All Blacks 2024
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As a fan on the couch I’ve got little idea who can coach and who can’t but all I have is what I see as a result ,
But I do suspect in modern coaching it’s more of a team thing than the one man in charge , we saw the results when fosters assistants were improved, and I see it regularly in afl , a new assistant comes into the mix and quite often brings something completely different to the table.
Out of interest, if Jamie Joseph had got the job , was it public knowledge who his assistants were going to be ?
@kiwiinmelb said in All Blacks 2024:
As a fan on the couch I’ve got little idea who can coach and who can’t but all I have is what I see as a result ,
But I do suspect in modern coaching it’s more of a team thing than the one man in charge , we saw the results when fosters assistants were improved, and I see it regularly in afl , a new assistant comes into the mix and quite often brings something completely different to the table.
Out of interest, if Jamie Joseph had got the job , was it public knowledge who his assistants were going to be ?
so according to the NZ Herald, 4 assistant coaches, Jason Ryan was continuing regardless, Tony Brown attack, Leon McDonald backs, Scott McLeod defense.
I think it's as good as Razor's team, not better because Scott Hansen is by all accounts a really good coach and had aligned with Razor wherever he was heading (assume another international side). No Jason Holland probably balances it out though.
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Seeing a lot of chat about Holland and McDonald in here which is justified. For what it’s worth I’ll add my 2 cents.
I know guys that have played with and under Leon McDonald and there are extremely mixed reviews. Without taking a jab at the guys character and morals, it seems a bit of odd when you’re out for breakfast and you come across one of your squad members who is there with his family, you would stop and introduce yourself and chat wouldn’t you? Apparently not if you’re Leon… you look at them and ignore them like you don’t know them.(Should probably not have said that but meh).
Mixed reviews on the coaching side too but that’s a personal preference I feel so take it with a grain of salt, players don’t always have to like their coaches to get team results.
Personally, I think every single coach has a lot to answer for, from head coach down to ‘line out throwing coach’. I would expect a response next weekend in Auckland in a big way, if not… well then the pitchforks will well and truly be out and rightfully so.
@Landers92 said in All Blacks 2024:
Seeing a lot of chat about Holland and McDonald in here which is justified. For what it’s worth I’ll add my 2 cents.
I know guys that have played with and under Leon McDonald and there are extremely mixed reviews. Without taking a jab at the guys character and morals, it seems a bit of odd when you’re out for breakfast and you come across one of your squad members who is there with his family, you would stop and introduce yourself and chat wouldn’t you? Apparently not if you’re Leon… you look at them and ignore them like you don’t know them.(Should probably not have said that but meh).
Mixed reviews on the coaching side too but that’s a personal preference I feel so take it with a grain of salt, players don’t always have to like their coaches to get team results.
maybe the player was Sammy Nock... i remember the big fallout between the two that was well documented on here.
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Rangi was better than havili, the centre experiment was a disaster,
but later under Ted , with him and mils we had 2 test quality fullbacks
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Just for context on Foster. The record we considered unacceptable and should be sacked was:
46 tests, 32 wins, 12 losses 2 draws69% winning record
We've got 10 tests left, and are currently 3-1.
2 Bankers Japan, Italy
3 'should win's - Arg, Ausx2
5 tough ones: SAx2, Fra, Ire, EngTo match Foster's record we need to go 10-4 overall ... so can drop 3 games.
So, if we drop 3 in the season it's a 'good' year, with a 78% win record. But I'd struggle to see us winning 3/5 of those tough games.
Given what we've seen so far, we may get 1 or 2 wins from the hard ones. But it all depends on our forwards stepping up on both sides of the ball.
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Just for context on Foster. The record we considered unacceptable and should be sacked was:
46 tests, 32 wins, 12 losses 2 draws69% winning record
We've got 10 tests left, and are currently 3-1.
2 Bankers Japan, Italy
3 'should win's - Arg, Ausx2
5 tough ones: SAx2, Fra, Ire, EngTo match Foster's record we need to go 10-4 overall ... so can drop 3 games.
So, if we drop 3 in the season it's a 'good' year, with a 78% win record. But I'd struggle to see us winning 3/5 of those tough games.
Given what we've seen so far, we may get 1 or 2 wins from the hard ones. But it all depends on our forwards stepping up on both sides of the ball.
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Just for context on Foster. The record we considered unacceptable and should be sacked was:
46 tests, 32 wins, 12 losses 2 draws69% winning record
We've got 10 tests left, and are currently 3-1.
2 Bankers Japan, Italy
3 'should win's - Arg, Ausx2
5 tough ones: SAx2, Fra, Ire, EngTo match Foster's record we need to go 10-4 overall ... so can drop 3 games.
So, if we drop 3 in the season it's a 'good' year, with a 78% win record. But I'd struggle to see us winning 3/5 of those tough games.
Given what we've seen so far, we may get 1 or 2 wins from the hard ones. But it all depends on our forwards stepping up on both sides of the ball.
@nzzp said in All Blacks 2024:
Just for context on Foster. The record we considered unacceptable and should be sacked was:
46 tests, 32 wins, 12 losses 2 draws69% winning record
We've got 10 tests left, and are currently 3-1.
2 Bankers Japan, Italy
3 'should win's - Arg, Ausx2
5 tough ones: SAx2, Fra, Ire, EngTo match Foster's record we need to go 10-4 overall ... so can drop 3 games.
So, if we drop 3 in the season it's a 'good' year, with a 78% win record. But I'd struggle to see us winning 3/5 of those tough games.
Given what we've seen so far, we may get 1 or 2 wins from the hard ones. But it all depends on our forwards stepping up on both sides of the ball.
The thing is, Razor is so cool, so dynamic, such a man of the people. He breakdances too.
Fozzie looked glum and he’s fat.
Different rules apply.
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@nzzp said in All Blacks 2024:
Just for context on Foster. The record we considered unacceptable and should be sacked was:
46 tests, 32 wins, 12 losses 2 draws69% winning record
We've got 10 tests left, and are currently 3-1.
2 Bankers Japan, Italy
3 'should win's - Arg, Ausx2
5 tough ones: SAx2, Fra, Ire, EngTo match Foster's record we need to go 10-4 overall ... so can drop 3 games.
So, if we drop 3 in the season it's a 'good' year, with a 78% win record. But I'd struggle to see us winning 3/5 of those tough games.
Given what we've seen so far, we may get 1 or 2 wins from the hard ones. But it all depends on our forwards stepping up on both sides of the ball.
The thing is, Razor is so cool, so dynamic, such a man of the people. He breakdances too.
Fozzie looked glum and he’s fat.
Different rules apply.
@MN5 said in All Blacks 2024:
@nzzp said in All Blacks 2024:
Just for context on Foster. The record we considered unacceptable and should be sacked was:
46 tests, 32 wins, 12 losses 2 draws69% winning record
We've got 10 tests left, and are currently 3-1.
2 Bankers Japan, Italy
3 'should win's - Arg, Ausx2
5 tough ones: SAx2, Fra, Ire, EngTo match Foster's record we need to go 10-4 overall ... so can drop 3 games.
So, if we drop 3 in the season it's a 'good' year, with a 78% win record. But I'd struggle to see us winning 3/5 of those tough games.
Given what we've seen so far, we may get 1 or 2 wins from the hard ones. But it all depends on our forwards stepping up on both sides of the ball.
The thing is, Razor is so cool, so dynamic, such a man of the people. He breakdances too.
Fozzie looked glum and he’s fat.
Different rules apply.
I am glad we sorted that out then, explains a lot.
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Just for context on Foster. The record we considered unacceptable and should be sacked was:
46 tests, 32 wins, 12 losses 2 draws69% winning record
We've got 10 tests left, and are currently 3-1.
2 Bankers Japan, Italy
3 'should win's - Arg, Ausx2
5 tough ones: SAx2, Fra, Ire, EngTo match Foster's record we need to go 10-4 overall ... so can drop 3 games.
So, if we drop 3 in the season it's a 'good' year, with a 78% win record. But I'd struggle to see us winning 3/5 of those tough games.
Given what we've seen so far, we may get 1 or 2 wins from the hard ones. But it all depends on our forwards stepping up on both sides of the ball.
@nzzp said in All Blacks 2024:
Just for context on Foster. The record we considered unacceptable and should be sacked was:
46 tests, 32 wins, 12 losses 2 draws69% winning record
It was never just about the % of wins. It was the shit style of play repeated ad nauseum, poor selections, the same mistakes repeated despite 'learnings' being every 2nd word out of every fluffybunnies mouth, and the new lows - first losses etc. Once you give those records up, you never get them back, and you lose a significant psychological edge.
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@nzzp said in All Blacks 2024:
Just for context on Foster. The record we considered unacceptable and should be sacked was:
46 tests, 32 wins, 12 losses 2 draws69% winning record
It was never just about the % of wins. It was the shit style of play repeated ad nauseum, poor selections, the same mistakes repeated despite 'learnings' being every 2nd word out of every fluffybunnies mouth, and the new lows - first losses etc. Once you give those records up, you never get them back, and you lose a significant psychological edge.
@reprobate said in All Blacks 2024:
@nzzp said in All Blacks 2024:
Just for context on Foster. The record we considered unacceptable and should be sacked was:
46 tests, 32 wins, 12 losses 2 draws69% winning record
It was never just about the % of wins. It was the shit style of play repeated ad nauseum, poor selections, the same mistakes repeated despite 'learnings' being every 2nd word out of every fluffybunnies mouth, and the new lows - first losses etc. Once you give those records up, you never get them back, and you lose a significant psychological edge.
No one fears us like the good old days
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@reprobate said in All Blacks 2024:
@nzzp said in All Blacks 2024:
Just for context on Foster. The record we considered unacceptable and should be sacked was:
46 tests, 32 wins, 12 losses 2 draws69% winning record
It was never just about the % of wins. It was the shit style of play repeated ad nauseum, poor selections, the same mistakes repeated despite 'learnings' being every 2nd word out of every fluffybunnies mouth, and the new lows - first losses etc. Once you give those records up, you never get them back, and you lose a significant psychological edge.
No one fears us like the good old days
@canefan said in All Blacks 2024:
@reprobate said in All Blacks 2024:
@nzzp said in All Blacks 2024:
Just for context on Foster. The record we considered unacceptable and should be sacked was:
46 tests, 32 wins, 12 losses 2 draws69% winning record
It was never just about the % of wins. It was the shit style of play repeated ad nauseum, poor selections, the same mistakes repeated despite 'learnings' being every 2nd word out of every fluffybunnies mouth, and the new lows - first losses etc. Once you give those records up, you never get them back, and you lose a significant psychological edge.
No one fears us like the good old days
They see NZ as an opportunity for some glory now.
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@canefan said in All Blacks 2024:
@reprobate said in All Blacks 2024:
@nzzp said in All Blacks 2024:
Just for context on Foster. The record we considered unacceptable and should be sacked was:
46 tests, 32 wins, 12 losses 2 draws69% winning record
It was never just about the % of wins. It was the shit style of play repeated ad nauseum, poor selections, the same mistakes repeated despite 'learnings' being every 2nd word out of every fluffybunnies mouth, and the new lows - first losses etc. Once you give those records up, you never get them back, and you lose a significant psychological edge.
No one fears us like the good old days
They see NZ as an opportunity for some glory now.
@Crazy-Horse said in All Blacks 2024:
@canefan said in All Blacks 2024:
@reprobate said in All Blacks 2024:
@nzzp said in All Blacks 2024:
Just for context on Foster. The record we considered unacceptable and should be sacked was:
46 tests, 32 wins, 12 losses 2 draws69% winning record
It was never just about the % of wins. It was the shit style of play repeated ad nauseum, poor selections, the same mistakes repeated despite 'learnings' being every 2nd word out of every fluffybunnies mouth, and the new lows - first losses etc. Once you give those records up, you never get them back, and you lose a significant psychological edge.
No one fears us like the good old days
They see NZ as an opportunity for some glory now.
The saffas will be looking to overtake us in the head to head record, and if we keep this up the Aussies will fancy themselves a chance of taking the Bled. Are we playing the Welsh or the Scots this year? The Italians might even dare to dream
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@Crazy-Horse said in All Blacks 2024:
@canefan said in All Blacks 2024:
@reprobate said in All Blacks 2024:
@nzzp said in All Blacks 2024:
Just for context on Foster. The record we considered unacceptable and should be sacked was:
46 tests, 32 wins, 12 losses 2 draws69% winning record
It was never just about the % of wins. It was the shit style of play repeated ad nauseum, poor selections, the same mistakes repeated despite 'learnings' being every 2nd word out of every fluffybunnies mouth, and the new lows - first losses etc. Once you give those records up, you never get them back, and you lose a significant psychological edge.
No one fears us like the good old days
They see NZ as an opportunity for some glory now.
The saffas will be looking to overtake us in the head to head record, and if we keep this up the Aussies will fancy themselves a chance of taking the Bled. Are we playing the Welsh or the Scots this year? The Italians might even dare to dream
@canefan said in All Blacks 2024:
@Crazy-Horse said in All Blacks 2024:
@canefan said in All Blacks 2024:
@reprobate said in All Blacks 2024:
@nzzp said in All Blacks 2024:
Just for context on Foster. The record we considered unacceptable and should be sacked was:
46 tests, 32 wins, 12 losses 2 draws69% winning record
It was never just about the % of wins. It was the shit style of play repeated ad nauseum, poor selections, the same mistakes repeated despite 'learnings' being every 2nd word out of every fluffybunnies mouth, and the new lows - first losses etc. Once you give those records up, you never get them back, and you lose a significant psychological edge.
No one fears us like the good old days
They see NZ as an opportunity for some glory now.
The saffas will be looking to overtake us in the head to head record, and if we keep this up the Aussies will fancy themselves a chance of taking the Bled. Are we playing the Welsh or the Scots this year? The Italians might even dare to dream
that'll take a while. We lead by 22 matches at the moment.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_rugby_union_matches_between_New_Zealand_and_South_Africa
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@reprobate said in All Blacks 2024:
@nzzp said in All Blacks 2024:
Just for context on Foster. The record we considered unacceptable and should be sacked was:
46 tests, 32 wins, 12 losses 2 draws69% winning record
It was never just about the % of wins. It was the shit style of play repeated ad nauseum, poor selections, the same mistakes repeated despite 'learnings' being every 2nd word out of every fluffybunnies mouth, and the new lows - first losses etc. Once you give those records up, you never get them back, and you lose a significant psychological edge.
No one fears us like the good old days
@canefan said in All Blacks 2024:
@reprobate said in All Blacks 2024:
@nzzp said in All Blacks 2024:
Just for context on Foster. The record we considered unacceptable and should be sacked was:
46 tests, 32 wins, 12 losses 2 draws69% winning record
It was never just about the % of wins. It was the shit style of play repeated ad nauseum, poor selections, the same mistakes repeated despite 'learnings' being every 2nd word out of every fluffybunnies mouth, and the new lows - first losses etc. Once you give those records up, you never get them back, and you lose a significant psychological edge.
No one fears us like the good old days
I’m not sure if “aura” has ever been mentioned on here but I’d dare say it’s gone now.
Is Stephen Jones still writing or has he retired ? I’d love to hear his views on it.
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@canefan said in All Blacks 2024:
@reprobate said in All Blacks 2024:
@nzzp said in All Blacks 2024:
Just for context on Foster. The record we considered unacceptable and should be sacked was:
46 tests, 32 wins, 12 losses 2 draws69% winning record
It was never just about the % of wins. It was the shit style of play repeated ad nauseum, poor selections, the same mistakes repeated despite 'learnings' being every 2nd word out of every fluffybunnies mouth, and the new lows - first losses etc. Once you give those records up, you never get them back, and you lose a significant psychological edge.
No one fears us like the good old days
I’m not sure if “aura” has ever been mentioned on here but I’d dare say it’s gone now.
Is Stephen Jones still writing or has he retired ? I’d love to hear his views on it.
@MN5 said in All Blacks 2024:
@canefan said in All Blacks 2024:
@reprobate said in All Blacks 2024:
@nzzp said in All Blacks 2024:
Just for context on Foster. The record we considered unacceptable and should be sacked was:
46 tests, 32 wins, 12 losses 2 draws69% winning record
It was never just about the % of wins. It was the shit style of play repeated ad nauseum, poor selections, the same mistakes repeated despite 'learnings' being every 2nd word out of every fluffybunnies mouth, and the new lows - first losses etc. Once you give those records up, you never get them back, and you lose a significant psychological edge.
No one fears us like the good old days
I’m not sure if “aura” has ever been mentioned on here but I’d dare say it’s gone now.
Is Stephen Jones still writing or has he retired ? I’d love to hear his views on it.
We still had it after 2015. Went into decline around 2019 but people still believed in it. Since then the slide has been rapid, although we showed what we could do in the RWC23 SF vs Ireland. And if Jordie or Rickie make one of those kicks we talk about our RWC23 shorthanded win as the most improbable and one of the greatest finals wins ever
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@MN5 said in All Blacks 2024:
@canefan said in All Blacks 2024:
@reprobate said in All Blacks 2024:
@nzzp said in All Blacks 2024:
Just for context on Foster. The record we considered unacceptable and should be sacked was:
46 tests, 32 wins, 12 losses 2 draws69% winning record
It was never just about the % of wins. It was the shit style of play repeated ad nauseum, poor selections, the same mistakes repeated despite 'learnings' being every 2nd word out of every fluffybunnies mouth, and the new lows - first losses etc. Once you give those records up, you never get them back, and you lose a significant psychological edge.
No one fears us like the good old days
I’m not sure if “aura” has ever been mentioned on here but I’d dare say it’s gone now.
Is Stephen Jones still writing or has he retired ? I’d love to hear his views on it.
We still had it after 2015. Went into decline around 2019 but people still believed in it. Since then the slide has been rapid, although we showed what we could do in the RWC23 SF vs Ireland. And if Jordie or Rickie make one of those kicks we talk about our RWC23 shorthanded win as the most improbable and one of the greatest finals wins ever
@canefan said in All Blacks 2024:
@MN5 said in All Blacks 2024:
@canefan said in All Blacks 2024:
@reprobate said in All Blacks 2024:
@nzzp said in All Blacks 2024:
Just for context on Foster. The record we considered unacceptable and should be sacked was:
46 tests, 32 wins, 12 losses 2 draws69% winning record
It was never just about the % of wins. It was the shit style of play repeated ad nauseum, poor selections, the same mistakes repeated despite 'learnings' being every 2nd word out of every fluffybunnies mouth, and the new lows - first losses etc. Once you give those records up, you never get them back, and you lose a significant psychological edge.
No one fears us like the good old days
I’m not sure if “aura” has ever been mentioned on here but I’d dare say it’s gone now.
Is Stephen Jones still writing or has he retired ? I’d love to hear his views on it.
We still had it after 2015. Went into decline around 2019 but people still believed in it. Since then the slide has been rapid, although we showed what we could do in the RWC23 SF vs Ireland. And if Jordie or Rickie make one of those kicks we talk about our RWC23 shorthanded win as the most improbable and one of the greatest finals wins ever
Yeah I think that’s why we don’t give up hope entirely, we weren’t that far off last year and I think the players lost can be replaced but might take a couple of seasons , but I suspect the periods of complete dominance might be over .
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@canefan said in All Blacks 2024:
@MN5 said in All Blacks 2024:
@canefan said in All Blacks 2024:
@reprobate said in All Blacks 2024:
@nzzp said in All Blacks 2024:
Just for context on Foster. The record we considered unacceptable and should be sacked was:
46 tests, 32 wins, 12 losses 2 draws69% winning record
It was never just about the % of wins. It was the shit style of play repeated ad nauseum, poor selections, the same mistakes repeated despite 'learnings' being every 2nd word out of every fluffybunnies mouth, and the new lows - first losses etc. Once you give those records up, you never get them back, and you lose a significant psychological edge.
No one fears us like the good old days
I’m not sure if “aura” has ever been mentioned on here but I’d dare say it’s gone now.
Is Stephen Jones still writing or has he retired ? I’d love to hear his views on it.
We still had it after 2015. Went into decline around 2019 but people still believed in it. Since then the slide has been rapid, although we showed what we could do in the RWC23 SF vs Ireland. And if Jordie or Rickie make one of those kicks we talk about our RWC23 shorthanded win as the most improbable and one of the greatest finals wins ever
Yeah I think that’s why we don’t give up hope entirely, we weren’t that far off last year and I think the players lost can be replaced but might take a couple of seasons , but I suspect the periods of complete dominance might be over .
@kiwiinmelb said in All Blacks 2024:
@canefan said in All Blacks 2024:
@MN5 said in All Blacks 2024:
@canefan said in All Blacks 2024:
@reprobate said in All Blacks 2024:
@nzzp said in All Blacks 2024:
Just for context on Foster. The record we considered unacceptable and should be sacked was:
46 tests, 32 wins, 12 losses 2 draws69% winning record
It was never just about the % of wins. It was the shit style of play repeated ad nauseum, poor selections, the same mistakes repeated despite 'learnings' being every 2nd word out of every fluffybunnies mouth, and the new lows - first losses etc. Once you give those records up, you never get them back, and you lose a significant psychological edge.
No one fears us like the good old days
I’m not sure if “aura” has ever been mentioned on here but I’d dare say it’s gone now.
Is Stephen Jones still writing or has he retired ? I’d love to hear his views on it.
We still had it after 2015. Went into decline around 2019 but people still believed in it. Since then the slide has been rapid, although we showed what we could do in the RWC23 SF vs Ireland. And if Jordie or Rickie make one of those kicks we talk about our RWC23 shorthanded win as the most improbable and one of the greatest finals wins ever
Yeah I think that’s why we don’t give up hope entirely, we weren’t that far off last year and I think the players lost can be replaced but might take a couple of seasons , but I suspect the periods of complete dominance might be over .
Absolutely. Someone brought up the U20s before. We haven't dominated there for a long time. I believe France in particular is pouring huge resources into getting hold of players from all over into their youth setup, and these players will form the backbone of the senior side for years to come. Similar in the UK. As the cliche says, there are no easy wins in tier 1 test rugby right now
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Are any of the competitions below test level as good or better than they were 10 - 20 years ago? The gap between the lower levels and international has never been wider in NZ.
School rugby - ?? our colts regularly get steam rolled now
Club rugby - worse
NPC - worse
Super rugby - worse -
Are any of the competitions below test level as good or better than they were 10 - 20 years ago? The gap between the lower levels and international has never been wider in NZ.
School rugby - ?? our colts regularly get steam rolled now
Club rugby - worse
NPC - worse
Super rugby - worse@Toddy
after 20 years of fun, market forces are finally starting to come into effect
still think NZ his intrinsic advantages over just about every other country
the game played by kids in the backyard is rugby, not soccer football, as by all others
we will always have at least a small edge in individual skills and game instincts
currently this edge is easily negated by the best opponents -
@nzzp said in All Blacks 2024:
Just for context on Foster. The record we considered unacceptable and should be sacked was:
46 tests, 32 wins, 12 losses 2 draws69% winning record
It was never just about the % of wins. It was the shit style of play repeated ad nauseum, poor selections, the same mistakes repeated despite 'learnings' being every 2nd word out of every fluffybunnies mouth, and the new lows - first losses etc. Once you give those records up, you never get them back, and you lose a significant psychological edge.
@reprobate said in All Blacks 2024:
@nzzp said in All Blacks 2024:
Just for context on Foster. The record we considered unacceptable and should be sacked was:
46 tests, 32 wins, 12 losses 2 draws69% winning record
It was never just about the % of wins. It was the shit style of play repeated ad nauseum, poor selections, the same mistakes repeated despite 'learnings' being every 2nd word out of every fluffybunnies mouth, and the new lows - first losses etc. Once you give those records up, you never get them back, and you lose a significant psychological edge.
Yeah, shipping a record number of points at home against a pretty limited Argentina is definitely a new low.
