All Blacks - loosie selections in recent years
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@reprobate said in All Blacks - loosie selections in recent years:
Finau was excellent. Sititi still seems a bit quiet vs last year.
IMO Finau had a very good game. Sititi grew into it - a poor start but dominated his opposite in the end (which is true for the Chiefs loose forwards).
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@reprobate said in All Blacks - loosie selections in recent years:
Finau was excellent. Sititi still seems a bit quiet vs last year.
My memories of Sititi last year was him bursting through in the midfield, think he's actually getting a bit more stuck in, in the tight this year - as well as being more closely marked.
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Finau showed good physicality and I’m hopeful he can bring that to the black jersey.
Not sure if anyone else noticed but when he got the ball out wider with some space, maybe it’s his style but he did look to be labouring a bit / running in gumboots. Was a little strange.
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@ACT-Crusader said in All Blacks - loosie selections in recent years:
Finau showed good physicality and I’m hopeful he can bring that to the black jersey.
Not sure if anyone else noticed but when he got the ball out wider with some space, maybe it’s his style but he did look to be labouring a bit / running in gumboots. Was a little strange.
That's his style but he's actually running quite fast.
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@brodean said in All Blacks - loosie selections in recent years:
@ACT-Crusader said in All Blacks - loosie selections in recent years:
Finau showed good physicality and I’m hopeful he can bring that to the black jersey.
Not sure if anyone else noticed but when he got the ball out wider with some space, maybe it’s his style but he did look to be labouring a bit / running in gumboots. Was a little strange.
That's his style but he's actually running quite fast.
mmm…. I might have to watch again because not sure if it’s quite fast or quite fast
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@ACT-Crusader said in All Blacks - loosie selections in recent years:
@brodean said in All Blacks - loosie selections in recent years:
@ACT-Crusader said in All Blacks - loosie selections in recent years:
Finau showed good physicality and I’m hopeful he can bring that to the black jersey.
Not sure if anyone else noticed but when he got the ball out wider with some space, maybe it’s his style but he did look to be labouring a bit / running in gumboots. Was a little strange.
That's his style but he's actually running quite fast.
mmm…. I might have to watch again because not sure if it’s quite fast or quite fast
It's a lot faster than Blackadder.
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I don't mind Finau in black - just not sure that starting 3 above Savea, Sitit and Finau are the best at dominating the ruck ....especially clearing and hitting a large number of rucks in the early game.
Can see them playing ( not saying I agree with it) Blackadder and Jacobson as utilitie loose fowards.
IMO we should have Ardie locked at 7, Sitit at 8 and then a bit of horses for courses......
(I really dislike the idea of continuing to play Ardie at 8, I believe it unbalances the trio)as far as playing 6...
EB - hit loads of rucks and tackles ( yeah yeah dominant tackles argument ... but the # of tackles is impressive regardless)Jacobson another workhorse and likely to be used as cover of all 3 positions I suspect
Finau for line out option and impact in the broken play especially in the middle and wider channels.
But I also do not dislike a Parker or Howden type option in there either.
Will be interesting to see what the esteemed Ab coaches and selectors decide
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@brodean said in All Blacks - loosie selections in recent years:
Well I thought Finau mixed it up well last night. He's still good at making metres close in. The main issue I think with those three is they don't have a lot of focus on cleaning.
Yep, agree. Finau certainly has the size and power to run at forwards, probably moreso than Savea who is all about leg drive post-contact which doesn't give the same momentum as it effectively makes for slower ball, and Sititi who has quick feet pre-contact and good body position, but is not that big.
It may be that we just can't have both Sititi and Savea starting, and the best balance is one of them on the bench, with Finau and one of the EB/LJ/DP style workers to round out the trio. 6:2 bench, and you could have e.g. Finau/Dalton/Sititi then EB/Savea/Sotutu. We may not have all-time loosies at the moment, but we do have depth: a whole lot of very good ones, so good use of the bench would help us make the most of them. -
@reprobate said in All Blacks - loosie selections in recent years:
@brodean said in All Blacks - loosie selections in recent years:
Well I thought Finau mixed it up well last night. He's still good at making metres close in. The main issue I think with those three is they don't have a lot of focus on cleaning.
Yep, agree. Finau certainly has the size and power to run at forwards, probably moreso than Savea who is all about leg drive post-contact which doesn't give the same momentum as it effectively makes for slower ball, and Sititi who has quick feet pre-contact and good body position, but is not that big.
It may be that we just can't have both Sititi and Savea starting, and the best balance is one of them on the bench, with Finau and one of the EB/LJ/DP style workers to round out the trio. 6:2 bench, and you could have e.g. Finau/Dalton/Sititi then EB/Savea/Sotutu. We may not have all-time loosies at the moment, but we do have depth: a whole lot of very good ones, so good use of the bench would help us make the most of them.That sounds promising. More like the saffas, where you pick players to start or sub depending on their strengths. The tighter back row plays the first half, the looser more dynamic one plays the second half, or whatever the strategy is. Both empty the tank in the time they have
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@Canes4life said in All Blacks - loosie selections in recent years:
Parsons mentioned on Aotearoa Rugby Pod that he would pick Savea, Sititi, Kirifi and Jacobsen as his first four choices in the loose and then said the last two were up in the air. Blackadder, Lakai, Finau, Papali'i and Parker are all obvious options that could be in the frame.
Problem for Kirifi is if they see Ardie as a 7. Lakai is such a talent, that it would be backwards to leave him out, so in which case he has to supplant three current guys in Papalii, Jacobson and Blackadder - and as a 28 year old, I just don't really see them going that way - unless they go towards a 6-2 split - which I don't see them doing.
Further, Kirifi's best attribute (jackaling) is arguably less valuable at the end of the game, where referees tend to blow less penalties + teams are less inclinced to jackal due to risk of conceding a penalty.
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If we try and simplify this a little by looking at this through the lens of where the candidates have been playing in SRP we get:
7 Paps, Jacobson, Kirifi, RD
6 Finau, Parker, Blackadder, [Grace].
8 Sotutu, Sititi, Lakai, Leo Willie
But of course Jacobson, RD, Blackadder, and Lakai can play 7 and 8 and at a push 6, as probably can Paps.
It’s tricky. RD is a given.
I think I’d then pick specialist 6s and 8s, which for me would be Parker, Finau, Sititi and Sotutu.
Then two from Jacobson, Blackadder, Paps, Lakai and Kirifi.
For me, given Ethan’s fragility, I think I’d pick Luke and Peter, which is tough on the others.
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There seems to be a lot of favour for the small loose forwards at the moment from Robertson's coaching group. This isn't so much an issue when the tight five are dominant but we aren't always going to have the same level of dominance we've seen against France B and C.
The combo of Lio Willie, Kirifi and Savea struggled in the last quarter last night.
When we consider the size groups of loose forwards there seems to be too many from the small group.
Small Loose Forwards
Ardie Savea
Duplesis Kirifi
Christian Lio Willie
Peter Lakai
Wallace SititiMedium Loose Forwards
Ethan Blackadder
Dalton Papali'i
Luke Jacobson
Hoskins Sotutu
Devan FlandersLarge Loose Forwards
Samipeni Finau
Simon Parker
Oliver Haig
TK HowdenMore and more Vaa'i could be included as a large loose forward but he's been selected as a lock in the current squad. With the emergence of Holland it seems like his experiment at blindside is getting closer and closer to being locked in. We need to see how he goes against South Africa and a first choice Puma's side.
We need a big more balance in the loose forwards squad mix and the match day 23 mix.
