All Blacks 2023
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My strong money is on Havili, assuming he is fit.
Foster drops nobody. Not for form, not for a better mix, not to change the style of play. You only leave the Foster team or squad because you are injured or retire.
@Chester-Draws That's not entirely true. Bridge, Sotutu & Akira have all been dropped (among others).
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@canefan said in All Blacks 2023:
I think it's fair to say we are playing a significantly different style now, compared to the helter skelter stuff of the last two years. Jordie has been a big upgrade with his direct runs. I wonder if Havili, assuming he makes the cut, would be encouraged to play a more direct game and could he do this successfully if needed?
He has been playing that, he has been hitting it up for most of the last few years. It is just fucking ineffective when he does it
@Machpants yep, ironically when they wanted/needed a Laumape style player, they didnt have one...so just played that style anyway.
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@canefan said in All Blacks 2023:
I think it's fair to say we are playing a significantly different style now, compared to the helter skelter stuff of the last two years. Jordie has been a big upgrade with his direct runs. I wonder if Havili, assuming he makes the cut, would be encouraged to play a more direct game and could he do this successfully if needed?
He has been playing that, he has been hitting it up for most of the last few years. It is just fucking ineffective when he does it
@Machpants said in All Blacks 2023:
@canefan said in All Blacks 2023:
I think it's fair to say we are playing a significantly different style now, compared to the helter skelter stuff of the last two years. Jordie has been a big upgrade with his direct runs. I wonder if Havili, assuming he makes the cut, would be encouraged to play a more direct game and could he do this successfully if needed?
He has been playing that, he has been hitting it up for most of the last few years. It is just fucking ineffective when he does it
May the rugby Gods protect Jordie Barrett, at least until November....
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Havili certainly isn't like for like for Barrett... makes you wonder whether they'll be thinking about Tupaea for a proper back door entrance. If they are happy to pick Newell and Blackadder, I see no reason why they couldn't pick him.
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@frugby Except that Tupaea isn't better than Havili (yet) and hasn't played rugby for a very long time.
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@Stargazer Different profiles though. If they want a hard ball-carrier, Tupaea and McLeod would be better bets than Havili imo.
@frugby Not the same distribution and kicking skills though. Also not the same versatility and experience. At this time of the year, with little time to go before the RWC, Havili is a far more usefull squaddie than Tupaea and McLeod. They are for the future.
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I think it's fair to say we are playing a significantly different style now, compared to the helter skelter stuff of the last two years. Jordie has been a big upgrade with his direct runs. I wonder if Havili, assuming he makes the cut, would be encouraged to play a more direct game and could he do this successfully if needed?
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@frugby Not the same distribution and kicking skills though. Also not the same versatility and experience. At this time of the year, with little time to go before the RWC, Havili is a far more usefull squaddie than Tupaea and McLeod. They are for the future.
@Stargazer Did you read what I said? I said, of they are looking for a like-for-like option, they might have Tupaea and McLeod in mind.
It wasn't a comment on Havili's overall ability, though that in itself can be debated, because he hasn't exactly set the world on fire at test level...
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@Stargazer Did you read what I said? I said, of they are looking for a like-for-like option, they might have Tupaea and McLeod in mind.
It wasn't a comment on Havili's overall ability, though that in itself can be debated, because he hasn't exactly set the world on fire at test level...
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@Stargazer said in All Blacks 2023:
@frugby They are not like for like. They're super green, inexperienced and unproven.
In play styles, they are way more similar to Jordie Barrett than Havili is - so like for like.
By your argument, Sam Whitelock and Aaron Smith are like for like because they're both proven and highly experienced.
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@Stargazer said in All Blacks 2023:
@frugby They are not like for like. They're super green, inexperienced and unproven.
In play styles, they are way more similar to Jordie Barrett than Havili is - so like for like.
By your argument, Sam Whitelock and Aaron Smith are like for like because they're both proven and highly experienced.
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If we want ineffective ball running, wayward kicking, and distributing to Scottish players for runaways, Havili is our guy fir sure
If we want someone to come in and do Jordie's role, then it's not David
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@Stargazer said in All Blacks 2023:
@frugby They are not like for like. They're super green, inexperienced and unproven.
In play styles, they are way more similar to Jordie Barrett than Havili is - so like for like.
By your argument, Sam Whitelock and Aaron Smith are like for like because they're both proven and highly experienced.
@frugby said in All Blacks 2023:
@Stargazer said in All Blacks 2023:
@frugby They are not like for like. They're super green, inexperienced and unproven.
In play styles, they are way more similar to Jordie Barrett than Havili is - so like for like.
By your argument, Sam Whitelock and Aaron Smith are like for like because they're both proven and highly experienced.
the rest if us knew what you meant, im sure not all agreed but knew what you meant
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@frugby said in All Blacks 2023:
By your argument, Sam Whitelock and Aaron Smith are like for like because they're both proven and highly experienced.
No, they're not. They play in different positions. Stop twisting my words.
@Stargazer said in All Blacks 2023:
@frugby said in All Blacks 2023:
By your argument, Sam Whitelock and Aaron Smith are like for like because they're both proven and highly experienced.
No, they're not. They play in different positions. Stop twisting my words.
By like for like, I was quite clearly referring to play style. Nothing to do with experience.
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God i hope Havili doesn't go
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2023:
God i hope Havili doesn't go
I am sorry my son, but David is a near certainty. You may pray for something else, though.
I know what you mean. He would be extremely handy for the Mako.
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They're like for like in that they are big bodies that can run it straight, jordie has a more full court game. He's played every position in the abs beyond 9, and has a lot of strings to how bow. McLeod and Tup not so much
@Machpants said in All Blacks 2023:
They're like for like in that they are big bodies that can run it straight, jordie has a more full court game. He's played every position in the abs beyond 9, and has a lot of strings to how bow. McLeod and Tup not so much
Absolutely correct. That's why I originally said, if they want a hard ball-carrier, which to me has been the most important part of Barrett's game this year, then the other two are more like for like than Havili.
The most like for like in the other regard would be Sam Gilbert, but he is very much a Jordie Barrett lite, who does everything Barrett does, except slightly worse, barring the fact he is the greatest goal kicker of all time.
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@Stargazer said in All Blacks 2023:
@frugby said in All Blacks 2023:
By your argument, Sam Whitelock and Aaron Smith are like for like because they're both proven and highly experienced.
No, they're not. They play in different positions. Stop twisting my words.
By like for like, I was quite clearly referring to play style. Nothing to do with experience.
