All Blacks vs Wallabies 2
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@nostrildamus said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
Yes the All Black squad is not supposed to be a training squad for fading Crusaders.
I don't give a crap about the 'fading crusaders' they are only part of the problem. Tj and BB, Cane? Two are gone at the end of the season and one is well past his best before, esp at 10. Ardie needs a rcoket and should be on the bench at most. This is a pathetic inwards looking selection of caps, not players. Razor, for all his talk, is frozen in the spotlight and unable to think beyond 'not losing'
@Machpants said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
Razor, for all his talk, is frozen in the spotlight and unable to think beyond 'not losing'
Yeah, seems that way.
Far less bold than I thought he'd be. -
The saving grace is we have a tight 5 of some ability.
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@gt12 said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
Not sure why we need Jacobson on the bench - it would seem a good test to get Finau on to hit some bodies. Clearly, he’s on the outer until he moves south.
Get off it. Finau was our starting blindside at the start of the year and was dropped because he was poor - universally agreed by everyone. You'll never guess where Jacobson comes from either...
Finau wasn't poor. He was good enough for us to win.
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Well folks, the much anticipated post is here. You can all stop with the backline predictions and start chatting about this weekends backline that you’ll see below. I was unable to get the forward pack but have heard that Tuipolotu is a real chance to be in the 23 this week.
Again, and as I usually say, a very reliable source who hasn’t led me astray yet. If it’s wrong I’ll own it.
If there are any late week updates in regards to the team, I’ll post that in this thread.
Backline for this weekend as follows.
- T.Perenara
- B.Barrett
- C.Clarke
- A. Lienart-Brown
- R.Ioane
- S.Reece
- W.Jordan
Bench
21. C.Ratima
22. D.Mckenzie
23. D.Havili@Landers92 your worcestershire is top shelf
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I don't mind that team but have to question the continued selection of Lolesio. Best of a bad bunch I guess, but I'm not convinced even that is true
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@frugby said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
@gt12 said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
@frugby said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
@Kirwan said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
@frugby said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
Fact is the ABs don't really have the cattle. There is not one player not selected this week that makes a considerable difference to this team. There is no silver bullet.
The real assessment of this team is at the end of next year, where if Razor is still showing 'Crusader bias' and the results aren't there, he'll come in for criticism.
Not in the squad, no. But there are several players that would improve things.
Nawera for Reece or Telea.
Sotutu
Any back for Havilli (I’d look at Lam)
Akira or Suafoa for Blackadder or Jacobson
Plummer to actually be usedAnd that’s just the tip of my head.
Loosies are a huge problem. Picking too many sevens, and players either out of form or not good enough.
I don't entirely disagree with most of that, but I am not convinced that those players improve things.
I would pay that potentially Sotutu could be a good impact sub, but lets not forget he has been tried and failed by the All Blacks before.
Glad you weren't selecting when Nonu or Kaino were around.
I've literally said I'd pick Sotutu. More just pointing out that there is no guarantee he is a success like some people think he would be.
just so i am clear, your argument is, that while the current guys suck, we shouldn't drop them because the replacements might suck too?
@mariner4life said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
@frugby said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
@gt12 said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
@frugby said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
@Kirwan said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
@frugby said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
Fact is the ABs don't really have the cattle. There is not one player not selected this week that makes a considerable difference to this team. There is no silver bullet.
The real assessment of this team is at the end of next year, where if Razor is still showing 'Crusader bias' and the results aren't there, he'll come in for criticism.
Not in the squad, no. But there are several players that would improve things.
Nawera for Reece or Telea.
Sotutu
Any back for Havilli (I’d look at Lam)
Akira or Suafoa for Blackadder or Jacobson
Plummer to actually be usedAnd that’s just the tip of my head.
Loosies are a huge problem. Picking too many sevens, and players either out of form or not good enough.
I don't entirely disagree with most of that, but I am not convinced that those players improve things.
I would pay that potentially Sotutu could be a good impact sub, but lets not forget he has been tried and failed by the All Blacks before.
Glad you weren't selecting when Nonu or Kaino were around.
I've literally said I'd pick Sotutu. More just pointing out that there is no guarantee he is a success like some people think he would be.
just so i am clear, your argument is, that while the current guys suck, we shouldn't drop them because the replacements might suck too?
No, my argument is that we could change them, but I don't think it will really make a difference, so I am fairly indifferent to it.
I think a lot of people think that by picking other players it will improve the All Blacks performance, but I honestly think last week's team as pretty close to the best 23 players in the country.
Certainly 7 out of 8 of that pack are. Cane v Papalii v Whoever else is negligible. Take out Reece for whoever you like, and I think most would say that is the best backline.
Aumua would miss out to Samasoni if fit, Tosi v Newell is negligible, Darry v Tuipulotu is negligible, Perenara would miss out to Roigard if fit, Beauden would be in for Plummer as an impact sub.
In other words, the only place where you could potentially change things and see real change would be the loose forwards.
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@Kirwan Of the 23 there are seven I would happily never see in an AB side again and another I would drop
Time for a 1974 style clean-out (15 debutants in a squad of 25)?
@dogmeat said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
Time for a 1974 style clean-out (15 debutants in a squad of 25)
We need a Cavaliers tour to Russia.
I'm intrigued as to whether we are going to learn anything new from this team. I would suggest not. It is quite possible that we will be shit a the beginning and finish well, as opposed to the other way around though.
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@mariner4life said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
@frugby said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
@gt12 said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
@frugby said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
@Kirwan said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
@frugby said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
Fact is the ABs don't really have the cattle. There is not one player not selected this week that makes a considerable difference to this team. There is no silver bullet.
The real assessment of this team is at the end of next year, where if Razor is still showing 'Crusader bias' and the results aren't there, he'll come in for criticism.
Not in the squad, no. But there are several players that would improve things.
Nawera for Reece or Telea.
Sotutu
Any back for Havilli (I’d look at Lam)
Akira or Suafoa for Blackadder or Jacobson
Plummer to actually be usedAnd that’s just the tip of my head.
Loosies are a huge problem. Picking too many sevens, and players either out of form or not good enough.
I don't entirely disagree with most of that, but I am not convinced that those players improve things.
I would pay that potentially Sotutu could be a good impact sub, but lets not forget he has been tried and failed by the All Blacks before.
Glad you weren't selecting when Nonu or Kaino were around.
I've literally said I'd pick Sotutu. More just pointing out that there is no guarantee he is a success like some people think he would be.
just so i am clear, your argument is, that while the current guys suck, we shouldn't drop them because the replacements might suck too?
No, my argument is that we could change them, but I don't think it will really make a difference, so I am fairly indifferent to it.
I think a lot of people think that by picking other players it will improve the All Blacks performance, but I honestly think last week's team as pretty close to the best 23 players in the country.
Certainly 7 out of 8 of that pack are. Cane v Papalii v Whoever else is negligible. Take out Reece for whoever you like, and I think most would say that is the best backline.
Aumua would miss out to Samasoni if fit, Tosi v Newell is negligible, Darry v Tuipulotu is negligible, Perenara would miss out to Roigard if fit, Beauden would be in for Plummer as an impact sub.
In other words, the only place where you could potentially change things and see real change would be the loose forwards.
@frugby said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
@frugby said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
@gt12 said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
@frugby said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
@Kirwan said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
@frugby said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
Fact is the ABs don't really have the cattle. There is not one player not selected this week that makes a considerable difference to this team. There is no silver bullet.
The real assessment of this team is at the end of next year, where if Razor is still showing 'Crusader bias' and the results aren't there, he'll come in for criticism.
Not in the squad, no. But there are several players that would improve things.
Nawera for Reece or Telea.
Sotutu
Any back for Havilli (I’d look at Lam)
Akira or Suafoa for Blackadder or Jacobson
Plummer to actually be usedAnd that’s just the tip of my head.
Loosies are a huge problem. Picking too many sevens, and players either out of form or not good enough.
I don't entirely disagree with most of that, but I am not convinced that those players improve things.
I would pay that potentially Sotutu could be a good impact sub, but lets not forget he has been tried and failed by the All Blacks before.
Glad you weren't selecting when Nonu or Kaino were around.
I've literally said I'd pick Sotutu. More just pointing out that there is no guarantee he is a success like some people think he would be.
just so i am clear, your argument is, that while the current guys suck, we shouldn't drop them because the replacements might suck too?
No, my argument is that we could change them, but I don't think it will really make a difference, so I am fairly indifferent to it.
I think a lot of people think that by picking other players it will improve the All Blacks performance, but I honestly think last week's team as pretty close to the best 23 players in the country.
Certainly 7 out of 8 of that pack are. Cane v Papalii v Whoever else is negligible. Take out Reece for whoever you like, and I think most would say that is the best backline.
Aumua would miss out to Samasoni if fit, Tosi v Newell is negligible, Darry v Tuipulotu is negligible, Perenara would miss out to Roigard if fit, Beauden would be in for Plummer as an impact sub.
In other words, the only place where you could potentially change things and see real change would be the loose forwards.
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@No-Quarter said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
All I will say is, thanks to terrible squad selections and Crusader bias, the 23 we are putting out this year is nowhere near as strong as it could be
Agree Havili shouldn’t be there but isn’t there more of a Chiefs bias in that 23?
@Nevorian said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
@No-Quarter said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
All I will say is, thanks to terrible squad selections and Crusader bias, the 23 we are putting out this year is nowhere near as strong as it could be
Agree Havili shouldn’t be there but isn’t there more of a Chiefs bias in that 23?
Bias only applies if the players concerned get picked but don't deserve their spot....
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@frugby said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
@frugby said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
@gt12 said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
@frugby said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
@Kirwan said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
@frugby said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
Fact is the ABs don't really have the cattle. There is not one player not selected this week that makes a considerable difference to this team. There is no silver bullet.
The real assessment of this team is at the end of next year, where if Razor is still showing 'Crusader bias' and the results aren't there, he'll come in for criticism.
Not in the squad, no. But there are several players that would improve things.
Nawera for Reece or Telea.
Sotutu
Any back for Havilli (I’d look at Lam)
Akira or Suafoa for Blackadder or Jacobson
Plummer to actually be usedAnd that’s just the tip of my head.
Loosies are a huge problem. Picking too many sevens, and players either out of form or not good enough.
I don't entirely disagree with most of that, but I am not convinced that those players improve things.
I would pay that potentially Sotutu could be a good impact sub, but lets not forget he has been tried and failed by the All Blacks before.
Glad you weren't selecting when Nonu or Kaino were around.
I've literally said I'd pick Sotutu. More just pointing out that there is no guarantee he is a success like some people think he would be.
just so i am clear, your argument is, that while the current guys suck, we shouldn't drop them because the replacements might suck too?
No, my argument is that we could change them, but I don't think it will really make a difference, so I am fairly indifferent to it.
I think a lot of people think that by picking other players it will improve the All Blacks performance, but I honestly think last week's team as pretty close to the best 23 players in the country.
Certainly 7 out of 8 of that pack are. Cane v Papalii v Whoever else is negligible. Take out Reece for whoever you like, and I think most would say that is the best backline.
Aumua would miss out to Samasoni if fit, Tosi v Newell is negligible, Darry v Tuipulotu is negligible, Perenara would miss out to Roigard if fit, Beauden would be in for Plummer as an impact sub.
In other words, the only place where you could potentially change things and see real change would be the loose forwards.
@gt12 said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
@frugby said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
@frugby said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
@gt12 said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
@frugby said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
@Kirwan said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
@frugby said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
Fact is the ABs don't really have the cattle. There is not one player not selected this week that makes a considerable difference to this team. There is no silver bullet.
The real assessment of this team is at the end of next year, where if Razor is still showing 'Crusader bias' and the results aren't there, he'll come in for criticism.
Not in the squad, no. But there are several players that would improve things.
Nawera for Reece or Telea.
Sotutu
Any back for Havilli (I’d look at Lam)
Akira or Suafoa for Blackadder or Jacobson
Plummer to actually be usedAnd that’s just the tip of my head.
Loosies are a huge problem. Picking too many sevens, and players either out of form or not good enough.
I don't entirely disagree with most of that, but I am not convinced that those players improve things.
I would pay that potentially Sotutu could be a good impact sub, but lets not forget he has been tried and failed by the All Blacks before.
Glad you weren't selecting when Nonu or Kaino were around.
I've literally said I'd pick Sotutu. More just pointing out that there is no guarantee he is a success like some people think he would be.
just so i am clear, your argument is, that while the current guys suck, we shouldn't drop them because the replacements might suck too?
No, my argument is that we could change them, but I don't think it will really make a difference, so I am fairly indifferent to it.
I think a lot of people think that by picking other players it will improve the All Blacks performance, but I honestly think last week's team as pretty close to the best 23 players in the country.
Certainly 7 out of 8 of that pack are. Cane v Papalii v Whoever else is negligible. Take out Reece for whoever you like, and I think most would say that is the best backline.
Aumua would miss out to Samasoni if fit, Tosi v Newell is negligible, Darry v Tuipulotu is negligible, Perenara would miss out to Roigard if fit, Beauden would be in for Plummer as an impact sub.
In other words, the only place where you could potentially change things and see real change would be the loose forwards.
That's one of my favourite gifs. Nice to have a little joy on this thread for one moment at least
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@reprobate said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
Fucking BB at 10 and TJ at 9. What is this 2014?
Should be DMac at 9 and TJP at 10 to really troll people
@nzzp said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
@reprobate said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
Fucking BB at 10 and TJ at 9. What is this 2014?
Should be DMac at 9 and TJP at 10 to really troll people
The halfback passing might improve!
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@dogmeat said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
Time for a 1974 style clean-out (15 debutants in a squad of 25)
We need a Cavaliers tour to Russia.
I'm intrigued as to whether we are going to learn anything new from this team. I would suggest not. It is quite possible that we will be shit a the beginning and finish well, as opposed to the other way around though.
@Snowy said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
@dogmeat said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
Time for a 1974 style clean-out (15 debutants in a squad of 25)
We need a Cavaliers tour to Russia.
I'm intrigued as to whether we are going to learn anything new from this team. I would suggest not. It is quite possible that we will be shit a the beginning and finish well, as opposed to the other way around though.
Learn nothing. Nada. Except perhaps more evidence that Razor is not the droid we're looking for
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Having minimal backup Ist five cover after DMac for the rest of the year is a risk.
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Having minimal backup Ist five cover after DMac for the rest of the year is a risk.
@BerniesCorner said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
Having minimal backup Ist five cover after DMac for the rest of the year is a risk.
I'd have kept DMac on. He's your future 10, he's playing bloody well (mostly) - and BB is a dead end.
What the hell kind of message are you sending to him by dropping him? Do you think he'll suddenly play better? You want him creating chaos and throwing those passes, not going to ground with the ball.
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Yep this match is kinda a send off. Not the ruthless selectorial process we have seen historically.
They should've trusted the young fullas more this year and given game time. -
Yep this match is kinda a send off. Not the ruthless selectorial process we have seen historically.
They should've trusted the young fullas more this year and given game time.@BerniesCorner said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
Yep this match is kinda a send off. Not the ruthless selectorial process we have seen historically.
They should've trusted the young fullas more this year and given game time.I can't imagine Fred Allen giving players a send off other than "you're bloody useless" if they asked why they weren't selected.
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No time for sentimentality when our form is bad, so;
Cane
Perenara
Reece
Aumua
Jacobsen
Havili
Barrett BNow saying I'd be happy not seeing them in Black again isn't quite the same as advocating none of them should play this weekend. That would be too disruptive, but I wouldn't be taking any of them to the NH. They're either past it or haven't got it. Patrick T fits those criteria too in an ideal world.
@dogmeat said in All Blacks vs Wallabies 2:
No time for sentimentality when our form is bad, so;
Cane
Perenara
Reece
Aumua
Jacobsen
Havili
Barrett BNow saying I'd be happy not seeing them in Black again isn't quite the same as advocating none of them should play this weekend. That would be too disruptive, but I wouldn't be taking any of them to the NH. They're either past it or haven't got it. Patrick T fits those criteria too in an ideal world.
You must have some time for sentimentality - otherwise how is Ardie not on your list?
