ABs v Scotland
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@rocky-rockbottom I'm all for the game being more competitive, but through other teams catching up, not us dropping back (I know that sounds arrogant, but we have been poor this year at parts of the game we usually dominate - silky skills, counter attack, off loads, handling, last 20)
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@crash said in ABs v Scotland:
Can't whinge about the ref. Thought he was ok overall....now Australia on the other hand...
> Cane's YC was pretty cynical.
Just wish we would stop doing the dumb stuff. Naholo has a history of tackling players in mid-air. He should be taken aside and given a coaching clinic. Why does he persist in doing this shit? Shag have a word FFS.On the replay it actually looked like Cane got pushed over by another AB and then sealing off the ball. Crockett's was stupid, really stupid, the 9 hadn't even really done that stupid NH roll the ball thing they do that refs let them get away with.
@nepia looked more like Squire that did more pushing on Cane, Crockett kinda leaned on him...but the Crockett card is an odd one, he was carded for playing the 9 without the ball, the 9 had his hands on the ball.
Whether the 9'is allowed time to roll it, Polish it or whatever, the call he played the 9 without the ball was blatantly wrong.
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That interception by Hogg when we were putting in the final pass to dot down under the post. Whoever was that support runner (Cane?) give yourself an uppercut now, and next time give your self 2m of depth.
Unnecessarily flat supporting line butchers another try.
@rapido said in ABs v Scotland:
That interception by Hogg when we were putting in the final pass to dot down under the post. Whoever was that support runner (Cane?) give yourself an uppercut now, and next time give your self 2m of depth.
Unnecessarily flat supporting line butchers another try.
The flat supporting line has been a problem for a number of years. TJ is the worst at it and I think a try was disallowed against Wales last year at Eden Park because he was so flat that the pass was forced to be thrown forward. The same thing could have happened in Dunedin this year with Read's final pass to him. I don't know why the coaches are not fixing this fairly basic issue.
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I think I am ready to abandon Naholo. By my count he gave away 3 needless and stupid PK's for almost no reason whatsoever.
He has talent to burn, but he doesn't have it in the top 6 inches. Unless he can sort his brainfarts out he's not of All Black standard.
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@booboo
It would take a lot longer to answer properly than half past two on a Sunday morning allows.
The short answer is that using "Jock" isn't cool"@talisker said in ABs v Scotland:
@booboo
It would take a lot longer to answer properly than half past two on a Sunday morning allows.
The short answer is that using "Jock" isn't cool "Rolled gold rubbish, talisker, you are making it up.
The term is as old as "Pom" and maybe older, it has been around as long as "Kiwi" and "Mick" (for Catholics) and "Frog".
Do keep updating your records, though, on raaaacist, hurty terminology. It must be a fascinating obsession to be sure, it will keep you indoors and at a good distance from normal society.
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@antipodean said in ABs v Scotland:
When does Crockett finally retire? I'm sick of that muppet. Cane's YC was because Crockett shoved him over the ruck.
His own yellow was stupid, but Crockett had nothing to do with Cane's YC. I just watched it again and if you want to blame anyone else but Cane for his YC, then it's Liam Squire.
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@stargazer Jebus man, just give up the denial! That's two Sundays in a row I've logged in and the first post(s) are yourself white knighting Crusaders/Canterbury players.
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@stargazer watch what? And what is nonsense?
@bones The nonsense is your comment that I'm white knighting Crusaders/Canterbury players. I don't give a rat's arse about Crockett; I was just stating a fact in response to an incorrect comment from @antipodean saying that Cane got yellow carded because Crockett shoved him over the ruck. My response was that that was wrong; Crockett was there but he wasn't to blame for Cane's YC. I said that if there's anyone else to blame for that YC but Cane himself, it would be Squire. If you want to check that fact, you can watch the highlights video at around the 60 minutes 50 seconds mark. If antipodean had made the comment about Fifita or Ofa or whoever, I'd have pointed out the facts the same way.
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@bones The nonsense is your comment that I'm white knighting Crusaders/Canterbury players. I don't give a rat's arse about Crockett; I was just stating a fact in response to an incorrect comment from @antipodean saying that Cane got yellow carded because Crockett shoved him over the ruck. My response was that that was wrong; Crockett was there but he wasn't to blame for Cane's YC. I said that if there's anyone else to blame for that YC but Cane himself, it would be Squire. If you want to check that fact, you can watch the highlights video at around the 60 minutes 50 seconds mark. If antipodean had made the comment about Fifita or Ofa or whoever, I'd have pointed out the facts the same way.
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@stargazer oh I think you're confused - I'm not disputing any facts fella. Just pointing out the fact you're often first on the scene if thems Chch lads are being criticised!
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@bones I have nothing with Chch or Chch lads. Have been there twice in my life. Maybe you're just a bit sensitive about the Chch lads yourself? In a negative way?
@stargazer Yes, that must be exactly it. I am so sensitive at always seeing @Stargazer have to defend and promote those poor lads.
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That’s a good Scotland team. It’s not often that I’d select any members for the ABs but I’d definitely have one or two of them in black. Bad handling was really the only reason why they didn’t win that.
Which really tells the story this year. It’s just a shitty AB team.
Firstly, I’m not convinced it’s very well led - Barrett should not be vice captain and is just struggling to push us around the field. Secondly, there is a lack of key personal skills - clearing out arriving players and height when running with the ball are two that I noticed, plus later on pushing flat (forward) passes, which is just fucking terrible, and of course catching and holding the ball. Between forward passes and bad catching we took our foot off their throat two to three times in the first half. Thirdly, decision making - a clear pattern of shitty option taking and/or shitty execution. A good example is about 12 minutes in when we break them down with a nice midfield break, followed by Barrett choosing to grub ahead directly into the only Scottish player covering - who goes on to take exactly the right option by kicking to the corner.
Much of the problem is with personnel - either because of new or developing combinations. However, much of it is also self inflicted - there appears to be no effort to get any territory, and the kicking game is fucking terrible - compared to where we were two years ago. That’s mainly on Barrett, but also Smith, and we miss another option (McKenzie doesn’t seem to help at all, which is fucking strange given that’s one of his few strengths). I wonder whether Nonu had been kicking more than I thought, as it could be that we are not only missing his option taking, but even his kicking. Well played to SBW with better option taking though, especially as he seems to have worked out when to use the grubber.
I have no idea how Naholo wasn’t carded. That’s a YC all day and he has form for that too. For every special thing he does, he does two fuckups. I don’t see his Value.
Good news: Cane (I though unlucky to be carded), Hames, Whitelock, SBW (why was he subbed?) and of course Ioane - he was outstanding. Our scrum - except for the one scrum where we bet on it and fucked it up. Our starting line out - except when we throw to the back, where the throwing needs work. The midfield is slowly getting better, but I still don’t like the combination with Barrett.
Mixed bags: Taylor great at times but also with one bad throw and a fucked up try due to his late pass, Fifita - some reasonable runs but also a lack of accuracy, such as his dropped ball off a kick off, and not finishing the tackle which led to the first Scot try. McKenzie who did well to get his try, and was great with a super accurate pass for Barrett’s try - but really doesn’t offer much from the back and chooses bad options from kick receipts.
Getting worse: Squire, with the classic Fifita hungus right when we had them broken down, Crockett (For fucks sake, that was fucking terrible), Harris, and Naholo, who I don’t think did one good thing all night.
Funnily enough, had we nailed passing, catching, cleaning out etc I think we could have won by 20 or more but with all the little inaccuracies plus the lack of territory we end conceding too many points, despite pretty good scrambling defense (last 4 minutes aside).
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@stargazer Yes, that must be exactly it. I am so sensitive at always seeing @Stargazer have to defend and promote those poor lads.
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Having now woken with a head full of expired single malt I will try and add a little to the conversation.
I had some refs ears things (kindly donated by the gent of scots ancestry next to me) and the Naholo decision was interesting. At first they were heading for a card but on the last replay as the ref was confirming the card decision they seemed to switch to a private channel as the ears went quiet. Then they explained the mitigating circumstances. I suspect that to speed up the decision the TMO said YC is a bit rough on the player considering he was unsighted by a lazy runner.
Cane's YC was deliberate and cynical. He straight out took one for the team. He was on his feet and jogging off as soon as the whistle went without even listening to the ref. He knew exactly what he did and why. -
That’s a good Scotland team. It’s not often that I’d select any members for the ABs but I’d definitely have one or two of them in black. Bad handling was really the only reason why they didn’t win that.
Which really tells the story this year. It’s just a shitty AB team.
Firstly, I’m not convinced it’s very well led - Barrett should not be vice captain and is just struggling to push us around the field. Secondly, there is a lack of key personal skills - clearing out arriving players and height when running with the ball are two that I noticed, plus later on pushing flat (forward) passes, which is just fucking terrible, and of course catching and holding the ball. Between forward passes and bad catching we took our foot off their throat two to three times in the first half. Thirdly, decision making - a clear pattern of shitty option taking and/or shitty execution. A good example is about 12 minutes in when we break them down with a nice midfield break, followed by Barrett choosing to grub ahead directly into the only Scottish player covering - who goes on to take exactly the right option by kicking to the corner.
Much of the problem is with personnel - either because of new or developing combinations. However, much of it is also self inflicted - there appears to be no effort to get any territory, and the kicking game is fucking terrible - compared to where we were two years ago. That’s mainly on Barrett, but also Smith, and we miss another option (McKenzie doesn’t seem to help at all, which is fucking strange given that’s one of his few strengths). I wonder whether Nonu had been kicking more than I thought, as it could be that we are not only missing his option taking, but even his kicking. Well played to SBW with better option taking though, especially as he seems to have worked out when to use the grubber.
I have no idea how Naholo wasn’t carded. That’s a YC all day and he has form for that too. For every special thing he does, he does two fuckups. I don’t see his Value.
Good news: Cane (I though unlucky to be carded), Hames, Whitelock, SBW (why was he subbed?) and of course Ioane - he was outstanding. Our scrum - except for the one scrum where we bet on it and fucked it up. Our starting line out - except when we throw to the back, where the throwing needs work. The midfield is slowly getting better, but I still don’t like the combination with Barrett.
Mixed bags: Taylor great at times but also with one bad throw and a fucked up try due to his late pass, Fifita - some reasonable runs but also a lack of accuracy, such as his dropped ball off a kick off, and not finishing the tackle which led to the first Scot try. McKenzie who did well to get his try, and was great with a super accurate pass for Barrett’s try - but really doesn’t offer much from the back and chooses bad options from kick receipts.
Getting worse: Squire, with the classic Fifita hungus right when we had them broken down, Crockett (For fucks sake, that was fucking terrible), Harris, and Naholo, who I don’t think did one good thing all night.
Funnily enough, had we nailed passing, catching, cleaning out etc I think we could have won by 20 or more but with all the little inaccuracies plus the lack of territory we end conceding too many points, despite pretty good scrambling defense (last 4 minutes aside).
@gt12 It's all bit of a repeating theme this year, isn't it? I can't help but thinking that there's something in the coaching that is causing some of the (bad) option taking. Either they've run out of ideas, or they are working on some kind of brilliant scheme making everyone think we're shit, only to show the full - obvioulsy sensationally good - picture come RWC time. Not good for our collective blood pressure.
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BTW, the evening was brilliant and worth the fortune spent. The pre game build up was like a rock concert. Murrayfield itself is a great stadium for watching the game. The locals were excellent value as I expected. Not a single bad comment heard despite them probably feeling a chance had passed them by. Obviously some disagreement with the odd decision but they forgot about it quickly and got on with enjoying the game. A good friendly rugby knowledgeable crowd. Great atmosphere and they were genuinely pleased with the home team performance.
Can highly recommend coming here for a game if you get a chance. -
@gt12 It's all bit of a repeating theme this year, isn't it? I can't help but thinking that there's something in the coaching that is causing some of the (bad) option taking. Either they've run out of ideas, or they are working on some kind of brilliant scheme making everyone think we're shit, only to show the full - obvioulsy sensationally good - picture come RWC time. Not good for our collective blood pressure.
Yeah, I’m now looking at some of my comments (which I made while watching) and I think I was a bit too harsh on Barrett, who actually worked well with SBW and did some great things (try saving tackle for one), so I should have used others to make my point (although his forward pass to Crotty well fucked me off).
I had another look at Cane’s card and I think it was deserved. At first I thought he’d been pushed over, but he put himself there illegally, and deliberately I think.
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BTW, the evening was brilliant and worth the fortune spent. The pre game build up was like a rock concert. Murrayfield itself is a great stadium for watching the game. The locals were excellent value as I expected. Not a single bad comment heard despite them probably feeling a chance had passed them by. Obviously some disagreement with the odd decision but they forgot about it quickly and got on with enjoying the game. A good friendly rugby knowledgeable crowd. Great atmosphere and they were genuinely pleased with the home team performance.
Can highly recommend coming here for a game if you get a chance. -
BTW, the evening was brilliant and worth the fortune spent. The pre game build up was like a rock concert. Murrayfield itself is a great stadium for watching the game. The locals were excellent value as I expected. Not a single bad comment heard despite them probably feeling a chance had passed them by. Obviously some disagreement with the odd decision but they forgot about it quickly and got on with enjoying the game. A good friendly rugby knowledgeable crowd. Great atmosphere and they were genuinely pleased with the home team performance.
Can highly recommend coming here for a game if you get a chance.
