ball, waiting for the defence, by contrast the rush defence that we cant break, and clearly not even replicate.
I have tried not to be too hard or critical of Fozzie and his team, cos, well it is no doubt a tougher job than Gats portrayed it as when he said anyone could do it, but by the same token, there appears little actual coaching, innovation or learning.
@booboo mentioned above taking a tap kick at penalty time that we did last night, was that thought out as a tactic, replicated from what the Irish did last week, or just a team and leader devoid of ideas?
@taniwharugby said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@booboo mentioned above taking a tap kick at penalty time that we did last night, was that thought out as a tactic, replicated from what the Irish did last week, or just a team and leader devoid of ideas?
I had actually been thinking about the tap close to the line as a tactic for a while now. How often do we see the attacking team penalised at the scrum when they take that option? Enough to cause me some frustration. From memory the ABs got pinged last week didn't they?
Would an old fashioned wall at a tap be legal nowadays?
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@No-Quarter said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@The-Irishman said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
Hello folks, been awhile! I never saw the game, nor last weeks either, only the brief highlights on YouTube. The comment section on YouTube is in stark contrast to the comments in here. I must direct that poster to the fern
Gracious indeed.
Nobody here is making any excuses, every poster to a man is stating that Ireland is unequivocally a much better team than the ABs right now. Better coaches, better gameplan, better forwards, just better across the park. So the discussion has turned to how do we improve, and getting rid of our head coach who has absolutely no track record of success at ANY level is the first step.
Razor has a clear way he gets the Saders to play. Everyone seems to be very sure of their roles and they all function harmoniously as part of the wider team. These are things you can't say about the ABs right now. Things we need
@canefan said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
Razor has a clear way he gets the Saders to play. Everyone seems to be very sure of their roles and they all function harmoniously as part of the wider team. These are things you can't say about the ABs right now. Things we need
Talking sense bro
Called leadership
Desperate times, desperate measures. Re man the bridge, intro some Crusaders props, start Samisoni, intro a young lock from the bench, Whitelock captain . Dont mind a few losses but this chaotic non progression is insane
Where's Razor -
Paps 7. He's good in that space!
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@taniwharugby said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@booboo mentioned above taking a tap kick at penalty time that we did last night, was that thought out as a tactic, replicated from what the Irish did last week, or just a team and leader devoid of ideas?
Where is our innovation? We just seem to play the same, decrepit gameplan. There was a time when it felt like we led the world in innovative thinking about Rugby, but now it's just risnse and repeat with braindead tactics.
@nzzp said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@taniwharugby said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@booboo mentioned above taking a tap kick at penalty time that we did last night, was that thought out as a tactic, replicated from what the Irish did last week, or just a team and leader devoid of ideas?
Where is our innovation? We just seem to play the same, decrepit gameplan. There was a time when it felt like we led the world in innovative thinking about Rugby, but now it's just risnse and repeat with braindead tactics.
Not to worry, Winnie the Pooh has announced a new approach called being more "3 dimensional". I'll be at the ground next Sat and look forward to seeing wtf that looks like.
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What is the mechanism for sacking an All Black coach, anyway? Asking for a friend.
I presume the provinces could still hold a special general meeting and demand the Board sack him? You'd kind of think that some of the sentiments expressed on here would be moving in those circles. Last night was a bit of a shit show and there's been a few of those, now.
However, keep some powder dry, gentlemen (and ladies). I think there's a few more furlongs to run before the unwanted Foster-child is returned from whence he came.
Great post @MrDenmore
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@nzzp said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@taniwharugby said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@booboo mentioned above taking a tap kick at penalty time that we did last night, was that thought out as a tactic, replicated from what the Irish did last week, or just a team and leader devoid of ideas?
Where is our innovation? We just seem to play the same, decrepit gameplan. There was a time when it felt like we led the world in innovative thinking about Rugby, but now it's just risnse and repeat with braindead tactics.
Not to worry, Winnie the Pooh has announced a new approach called being more "3 dimensional". I'll be at the ground next Sat and look forward to seeing wtf that looks like.
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@ACT-Crusader said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
Teams that have made the final or even won it have had varied success in the year or two leading up.
England in 07 were dreadful - lost 36-0 against SA in the pool phase, but were a dragging foot away from winning the final. Knockout rugby is weird.
@nzzp said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@ACT-Crusader said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
Teams that have made the final or even won it have had varied success in the year or two leading up.
England in 07 were dreadful - lost 36-0 against SA in the pool phase, but were a dragging foot away from winning the final. Knockout rugby is weird.
There’s many examples, England were dominant for the latter part of 02 and all of 03 and yet it took extra time to squeak past a Wallabies team that we had put 50 on just a couple of months earlier.
For all our dominance and depth in 09-10, we won a RWC against a plucky French side that hadn’t won much, and by 1 point!
The Boks 2019…
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@nzzp said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@ACT-Crusader said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
Teams that have made the final or even won it have had varied success in the year or two leading up.
England in 07 were dreadful - lost 36-0 against SA in the pool phase, but were a dragging foot away from winning the final. Knockout rugby is weird.
There’s many examples, England were dominant for the latter part of 02 and all of 03 and yet it took extra time to squeak past a Wallabies team that we had put 50 on just a couple of months earlier.
For all our dominance and depth in 09-10, we won a RWC against a plucky French side that hadn’t won much, and by 1 point!
The Boks 2019…
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@Chris-B lack or performance I.e results. Happens all the time in professional sport and other high performance environments such investment management when a fund manager consistently under performs.
@The-Docter said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@Chris-B lack or performance I.e results. Happens all the time in professional sport and other high performance environments such investment management when a fund manager consistently under performs.
I was meaning how do they get sacked (the process), not why.
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@canefan said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
Razor has a clear way he gets the Saders to play. Everyone seems to be very sure of their roles and they all function harmoniously as part of the wider team. These are things you can't say about the ABs right now. Things we need
Talking sense bro
Called leadership
Desperate times, desperate measures. Re man the bridge, intro some Crusaders props, start Samisoni, intro a young lock from the bench, Whitelock captain . Dont mind a few losses but this chaotic non progression is insane
Where's Razor@BerniesCorner said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@canefan said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
Razor has a clear way he gets the Saders to play. Everyone seems to be very sure of their roles and they all function harmoniously as part of the wider team. These are things you can't say about the ABs right now. Things we need
Talking sense bro
Called leadership
Desperate times, desperate measures. Re man the bridge, intro some Crusaders props, start Samisoni, intro a young lock from the bench, Whitelock captain . Dont mind a few losses but this chaotic non progression is insane
Where's RazorAsleep by the pool (not that I'm stalking or anything... 🧐)
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@Victor-Meldrew but go with your gut instinct. Can Foster and co deliver the goods.? If not get rid of him sooner than later. If the next guy can’t change things at least we know we don’t have the cattle.
@broughie said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@Victor-Meldrew but go with your gut instinct. Can Foster and co deliver the goods.? If not get rid of him sooner than later. If the next guy can’t change things at least we know we don’t have the cattle.
Same reason a doctor doesn't rely on gut instinct before he performs an operation. You need to understand the problem first, then get the right guy with the right skills to fix the problem.
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Hi Folks,
Im new to these pastures.
Here is my two cents for what its worth.
Peyper got all 3 big calls wrong for me.
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Ofa should have been a yellow and penalty try.
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Leicesters was fine for me. Rugby incident. Tiddlywinks etc. To suggest there was intent is disingenuous
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The head clash red is an absolutely farcical call. People paying 150 odd dollars to watch a game see it reduced to that nonsense and then Ardie Savea is collateral damage in the ensuing mess. They are ruining the sport with this garbage. SBW on Anthony Watson is a red.....this isn't.
LF looks a bit slow. I think Clarke can do everything LF can do but has more gas. Rieko isn't a centres arsehole but has improved to be fair. 3 years on from RWC 2019 we still don't know the starting front row, back row, or centres. You could make a case for only Whitelock, Jordan and Aaron Smith being nailed on. Although in Jordans case he should be the fullback.
The team is in fucking rag order. The culture looks shite too. From all the social media its all basketball jerseys, slang and shite haircuts. They all need a boot up the fucking hole.
Grace and Blackadder will become mainstays in the not too distant future. Vaii needs a chance to start instead of one of the veterans.
Id have had Romano as the stop gap over Tuipolutu today . PT is a joke of a player....powder puff.
ST should be starting hooker. Makes Mealamu esque hard yards with footwork before contact.
Mo'unga got absolutely rag dolled out there a few times today. He looked like a boy against men.
Laumape would be useful to have around the last few years.
My silk purse out of a sows ear backline......
- Smith
- Barrett
- Clarke
- Jordie
- Rieko
- Reece
- Jordan
The Irish are a very functional team but pretty blunt. More perspiration than inspiration. They know their jobs and do them well to be fair.
Not sure about their attacking lines though...lazy runners and shepherding/obstruction all over the place. Sexton is passing the ball to players behind a wall of green shirts.
As an aside they (the Irish) are turning into a pretty classless bunch. Sexton wants a conference with the ref on every call. Even going back to the previous encounters such as the Autumn game where Coles was heard saying "jeez he's a mouthy fluffybunny" about Sexton on the ref mic.
O'Mahony hit a player late after Aki's try last week. Today he started a schmozzle and was the one doing all the mouthing. Sexton gave Cane a spray last week after Ringrose gave him a rib tickler and today after Porters try Sexton was down shouting haaaaaaaaaa in Aaron Smiths face. There is also a lot of South Africa-esque rest taking place between play. Feigning injury etc. O'Mahony main culprit. Todays game took over 2 hours.@Steve said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
Hi Folks,
Im new to these pastures.
Here is my two cents for what its worth.
Peyper got all 3 big calls wrong for me.
-
Ofa should have been a yellow and penalty try.
-
Leicesters was fine for me. Rugby incident. Tiddlywinks etc. To suggest there was intent is disingenuous
-
The head clash red is an absolutely farcical call. People paying 150 odd dollars to watch a game see it reduced to that nonsense and then Ardie Savea is collateral damage in the ensuing mess. They are ruining the sport with this garbage. SBW on Anthony Watson is a red.....this isn't.
LF looks a bit slow. I think Clarke can do everything LF can do but has more gas. Rieko isn't a centres arsehole but has improved to be fair. 3 years on from RWC 2019 we still don't know the starting front row, back row, or centres. You could make a case for only Whitelock, Jordan and Aaron Smith being nailed on. Although in Jordans case he should be the fullback.
The team is in fucking rag order. The culture looks shite too. From all the social media its all basketball jerseys, slang and shite haircuts. They all need a boot up the fucking hole.
Grace and Blackadder will become mainstays in the not too distant future. Vaii needs a chance to start instead of one of the veterans.
Id have had Romano as the stop gap over Tuipolutu today . PT is a joke of a player....powder puff.
ST should be starting hooker. Makes Mealamu esque hard yards with footwork before contact.
Mo'unga got absolutely rag dolled out there a few times today. He looked like a boy against men.
Laumape would be useful to have around the last few years.
My silk purse out of a sows ear backline......
- Smith
- Barrett
- Clarke
- Jordie
- Rieko
- Reece
- Jordan
The Irish are a very functional team but pretty blunt. More perspiration than inspiration. They know their jobs and do them well to be fair.
Not sure about their attacking lines though...lazy runners and shepherding/obstruction all over the place. Sexton is passing the ball to players behind a wall of green shirts.
As an aside they (the Irish) are turning into a pretty classless bunch. Sexton wants a conference with the ref on every call. Even going back to the previous encounters such as the Autumn game where Coles was heard saying "jeez he's a mouthy fluffybunny" about Sexton on the ref mic.
O'Mahony hit a player late after Aki's try last week. Today he started a schmozzle and was the one doing all the mouthing. Sexton gave Cane a spray last week after Ringrose gave him a rib tickler and today after Porters try Sexton was down shouting haaaaaaaaaa in Aaron Smiths face. There is also a lot of South Africa-esque rest taking place between play. Feigning injury etc. O'Mahony main culprit. Todays game took over 2 hours.I agree with all of this. Someone needs to find Reiko Ioanes barber, knock him out, revive him and knock him out again for good measure. Just an awful do.
Things have improved though, Patrick Tuipulotu didn’t come on the field with pink hair at least.
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Judging by the past two weeks, this upcoming. RWC is going to be fantastic - any Top ten team can beat any other on their day. They just have to solve the accidental head clash issue.
On topic: Ireland deserved winners. Played with the intensity we were used from the ABs in the early 2010s,just lacked AB clinicality
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Judging by the past two weeks, this upcoming. RWC is going to be fantastic - any Top ten team can beat any other on their day. They just have to solve the accidental head clash issue.
On topic: Ireland deserved winners. Played with the intensity we were used from the ABs in the early 2010s,just lacked AB clinicality
@Tordah said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
any Top ten team can beat any other on their day
I'd go with Wales or France as teams I'd like to win it.
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@booboo said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
Stuff you can blame the coaches for:
- What was with the midfield high kicks? All it did was gift the ball and field position to Ireland. Seemed a complete waste of ball.
If my memory serves me right these were the first few plays of game.
- We kick off, and Ireland do what Ireland do and exit extremely well either via Lowe or Park and get the ball out around half way nearly every time.
- We get the ball, don't really make any ground and BB or AS put in a midfield bomb.
- Ireland defuse the bomb more often than not, regather, play some structure then kick us back into our half or 22.
So in only a few phases Ireland have us under pressure and to be honest this is simple rugby. Play for territory, pressure the opposition on D whilst they try to exit and hope they make mistakes.
If Ireland could finish their attacks they would be a very difficult team to beat.
@chimoaus said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@booboo said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
Stuff you can blame the coaches for:
- What was with the midfield high kicks? All it did was gift the ball and field position to Ireland. Seemed a complete waste of ball.
If my memory serves me right these were the first few plays of game.
- We kick off, and Ireland do what Ireland do and exit extremely well either via Lowe or Park and get the ball out around half way nearly every time.
- We get the ball, don't really make any ground and BB or AS put in a midfield bomb.
- Ireland defuse the bomb more often than not, regather, play some structure then kick us back into our half or 22.
So in only a few phases Ireland have us under pressure and to be honest this is simple rugby. Play for territory, pressure the opposition on D whilst they try to exit and hope they make mistakes.
If Ireland could finish their attacks they would be a very difficult team to beat.
When was the last time the AB's scored or got on the board first?
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@broughie said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@Victor-Meldrew but go with your gut instinct. Can Foster and co deliver the goods.? If not get rid of him sooner than later. If the next guy can’t change things at least we know we don’t have the cattle.
Same reason a doctor doesn't rely on gut instinct before he performs an operation. You need to understand the problem first, then get the right guy with the right skills to fix the problem.
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
Same reason a doctor doesn't rely on gut instinct before he performs an operation. You need to understand the problem first, then get the right guy with the right skills to fix the problem.
Vic you are over thinking it. Time to change the bridge
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@Bones said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@booboo said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
secondly, the red on Gus. That's the worst example of the head contact protocols I've seen. The very definition of unavoidable.
Get outta town! He ran into the ball carrier, actually accelerated towards him and lined him up! The very definition of avoidable!
Stop it Justin
@booboo said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@Bones said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@booboo said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
secondly, the red on Gus. That's the worst example of the head contact protocols I've seen. The very definition of unavoidable.
Get outta town! He ran into the ball carrier, actually accelerated towards him and lined him up! The very definition of avoidable!
Stop it Justin
Weak. Are you saying he didn't look at the player, change his angle and accelerate towards him in order to make a hit? If so, your eyesight is probably as good as you think Angus' is.
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My biggest disappointment in this team is their inability to chance their arm when we have ball in hand. How many times have we gone a couple phases and then aimlessly kicked the ball away? It’s almost ingrained into this team atm, there is no innovation at all.
How about instead of running through the motions we actually chance our arm a little and use the talent at our disposal. The reason the likes of Ardie, Reiko, Jordan, Reece etc are in this side is for their ability to cut teams to shreds, yet we hardly ever spin it wide.
All we are doing at the moment is handing over possession to the other team and then wondering why we are spending large spells of the game defending.
Keep doing the same shit and we’ll keep getting the same results.
@Canes4life said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
My biggest disappointment in this team is their inability to chance their arm when we have ball in hand. How many times have we gone a couple phases and then aimlessly kicked the ball away? It’s almost ingrained into this team atm, there is no innovation at all.
How about instead of running through the motions we actually chance our arm a little and use the talent at our disposal. The reason the likes of Ardie, Reiko, Jordan, Reece etc are in this side is for their ability to cut teams to shreds, yet we hardly ever spin it wide.
What planet are you on? We constantly spin it wide without going forward first. If this talent was so successful at running around the opposition, why wouldn't we do that all the time and rack up 50 points?
