All Blacks Squad for France
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Yeah, but this sort of criticism is part of why we have such a winning culture. I’d hate for it to go away.
I remember a good quote from one of the AB biographies, yes you are now an All Black, now you want to be a great All Black.
Always something to improve.
@kirwan Yeah but it's all relative though. Not a lot of obvious weaknesses in that squad, but there is a substantial drop off in quality between starting tightfive and the next cabs off the rank. Trouble most of your opponents are going to have is that even if (and its a big bloody if) they can somehow get on top of your pack, they've still got to stop the Smiths, Barrett, Ioane and Naholo from creating tries out of half and quarter chances.
Taking the Lions tests as a yardstick, on their best days they're facing an average of 22 points. The Lions averaged 18 and the rest of the Rugby Championship averaged 20 points against the ABs in 2017.
Not sure I've really got a point here, except the bloody obvious one that the ABs are odds on to more or less replicate their dominance since 2010 in 2018 - even though your likely squad does feel a little weaker?
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@rapido said in All Blacks Squad for France:
I only have a complex with props and bad hair.
I guess props need to be grown-up men.
When your getting you're neck rammed back through you're ass by other 20 year-olds on a world stage .... you don't want to stand out by having plaits and beads etc ..... it sticks in the mind and forms a complex in right-thinking god-fearing folk like me.
One thing I hate at all levels is a prop with a "Man Bun".
@mikedogz said in All Blacks Squad for France:
@rapido said in All Blacks Squad for France:
I only have a complex with props and bad hair.
I guess props need to be grown-up men.
When your getting you're neck rammed back through you're ass by other 20 year-olds on a world stage .... you don't want to stand out by having plaits and beads etc ..... it sticks in the mind and forms a complex in right-thinking god-fearing folk like me.
One thing I hate at all levels is a prop with a "Man Bun".
They should all be made to go to the Waikato school of 90s lids. You coulda landed planes on those dos.
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It's probably about time I ask the same question I do every year.
What the hell does Luke Romano do to keep getting in the team?
@mn5 said in All Blacks Squad for France:
It's probably about time I ask the same question I do every year.
What the hell does Luke Romano do to keep getting in the team?
Be better than any of the other options. Patty T. is the apparent next cab off the rank, so the bar isn't set that high.
But it's an interesting question as to who else might be in contention, because it's not a bad place to look for a bolter. Who is the next best available option at each of the Franchises? Strange, Allardice, Franklin? Who at the Canes and Blues?
Pity Big Bird is injured. He's got the frame to be an excellent international option.
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@Chris-B Michael Fatialofa probably the best of the Canes locks, though not sure he fills the same role that Romano/Pat T would, and after a long injury break is yet to reach the heights he did last year (pun intended).
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@Chris-B Michael Fatialofa probably the best of the Canes locks, though not sure he fills the same role that Romano/Pat T would, and after a long injury break is yet to reach the heights he did last year (pun intended).
@no-quarter Fatialofa is off overseas. That pretty much rules him out i'd say.
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@KiwiMurph fuck! That sucks. I need to pay more attention to the exodus thread
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If Laulala is good to go I wonder if they will use Ofa as a reserve LH? It's not his best position but might be the best option available.
@bovidae said in All Blacks Squad for France:
If Laulala is good to go I wonder if they will use Ofa as a reserve LH? It's not his best position but might be the best option available.
It's quite possible, but they'd still need a third loosehead in the squad in case of injury on game day.
Tim Perry is only out with a hamstring strain so he shouldn't be out for too long. Given the paucity of other options, I expect them to pick him - but Ofa could easily sit on the bench ahead of Tim.
I'm not sure that leaning on Wyatt solves any long term problem. If Joe Moody happens to get injured then I think it's justified because you've then got the two best (and possibly three best with Moli) options injured in a position of little depth and it would be pretty scary to go into a test with Perry and Ofa as our looseheads.
But if Moody is fit then we're better off giving someone new limited minutes from the bench.
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@mn5 said in All Blacks Squad for France:
It's probably about time I ask the same question I do every year.
What the hell does Luke Romano do to keep getting in the team?
Be better than any of the other options. Patty T. is the apparent next cab off the rank, so the bar isn't set that high.
But it's an interesting question as to who else might be in contention, because it's not a bad place to look for a bolter. Who is the next best available option at each of the Franchises? Strange, Allardice, Franklin? Who at the Canes and Blues?
Pity Big Bird is injured. He's got the frame to be an excellent international option.
@chris-b
Franklin was called into the AB training squad as recently as last year so would still be in the mix. He was also selected as an injury replacement for Whitelock in 2016 and I remember Hansen saying it was because he was considered a loose lock (a like-for-like replacement). So not a comparable replacement for Romano.
A pity Hemopo isn't taller because he has all the skills.
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@mn5 said in All Blacks Squad for France:
It's probably about time I ask the same question I do every year.
What the hell does Luke Romano do to keep getting in the team?
Be better than any of the other options. Patty T. is the apparent next cab off the rank, so the bar isn't set that high.
But it's an interesting question as to who else might be in contention, because it's not a bad place to look for a bolter. Who is the next best available option at each of the Franchises? Strange, Allardice, Franklin? Who at the Canes and Blues?
Pity Big Bird is injured. He's got the frame to be an excellent international option.
@chris-b said in All Blacks Squad for France:
@mn5 said in All Blacks Squad for France:
It's probably about time I ask the same question I do every year.
What the hell does Luke Romano do to keep getting in the team?
Be better than any of the other options. Patty T. is the apparent next cab off the rank, so the bar isn't set that high.
But it's an interesting question as to who else might be in contention, because it's not a bad place to look for a bolter. Who is the next best available option at each of the Franchises? Strange, Allardice, Franklin? Who at the Canes and Blues?
Pity Big Bird is injured. He's got the frame to be an excellent international option.
I like Strange.
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@chris-b said in All Blacks Squad for France:
@mn5 said in All Blacks Squad for France:
It's probably about time I ask the same question I do every year.
What the hell does Luke Romano do to keep getting in the team?
Be better than any of the other options. Patty T. is the apparent next cab off the rank, so the bar isn't set that high.
But it's an interesting question as to who else might be in contention, because it's not a bad place to look for a bolter. Who is the next best available option at each of the Franchises? Strange, Allardice, Franklin? Who at the Canes and Blues?
Pity Big Bird is injured. He's got the frame to be an excellent international option.
I like Strange.
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@rancid-schnitzel said in All Blacks Squad for France:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks Squad for France:
I know we're talking "on paper" but could this be the weakest AB squad in a good number of years? Some of the names floating around are pretty average.
We're a Codie Taylor injury away from playing a couple of very ordinary hookers
Props are starting to go okay with the cantab boys coming back.
Two of the locks are only just test standard, and not really starting quality. If Patty T is next in line then, well, jesus...
In the loosies, i have faith in the opensides (not named Savea), but the rest are green as all fuck.3rd halfback is a cripple fight, and the 2nd guy isn't exactly a reliable test player despite years of experience.
At 10 our starter isn't that good, the anointed backup is definitely not up to standard, lets hope Mo'unga goes alright
The midfielders are either injured, or green (though ALB is having a better year this compared to last)
At least the back 3 look alright.Good post apart from the nonsense about the no. 10. Yes I would go gay for the guy but seriously man. While you can question the relevance and selection process, not very good players do not win back-to-back world player of the year awards.
He means as an out and out 10 not as a rugby player.
@kiwimurph said in All Blacks Squad for France:
@rancid-schnitzel said in All Blacks Squad for France:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks Squad for France:
I know we're talking "on paper" but could this be the weakest AB squad in a good number of years? Some of the names floating around are pretty average.
We're a Codie Taylor injury away from playing a couple of very ordinary hookers
Props are starting to go okay with the cantab boys coming back.
Two of the locks are only just test standard, and not really starting quality. If Patty T is next in line then, well, jesus...
In the loosies, i have faith in the opensides (not named Savea), but the rest are green as all fuck.3rd halfback is a cripple fight, and the 2nd guy isn't exactly a reliable test player despite years of experience.
At 10 our starter isn't that good, the anointed backup is definitely not up to standard, lets hope Mo'unga goes alright
The midfielders are either injured, or green (though ALB is having a better year this compared to last)
At least the back 3 look alright.Good post apart from the nonsense about the no. 10. Yes I would go gay for the guy but seriously man. While you can question the relevance and selection process, not very good players do not win back-to-back world player of the year awards.
He means as an out and out 10 not as a rugby player.
What is an 'out and out 10'? Is that Ronan O'Gara/ Jonny Wilkinson type player or a bloke whose individual brilliance and pace tears the opposition a new arse?
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@gt12 said in All Blacks Squad for France:
@rancid-schnitzel said in All Blacks Squad for France:
@chester-draws said in All Blacks Squad for France:
@crucial said in All Blacks Squad for France:
@mn5 said in All Blacks Squad for France:
It's probably about time I ask the same question I do every year.
What the hell does Luke Romano do to keep getting in the team?
Luke Romano is the new Todd Blackadder?
Was Todd ever a suitcase? I don't recall that -- IMO like Jon Mitchell he was a pick for a particular need at a particular time.
I'm also in the not yet that persuaded by BB at 10 (I much prefer him as a fullback). An outrageously gifted player who sadly is not good for the team when he plays 10.
Looking at all the cool things he does individually distracts from looking at how his AB backlines have been lacklustre. Thinking sides like the Rennie Chiefs and the BIL shut him down easily enough. He's won one Super series.
Our back play is far worse than under Cruden, who didn't have the athletic gifts but gave other players space and time. Carter added goal kicking, which Beauden still is erratic with.
Yeah those Chiefs really shut him down.
What a nonsense post.
In terms of this thread, you pretty much just proved @mariner4life ’s point?
Fantastic player with plenty of pace, but those highlights hardly show a first five directing play. Plenty of pace though.
That's reaching in the extreme. Yeah, despite carving up the Chiefs, his clearing kicks needed another metre. This is beyond ridiculous.
@rancid-schnitzel said in All Blacks Squad for France:
That's reaching in the extreme. Yeah, despite carving up the Chiefs, his clearing kicks needed another metre. This is beyond ridiculous.
You don't think we can find highlight reels of Cruden cutting the Hurricanes apart? For that matter I could put 15 minutes showing Ihaia West carving up sides, let alone someone like Sopoaga. Highlights reels aren't worth much as evidence.
No-one disputes his ability with ball in hand.
It's whether he can run a backline.
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@chester-draws said in All Blacks Squad for France:
As I said, individual brilliance. That is not in doubt.
But Cruden directed a better backline, both at Super and AB level.
I've watched a fair few Rennie Chiefs vs Hurricanes games. Mostly BB has been average. You can pull out exceptions. It's harder for me to pull out whole games where he's been average.
He's still only won one championship.
And lost more AB games than Cruden or DC in their longer careers.
If you mean that Cruden had better players in his backlines, then yes totally agree. Nonu and Konrad shit on the combos BB has played with.
BB replaced Cruden, not because Hansen loves him because he's a much better player and 10. You're entitled to your opinion, just as I'm entitled to say it's complete garbage.
That losses argument is straight out idiotic.
How many games did Cruden have Nonu and Smith? He played with loads of other combos than merely that one. He ran some lively Chiefs backs with some very unpromising material too.
Cruden got dropped for two reasons. Firstly, and most importantly, he was too frequently injured. Secondly, he made a fool of when he missed that flight overseas, and as much as I think he was a great player he's a lot fond of himself as a person. The "no dickheads" rule may have been an issue.
While Cruden was fit, Beauden was always behind him.
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@rancid-schnitzel said in All Blacks Squad for France:
That's reaching in the extreme. Yeah, despite carving up the Chiefs, his clearing kicks needed another metre. This is beyond ridiculous.
You don't think we can find highlight reels of Cruden cutting the Hurricanes apart? For that matter I could put 15 minutes showing Ihaia West carving up sides, let alone someone like Sopoaga. Highlights reels aren't worth much as evidence.
No-one disputes his ability with ball in hand.
It's whether he can run a backline.
@chester-draws said in All Blacks Squad for France:
@rancid-schnitzel said in All Blacks Squad for France:
That's reaching in the extreme. Yeah, despite carving up the Chiefs, his clearing kicks needed another metre. This is beyond ridiculous.
You don't think we can find highlight reels of Cruden cutting the Hurricanes apart? For that matter I could put 15 minutes showing Ihaia West carving up sides, let alone someone like Sopoaga. Highlights reels aren't worth much as evidence.
No-one disputes his ability with ball in hand.
It's whether he can run a backline.
For me the only difference between BB and DMac is error rate. Neither classically run a backline. Both are able to take destructive advantage of opposition errors and spot opportunities. You can play either at 15 or 10 to display those attributes. DMac will go looking for opportunities a bit more often than BB, who seems happy to wait for them. Because of that DMac's error rate is higher.
For traditional play neither is a 10. -
if thats what we have got , thats what we have got ,
Good coaches will design the gameplan around , making the most of your strengths ,
Still rather be in our position than anyone elses
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@rancid-schnitzel said in All Blacks Squad for France:
That's reaching in the extreme. Yeah, despite carving up the Chiefs, his clearing kicks needed another metre. This is beyond ridiculous.
You don't think we can find highlight reels of Cruden cutting the Hurricanes apart? For that matter I could put 15 minutes showing Ihaia West carving up sides, let alone someone like Sopoaga. Highlights reels aren't worth much as evidence.
No-one disputes his ability with ball in hand.
It's whether he can run a backline.
@chester-draws said in All Blacks Squad for France:
@rancid-schnitzel said in All Blacks Squad for France:
That's reaching in the extreme. Yeah, despite carving up the Chiefs, his clearing kicks needed another metre. This is beyond ridiculous.
You don't think we can find highlight reels of Cruden cutting the Hurricanes apart? For that matter I could put 15 minutes showing Ihaia West carving up sides, let alone someone like Sopoaga. Highlights reels aren't worth much as evidence.
No-one disputes his ability with ball in hand.
It's whether he can run a backline.
Your claim was that the Chiefs easily contained him. That video clearly showed your claim was a complete load of nonsense, just like the rest of your claims.
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@chris-b said in All Blacks Squad for France:
@mn5 said in All Blacks Squad for France:
It's probably about time I ask the same question I do every year.
What the hell does Luke Romano do to keep getting in the team?
Be better than any of the other options. Patty T. is the apparent next cab off the rank, so the bar isn't set that high.
But it's an interesting question as to who else might be in contention, because it's not a bad place to look for a bolter. Who is the next best available option at each of the Franchises? Strange, Allardice, Franklin? Who at the Canes and Blues?
Pity Big Bird is injured. He's got the frame to be an excellent international option.
I like Strange.
@rapido said in All Blacks Squad for France:
@chris-b said in All Blacks Squad for France:
@mn5 said in All Blacks Squad for France:
It's probably about time I ask the same question I do every year.
What the hell does Luke Romano do to keep getting in the team?
Be better than any of the other options. Patty T. is the apparent next cab off the rank, so the bar isn't set that high.
But it's an interesting question as to who else might be in contention, because it's not a bad place to look for a bolter. Who is the next best available option at each of the Franchises? Strange, Allardice, Franklin? Who at the Canes and Blues?
Pity Big Bird is injured. He's got the frame to be an excellent international option.
I like Strange.
who doesn't/didn't like a bit of Strange!
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@rapido said in All Blacks Squad for France:
I only have a complex with props and bad hair.
I guess props need to be grown-up men.
When your getting you're neck rammed back through you're ass by other 20 year-olds on a world stage .... you don't want to stand out by having plaits and beads etc ..... it sticks in the mind and forms a complex in right-thinking god-fearing folk like me.
One thing I hate at all levels is a prop with a "Man Bun".
@mikedogz said in All Blacks Squad for France:
@rapido said in All Blacks Squad for France:
I only have a complex with props and bad hair.
I guess props need to be grown-up men.
When your getting you're neck rammed back through you're ass by other 20 year-olds on a world stage .... you don't want to stand out by having plaits and beads etc ..... it sticks in the mind and forms a complex in right-thinking god-fearing folk like me.
One thing I hate at all levels is a prop with a "Man Bun".
I wondered what the Tahs loosehead thought of having the strands wrapped around his face. Not a pleasant thought!
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How many games did Cruden have Nonu and Smith? He played with loads of other combos than merely that one. He ran some lively Chiefs backs with some very unpromising material too.
Cruden got dropped for two reasons. Firstly, and most importantly, he was too frequently injured. Secondly, he made a fool of when he missed that flight overseas, and as much as I think he was a great player he's a lot fond of himself as a person. The "no dickheads" rule may have been an issue.
While Cruden was fit, Beauden was always behind him.
@chester-draws said in All Blacks Squad for France:
Cruden got dropped for two reasons. Firstly, and most importantly, he was too frequently injured. Secondly, he made a fool of when he missed that flight overseas, and as much as I think he was a great player he's a lot fond of himself as a person. The "no dickheads" rule may have been an issue.
While Cruden was fit, Beauden was always behind him.
What a load of bullshit. Cruden didn't get dropped because he was injured often or missed a plane. His form dropped off and BB kept on improving. BB was clearly the better player when he overtook Cruden.
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@chester-draws said in All Blacks Squad for France:
Cruden got dropped for two reasons. Firstly, and most importantly, he was too frequently injured. Secondly, he made a fool of when he missed that flight overseas, and as much as I think he was a great player he's a lot fond of himself as a person. The "no dickheads" rule may have been an issue.
While Cruden was fit, Beauden was always behind him.
What a load of bullshit. Cruden didn't get dropped because he was injured often or missed a plane. His form dropped off and BB kept on improving. BB was clearly the better player when he overtook Cruden.
@stargazer said in All Blacks Squad for France:
@chester-draws said in All Blacks Squad for France:
Cruden got dropped for two reasons. Firstly, and most importantly, he was too frequently injured. Secondly, he made a fool of when he missed that flight overseas, and as much as I think he was a great player he's a lot fond of himself as a person. The "no dickheads" rule may have been an issue.
While Cruden was fit, Beauden was always behind him.
What a load of bullshit. Cruden didn't get dropped because he was injured often or missed a plane. His form dropped off and BB kept on improving. BB was clearly the better player when he overtook Cruden.
Personally I'd have had Cruden inside SBW all day long. But BB inside Crotty. BB was effective as a super sub. Cruden was really an injury replacement.
I think it came down to BB having such an influence that AB selectors wanted him to get as many touches as possible.
