Mental Illness.
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I've had battles with mental health over the years, but in hindsight I would say 95% of it has just been the ups and downs of being a person. The 5% of it which wasn't though is very very different.
Had my first bit of depression in 3rd year university. It was pretty scary as I honestly didn't have a clue what to do about it. I was sitting in a lecture and over the course of it I started to feel very down. It was a completely different feeling to being upset / pissed off / blah or "in a bit of a funk" as it's colloquially known. I struggled to see the point of absolutely anything and really felt like shit. The freakiest part though was that I just didn't feel like I was actually me and I was looking down on me. I went to bed at night genuinely scared and worried that I would wake up the next day feeling the same. I went to dinner with my other half, tried to explain it and she didn't get it. On the way home, we stopped at the servo to pick up some completely pointless rags (I think one was called Thats Life) to try and get some perspective. It just didn't work, I couldn't break it. After about 4 days when I was walking home, I realised that it had broken and I was feeling normal again.
To this day, I have no idea what it was, but all modern research point to it being a depressive episode.
Since then, and this is now 25 years ago, I've always been very cognisant of this feeling and how I am. Like everybody, I get down on myself from time to time and lose perspective of what I've actually got in front of me. I've had little swings here and there, but if I start getting that feeling again I simply stop what I'm doing and regroup. Generally for me, it's going for a run. I had a really shit last Thursday which also co-incided with (for the UK anyway) cataclysmic rain. So when I got back from London, I decided to go for a run anyway. And by fuck did it turn me around. Only did 35 mins and was soaked to the bone/freezing afterwards but after a hot shower I felt fantastic.
The point of this though is would that have worked back in 1998? I genuinely don't know but if I had to guess I don't think it would. That shit was real, and something different. So although I'm hugely sceptical of a lot of mental health media, I have zero doubt that it really is a real thing & I cannot imagine having to live with it day in / day out. My sister had a bad episode about 15 years ago and I don't think she's ever really recovered from it. At the time, I always though her obesity was the cause of it, but perhaps it's more a circular thing. One is related to the other and it's a hard cycle to bust. She seems much stronger now though although the underlying condition hasn't changed.
One thing I do suffer from badly though is anxiety. It has destroyed many social & work situations for me. I still haven't got the solution to get that under control, but I do refuse to take medication. I've opened up about it with a few buds, and it's surprisingly prevalent. However, I'm the only one that doesn't take Xanax to relieve the symptoms. I spoke to a Dr once about it, and they talked about various therapies / scenarios I should look at before drugs. I guess I've been too stubborn to try it as I don't like putting drugs into my body (never really have). Perhaps I could have had a much happier life / successful career if I had gone down this path. That, I'll never know.
So yeah, bit of a ramble but that's my two cents. Upshot is that I believe mental health issues are very very real things, but far too many people self-prescribe as mental health issues in order to self-explain their own (usually shitty) behaviour.
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@MajorRage I wouldn’t rule out drugs for anxiety completely mate - they can really change your life. Long history of it on my wife’s side, and they definitely work. You could always trial a small controlled dosage and see what happens - unless you’re the addictive type…
On a different mental illness, my best mate from school was (still is I guess) bipolar. Holy shit that’s a scary thing. The lows were like the world is enveloping him and could last weeks and months. The highs were much shorter, but by god were they destructive. Total delusion, quite extraordinary to witness.
Left him with a 10yr gap in his life during his 20’s until they finally found a medication balance that he could / was willing stick to.
He’s now a married dad and in a stable job, when 20 years ago it looked like his life was going to end very prematurely
Scary stuff
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@dogmeat said in Mental Illness.:
Getting old sucks but reading this I am very grateful I grew up in an era when the biggest issue was 'Raleigh 20 envy'.
Chopper envy in The Hutt Valley
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@MajorRage said in Mental Illness.:
I've had battles with mental health over the years, but in hindsight I would say 95% of it has just been the ups and downs of being a person. The 5% of it which wasn't though is very very different.
Had my first bit of depression in 3rd year university. It was pretty scary as I honestly didn't have a clue what to do about it. I was sitting in a lecture and over the course of it I started to feel very down. It was a completely different feeling to being upset / pissed off / blah or "in a bit of a funk" as it's colloquially known. I struggled to see the point of absolutely anything and really felt like shit. The freakiest part though was that I just didn't feel like I was actually me and I was looking down on me. I went to bed at night genuinely scared and worried that I would wake up the next day feeling the same. I went to dinner with my other half, tried to explain it and she didn't get it. On the way home, we stopped at the servo to pick up some completely pointless rags (I think one was called Thats Life) to try and get some perspective. It just didn't work, I couldn't break it. After about 4 days when I was walking home, I realised that it had broken and I was feeling normal again.
To this day, I have no idea what it was, but all modern research point to it being a depressive episode.
Since then, and this is now 25 years ago, I've always been very cognisant of this feeling and how I am. Like everybody, I get down on myself from time to time and lose perspective of what I've actually got in front of me. I've had little swings here and there, but if I start getting that feeling again I simply stop what I'm doing and regroup. Generally for me, it's going for a run. I had a really shit last Thursday which also co-incided with (for the UK anyway) cataclysmic rain. So when I got back from London, I decided to go for a run anyway. And by fuck did it turn me around. Only did 35 mins and was soaked to the bone/freezing afterwards but after a hot shower I felt fantastic.
The point of this though is would that have worked back in 1998? I genuinely don't know but if I had to guess I don't think it would. That shit was real, and something different. So although I'm hugely sceptical of a lot of mental health media, I have zero doubt that it really is a real thing & I cannot imagine having to live with it day in / day out. My sister had a bad episode about 15 years ago and I don't think she's ever really recovered from it. At the time, I always though her obesity was the cause of it, but perhaps it's more a circular thing. One is related to the other and it's a hard cycle to bust. She seems much stronger now though although the underlying condition hasn't changed.
One thing I do suffer from badly though is anxiety. It has destroyed many social & work situations for me. I still haven't got the solution to get that under control, but I do refuse to take medication. I've opened up about it with a few buds, and it's surprisingly prevalent. However, I'm the only one that doesn't take Xanax to relieve the symptoms. I spoke to a Dr once about it, and they talked about various therapies / scenarios I should look at before drugs. I guess I've been too stubborn to try it as I don't like putting drugs into my body (never really have). Perhaps I could have had a much happier life / successful career if I had gone down this path. That, I'll never know.
So yeah, bit of a ramble but that's my two cents. Upshot is that I believe mental health issues are very very real things, but far too many people self-prescribe as mental health issues in order to self-explain their own (usually shitty) behaviour.
So much of it is figuring out your own coping mechanisms. @taniwharugby mentioned the working out, that is massively important for me too and I’m genuinely racked with guilt most summers as I realise whilst I’ve been social for the most part and had a few brews I feel bad as the days go by and I haven’t been down in the garage doing my routine and being careful the waistline doesn’t expand too much with said beers and the inevitable overeating that comes with it, not ideal for T shirt season. Two sessions of calisthenics/bag work so far this week so back into it.
Dr Paul Wood who some on here are aware of suggests doing something tough and even unpleasant every day to build mental toughness and prove you can do it. In my case yesterday that was making a really tough call to a client I had been putting off but afterwards being satisfied I’d done it. The day before it was confronting my son over some bad behaviour and being a “Dad” as opposed to sweeping it under the carpet.
Today’s one is being in Levin in stinking hot weather in a long sleeved shirt and dress pants.
The post above is right though, some will put down any bad behaviour to imaginary conditions that they often won’t even have. Some people are just fluffybunnies.
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This is a topic close to my heart as well, and like others the females in my family have suffered the worst from poor mental health - I think social media plays a huge role in that as it does affect women more than men.
For my wife, without going into any details, she had a hell of a childhood and the trauma (that word gets thrown around way too much these days) from that affects her day to day life and she has to work hard to manage that. I don't know how she does it, she is stronger than I will ever be to overcome what she has and raise 3 amazing boys, effectively breaking that cycle of abuse. She is an exception though, a lot of people that suffered badly as children really have no chance in life which is really sad.
We'd fix a lot of societal issues if the collective we just looked after our kids better. I know English was trying to use big data to identify at risk children, but it's not an easy problem for a government to solve.
I also share others thoughts on how mental health issues are diagnosed, and how quickly doctors & psychiatrists are to prescribe some serious meds based on nothing more than a conversation instead of first trying things like therapy (with a trained psychologist) and exercise to see if that makes a positive difference. Exercise in particular is proven to help so surely that should be a starting point.
I will also add that narcissists on social media self diagnosing themselves with mental illnesses to justify their awful behaviour do absolutely no favours to people that are genuinely suffering through no fault of their own.
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Kudos to Mrs NQ. A good friend of mine had a troubled adolescence/young adult time, partly due to him being something of a fluffybunny, but mainly due to parental issues; an overbearing, entitled mother and a lovely but weak Father.
He turned things around based on a simple mantra which is "First, forgive your parents". Initially I thought this was all about putting in the past things like your parents not buying you a Raleigh Chopper or some such, but grew to realise it was all about no matter what your parents were like, put that behind you and take ownership of your own life and behaviour. In doing so you become free to be the person that you want to be. Obviously this is easier depending upon one's experiences but it made me become more in command of myself and my responsibilities. It sounds as though Mrs NQ has gone a long way down that road too.
Hats off to the girl.
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I think the issue with mental health is like many things in society these days, i.e. an overcorrection in response to inadequate management in the past rather than finding the right balance. While before, you were weak or a poof if you talked about your feelings, now it's straight to therapy or medication. Mental health should not be stigmatised, but at the same time shouldn't be idolised and almost bragged about. Ultimately mental health is a very complex thing and has a massive connection to physical health as well. I had my first ever major health scare in my early 20s. I'd had asthma all my life but hadn't really worried much in recent years. But I was living in Norway and contracted some kind of respiratory infection and had a bad asthma attack. It freaked me out. I couldn't sleep because I was afraid I would stop breathing. I sucked on mints by the truck loads so that I could feel I was breathing. The anxiety caused me to have massive chest pains and I then thought I was having heart problems. It hurt to breathe or cough. I was constantly going to emergency or wanting to go. Thankfully a decent doctor sat me down and told me that it was down to anxiety and I was smart enough to follow his advice. It's terrifying to think how severely that mental issue manifested itself in terms of physical effects. It fůcked me up royally and it was all in my head.
As I said, mental health is very complex and can take many forms and be for many reasons. Just look at those guys who appear to be living the life, with loving families who suddenly commit suicide.
Personally I've been hammered in the past decade. I lost my wife and both in-laws to cancer. Both my parents have just had cancer and my son suffered very bad PTSD after his mother died and he nearly died of a drug overdose. My saving grace has been exercise and I can't stress that enough. I remember one day when my son was particularly bad. He'd gone missing and I'd been talking to the cops. I was a mess but decided to go to swimming training just to do something. It was like night and day. Obviously my problems hadn't gone away but I felt like a different person and was ready to face whatever shit was coming. That was powerful and I have never forgotten it. Exercise is non-negotiable now and IMHO is a million times better than paying hundreds of dollars to talk to a stranger. That doesn't mean I think therapy is useless. Quite the opposite but I think alot of that is just getting things off your chest and having a sympathetic ear. I prefer friends and those I love.Shit. Rambling. I have a million more things to say but it's too incoherent. Ultimately, mental health and physical health are inextricably linked and IMHO exercise is vital for good mental health. I'd be royally fůcked without it
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@MajorRage said in Mental Illness.:
One thing I do suffer from badly though is anxiety. It has destroyed many social & work situations for me. I still haven't got the solution to get that under control, but I do refuse to take medication. I've opened up about it with a few buds, and it's surprisingly prevalent. However, I'm the only one that doesn't take Xanax to relieve the symptoms. I spoke to a Dr once about it, and they talked about various therapies / scenarios I should look at before drugs. I guess I've been too stubborn to try it as I don't like putting drugs into my body (never really have). Perhaps I could have had a much happier life / successful career if I had gone down this path. That, I'll never know.
I can really relate to this and the dichotomy of drugs/therapy to deal with it and wonder if the age when you become aware of it is key.
I knew since growing up that something wasn't quite right and my parents, who were incredibly progressive for the 60/70's on mental health ("it's simply an illness just like pneumonia or arthritis") simply told me I worried too much. I'd get a bit worried about stuff like leaving lights on or, long after a conversation, worry if I'd said the wrong thing. Later, in my 30's, I spent some time at a mental hospital helping out and became accustomed to dealing with the whole mental health spectrum and from that experience and my upbringing, thought myself pretty OK when dealing with people with mental health issues and just accepted I was a bit of a worrier or too cautious.
It wasn't until my daughter had a serious hospitalising breakdown in her early 20's that I started to understand anxiety and that it ran in my family. I was pretty taken aback/shocked to find out my sister suffered badly from it, but had learned to deal with it from an early age.
Now my older sister is the most capable person you will meet. A senior nurse who in her early-20's toured around the world, inc. eastern Europe & Russia (was arrested by Polish security police for going off-piste) and did and saw stuff most of us could dream of. She also pretty much raised 5 uber-successful kids on her own after her husband buggered off. She's the person who remains calm and collected in any crisis, handles serious problems and situations with ease and will probably think nothing about flying to NY for some shopping or art exhibition when she's in her mid-80's.
That revelation and my daughter's breakdown was an eye-opener and explained so much to me. My sister had learned how it affected her, determined it would not run her life and had found out what worked for her - which didn't include drugs or therapy. More importantly, she had accepted it as part of herself and never let managing it become a big thing in her life.
For me, just being aware that I can sometimes suffer from acute anxiety has made things better - I can recognise when I'm letting it get a hold on me, rationalise the situation and control it that way. Maybe drugs and or therapy may have helped me in my youth, but I have to balance that against it becoming a bigger part of my life.
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@Rancid-Schnitzel said in Mental Illness.:
Just look at those guys who appear to be living the life, with loving families who suddenly commit suicide.
I started researching psychology (even read Jung and Freud, I advise not to) and in particular suicide, a couple of years ago largely because of that quote above. It's hugely complicated of course because people are, but the stats are staggering. Numbers differ depending on country and parameters, but an example is that one in twenty Australians between the ages of 16 and 80 will attempt suicide. Far more think about it. NZ may be worse but unlikely to be any better. So if you know 20 people...
Part of the problem is the stigma associated with it and the bullshit misunderstandings of it that get thrown around. There's a reason that those that should be talking, won't. Anyway, this was one of the first things that I found when I started looking and should be a must read for the general public.
The numbers are US and use different metrics to the Aus numbers that I mentioned.
There are some other misconceptions as well about suicide rates being higher when times are tough, or at least unusual. There is some data that rates drop during wartime, economic depressions (unfortunate word) and even during pandemics (including covid). There could be many and varied reasons that are apparent but the "not coping" thing isn't really about external factors it tends to be a more existential crisis. @MajorRage mentioned the "what's the point?" thought. It's a big one. Difficult to know an answer unless you happen to know the meaning of life (if so please DM me).
I wish that "mental illness" and "mental health" also hadn't become so broadly linked and used. Someone having a shit time of it can be really hurting to the point of suicidal thoughts (or action), but it isn't the same as being bipolar for example. Semantics I know, but thee two terms are linked and yet different, but the same.
I won't go on, but some of the misconceptions and ignorance about "sensitive" topics piss me off. Often by people who should know better.
As for the OP. It's both, we live all wrong (or at least haven't adjusted yet), and we also are recognising the outcomes more. What we aren't doing is curing it, we are addressing the symptoms (drugs), as is the case with so much of medicine. Some real pathology needed back to root causes and a more wholistic approach.
All that is probably more than my 2c worth but I have had some skin in the game.
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@taniwharugby said in Mental Illness.:
Now I'm not discounting what happened to him, or that it didnt impact him, but I also think people are very quick to go down the mental heath issue path, more so that I think they are difficult to truly diagnose (in that I am sure anyone could convince a Dr they have a mental illness) and likely difficult to cure for those with illnesses.
I'm in a strange dichotomy where I think most people are taking the piss when it comes to mental health, but am acutely aware of the debilitating aspects of mental health issues.
A close family member had a promising professional football career destroyed as a result of acute depression. And I'm ashamed to say that my response at the time was less than helpful as I couldn't understand why. Discussing that with my father led to an uncomfortable admission that he'd suffered from depression and contemplated suicide. I didn't feel equipped to continuing having that discussion. I mean, what the fuck do you say to that other than "pleased you didn't"?
I get the feeling that mentioning some are taking the piss in this day and age is social suicide. I've culled my list of acquaintances due to their belief that the topic is sacrosanct and prevailing orthodoxy isn't to be questioned. It's one thing to destigmatise it, it's another to accept without question or criticism when it's brought up.
Case in point; the number of vets who have claimed PTSD as a result of their service. Most of them haven't seen combat, the worst they had to deal with was temporary internet access unavailability. PS employees claiming it from office work, are we really that fragile these days?
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I totally get what you’re driving at, especially the view that nothing can be questioned and this for me is probably the biggest barrier to wider understanding. However it is often difficult to comprehend what mental anguish a person is going through. Ms Cato No1 had a period of pretty deep depression and I found that very difficult to deal with as I just couldn’t understand why. A close friend that had experienced much the same but with far more obvious reasons helped my understanding somewhat. Paraphrased she said “ she’s got nothing to be depressed about, she’s doing the Uni course she always wanted, she has friends, a loving family, she has hobbies, she’s a pretty girl. There’s nothing to be depressed about. And you know what? None of that matters if you can’t see it”.
5 Common Myths About Suicide Debunked
