All Blacks 2024
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@Windows97 said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
@Mr-Fish said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
@Windows97 said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
It's quite funny how we've gone from a complete lack of depth at 8 to now overflowing. I'd be very tempted to put Savea back to 7 and give Sotutu and Sititi a go - they've both really deserved it.
Finau - Savea - Sotutu/Sititi has a lot of power to it. It's a bit tough on Papps but it's an excitng combination.
When did we have a complete lack of depth at No 8?
Read was always a permanent fixture leading up to 2019 and since then we've had Savea, Jacobson and Sotutu all playing well (at Super Rugby level).
At the start of the year we Savea oversea's, Sotutu was someone who hadn't lived up to his potential and Sititi was completly unknown. Not exactly flush with depth.
It was wide open for someone to put their hand up as a 8, thankfully Sotutu and Sititi have done that this year.
Sotutu hasn't lived up the hype now any more than he had at the start of the year. If anything, he's got even more hype around him. He's always been a good player for the Blues, particularly in the last couple of years. Whether he can carry that into the Test season is anyone's guess (as it was last year and the hear before).
I'd say the hype around Sititi is even worse at the moment. He's had one great game against the Hurricanes and one great game against Moana Pasifika. Otherwise, he's failed to replicate that similar form in the games in between. He could absolutely become a Test great but it's not like he's had an absolutely standout season for the Chiefs, just a few great games (one in a semi-final when the world is watching).
The Super Rugby sides haven't struggled for top number 8s and while the All Blacks might have lacked depth, I wouldn't say anything's changed this year on that front - a few guys with great potential but still no one really proven to back up Savea.
@Mr-Fish said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
I'd say the hype around Sititi is even worse at the moment. He's had one great game against the Hurricanes and one great game against Moana Pasifika. Otherwise, he's failed to replicate that similar form in the games in between.
I take it you missed the quarter final where Sititi was also excellent?
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I'm liking this new excuse pre-prepared for Razor: World Rugby is now more competitive.
What else can this thread conjure?
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A few names below of Hurricanes boys who have have had calls to attend the 3 day camp.
Billy Proctor, Ruben Love, Peter Lakai, Asafo Aumua, Brayden Iose, Brett Cameron, TJ Perenara and Jordy Barrett. Quite possible there’s more but that’s the only oil I have for now.
Starting losing your minds over Brett Cameron in 3,2,1…… go!
@Landers92 said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
A few names below of Hurricanes boys who have have had calls to attend the 3 day camp.
Billy Proctor, Ruben Love, Peter Lakai, Asafo Aumua, Brayden Iose, Brett Cameron, TJ Perenara and Jordy Barrett. Quite possible there’s more but that’s the only oil I have for now.
Starting losing your minds over Brett Cameron in 3,2,1…… go!
Someone has to hold a bag at some point.
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I'm liking this new excuse pre-prepared for Razor: World Rugby is now more competitive.
What else can this thread conjure?
@antipodean said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
I'm liking this new excuse pre-prepared for Razor: World Rugby is now more competitive.
What else can this thread conjure?
Poor old Foster on the other hand lost to a bunch of chumps.
Rugby is so unfair
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@Chris said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
@Landers92 said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
A few names below of Hurricanes boys who have have had calls to attend the 3 day camp.
Billy Proctor, Ruben Love, Peter Lakai, Asafo Aumua, Brayden Iose, Brett Cameron, TJ Perenara and Jordy Barrett. Quite possible there’s more but that’s the only oil I have for now.
Starting losing your minds over Brett Cameron in 3,2,1…… go!
9 crusaders also attending that camp I believe it includes extended squad members who may not be in the 32 come Next Monday.
23 into 9 doesn’t really add up, so not sure if our sauces are aligned
@ACT-Crusader said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
@Chris said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
@Landers92 said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
A few names below of Hurricanes boys who have have had calls to attend the 3 day camp.
Billy Proctor, Ruben Love, Peter Lakai, Asafo Aumua, Brayden Iose, Brett Cameron, TJ Perenara and Jordy Barrett. Quite possible there’s more but that’s the only oil I have for now.
Starting losing your minds over Brett Cameron in 3,2,1…… go!
9 crusaders also attending that camp I believe it includes extended squad members who may not be in the 32 come Next Monday.
23 into 9 doesn’t really add up, so not sure if our sauces are aligned
It includes extended squad members who will not be in the 32 released on Monday.So numbers mean nothing .
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@Mr-Fish said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
I'd say the hype around Sititi is even worse at the moment. He's had one great game against the Hurricanes and one great game against Moana Pasifika. Otherwise, he's failed to replicate that similar form in the games in between.
I take it you missed the quarter final where Sititi was also excellent?
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
@Mr-Fish said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
I'd say the hype around Sititi is even worse at the moment. He's had one great game against the Hurricanes and one great game against Moana Pasifika. Otherwise, he's failed to replicate that similar form in the games in between.
I take it you missed the quarter final where Sititi was also excellent?
My point was really more about Sititi struggling against the stronger teams until he stood up against the Hurricanes in the semi-final.
I know the Reds are the Chiefs' kryptonite but don't think that's a sign he's necessarily ready to take on England, South Africa, Ireland etc. Again, it's entirely possible he does step up to the plate if he gets the call - but he's no more a proven Test No 8 now than Sotutu was a few years ago before he'd played for the All Blacks. The No 8 depth hasn't changed until one of these players with high potential proves they're capable at international level - we've not struggled for great Super Rugby 8s in recent years, just think of Cullen Grace, Luke Jacobson, Pita Gus Sowakula etc etc.
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@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
@Mr-Fish said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
I'd say the hype around Sititi is even worse at the moment. He's had one great game against the Hurricanes and one great game against Moana Pasifika. Otherwise, he's failed to replicate that similar form in the games in between.
I take it you missed the quarter final where Sititi was also excellent?
My point was really more about Sititi struggling against the stronger teams until he stood up against the Hurricanes in the semi-final.
I know the Reds are the Chiefs' kryptonite but don't think that's a sign he's necessarily ready to take on England, South Africa, Ireland etc. Again, it's entirely possible he does step up to the plate if he gets the call - but he's no more a proven Test No 8 now than Sotutu was a few years ago before he'd played for the All Blacks. The No 8 depth hasn't changed until one of these players with high potential proves they're capable at international level - we've not struggled for great Super Rugby 8s in recent years, just think of Cullen Grace, Luke Jacobson, Pita Gus Sowakula etc etc.
@Mr-Fish said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
but he's no more a proven Test No 8 now than Sotutu was a few years ago before he'd played for the All Blacks. The No 8 depth hasn't changed until one of these players with high potential proves they're capable at international level
Of course but I think the excitement comes more from his ceiling and how far he's come in a short period of time. He seems to be a fast learner. His games the last 2 weeks are much improved from earlier in the season. He's come a hell of a long way in his debut season. It will be fascinating to see how he and Sotutu match up on Saturday. That will be as close to international footy as NZ players can get.
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@Mr-Fish said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
but he's no more a proven Test No 8 now than Sotutu was a few years ago before he'd played for the All Blacks. The No 8 depth hasn't changed until one of these players with high potential proves they're capable at international level
Of course but I think the excitement comes more from his ceiling and how far he's come in a short period of time. He seems to be a fast learner. His games the last 2 weeks are much improved from earlier in the season. He's come a hell of a long way in his debut season. It will be fascinating to see how he and Sotutu match up on Saturday. That will be as close to international footy as NZ players can get.
@KiwiMurph that and his brilliant work rate.
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personally all i want is for us to go to Ireland and
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
personally all i want is for us to go to Ireland and
I don't know. Watching the RWC live on tv, I heard the lamentation of Irish men and I am not convinced it would be any less painful hearing the lamentation of their women.
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personally all i want is for us to go to Ireland and
There is suddenly doubt about Ireland and they look like there current team is on the downward slope. (Based on the way the 6 nations finished and Leinster’s performance this year)
They will have an interim coach in the autumn so it seems they won’t be a strong as we have seen recently
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I'm liking this new excuse pre-prepared for Razor: World Rugby is now more competitive.
What else can this thread conjure?
@antipodean said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
What else can this thread conjure?
Robertson isn't fat?
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I'm liking this new excuse pre-prepared for Razor: World Rugby is now more competitive.
What else can this thread conjure?
@antipodean said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
I'm liking this new excuse pre-prepared for Razor: World Rugby is now more competitive.
What else can this thread conjure?
I’m almost hoping the ABs finish the test season with a losing record just to see some you guys go crazy. Meanwhile Razor will be laughing saying, three more years
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2020 Foster record 3-1-2, losses to AUS ARG
2021 12-3, losing to SAR FRA IREWe thought 21 was a disaster and it was. That's got to be the bar
@nzzp said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
2020 Foster record 3-1-2, losses to AUS ARG
2021 12-3, losing to SAR FRA IREWe thought 21 was a disaster and it was. That's got to be the bar
We only had four difficult games in 2021 and we lost three of them. That's the real bar. Should assume we'll win against Australia, Argentina etc - it's the games against France, Ireland, South Africa and to a lesser extent England that will test the All Blacks' mettle (though NZ do have home advantage for the England games).
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@nzzp said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
2020 Foster record 3-1-2, losses to AUS ARG
2021 12-3, losing to SAR FRA IREWe thought 21 was a disaster and it was. That's got to be the bar
We only had four difficult games in 2021 and we lost three of them. That's the real bar. Should assume we'll win against Australia, Argentina etc - it's the games against France, Ireland, South Africa and to a lesser extent England that will test the All Blacks' mettle (though NZ do have home advantage for the England games).
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@nzzp said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
@Mr-Fish you know we went 2-1-1 against Australia in 2020 right? Hardly easy beats
2020 was a bit of an anomaly due to Covid. Just an all-round messed up season.
@Mr-Fish said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
@nzzp said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
@Mr-Fish you know we went 2-1-1 against Australia in 2020 right? Hardly easy beats
2020 was a bit of an anomaly due to Covid. Just an all-round messed up season.
That didn't stop the coach being criticised for an under-developed squad though.
I think 3 losses - even against "tough teams" - will start the questioning. Hope it's met full on by NZR, though.
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@Mr-Fish said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
@nzzp said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
@Mr-Fish you know we went 2-1-1 against Australia in 2020 right? Hardly easy beats
2020 was a bit of an anomaly due to Covid. Just an all-round messed up season.
That didn't stop the coach being criticised for an under-developed squad though.
I think 3 losses - even against "tough teams" - will start the questioning. Hope it's met full on by NZR, though.
@Victor-Meldrew I seem to recall there being a bit of leniency in 2020 due to covid, but the following year and then the reappointment is what pissed more people off.
I wonder of they have introduced any KPIs since then, I guess historically putting win KPIs on an AB coach was a bit of a nothkng KPI
