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All Blacks vs Wales

Scheduled Pinned Locked Moved Rugby Matches
allblackswales
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  • CrucialC Crucial

    @KiwiMurph said in All Blacks vs Wales:

    I want to see more of Mounga 10 Jordie 12 Beaudy 15. It worked really well Bledisloe 2.

    The issue at the moment with that set up is the bench for both cover and impact without Jordan available.

    If Mounga goes off and BB goes to 10 you are forced to move JB which disrupts the whole 'ideal' structure. (BB, DH, JB has been tried and wasn't that good). The other option is to have 15 cover on the bench so the BB, JB combo can have a shot. At the moment that would be Perofeta, who looked well out of his depth against Japan.

    KiwiMurphK Offline
    KiwiMurphK Offline
    KiwiMurph
    wrote on last edited by
    #126

    @Crucial Havili can also cover 15 and he'll likely be on the bench anyway.

    CrucialC 1 Reply Last reply
    0
    • No QuarterN Offline
      No QuarterN Offline
      No Quarter
      wrote on last edited by
      #127

      Yep you have DH and ALB on the bench and you have all positions well covered.

      1 Reply Last reply
      1
      • BovidaeB Offline
        BovidaeB Offline
        Bovidae
        wrote on last edited by
        #128

        Jordie covers wing again eh? 😉

        I realise that Rieko would be the first option.

        No QuarterN 1 Reply Last reply
        0
        • KiwiMurphK KiwiMurph

          @Crucial Havili can also cover 15 and he'll likely be on the bench anyway.

          CrucialC Offline
          CrucialC Offline
          Crucial
          wrote on last edited by
          #129

          @KiwiMurph said in All Blacks vs Wales:

          @Crucial Havili can also cover 15 and he'll likely be on the bench anyway.

          I did think of that but I doubt very much that after seasons of training as a specialist 12 he will be viewed seriously as covering a position that he hasn't played in a long time. If it was in a crisis then absolutely, but as a planned bench option? I'm not so sure.

          1 Reply Last reply
          1
          • BovidaeB Bovidae

            Jordie covers wing again eh? 😉

            I realise that Rieko would be the first option.

            No QuarterN Offline
            No QuarterN Offline
            No Quarter
            wrote on last edited by
            #130

            @Bovidae said in All Blacks vs Wales:

            Jordie covers wing again eh? 😉

            I realise that Rieko would be the first option.

            Rieko, Beauden, ALB, DH, almost anyone would be better options on the wing haha. God that was a failed experiment with Jordie.

            CrucialC 1 Reply Last reply
            1
            • No QuarterN No Quarter

              @Bovidae said in All Blacks vs Wales:

              Jordie covers wing again eh? 😉

              I realise that Rieko would be the first option.

              Rieko, Beauden, ALB, DH, almost anyone would be better options on the wing haha. God that was a failed experiment with Jordie.

              CrucialC Offline
              CrucialC Offline
              Crucial
              wrote on last edited by
              #131

              @No-Quarter said in All Blacks vs Wales:

              @Bovidae said in All Blacks vs Wales:

              Jordie covers wing again eh? 😉

              I realise that Rieko would be the first option.

              Rieko, Beauden, ALB, DH, almost anyone would be better options on the wing haha. God that was a failed experiment with Jordie.

              You mean like this game where he scored 4 tries at wing?
              http://stats.allblacks.com/asp/teamsheet.asp?MT_ID=2305

              Funny thing was that he was completely lost, kept asking DMac where he should be but ended up being the top tryscorer.
              I was at the game and the animated 'discussions' he and DMac were having in the back field were quite funny to watch

              1 Reply Last reply
              0
              • StargazerS Stargazer

                Let's start with the right forwards in the right jerseys. If the pack performs well, it will make a hell of a difference to how the backline goes. Against Japan, the pack didn't go well, so it's not suprising that the backs struggled, too. Add to that a stupid game plan with too much kicking combined with a malfunctioning defence, plus too many rookies, and you have a recipe for a poor performance.

                While I agree that Jordie should get another shot in the 12 jersey, I also think he's a better fullback than BB. With Jordan not in the squad, I can see merit in starting Jordie at fullback, with BB on the bench.

                But as I said, get the forward combination, especially the backrow, right first.

                mariner4lifeM Offline
                mariner4lifeM Offline
                mariner4life
                wrote on last edited by mariner4life
                #132

                @Stargazer said in All Blacks vs Wales:

                Let's start with the right forwards in the right jerseys. If the pack performs well, it will make a hell of a difference to how the backline goes. Against Japan, the pack didn't go well, so it's not suprising that the backs struggled, too. Add to that a stupid game plan with too much kicking combined with a malfunctioning defence, plus too many rookies, and you have a recipe for a poor performance.

                While I agree that Jordie should get another shot in the 12 jersey, I also think he's a better fullback than BB. With Jordan not in the squad, I can see merit in starting Jordie at fullback, with BB on the bench.

                But as I said, get the forward combination, especially the backrow, right first.

                While I am never as quick to excuse the guys on the field as you

                I pretty much agree with everything here

                JB at 12 needs a full tour now to show it's for real. But his problem is, who plays 15? And thrn the question is, is the drop to the 2nd best 12 or 15 the biggest?

                I also really hate a bench player's introduction resulting in more than 1 change

                No QuarterN 1 Reply Last reply
                2
                • No QuarterN Offline
                  No QuarterN Offline
                  No Quarter
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #133

                  @Crucial lol yeah he didn't actually play that well in that game from memory, just dotted the ball down 4 times. Might have taken a decent cross kick for one of them? He's just not a winger, it was bizarre that they persisted with that for so long.

                  1 Reply Last reply
                  0
                  • mariner4lifeM mariner4life

                    @Stargazer said in All Blacks vs Wales:

                    Let's start with the right forwards in the right jerseys. If the pack performs well, it will make a hell of a difference to how the backline goes. Against Japan, the pack didn't go well, so it's not suprising that the backs struggled, too. Add to that a stupid game plan with too much kicking combined with a malfunctioning defence, plus too many rookies, and you have a recipe for a poor performance.

                    While I agree that Jordie should get another shot in the 12 jersey, I also think he's a better fullback than BB. With Jordan not in the squad, I can see merit in starting Jordie at fullback, with BB on the bench.

                    But as I said, get the forward combination, especially the backrow, right first.

                    While I am never as quick to excuse the guys on the field as you

                    I pretty much agree with everything here

                    JB at 12 needs a full tour now to show it's for real. But his problem is, who plays 15? And thrn the question is, is the drop to the 2nd best 12 or 15 the biggest?

                    I also really hate a bench player's introduction resulting in more than 1 change

                    No QuarterN Offline
                    No QuarterN Offline
                    No Quarter
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #134

                    @mariner4life said in All Blacks vs Wales:

                    @Stargazer said in All Blacks vs Wales:

                    Let's start with the right forwards in the right jerseys. If the pack performs well, it will make a hell of a difference to how the backline goes. Against Japan, the pack didn't go well, so it's not suprising that the backs struggled, too. Add to that a stupid game plan with too much kicking combined with a malfunctioning defence, plus too many rookies, and you have a recipe for a poor performance.

                    While I agree that Jordie should get another shot in the 12 jersey, I also think he's a better fullback than BB. With Jordan not in the squad, I can see merit in starting Jordie at fullback, with BB on the bench.

                    But as I said, get the forward combination, especially the backrow, right first.

                    While I am never as quick to excuse the guys on the field as you

                    I pretty much agree with everything here

                    JB at 12 needs a full tour now to show it's for real. But his problem is, who plays 15? And thrn the question is, is the drop to the 2nd best 12 or 15 the biggest?

                    I also really hate a bench player's introduction resulting in more than 1 change

                    The drop to 2nd best 12 is undoubtedly bigger. We have Beauden and Jordan (longer term) at 15, the cupboard is very bare at 12, hence us trying to shoehorn Havili there. I'm also more excited by Beauden and Jordan at the back as that gives us extra attacking ability, E.G. scoring tries out of absolutely fucking nothing which can turn the course of a test, which we may need when our forwards are getting smacked around.

                    nzzpN ACT CrusaderA S 3 Replies Last reply
                    3
                    • No QuarterN No Quarter

                      @mariner4life said in All Blacks vs Wales:

                      @Stargazer said in All Blacks vs Wales:

                      Let's start with the right forwards in the right jerseys. If the pack performs well, it will make a hell of a difference to how the backline goes. Against Japan, the pack didn't go well, so it's not suprising that the backs struggled, too. Add to that a stupid game plan with too much kicking combined with a malfunctioning defence, plus too many rookies, and you have a recipe for a poor performance.

                      While I agree that Jordie should get another shot in the 12 jersey, I also think he's a better fullback than BB. With Jordan not in the squad, I can see merit in starting Jordie at fullback, with BB on the bench.

                      But as I said, get the forward combination, especially the backrow, right first.

                      While I am never as quick to excuse the guys on the field as you

                      I pretty much agree with everything here

                      JB at 12 needs a full tour now to show it's for real. But his problem is, who plays 15? And thrn the question is, is the drop to the 2nd best 12 or 15 the biggest?

                      I also really hate a bench player's introduction resulting in more than 1 change

                      The drop to 2nd best 12 is undoubtedly bigger. We have Beauden and Jordan (longer term) at 15, the cupboard is very bare at 12, hence us trying to shoehorn Havili there. I'm also more excited by Beauden and Jordan at the back as that gives us extra attacking ability, E.G. scoring tries out of absolutely fucking nothing which can turn the course of a test, which we may need when our forwards are getting smacked around.

                      nzzpN Offline
                      nzzpN Offline
                      nzzp
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #135

                      @No-Quarter said in All Blacks vs Wales:

                      the cupboard is very bare at 12

                      I still reckon that a well coached Laumape could have been a bloody good 12 at Test level. Just never got his head right at that level I don't think.

                      G kiwi_expatK 2 Replies Last reply
                      4
                      • mariner4lifeM Offline
                        mariner4lifeM Offline
                        mariner4life
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #136

                        We need 10 running to hold defenders
                        A threat at 12 to hold defenders

                        To open space for our best attacking threat, our lightning quick 13.

                        But as stargazer said, without good ball 10, 12 and 13 are there to make tackles

                        1 Reply Last reply
                        6
                        • Jailbreak7J Offline
                          Jailbreak7J Offline
                          Jailbreak7
                          wrote on last edited by Jailbreak7
                          #137

                          I would have said DMac to cover 15 from bench, but it is likely he will start for AB XV. More likely to be DH covering from bench.

                          1 Reply Last reply
                          0
                          • S Steve

                            @ACT-Crusader said in All Blacks vs Wales:

                            @Steve said in All Blacks vs Wales:

                            @Steve said in All Blacks vs Wales:

                            @Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks vs Wales:

                            @Steve said in All Blacks vs Wales:

                            We found our starting 12 for the RWC. Its clear to see its Jordie.

                            It isn't clear to me. Let's see how he goes against teams other than the Oz Eden Park team.

                            Fair enough but he ticks all the boxes on paper and based on the limited amount we seen.

                            He can crash and bash, he can kick, he can offload and he can tackle. He will focus the mind of their ten and back row too as he isn't as easy to knock over as Havili.

                            RTS has no kicking game so the defence can just rush up if Mo'unga shovels it. Parsons alluded to this on this weeks Aotearoa Rugby pod.

                            Havili has had plenty of chances and while a great footballer, he is the George bridge of 12's. Lightweight, Vanilla, not super quick, not super strong.

                            We have seen ALB there before and backrow/centres combos were our weakest points in RWC 2019. The centres were insipid and the backrow was unbalanced. Whats the point in doing it again? ALB crabs sideways and throws basketball passes although he is a good defender. Jordie put his head down in Eden Park and pumped the legs. Got us going forward every time. It was refreshing and the contribution was arguably under appreciated.

                            Jordie offers us a point of difference and that's what we need to go far in the RWC.

                            Jordie at 12 and Will Jordan at 15 is the only way we win the RWC.

                            1. SMITH
                            2. BARRETT
                            3. CLARKE
                            4. JORDIE
                            5. RIEKO (RELUCTANTLY)
                            6. REECE
                            7. JORDAN

                            Thats the best backline we can field based on the current crop.

                            Clarke and Jordie can cart it up off set piece. Jordan is the scalpel. Reece will rome and rove, get you the odd turnover, intercept or pick and go for cheap yardage.

                            Rieko to use his pace in defence and attack.

                            I like the idea of the Barrett brothers working in unison.

                            I don't fancy Mo'unga against the Irish, English, French or Boks. They just chew him up. Choke tackle city.

                            Those very teams did that to Beaudie this year. Richie played pretty good against the Boks when he started that second test. Played with a bit of depth and created space for his outsides. He was very poor last weekend.

                            Fair point.....Jordie to 10 it is !!!!!

                            ACT CrusaderA Offline
                            ACT CrusaderA Offline
                            ACT Crusader
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #138

                            @Steve said in All Blacks vs Wales:

                            @ACT-Crusader said in All Blacks vs Wales:

                            @Steve said in All Blacks vs Wales:

                            @Steve said in All Blacks vs Wales:

                            @Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks vs Wales:

                            @Steve said in All Blacks vs Wales:

                            We found our starting 12 for the RWC. Its clear to see its Jordie.

                            It isn't clear to me. Let's see how he goes against teams other than the Oz Eden Park team.

                            Fair enough but he ticks all the boxes on paper and based on the limited amount we seen.

                            He can crash and bash, he can kick, he can offload and he can tackle. He will focus the mind of their ten and back row too as he isn't as easy to knock over as Havili.

                            RTS has no kicking game so the defence can just rush up if Mo'unga shovels it. Parsons alluded to this on this weeks Aotearoa Rugby pod.

                            Havili has had plenty of chances and while a great footballer, he is the George bridge of 12's. Lightweight, Vanilla, not super quick, not super strong.

                            We have seen ALB there before and backrow/centres combos were our weakest points in RWC 2019. The centres were insipid and the backrow was unbalanced. Whats the point in doing it again? ALB crabs sideways and throws basketball passes although he is a good defender. Jordie put his head down in Eden Park and pumped the legs. Got us going forward every time. It was refreshing and the contribution was arguably under appreciated.

                            Jordie offers us a point of difference and that's what we need to go far in the RWC.

                            Jordie at 12 and Will Jordan at 15 is the only way we win the RWC.

                            1. SMITH
                            2. BARRETT
                            3. CLARKE
                            4. JORDIE
                            5. RIEKO (RELUCTANTLY)
                            6. REECE
                            7. JORDAN

                            Thats the best backline we can field based on the current crop.

                            Clarke and Jordie can cart it up off set piece. Jordan is the scalpel. Reece will rome and rove, get you the odd turnover, intercept or pick and go for cheap yardage.

                            Rieko to use his pace in defence and attack.

                            I like the idea of the Barrett brothers working in unison.

                            I don't fancy Mo'unga against the Irish, English, French or Boks. They just chew him up. Choke tackle city.

                            Those very teams did that to Beaudie this year. Richie played pretty good against the Boks when he started that second test. Played with a bit of depth and created space for his outsides. He was very poor last weekend.

                            Fair point.....Jordie to 10 it is !!!!!

                            Would love to see him start at 13 to get the full deck of 10-15

                            ChrisC 1 Reply Last reply
                            1
                            • ACT CrusaderA ACT Crusader

                              @Steve said in All Blacks vs Wales:

                              @ACT-Crusader said in All Blacks vs Wales:

                              @Steve said in All Blacks vs Wales:

                              @Steve said in All Blacks vs Wales:

                              @Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks vs Wales:

                              @Steve said in All Blacks vs Wales:

                              We found our starting 12 for the RWC. Its clear to see its Jordie.

                              It isn't clear to me. Let's see how he goes against teams other than the Oz Eden Park team.

                              Fair enough but he ticks all the boxes on paper and based on the limited amount we seen.

                              He can crash and bash, he can kick, he can offload and he can tackle. He will focus the mind of their ten and back row too as he isn't as easy to knock over as Havili.

                              RTS has no kicking game so the defence can just rush up if Mo'unga shovels it. Parsons alluded to this on this weeks Aotearoa Rugby pod.

                              Havili has had plenty of chances and while a great footballer, he is the George bridge of 12's. Lightweight, Vanilla, not super quick, not super strong.

                              We have seen ALB there before and backrow/centres combos were our weakest points in RWC 2019. The centres were insipid and the backrow was unbalanced. Whats the point in doing it again? ALB crabs sideways and throws basketball passes although he is a good defender. Jordie put his head down in Eden Park and pumped the legs. Got us going forward every time. It was refreshing and the contribution was arguably under appreciated.

                              Jordie offers us a point of difference and that's what we need to go far in the RWC.

                              Jordie at 12 and Will Jordan at 15 is the only way we win the RWC.

                              1. SMITH
                              2. BARRETT
                              3. CLARKE
                              4. JORDIE
                              5. RIEKO (RELUCTANTLY)
                              6. REECE
                              7. JORDAN

                              Thats the best backline we can field based on the current crop.

                              Clarke and Jordie can cart it up off set piece. Jordan is the scalpel. Reece will rome and rove, get you the odd turnover, intercept or pick and go for cheap yardage.

                              Rieko to use his pace in defence and attack.

                              I like the idea of the Barrett brothers working in unison.

                              I don't fancy Mo'unga against the Irish, English, French or Boks. They just chew him up. Choke tackle city.

                              Those very teams did that to Beaudie this year. Richie played pretty good against the Boks when he started that second test. Played with a bit of depth and created space for his outsides. He was very poor last weekend.

                              Fair point.....Jordie to 10 it is !!!!!

                              Would love to see him start at 13 to get the full deck of 10-15

                              ChrisC Offline
                              ChrisC Offline
                              Chris
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #139

                              @ACT-Crusader said in All Blacks vs Wales:

                              @Steve said in All Blacks vs Wales:

                              @ACT-Crusader said in All Blacks vs Wales:

                              @Steve said in All Blacks vs Wales:

                              @Steve said in All Blacks vs Wales:

                              @Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks vs Wales:

                              @Steve said in All Blacks vs Wales:

                              We found our starting 12 for the RWC. Its clear to see its Jordie.

                              It isn't clear to me. Let's see how he goes against teams other than the Oz Eden Park team.

                              Fair enough but he ticks all the boxes on paper and based on the limited amount we seen.

                              He can crash and bash, he can kick, he can offload and he can tackle. He will focus the mind of their ten and back row too as he isn't as easy to knock over as Havili.

                              RTS has no kicking game so the defence can just rush up if Mo'unga shovels it. Parsons alluded to this on this weeks Aotearoa Rugby pod.

                              Havili has had plenty of chances and while a great footballer, he is the George bridge of 12's. Lightweight, Vanilla, not super quick, not super strong.

                              We have seen ALB there before and backrow/centres combos were our weakest points in RWC 2019. The centres were insipid and the backrow was unbalanced. Whats the point in doing it again? ALB crabs sideways and throws basketball passes although he is a good defender. Jordie put his head down in Eden Park and pumped the legs. Got us going forward every time. It was refreshing and the contribution was arguably under appreciated.

                              Jordie offers us a point of difference and that's what we need to go far in the RWC.

                              Jordie at 12 and Will Jordan at 15 is the only way we win the RWC.

                              1. SMITH
                              2. BARRETT
                              3. CLARKE
                              4. JORDIE
                              5. RIEKO (RELUCTANTLY)
                              6. REECE
                              7. JORDAN

                              Thats the best backline we can field based on the current crop.

                              Clarke and Jordie can cart it up off set piece. Jordan is the scalpel. Reece will rome and rove, get you the odd turnover, intercept or pick and go for cheap yardage.

                              Rieko to use his pace in defence and attack.

                              I like the idea of the Barrett brothers working in unison.

                              I don't fancy Mo'unga against the Irish, English, French or Boks. They just chew him up. Choke tackle city.

                              Those very teams did that to Beaudie this year. Richie played pretty good against the Boks when he started that second test. Played with a bit of depth and created space for his outsides. He was very poor last weekend.

                              Fair point.....Jordie to 10 it is !!!!!

                              Would love to see him start at 13 to get the full deck of 10-15

                              He needs to play no.8 so we can have a tall player there finally.

                              1 Reply Last reply
                              2
                              • No QuarterN No Quarter

                                @mariner4life said in All Blacks vs Wales:

                                @Stargazer said in All Blacks vs Wales:

                                Let's start with the right forwards in the right jerseys. If the pack performs well, it will make a hell of a difference to how the backline goes. Against Japan, the pack didn't go well, so it's not suprising that the backs struggled, too. Add to that a stupid game plan with too much kicking combined with a malfunctioning defence, plus too many rookies, and you have a recipe for a poor performance.

                                While I agree that Jordie should get another shot in the 12 jersey, I also think he's a better fullback than BB. With Jordan not in the squad, I can see merit in starting Jordie at fullback, with BB on the bench.

                                But as I said, get the forward combination, especially the backrow, right first.

                                While I am never as quick to excuse the guys on the field as you

                                I pretty much agree with everything here

                                JB at 12 needs a full tour now to show it's for real. But his problem is, who plays 15? And thrn the question is, is the drop to the 2nd best 12 or 15 the biggest?

                                I also really hate a bench player's introduction resulting in more than 1 change

                                The drop to 2nd best 12 is undoubtedly bigger. We have Beauden and Jordan (longer term) at 15, the cupboard is very bare at 12, hence us trying to shoehorn Havili there. I'm also more excited by Beauden and Jordan at the back as that gives us extra attacking ability, E.G. scoring tries out of absolutely fucking nothing which can turn the course of a test, which we may need when our forwards are getting smacked around.

                                ACT CrusaderA Offline
                                ACT CrusaderA Offline
                                ACT Crusader
                                wrote on last edited by ACT Crusader
                                #140

                                @No-Quarter I’ve been a big fan of Beaudie at fullback because on the counter and broken play he is still a very dangerous proposition with space. I’d say the only reservation they would have about a permanent shift whilst Jordie is available to play fullback is Beaudies kicking. It’s still a pretty important tool needed and Jordie’s big boot has gotten us out of a few tough spots and I’m not sure anyone else has that in the squad.

                                And not that Beaudie is bad at this, but under the high ball Jordie’s ability to not only getting high, but jumping early to take it - he is pretty damn good at this and one of the better players I’ve seen.

                                voodooV BonesB Chris B.C 3 Replies Last reply
                                1
                                • ACT CrusaderA ACT Crusader

                                  @No-Quarter I’ve been a big fan of Beaudie at fullback because on the counter and broken play he is still a very dangerous proposition with space. I’d say the only reservation they would have about a permanent shift whilst Jordie is available to play fullback is Beaudies kicking. It’s still a pretty important tool needed and Jordie’s big boot has gotten us out of a few tough spots and I’m not sure anyone else has that in the squad.

                                  And not that Beaudie is bad at this, but under the high ball Jordie’s ability to not only getting high, but jumping early to take it - he is pretty damn good at this and one of the better players I’ve seen.

                                  voodooV Offline
                                  voodooV Offline
                                  voodoo
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #141

                                  @ACT-Crusader said in All Blacks vs Wales:

                                  @No-Quarter I’ve been a big fan of Beaudie at fullback because on the counter and broken play he is still a very dangerous proposition with space. I’d say the only reservation they would have about a permanent shift whilst Jordie is available to play fullback is Beaudies kicking. It’s still a pretty important tool needed and Jordie’s big boot has gotten us out of a few tough spots and I’m not sure anyone else has that in the squad.

                                  And not that Beaudie is bad at this, but under the high ball and not only getting high, but jumping early to take it - Jordie is pretty damn good and one of the better players I’ve seen at it.

                                  As a few of us have said recently it's all about the relative drop off at 15 (JB to BB) vs 12 (JB to DV/RTS)

                                  I'd def go with AS & RM, JB and RI midfield, CC and SR wings, with BB at 15.

                                  ACT CrusaderA 1 Reply Last reply
                                  1
                                  • ACT CrusaderA ACT Crusader

                                    @No-Quarter I’ve been a big fan of Beaudie at fullback because on the counter and broken play he is still a very dangerous proposition with space. I’d say the only reservation they would have about a permanent shift whilst Jordie is available to play fullback is Beaudies kicking. It’s still a pretty important tool needed and Jordie’s big boot has gotten us out of a few tough spots and I’m not sure anyone else has that in the squad.

                                    And not that Beaudie is bad at this, but under the high ball Jordie’s ability to not only getting high, but jumping early to take it - he is pretty damn good at this and one of the better players I’ve seen.

                                    BonesB Offline
                                    BonesB Offline
                                    Bones
                                    wrote on last edited by
                                    #142

                                    @ACT-Crusader said in All Blacks vs Wales:

                                    @No-Quarter I’ve been a big fan of Beaudie at fullback because on the counter and broken play he is still a very dangerous proposition with space. I’d say the only reservation they would have about a permanent shift whilst Jordie is available to play fullback is Beaudies kicking. It’s still a pretty important tool needed and Jordie’s big boot has gotten us out of a few tough spots and I’m not sure anyone else has that in the squad.

                                    And not that Beaudie is bad at this, but under the high ball Jordie’s ability to not only getting high, but jumping early to take it - he is pretty damn good at this and one of the better players I’ve seen.

                                    I mean, it's as easy as getting Havili back to 15 innit?

                                    1 Reply Last reply
                                    0
                                    • nzzpN nzzp

                                      @No-Quarter said in All Blacks vs Wales:

                                      the cupboard is very bare at 12

                                      I still reckon that a well coached Laumape could have been a bloody good 12 at Test level. Just never got his head right at that level I don't think.

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                                      game_film
                                      wrote on last edited by
                                      #143

                                      @nzzp Agreed. They never went all in on him. The ABs often find a reason not to play someone whereas other countries work with what they’ve got and players adjust to the level. Lots of examples from the Kiwis who went to play in Europe.

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                                      • voodooV voodoo

                                        @ACT-Crusader said in All Blacks vs Wales:

                                        @No-Quarter I’ve been a big fan of Beaudie at fullback because on the counter and broken play he is still a very dangerous proposition with space. I’d say the only reservation they would have about a permanent shift whilst Jordie is available to play fullback is Beaudies kicking. It’s still a pretty important tool needed and Jordie’s big boot has gotten us out of a few tough spots and I’m not sure anyone else has that in the squad.

                                        And not that Beaudie is bad at this, but under the high ball and not only getting high, but jumping early to take it - Jordie is pretty damn good and one of the better players I’ve seen at it.

                                        As a few of us have said recently it's all about the relative drop off at 15 (JB to BB) vs 12 (JB to DV/RTS)

                                        I'd def go with AS & RM, JB and RI midfield, CC and SR wings, with BB at 15.

                                        ACT CrusaderA Offline
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                                        ACT Crusader
                                        wrote on last edited by
                                        #144

                                        @voodoo I’d go with RM, LF, DH, BE, SR…

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                                        • No QuarterN No Quarter

                                          @mariner4life said in All Blacks vs Wales:

                                          @Stargazer said in All Blacks vs Wales:

                                          Let's start with the right forwards in the right jerseys. If the pack performs well, it will make a hell of a difference to how the backline goes. Against Japan, the pack didn't go well, so it's not suprising that the backs struggled, too. Add to that a stupid game plan with too much kicking combined with a malfunctioning defence, plus too many rookies, and you have a recipe for a poor performance.

                                          While I agree that Jordie should get another shot in the 12 jersey, I also think he's a better fullback than BB. With Jordan not in the squad, I can see merit in starting Jordie at fullback, with BB on the bench.

                                          But as I said, get the forward combination, especially the backrow, right first.

                                          While I am never as quick to excuse the guys on the field as you

                                          I pretty much agree with everything here

                                          JB at 12 needs a full tour now to show it's for real. But his problem is, who plays 15? And thrn the question is, is the drop to the 2nd best 12 or 15 the biggest?

                                          I also really hate a bench player's introduction resulting in more than 1 change

                                          The drop to 2nd best 12 is undoubtedly bigger. We have Beauden and Jordan (longer term) at 15, the cupboard is very bare at 12, hence us trying to shoehorn Havili there. I'm also more excited by Beauden and Jordan at the back as that gives us extra attacking ability, E.G. scoring tries out of absolutely fucking nothing which can turn the course of a test, which we may need when our forwards are getting smacked around.

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                                          Steve
                                          wrote on last edited by
                                          #145

                                          @No-Quarter said in All Blacks vs Wales:

                                          @mariner4life said in All Blacks vs Wales:

                                          @Stargazer said in All Blacks vs Wales:

                                          Let's start with the right forwards in the right jerseys. If the pack performs well, it will make a hell of a difference to how the backline goes. Against Japan, the pack didn't go well, so it's not suprising that the backs struggled, too. Add to that a stupid game plan with too much kicking combined with a malfunctioning defence, plus too many rookies, and you have a recipe for a poor performance.

                                          While I agree that Jordie should get another shot in the 12 jersey, I also think he's a better fullback than BB. With Jordan not in the squad, I can see merit in starting Jordie at fullback, with BB on the bench.

                                          But as I said, get the forward combination, especially the backrow, right first.

                                          While I am never as quick to excuse the guys on the field as you

                                          I pretty much agree with everything here

                                          JB at 12 needs a full tour now to show it's for real. But his problem is, who plays 15? And thrn the question is, is the drop to the 2nd best 12 or 15 the biggest?

                                          I also really hate a bench player's introduction resulting in more than 1 change

                                          The drop to 2nd best 12 is undoubtedly bigger. We have Beauden and Jordan (longer term) at 15, the cupboard is very bare at 12, hence us trying to shoehorn Havili there. I'm also more excited by Beauden and Jordan at the back as that gives us extra attacking ability, E.G. scoring tries out of absolutely fucking nothing which can turn the course of a test, which we may need when our forwards are getting smacked around.

                                          Hammer. Nail. Head

                                          Ben Smith, Dagg, McKenzie , Cullen, Muliaina used to get us out of serious holes by running the ball back , finding a gap , and next thing you know you are 20 meters from their try line and they are scrambling . You get cheap offside penalties and are in great scoring positions. Jordie is too conservative a 15, but exactly what we need at 12.

                                          Foster picks his fullback as a kick fielder as opposed to an attacking weapon. We need to be bold.

                                          Look at Will Jordan’s highlight reel for the Allblacks . Think of the try he scored against Ireland running 80 meters around sexton on the angle. The chip and chases against wales, the USA, the swerve against OZ gathering Beaudys chip.

                                          Now imagine letting this boy have time and space and the whole field to choose from if we play him at FB.

                                          He is another point of difference and we are not using him to his full potential.

                                          Having him in the wing being bundled into touch is a waste of time.

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