Black Caps v England

[Chris B.]

@Canes4life Henry seems a weak option at 4.

I reckon Kane should be batting at 4 and Young or Conway at 3.

[No Quarter]

As expected batting against the new ball under lights was extremely difficult. Kane's wicket really put England on top. Gonna need Conway to go big tomorrow (to state the blindingly obvious).

[booboo]

Damn. I saw what I took to be the stumps score of them being 3 handy something for 8.

Next I look and see they'd declared and we're f all for 3.

Poo.

Didn't realise this was a pink ball test.

[Rapido]

@Crazy-Horse said in Black Caps v England:

@LABCAT said in Black Caps v England:

@Crazy-Horse said in Black Caps v England:

@LABCAT said in Black Caps v England:

@Donsteppa said in Black Caps v England:

@Chris said in Black Caps v England:

@Donsteppa said in Black Caps v England:

@Chris said in Black Caps v England:

Just got home from morning coaching session
Catching up, A worry to see Scott Kuggeljin playing a test he is not up to test cricket,it would have been better to blood a youngster for the experience, probably would not lose a lot short term but gain long term.

It's a lose lose selection all round. Ordinarily the Outraged of Twitter are best ignored, but slightly conflicted feelings in this case, as they're being aggravated for a journeyman with no recent first class form to speak of. Maybe best to have gone with Duffy... or... arguably a bloke sitting 500m away watching via his WiFi.

I would have blooded a youngster.

Genuine question of - which one? I have no other names leaping to mind (maybe there should be). Doug Bracewell would have been ideal (gnashing of teeth from @MN5 aside )... others?

I would have picked:
https://www.espncricinfo.com/cricketers/zakary-foulkes-1202098

First class record doesn't look much yet but watching him play he looks like he has the skills to be the next Souther/Boult

Too early for the kid. Looks like he has talent but also looks like he is still trying to find out who he is as a cricketer. Batsman who bowls, bowler who bats or genuine all-rounder?

He's definitely a bowler who bats a bit, nothing else.

Was it too early for Southee, Boult, Vettori etc?

Genuine question because I don't know. Does Foulkes have any age grade pedigree? I ask because I seem to recall Southee and Boult spearheading an age grade NZ side to a handy world cup place.

The only thing I know about Foulkes is McMillan mentioning Foulkes was considered more of a batter and Canterbury were surprised by his success with the ball.

Edit @chris - wiki tells me Foulkes played in Qld during a T20 comp. Did you get to see him or hear about him?

We pulled out of the U19 world cup, for covid travel reasons, so his age cohort didn't get a national selection. So, don't know whether he would have been in that team, or not. Or, if he then would have had pedigree compared to international peers.

NZC usually don't spend any money on youth cricket, only attend tournaments where the ICC is paying the bill. So, its basically 1 tournament (plus a warm-up) every 2 years. It is all therefore 50-over cricket, only. But that is still a good gauge, tbh.

NZ haven't played a Youth Test for 15 years, since 2008 when Kane Williamson (and Neesham & Doug Bracewell) were in the team. (https://archive.nzc.nz/Events/New_Zealand_Under-19s_in_England_2008/Team_Averages.html )

Us, Windies, Zim appear to have given up on Youth Tests, that is some 'illustrious' company.
Screenshot 2023-02-17 at 11.08.33 AM

[canefan]

@Rapido said in Black Caps v England:

@Crazy-Horse said in Black Caps v England:

@LABCAT said in Black Caps v England:

@Crazy-Horse said in Black Caps v England:

@LABCAT said in Black Caps v England:

@Donsteppa said in Black Caps v England:

@Chris said in Black Caps v England:

@Donsteppa said in Black Caps v England:

@Chris said in Black Caps v England:

Just got home from morning coaching session
Catching up, A worry to see Scott Kuggeljin playing a test he is not up to test cricket,it would have been better to blood a youngster for the experience, probably would not lose a lot short term but gain long term.

It's a lose lose selection all round. Ordinarily the Outraged of Twitter are best ignored, but slightly conflicted feelings in this case, as they're being aggravated for a journeyman with no recent first class form to speak of. Maybe best to have gone with Duffy... or... arguably a bloke sitting 500m away watching via his WiFi.

I would have blooded a youngster.

Genuine question of - which one? I have no other names leaping to mind (maybe there should be). Doug Bracewell would have been ideal (gnashing of teeth from @MN5 aside )... others?

I would have picked:
https://www.espncricinfo.com/cricketers/zakary-foulkes-1202098

First class record doesn't look much yet but watching him play he looks like he has the skills to be the next Souther/Boult

Too early for the kid. Looks like he has talent but also looks like he is still trying to find out who he is as a cricketer. Batsman who bowls, bowler who bats or genuine all-rounder?

He's definitely a bowler who bats a bit, nothing else.

Was it too early for Southee, Boult, Vettori etc?

Genuine question because I don't know. Does Foulkes have any age grade pedigree? I ask because I seem to recall Southee and Boult spearheading an age grade NZ side to a handy world cup place.

The only thing I know about Foulkes is McMillan mentioning Foulkes was considered more of a batter and Canterbury were surprised by his success with the ball.

Edit @chris - wiki tells me Foulkes played in Qld during a T20 comp. Did you get to see him or hear about him?

We pulled out of the U19 world cup, for covid travel reasons, so his age cohort didn't get a national selection. So, don't know whether he would have been in that team, or not. Or, if he then would have had pedigree compared to international peers.

NZC usually don't spend any money on youth cricket, only attend tournaments where the ICC is paying the bill. So, its basically 1 tournament (plus a warm-up) every 2 years. It is all therefore 50-over cricket, only. But that is still a good gauge, tbh.

NZ haven't played a Youth Test for 15 years, since 2008 when Kane Williamson (and Neesham & Doug Bracewell) were in the team. (https://archive.nzc.nz/Events/New_Zealand_Under-19s_in_England_2008/Team_Averages.html )

Us, Windies, Zim appear to have given up on Youth Tests, that is some 'illustrious' company.
Screenshot 2023-02-17 at 11.08.33 AM

Maybe they'll give a crap after they realise we are poo, when the last of that golden generation of youngsters retires

[nzzp]

@canefan said in Black Caps v England:

@Rapido said in Black Caps v England:

@Crazy-Horse said in Black Caps v England:

@LABCAT said in Black Caps v England:

@Crazy-Horse said in Black Caps v England:

@LABCAT said in Black Caps v England:

@Donsteppa said in Black Caps v England:

@Chris said in Black Caps v England:

@Donsteppa said in Black Caps v England:

@Chris said in Black Caps v England:

Just got home from morning coaching session
Catching up, A worry to see Scott Kuggeljin playing a test he is not up to test cricket,it would have been better to blood a youngster for the experience, probably would not lose a lot short term but gain long term.

It's a lose lose selection all round. Ordinarily the Outraged of Twitter are best ignored, but slightly conflicted feelings in this case, as they're being aggravated for a journeyman with no recent first class form to speak of. Maybe best to have gone with Duffy... or... arguably a bloke sitting 500m away watching via his WiFi.

I would have blooded a youngster.

Genuine question of - which one? I have no other names leaping to mind (maybe there should be). Doug Bracewell would have been ideal (gnashing of teeth from @MN5 aside )... others?

I would have picked:
https://www.espncricinfo.com/cricketers/zakary-foulkes-1202098

First class record doesn't look much yet but watching him play he looks like he has the skills to be the next Souther/Boult

Too early for the kid. Looks like he has talent but also looks like he is still trying to find out who he is as a cricketer. Batsman who bowls, bowler who bats or genuine all-rounder?

He's definitely a bowler who bats a bit, nothing else.

Was it too early for Southee, Boult, Vettori etc?

Genuine question because I don't know. Does Foulkes have any age grade pedigree? I ask because I seem to recall Southee and Boult spearheading an age grade NZ side to a handy world cup place.

The only thing I know about Foulkes is McMillan mentioning Foulkes was considered more of a batter and Canterbury were surprised by his success with the ball.

Edit @chris - wiki tells me Foulkes played in Qld during a T20 comp. Did you get to see him or hear about him?

We pulled out of the U19 world cup, for covid travel reasons, so his age cohort didn't get a national selection. So, don't know whether he would have been in that team, or not. Or, if he then would have had pedigree compared to international peers.

NZC usually don't spend any money on youth cricket, only attend tournaments where the ICC is paying the bill. So, its basically 1 tournament (plus a warm-up) every 2 years. It is all therefore 50-over cricket, only. But that is still a good gauge, tbh.

NZ haven't played a Youth Test for 15 years, since 2008 when Kane Williamson (and Neesham & Doug Bracewell) were in the team. (https://archive.nzc.nz/Events/New_Zealand_Under-19s_in_England_2008/Team_Averages.html )

Us, Windies, Zim appear to have given up on Youth Tests, that is some 'illustrious' company.
Screenshot 2023-02-17 at 11.08.33 AM

Maybe they'll give a crap after they realise we are poo, when the last of that golden generation of youngsters retires

It'll be too late by then, sadly.

I'm reaching the conclusion I really don't think the balls are good enough quality for day/night cricket. The difference between evening sessions with new balls and normal cricket is vast. I think it's too big - whether it's us, or someone else trying to bat through.

Anyway, apparently it suits TV and crowds, so it's here to stay whether random internet people think it's a good idea or not. The commericals seem to stack up.

Outfield looks lightning quick - and batting so so much easier today.

[nzzp]

Wags! Loving it - not backing down from taking on the bouncers. Spectacular to watch; back to back 6s

[No Quarter]

We loves Wags

[No Quarter]

Lol I knew that wouldn't last, valuable knock still from the night watchman.

[nzzp]

@No-Quarter said in Black Caps v England:

Lol I knew that wouldn't lastm valuable knock still from the night watchman.

done exactly what he needed to - soaked up balls last night, scored quickly today, and was good fun to watch.

If we lost one less last night (Williamson in particular) we'd be moderately happy. We're still a long way behind right now. Going to take some good batting to drag ourselves back into this

[No Quarter]

@Chris-B said in Black Caps v England:

@Canes4life Henry seems a weak option at 4.

I reckon Kane should be batting at 4 and Young or Conway at 3.

I couldn't agree with this more. I don't know why we are exposing our best player to the new ball so much, put him at 4 and let him feast on the older ball like Smith does.

[nzzp]

@No-Quarter said in Black Caps v England:

let him feast on the older ball like Smith does.

Not sure another over will make a difference (/cycnical)

[No Quarter]

That's worth a review surely, tho probably clipping

[mariner4life]

we're getting fucking smacked here jesus

[Donsteppa]

Good hear David Gower back commentating on an England Test once more.

Past the follow on and Dev is still there at the tea break.

[Chris B.]

Be handy if we can bat another 20-odd overs scoring something close to the current partnership rate and then have at them with a new ball under the lights.

Large-ish ask of Blundell and Kuggeleijn (and Timmy), but nevertheless...

[mariner4life]

two guys bowling together, combined records of 338 tests and 1,244 wickets. that's figgen impressive

[Crucial]

We probably need to hold out until we can use the new ball as the light changes. Any runs are a bonus

[No Quarter]

Wonderful innings from Blundell. He needs to go full attack now, T20 style, as we don't want to be out there too much longer. I'd honestly be thinking about a declaration to make the most of the new ball under lights if we stay out there too long.

[nzzp]

@No-Quarter said in Black Caps v England:

Wonderful innings from Blundell. He needs to go full attack now, T20 style, as we don't want to be out there too much longer. I'd honestly be thinking about a declaration to make the most of the new ball under lights if we stay out there too long.

I think they want a few more shadows before gettin gthe ball. But this is great - knocking a few runs off; down to 51 now (on Spark. Cricinfo seem well ahead and I'm not checking that).

also - stoked for Blundell! And unlucky for Timmah