All Blacks v Argentina II
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Hope EDG injury isn't to serious, but more than happy with Tamaiti having a start.
TJP ... WTAF ( TJP makes this a very beatable team, Reece was the better than TJP at half last week)
Wouldn't have minded seeing ALB at 12 and Reiko at 13....
Like the CC change too.
I've just scrolled through 619 posts and the match hasn't even started yet. I've no idea when I'll get around to reading the test 1 thread.
@Mattasaurus said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
Wouldn't have minded seeing ALB at 12 and Reiko at 13....
Me too. I was annoyed that JB wasn't subbed last test. I get the feeling that sometimes coaches don't want to be shown that their original selections might not be the best option so avoid making that choice.
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@Bones said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@pakman said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@ACT-Crusader said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
Lord has the physical dimensions and sure he’s still a young pup but I think they’ll persist with him at least whilst he’s fit and there are injuries to two frontline locks.
The key physical dimension he doesn't have is a weight of 125 kegs.
Whenever he's actually been able to string games together I've been impressed though, he definitely plays above his apparent weight. Whitelock seemed a bit of a lightweight to start with too.
Sam was very slight to start out and continued to put on weight in those early AB days. Retallick was the same.
Lord is only 23 so he has time to pack on more. But I don’t think we need him at 125. If he’s up around 115-118 range would be more than adequate
@ACT-Crusader said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@Bones said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@pakman said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@ACT-Crusader said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
Lord has the physical dimensions and sure he’s still a young pup but I think they’ll persist with him at least whilst he’s fit and there are injuries to two frontline locks.
The key physical dimension he doesn't have is a weight of 125 kegs.
Whenever he's actually been able to string games together I've been impressed though, he definitely plays above his apparent weight. Whitelock seemed a bit of a lightweight to start with too.
Sam was very slight to start out and continued to put on weight in those early AB days. Retallick was the same.
Lord is only 23 so he has time to pack on more. But I don’t think we need him at 125. If he’s up around 115-118 range would be more than adequate
I think Lord is 6’ 9” so, while 125 was a provocation I think 120 ought to be the target.
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@Jet said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
The backrow have all been 7's and the backline 10-15 are all historically outside backs. :face_with_tears_of_joy:
Where have the specialists gone?
Razor has said he wants people who can play multiple positions. I'm guessing he's of the belief that success comes from an ability to cover injuries.
@antipodean said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@Jet said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
The backrow have all been 7's and the backline 10-15 are all historically outside backs. :face_with_tears_of_joy:
Where have the specialists gone?
Razor has said he wants people who can play multiple positions. I'm guessing he's of the belief that success comes from an ability to cover injuries.
Perhaps he should consider that success comes from having the best players in their best positions...?
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@antipodean said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@Jet said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
The backrow have all been 7's and the backline 10-15 are all historically outside backs. :face_with_tears_of_joy:
Where have the specialists gone?
Razor has said he wants people who can play multiple positions. I'm guessing he's of the belief that success comes from an ability to cover injuries.
Perhaps he should consider that success comes from having the best players in their best positions...?
@canefan said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@antipodean said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@Jet said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
The backrow have all been 7's and the backline 10-15 are all historically outside backs. :face_with_tears_of_joy:
Where have the specialists gone?
Razor has said he wants people who can play multiple positions. I'm guessing he's of the belief that success comes from an ability to cover injuries.
Perhaps he should consider that success comes from having the best players in their best positions...?
As I alluded to in my post first test rant, I think the team can finally "move on" when Beaudy and Ardie are gone.
They are akin to latter career Cristiano Ronaldo.
Former worldies, who cause you headaches in team dynamic and team selection with their inclusion. Thats harsh on Savea granted but I think it definitely applies to Barrett.
Their deficiencies used to be masked by their propensity to pull highlight reel rabbits out of the hat. Cheat code players.
In Barretts case the candle has dimmed, and in Savea's, he always upset the balance of the backrow size wise and has a penchant of trying to do everything on his own.
The forwards and backs revolve around their selection, line out options, play making duties etc.
Read, Carter, Ben Smith
Savea, McKenzie, BarrettOne of those trio's embodies clarity of role and specialisation.
The other trio is a bunch of stray Jack Russells frolicking in a rubbish dump.
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@Kiwiwomble said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@Kirwan said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
Blackadder and TJ are the obvious problems. Managing Cane to his 100 is stupid as well.
Clarke will help massively with his work close to the ruck, and paper over a few forward problems with ball carrying. Much better in the air as well.
RI's pace will help blunt the Argies centre attack that embarassed us last week. ALB is too slow for centre, but could be a good option for 12.
Squad selection means this is as good as it's going to get.
The boks are going to demolish this group. Look at what happened in the last quarter when the pressure came on. Imagine 80mins of that. Fun.
sounds about right, its the original squad selection thats resulted in a few of these questionable decisions
it's an interesting comment. If you look at the team, there is an incredible amount of continuity from 2023
The front row group remains unchanged baring the loss of Sami T to injury.
Locks had last years 4th in line promoted, and Patty T who was constantly around the squad. Darry is an injury enforced replacement who looks like he might turn in to a find.
The loosies are super similar, with squaddie EB promoted for the departed SF. Cane and DP have swapped spots.
Halfback probably the greatest change, with a retirement, and injury and a justified dropping resulting in 3 new faces (one a retread)
DMac was basically the back up 10 promoted for a departure.
11-15 all the same. Even ALB on the bench. Telea still in the 23.This is the same AB team as last year where possible. And there is enough circumstantial evidence to suggest if last year's 10 and 6 were available they would be playing.
Essentially, we are seeing that Joe Schmidt is a better international coach than Razor is after 4 games in Charge.
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@canefan said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@antipodean said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@Jet said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
The backrow have all been 7's and the backline 10-15 are all historically outside backs. :face_with_tears_of_joy:
Where have the specialists gone?
Razor has said he wants people who can play multiple positions. I'm guessing he's of the belief that success comes from an ability to cover injuries.
Perhaps he should consider that success comes from having the best players in their best positions...?
As I alluded to in my post first test rant, I think the team can finally "move on" when Beaudy and Ardie are gone.
They are akin to latter career Cristiano Ronaldo.
Former worldies, who cause you headaches in team dynamic and team selection with their inclusion. Thats harsh on Savea granted but I think it definitely applies to Barrett.
Their deficiencies used to be masked by their propensity to pull highlight reel rabbits out of the hat. Cheat code players.
In Barretts case the candle has dimmed, and in Savea's, he always upset the balance of the backrow size wise and has a penchant of trying to do everything on his own.
The forwards and backs revolve around their selection, line out options, play making duties etc.
Read, Carter, Ben Smith
Savea, McKenzie, BarrettOne of those trio's embodies clarity of role and specialisation.
The other trio is a bunch of stray Jack Russells frolicking in a rubbish dump.
Move on from guy who was voted world player of the year 4 test matches ago?
Move on from the player who saved our skin 2 tests ago?
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Move on from guy who was voted world player of the year 4 test matches ago?
Move on from the player who saved our skin 2 tests ago?
@DaGrubster said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
Move on from guy who was voted world player of the year 4 test matches ago?
Move on from the player who saved our skin 2 tests ago.
Not necessarily. But I think he should have always been a 7.
That’s why in my post I said I was being harsh on him.He can be both our best player and the team could be more balanced or functional without him at the same time.
I think both things can be true in parallel.
- Finau
- Savea
- Sotutu
Could have been a runner if Ardie had stayed at 7.
He played 6 against Ireland in the 2019 World Cup 46-14 towelling of the Irish funnily enough.
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@canefan said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@antipodean said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@Jet said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
The backrow have all been 7's and the backline 10-15 are all historically outside backs. :face_with_tears_of_joy:
Where have the specialists gone?
Razor has said he wants people who can play multiple positions. I'm guessing he's of the belief that success comes from an ability to cover injuries.
Perhaps he should consider that success comes from having the best players in their best positions...?
As I alluded to in my post first test rant, I think the team can finally "move on" when Beaudy and Ardie are gone.
They are akin to latter career Cristiano Ronaldo.
Former worldies, who cause you headaches in team dynamic and team selection with their inclusion. Thats harsh on Savea granted but I think it definitely applies to Barrett.
Their deficiencies used to be masked by their propensity to pull highlight reel rabbits out of the hat. Cheat code players.
In Barretts case the candle has dimmed, and in Savea's, he always upset the balance of the backrow size wise and has a penchant of trying to do everything on his own.
The forwards and backs revolve around their selection, line out options, play making duties etc.
Read, Carter, Ben Smith
Savea, McKenzie, BarrettOne of those trio's embodies clarity of role and specialisation.
The other trio is a bunch of stray Jack Russells frolicking in a rubbish dump.
@Jet said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
Read, Carter, Ben Smith
Savea, McKenzie, BarrettOne of those trio's embodies clarity of role and specialisation.
The other trio is a bunch of stray Jack Russells frolicking in a rubbish dump.
I'm a Ben Smith fan but in the ABs he played in at least 3 or more positions, not his fault, wasn't necessarily ideal, but doesn't help your argument.
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@Jet said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
Read, Carter, Ben Smith
Savea, McKenzie, BarrettOne of those trio's embodies clarity of role and specialisation.
The other trio is a bunch of stray Jack Russells frolicking in a rubbish dump.
I'm a Ben Smith fan but in the ABs he played in at least 3 or more positions, not his fault, wasn't necessarily ideal, but doesn't help your argument.
@nostrildamus said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@Jet said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
Read, Carter, Ben Smith
Savea, McKenzie, BarrettOne of those trio's embodies clarity of role and specialisation.
The other trio is a bunch of stray Jack Russells frolicking in a rubbish dump.
I'm a Ben Smith fan but in the ABs he played in at least 3 or more positions, not his fault, wasn't necessarily ideal, but doesn't help your argument.
Dagg.....can I throw in a Dagg?
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As a kiwi overseas you can always throw in a dagg
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@DaGrubster said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
Move on from guy who was voted world player of the year 4 test matches ago?
Move on from the player who saved our skin 2 tests ago.
Not necessarily. But I think he should have always been a 7.
That’s why in my post I said I was being harsh on him.He can be both our best player and the team could be more balanced or functional without him at the same time.
I think both things can be true in parallel.
- Finau
- Savea
- Sotutu
Could have been a runner if Ardie had stayed at 7.
He played 6 against Ireland in the 2019 World Cup 46-14 towelling of the Irish funnily enough.
@Jet said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@DaGrubster said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
Move on from guy who was voted world player of the year 4 test matches ago?
Move on from the player who saved our skin 2 tests ago.
Not necessarily. But I think he should have always been a 7.
That’s why in my post I said I was being harsh on him.He can be both our best player and the team could be more balanced or functional without him at the same time.
I think both things can be true in parallel.
- Finau
- Savea
- Sotutu
Could have been a runner if Ardie had stayed at 7.
He played 6 against Ireland in the 2019 World Cup 46-14 towelling of the Irish funnily enough.
Funnily enough Ardie was never a good enough 7 to win World player of the year, so perhaps his best position ie really 8?
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@DaGrubster said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
Move on from guy who was voted world player of the year 4 test matches ago?
Move on from the player who saved our skin 2 tests ago.
Not necessarily. But I think he should have always been a 7.
That’s why in my post I said I was being harsh on him.He can be both our best player and the team could be more balanced or functional without him at the same time.
I think both things can be true in parallel.
- Finau
- Savea
- Sotutu
Could have been a runner if Ardie had stayed at 7.
He played 6 against Ireland in the 2019 World Cup 46-14 towelling of the Irish funnily enough.
I like that backrow.
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Just been wondering this week about coaching group etc and who is reponsible or takes responsibility?
After halftime Jase Ryan on TV named Reece as a player doing a dumb thing that was hurting ABs (no mention of forwards etc?)-Forward coach
Hansen next day made mention that forwards weren't giving TJ decent ball behind ruck etc.- Inside back coach
And after game Razor just said they weren't doing what they were training -head coach
Almost like everyone saying, it's not my fault isn't it??Taking the piss a bit fellas, but have been having a bit of a chuckle about it all week!
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Well Rieko Ioane and Caleb Clarke are better athletes than all of the SA backs.
I'm starting to run out of patience with Mckenzie. I was a fan but he's really struggled in a number of facets at 10.
@brodean said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
Well Rieko Ioane and Caleb Clarke are better athletes than all of the SA backs.
Yeah, nah
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Well Rieko Ioane and Caleb Clarke are better athletes than all of the SA backs.
I'm starting to run out of patience with Mckenzie. I was a fan but he's really struggled in a number of facets at 10.
@brodean said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
Well Rieko Ioane and Caleb Clarke are better athletes than all of the SA backs.
I'm starting to run out of patience with Mckenzie. I was a fan but he's really struggled in a number of facets at 10.
Matfield was on about Cullen in that video.
I see Will Jordan as the closest modern day version we have. He is something to be fearful of. We need him in the backfield. Forget about comms, and playmaking. That will come with time in the saddle. We need his legs back there.
Every new test season in years gone by we unleashed a Rocokoko, a Sivivatu, an Aaron Smith. We always trusted upcoming talent and the effervescence of youth.
I think latter day Hansen, Foster and now Razor are conservative. Scared. The stakes are too high.
You could throw in a Toeava back in the day and get away with it.
They need to be bolder.
Do we have the cattle of yesteryear....no.
But its no reason to be cowards either.
Give the other teams something to worry about. Fresh problems to solve.
We are predictable.
We need Roigard at 9 and Jordan at 15 between now and next RWC based on the current playing pool. They are our points of difference.
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@brodean said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
Well Rieko Ioane and Caleb Clarke are better athletes than all of the SA backs.
Yeah, nah
