All Blacks 2023
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@Crucial said in All Blacks 2023:
@Kiwiwomble said in All Blacks 2023:
@Crucial said in All Blacks 2023:
The stand out WTF selection in that article is PGS at 6.
Just shows how that position is still a conundrum. We really seem to struggle to develop tier 1 level test 6s for the requirements of the current game.
Plenty of Super quality ones but they all seem to struggle at the top level.i am starting to feel we're spoilt for choice when it comes to players on the cusp....and in the past there might have been one that was given a chance and stuck with and grew into the role...now after a couple of games there is a chorus of "what about that guy"
But one was picked and given a decent run. Twice it was attempted. Frizell and Akira.
Akira has had 15 starts (plus 6 bench games) and Frizell 18 starts (plus 7 bench).
Both showed enough form to be given a crack but neither kicked on.
Blackadder is full of endeavour and a skilled player but you do have to wonder if his style contributes to his injury issues. I noticed at the start of Super that he looks to have put some bulk on as well, which could be good but we have yet to see if it is.He has no regard for his body. Really awkward tackles, collisions. I loved him against SA a year or so back.
He looks more barrel chested this year indeed. Hopefully he reks some folk.
@Steve said in All Blacks 2023:
@Crucial said in All Blacks 2023:
@Kiwiwomble said in All Blacks 2023:
@Crucial said in All Blacks 2023:
The stand out WTF selection in that article is PGS at 6.
Just shows how that position is still a conundrum. We really seem to struggle to develop tier 1 level test 6s for the requirements of the current game.
Plenty of Super quality ones but they all seem to struggle at the top level.i am starting to feel we're spoilt for choice when it comes to players on the cusp....and in the past there might have been one that was given a chance and stuck with and grew into the role...now after a couple of games there is a chorus of "what about that guy"
But one was picked and given a decent run. Twice it was attempted. Frizell and Akira.
Akira has had 15 starts (plus 6 bench games) and Frizell 18 starts (plus 7 bench).
Both showed enough form to be given a crack but neither kicked on.
Blackadder is full of endeavour and a skilled player but you do have to wonder if his style contributes to his injury issues. I noticed at the start of Super that he looks to have put some bulk on as well, which could be good but we have yet to see if it is.He has no regard for his body. Really awkward tackles, collisions. I loved him against SA a year or so back.
He looks more barrel chested this year indeed. Hopefully he reks some folk.
So do you take the risk that you build a back row around him then cross your fingers that he doesn't injure himself?
I like his effort as well and he ticks boxes in speed, workrate, ball skills, lineout. My question mark is on stopping ability. Is his shoulder hard enough to stop Ireland and France setting up plays with a close run over the gainline? I haven't seen enough of him doing that.
Part of the reason we hark back to Jerry and Jerome days is that teams had to change their plans after a couple of big smashbacks down the one channel. Those guys would put some hurt on. -
@Crucial said in All Blacks 2023:
If what we want is a no frill hard shoulder then that guy could be Jacobsen. That was why he was meant to play in the last RWC and he is in great form at the moment.
Might not get on the highlights reels but is accurate, has high workrate and stops close runners in their tracks. Has the added bonus of versatilityThe answer is not Akira or Frizzell anyway.
We need 80 minutes of industry. I need to notice my 6,7,8 on the field.
Since 2019 (or even before) the 6 has been missing.
I notice Ethan when he plays. He is everywhere.
@Steve said in All Blacks 2023:
@Crucial said in All Blacks 2023:
If what we want is a no frill hard shoulder then that guy could be Jacobsen. That was why he was meant to play in the last RWC and he is in great form at the moment.
Might not get on the highlights reels but is accurate, has high workrate and stops close runners in their tracks. Has the added bonus of versatilityThe answer is not Akira or Frizzell anyway.
We need 80 minutes of industry. I need to notice my 6,7,8 on the field.
Since 2019 (or even before) the 6 has been missing.
I notice Ethan when he plays. He is everywhere.
Everywhere doesn't equal effective though. For Ethan that has been his problem in the past. Has looked like a fly in a jar, throwing himself around, but often grabbing tackles or non dominant ones because of angle. I'm pretty sure that his work-on would be more result for less energy expended (or better application) because the ability is there.
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@Steve said in All Blacks 2023:
@Crucial said in All Blacks 2023:
If what we want is a no frill hard shoulder then that guy could be Jacobsen. That was why he was meant to play in the last RWC and he is in great form at the moment.
Might not get on the highlights reels but is accurate, has high workrate and stops close runners in their tracks. Has the added bonus of versatilityThe answer is not Akira or Frizzell anyway.
We need 80 minutes of industry. I need to notice my 6,7,8 on the field.
Since 2019 (or even before) the 6 has been missing.
I notice Ethan when he plays. He is everywhere.
Everywhere doesn't equal effective though. For Ethan that has been his problem in the past. Has looked like a fly in a jar, throwing himself around, but often grabbing tackles or non dominant ones because of angle. I'm pretty sure that his work-on would be more result for less energy expended (or better application) because the ability is there.
@Crucial i think given where we are in the build up to the RWC....id rather have industry, someone stamping a presence on the game, you know what hes going to do, it may not be perfect but you can plan on it....than someone like frizell who might have a good 10 minutes in each half...or might not
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@Crucial i think given where we are in the build up to the RWC....id rather have industry, someone stamping a presence on the game, you know what hes going to do, it may not be perfect but you can plan on it....than someone like frizell who might have a good 10 minutes in each half...or might not
@Kiwiwomble said in All Blacks 2023:
@Crucial i think given where we are in the build up to the RWC....id rather have industry, someone stamping a presence on the game, you know what hes going to do, it may not be perfect but you can plan on it....than someone like frizell who might have a good 10 minutes in each half...or might not
I get that. SF and AI have been tested and failed. I get that some might want AI to get another opportunity but can we afford to waste the few tests left to give him one?
I would love to have his other attributes in the team but his close impact is too low for the big teams. Uses his upper body over his leg drive. Sure, give him half a metre of room and he can bust tackles, but those chances are few against accurate sides. Ideally we need someone with Sami T's ability to gain metres post contact on hit ups and stop the opposition doing so.
If Blackadder shows he can do that then he gets my vote otherwise he is as effective as Akira but in a different way. -
@Steve said in All Blacks 2023:
@Crucial said in All Blacks 2023:
If what we want is a no frill hard shoulder then that guy could be Jacobsen. That was why he was meant to play in the last RWC and he is in great form at the moment.
Might not get on the highlights reels but is accurate, has high workrate and stops close runners in their tracks. Has the added bonus of versatilityThe answer is not Akira or Frizzell anyway.
We need 80 minutes of industry. I need to notice my 6,7,8 on the field.
Since 2019 (or even before) the 6 has been missing.
I notice Ethan when he plays. He is everywhere.
Everywhere doesn't equal effective though. For Ethan that has been his problem in the past. Has looked like a fly in a jar, throwing himself around, but often grabbing tackles or non dominant ones because of angle. I'm pretty sure that his work-on would be more result for less energy expended (or better application) because the ability is there.
@Crucial said in All Blacks 2023:
@Steve said in All Blacks 2023:
@Crucial said in All Blacks 2023:
If what we want is a no frill hard shoulder then that guy could be Jacobsen. That was why he was meant to play in the last RWC and he is in great form at the moment.
Might not get on the highlights reels but is accurate, has high workrate and stops close runners in their tracks. Has the added bonus of versatilityThe answer is not Akira or Frizzell anyway.
We need 80 minutes of industry. I need to notice my 6,7,8 on the field.
Since 2019 (or even before) the 6 has been missing.
I notice Ethan when he plays. He is everywhere.
Everywhere doesn't equal effective though. For Ethan that has been his problem in the past. Has looked like a fly in a jar, throwing himself around, but often grabbing tackles or non dominant ones because of angle. I'm pretty sure that his work-on would be more result for less energy expended (or better application) because the ability is there.
Fair point. I just love honesty of effort. He will empty the tank. And I think he will learn quick. He was trending exponentially and then got injured. Who knows what level of player we would be talking about now otherwise....I think he is that good.
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@Steve said in All Blacks 2023:
@Crucial said in All Blacks 2023:
If what we want is a no frill hard shoulder then that guy could be Jacobsen. That was why he was meant to play in the last RWC and he is in great form at the moment.
Might not get on the highlights reels but is accurate, has high workrate and stops close runners in their tracks. Has the added bonus of versatilityThe answer is not Akira or Frizzell anyway.
We need 80 minutes of industry. I need to notice my 6,7,8 on the field.
Since 2019 (or even before) the 6 has been missing.
I notice Ethan when he plays. He is everywhere.
Everywhere doesn't equal effective though. For Ethan that has been his problem in the past. Has looked like a fly in a jar, throwing himself around, but often grabbing tackles or non dominant ones because of angle. I'm pretty sure that his work-on would be more result for less energy expended (or better application) because the ability is there.
@Crucial I agree on this. Saw some stats on effective tackles by loosies through 21-22. Interesting one was blackadder having a lot of contacts that needed support from Christie Crusadser and Papalii in The ABs in 2021. Christie's super high tackle count is influenced by this and also because Grace has still got that one weak shoulder the AB coaches talked about with him about after they took him to Aussie for a look. Anyone follow schoolboy rugby down south and know his injury history? It seems for the last three seasons he's lost time with shoulder knocks and when he plays his defence sits around 70 percent. I like the cut of his jib but he has got to be tackling at a higher effectiveness rate than that.
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@Crucial said in All Blacks 2023:
If what we want is a no frill hard shoulder then that guy could be Jacobsen. That was why he was meant to play in the last RWC and he is in great form at the moment.
Might not get on the highlights reels but is accurate, has high workrate and stops close runners in their tracks. Has the added bonus of versatilityThe answer is not Akira or Frizzell anyway.
We need 80 minutes of industry. I need to notice my 6,7,8 on the field.
Since 2019 (or even before) the 6 has been missing.
I notice Ethan when he plays. He is everywhere.
@Steve said in All Blacks 2023:
@Crucial said in All Blacks 2023:
If what we want is a no frill hard shoulder then that guy could be Jacobsen. That was why he was meant to play in the last RWC and he is in great form at the moment.
Might not get on the highlights reels but is accurate, has high workrate and stops close runners in their tracks. Has the added bonus of versatilityThe answer is not Akira or Frizzell anyway.
We need 80 minutes of industry. I need to notice my 6,7,8 on the field.
Since 2019 (or even before) the 6 has been missing.
I notice Ethan when he plays. He is everywhere.
Ethan is everywhere and sometimes effective, but often not. Being busy and ineffective is still ineffective. He's going to be vital in the squad covering the backrow, but his best position is seven.
Frizzell has dropped off a cliff in form this year, but is a "Foster Favourite" so probably will make the squad, no matter how many women he beats up.
And Akira has hardly failed, MoM performances against Tier One opponents can't be ignored, no matter how much you and others may want to. As for being noticed, I want my 6 to busy doing the hard work, buried in the tight, smashing people back in the tackle, clearing rucks. Stuff that's easy to miss that Akira routinely does and never gets credit for. One of the better maul defenders in NZ as well.
If you want a reminder just look at his work last week.
But Ioane brother derangement syndrome (IBDS) is a thing, so don't expect you to agree.
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@Steve said in All Blacks 2023:
@Crucial said in All Blacks 2023:
If what we want is a no frill hard shoulder then that guy could be Jacobsen. That was why he was meant to play in the last RWC and he is in great form at the moment.
Might not get on the highlights reels but is accurate, has high workrate and stops close runners in their tracks. Has the added bonus of versatilityThe answer is not Akira or Frizzell anyway.
We need 80 minutes of industry. I need to notice my 6,7,8 on the field.
Since 2019 (or even before) the 6 has been missing.
I notice Ethan when he plays. He is everywhere.
Ethan is everywhere and sometimes effective, but often not. Being busy and ineffective is still ineffective. He's going to be vital in the squad covering the backrow, but his best position is seven.
Frizzell has dropped off a cliff in form this year, but is a "Foster Favourite" so probably will make the squad, no matter how many women he beats up.
And Akira has hardly failed, MoM performances against Tier One opponents can't be ignored, no matter how much you and others may want to. As for being noticed, I want my 6 to busy doing the hard work, buried in the tight, smashing people back in the tackle, clearing rucks. Stuff that's easy to miss that Akira routinely does and never gets credit for. One of the better maul defenders in NZ as well.
If you want a reminder just look at his work last week.
But Ioane brother derangement syndrome (IBDS) is a thing, so don't expect you to agree.
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@Stargazer said in All Blacks 2023:
It was only a matter of time! :face_with_tears_of_joy:
Apologies for having an opinion on a discussion board
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@Kirwan the problem for Akira is he couldn't replicate his form vs Aussie when he played the Boks.
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks 2023:
@Kirwan the problem for Akira is he couldn't replicate his form vs Aussie when he played the Boks.
he's not alone there. There is a rogues gallery of forwards who look good beating up shit Aussie packs and then failing against others. Lots of them have played 6.
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@Kirwan the problem for Akira is he couldn't replicate his form vs Aussie when he played the Boks.
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks 2023:
@Kirwan the problem for Akira is he couldn't replicate his form vs Aussie when he played the Boks.
That is the thread myth, yes. He's not alone there, should we drop all those players? How about the ones that struggled against Ireland in a similar way?
Or we could pick the player with the best upside, IMHO AKira, and develop him? He's 90% there, unlike the others.
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the biggest problem at 6 isn't even who we have to choose from. The biggest problem is the guys locked in to 7 and 8, their strengths and weaknesses, and thus the specific type of player you need to make that trio work.
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the biggest problem at 6 isn't even who we have to choose from. The biggest problem is the guys locked in to 7 and 8, their strengths and weaknesses, and thus the specific type of player you need to make that trio work.
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2023:
the biggest problem at 6 isn't even who we have to choose from. The biggest problem is the guys locked in to 7 and 8, their strengths and weaknesses, and thus the specific type of player you need to make that trio work.
Solved with Akira, Ardie and Dalton.
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@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks 2023:
@Kirwan the problem for Akira is he couldn't replicate his form vs Aussie when he played the Boks.
That is the thread myth, yes. He's not alone there, should we drop all those players? How about the ones that struggled against Ireland in a similar way?
Or we could pick the player with the best upside, IMHO AKira, and develop him? He's 90% there, unlike the others.
@Kirwan said in All Blacks 2023:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks 2023:
@Kirwan the problem for Akira is he couldn't replicate his form vs Aussie when he played the Boks.
That is the thread myth, yes. He's not alone there, should we drop all those players? How about the ones that struggled against Ireland in a similar way?
Or we could pick the player with the best upside, IMHO AKira, and develop him? He's 90% there, unlike the others.
lol, i want him to be the guy as much as anyone but this just isn't even remotely true, no matter how many times you say it.
Anyway you are all wrong, Finau is the guy.
you know, once he is fit enough.
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@Kirwan said in All Blacks 2023:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks 2023:
@Kirwan the problem for Akira is he couldn't replicate his form vs Aussie when he played the Boks.
That is the thread myth, yes. He's not alone there, should we drop all those players? How about the ones that struggled against Ireland in a similar way?
Or we could pick the player with the best upside, IMHO AKira, and develop him? He's 90% there, unlike the others.
lol, i want him to be the guy as much as anyone but this just isn't even remotely true, no matter how many times you say it.
Anyway you are all wrong, Finau is the guy.
you know, once he is fit enough.
@mariner4life obviously I disagree. Ignoring the obvious positives, like his speed out wide, he's one of the few at 6 that drives people back in the tackle, unlike Frizzell actually attends rucks and moves bodies, and is a very good lineout option.
Previous big issue with him was fitness, that was solved a long time ago. Just look at 80min performance two games back from a long injury.
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@mariner4life obviously I disagree. Ignoring the obvious positives, like his speed out wide, he's one of the few at 6 that drives people back in the tackle, unlike Frizzell actually attends rucks and moves bodies, and is a very good lineout option.
Previous big issue with him was fitness, that was solved a long time ago. Just look at 80min performance two games back from a long injury.
@Kirwan said in All Blacks 2023:
he's one of the few at 6 that drives people back in the tackle,
actually he wrestles. He's an upper body scragger. Which works at Super level but not so much at test level. At the next level he still reminds me of the guy who's been the biggest and strongest his whole career
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@Kirwan said in All Blacks 2023:
he's one of the few at 6 that drives people back in the tackle,
actually he wrestles. He's an upper body scragger. Which works at Super level but not so much at test level. At the next level he still reminds me of the guy who's been the biggest and strongest his whole career
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2023:
@Kirwan said in All Blacks 2023:
he's one of the few at 6 that drives people back in the tackle,
actually he wrestles. He's an upper body scragger. Which works at Super level but not so much at test level. At the next level he still reminds me of the guy who's been the biggest and strongest his whole career
He really doesn’t.
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@Kirwan said in All Blacks 2023:
he's one of the few at 6 that drives people back in the tackle,
actually he wrestles. He's an upper body scragger. Which works at Super level but not so much at test level. At the next level he still reminds me of the guy who's been the biggest and strongest his whole career
