All Blacks 2025
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@nzzp said in All Blacks 2025:
@DurryMexted said in All Blacks 2025:
The crash or shovel ball 12 role that Jordie has taken on - its hard to tell if its a refection of his own skills, the defence he faces or the game plan but its tough to watch
his crash ball has dropped right off. Genuine crash balling would mean drawing in defenders - I don't see him doing that. With his frame, he should be a threat to run into or through the tackle. He's playing more like Havili than SBW at 12, and that does my nut given his potential upside.
I think all other top tier 12s do this better than Jordie at the moment and he’s been in the system since 2017……far too long in the tooth to talk about ‘potential upside’
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@nzzp said in All Blacks 2025:
@DurryMexted said in All Blacks 2025:
The crash or shovel ball 12 role that Jordie has taken on - its hard to tell if its a refection of his own skills, the defence he faces or the game plan but its tough to watch
his crash ball has dropped right off. Genuine crash balling would mean drawing in defenders - I don't see him doing that. With his frame, he should be a threat to run into or through the tackle. He's playing more like Havili than SBW at 12, and that does my nut given his potential upside.
I think all other top tier 12s do this better than Jordie at the moment and he’s been in the system since 2017……far too long in the tooth to talk about ‘potential upside’
@MN5 said in All Blacks 2025:
@nzzp said in All Blacks 2025:
@DurryMexted said in All Blacks 2025:
The crash or shovel ball 12 role that Jordie has taken on - its hard to tell if its a refection of his own skills, the defence he faces or the game plan but its tough to watch
his crash ball has dropped right off. Genuine crash balling would mean drawing in defenders - I don't see him doing that. With his frame, he should be a threat to run into or through the tackle. He's playing more like Havili than SBW at 12, and that does my nut given his potential upside.
I think all other top tier 12s do this better than Jordie at the moment and he’s been in the system since 2017……far too long in the tooth to talk about ‘potential upside’
when he came in he looked excellent there. But it's been shit for for a while.
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@ARHS said in All Blacks 2025:
I struggled with the tactics used at 10 and 13 last year. Wonder how much that is the players, v the match day tactics v the messages from the plethora of coaches in the AB camp. I really do suspect that the issue is the coordination of the messages from the instructors to a new set of players, at a different level, against stronger opponents.
Regarding the midfield, there was very little change from the previous regime to the new mob
The 13 runs a tight line on the shoulder of the 12. The 12 decides to bash up, pop a short ball or play it out the back. I think defences adjusted and the form & decision making of the 12 dipped
It's not utilising the extreme pace of the 13. I would like to see them stand further apart and use the blindside winger more on the shoulder
@Duluth said in All Blacks 2025:
It's not utilising the extreme pace of the 13. I would like to see them stand further apart and use the blindside winger more on the shoulder
The obvious benefit being more room for blindside winger and fullback to chose a line hitting a soft shoulder or gap. Especially effective when employed against a rush defence where defenders isolate themselves.
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There's so much sensible analysis on the board this morning, on improving our midfield. Bet none of it's gonna happen
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Jordie is still a good bench solution.
I'm bemused that now the issue is we don't have a player like SBW (and yes his ability to get the ball away was epic but I thought we never saw him in his prime; speed hampered by longterm injuries).
Still, others seem to differ "https://rugbynation.com/blogs/rugby/the-unstoppable-force-of-sonny-bill-williams"
-I don't recall lightning fast footwork when he was an AB. -
I can't see JB replaced at 12, he simply such a busy player there. Not saying he great, but noone looks gangbuster to me. I was prettyhopeful in Higgins, but by geez his defence worries me. Not just his tackling, but how often he seemed to get disconnected. I thought one of Canes strengths last year was how well JB and Proctor combined especially in defence.. Let's hope that Higgins switches on and does similar this season to puy hand up for ABs.
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I can't see JB replaced at 12, he simply such a busy player there. Not saying he great, but noone looks gangbuster to me. I was prettyhopeful in Higgins, but by geez his defence worries me. Not just his tackling, but how often he seemed to get disconnected. I thought one of Canes strengths last year was how well JB and Proctor combined especially in defence.. Let's hope that Higgins switches on and does similar this season to puy hand up for ABs.
@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2025:
I can't see JB replaced at 12, he simply such a busy player there. Not saying he great, but noone looks gangbuster to me. I was prettyhopeful in Higgins, but by geez his defence worries me. Not just his tackling, but how often he seemed to get disconnected. I thought one of Canes strengths last year was how well JB and Proctor combined especially in defence.. Let's hope that Higgins switches on and does similar this season to puy hand up for ABs.
He was pretty ordinary in a Canes jersey for the most part in 2024 IMO and as per recent seasons failed to step up when the pressure went on. Three years in a row for the Canes he went missing in the playoffs and he didn't exactly set the house on fire for the ABs either.
He's definitely replaceable but half the problem with the ABs is the Barrett's seem untouchable at the selection table.
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@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2025:
I can't see JB replaced at 12, he simply such a busy player there. Not saying he great, but noone looks gangbuster to me. I was prettyhopeful in Higgins, but by geez his defence worries me. Not just his tackling, but how often he seemed to get disconnected. I thought one of Canes strengths last year was how well JB and Proctor combined especially in defence.. Let's hope that Higgins switches on and does similar this season to puy hand up for ABs.
He was pretty ordinary in a Canes jersey for the most part in 2024 IMO and as per recent seasons failed to step up when the pressure went on. Three years in a row for the Canes he went missing in the playoffs and he didn't exactly set the house on fire for the ABs either.
He's definitely replaceable but half the problem with the ABs is the Barrett's seem untouchable at the selection table.
@Canes4life said in All Blacks 2025:
@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2025:
I can't see JB replaced at 12, he simply such a busy player there. Not saying he great, but noone looks gangbuster to me. I was prettyhopeful in Higgins, but by geez his defence worries me. Not just his tackling, but how often he seemed to get disconnected. I thought one of Canes strengths last year was how well JB and Proctor combined especially in defence.. Let's hope that Higgins switches on and does similar this season to puy hand up for ABs.
He was pretty ordinary in a Canes jersey for the most part in 2025 IMO and as per recent seasons failed to step up when the pressure went on. Three years in a row for the Canes he went missing in the playoffs.
He's definitely replaceable.
Witch.
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@Canes4life said in All Blacks 2025:
@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2025:
I can't see JB replaced at 12, he simply such a busy player there. Not saying he great, but noone looks gangbuster to me. I was prettyhopeful in Higgins, but by geez his defence worries me. Not just his tackling, but how often he seemed to get disconnected. I thought one of Canes strengths last year was how well JB and Proctor combined especially in defence.. Let's hope that Higgins switches on and does similar this season to puy hand up for ABs.
He was pretty ordinary in a Canes jersey for the most part in 2025 IMO and as per recent seasons failed to step up when the pressure went on. Three years in a row for the Canes he went missing in the playoffs.
He's definitely replaceable.
Witch.
@Nepia Lol you responded too quickly, I was in the middle of changing this.
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Would genuinely be stoked if we had a 12 step out of the shaows @Canes4life , just at this stage, I haven't seen anyone.
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Would genuinely be stoked if we had a 12 step out of the shaows @Canes4life , just at this stage, I haven't seen anyone.
@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2025:
Would genuinely be stoked if we had a 12 step out of the shaows @Canes4life , just at this stage, I haven't seen anyone.
Who knows if he'll get enough time to prove himself.. but Zarn Sullivan is going to spend some time in the midfield for the Blues
A big body and a second playmaker skillset
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Would genuinely be stoked if we had a 12 step out of the shaows @Canes4life , just at this stage, I haven't seen anyone.
@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2025:
Would genuinely be stoked if we had a 12 step out of the shaows @Canes4life , just at this stage, I haven't seen anyone.
ive come around to the idea of trying out more people, we want the kind of players that improves when surrounded by the best players and coaches in the country...which is hard to know unless we try
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Jordie is still a good bench solution.
I'm bemused that now the issue is we don't have a player like SBW (and yes his ability to get the ball away was epic but I thought we never saw him in his prime; speed hampered by longterm injuries).
Still, others seem to differ "https://rugbynation.com/blogs/rugby/the-unstoppable-force-of-sonny-bill-williams"
-I don't recall lightning fast footwork when he was an AB.@nostrildamus said in All Blacks 2025:
Jordie is still a good bench solution.
I'm bemused that now the issue is we don't have a player like SBW (and yes his ability to get the ball away was epic but I thought we never saw him in his prime; speed hampered by longterm injuries).
Still, others seem to differ "https://rugbynation.com/blogs/rugby/the-unstoppable-force-of-sonny-bill-williams"
-I don't recall lightning fast footwork when he was an AB.AI nonsense. How many scrums and mauls did he get in ?
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@SBW1 said in All Blacks 2025:
Article did say talks had stalled.
That means money.
RM would love to come back for the right $$$ I'm sure. But buying him out is expensive and NZR have no money.
Right decision to not pay, but I am very disappointed at how long this has taken and how much of a distraction this has been in the media. Coaches should be publicly backing their players, not squeezing one out for an overseas player who didn't set the world on fire at Test level.
@nzzp said in All Blacks 2025:
@SBW1 said in All Blacks 2025:
Article did say talks had stalled.
That means money.
RM would love to come back for the right $$$ I'm sure. But buying him out is expensive and NZR have no money.
Right decision to not pay, but I am very disappointed at how long this has taken and how much of a distraction this has been in the media. Coaches should be publicly backing their players, not squeezing one out for an overseas player who didn't set the world on fire at Test level.
Yup, it’s pretty predictable. They were never going to pay extra for him but try and find ways to make it easier for him to come back.
Of course, they went public with this news they were trying to bring him back early - why? No idea.
Then of course players here like DMac would have lost confidence in their place in this new regime. He was asked to play a run at all costs gameplan and then was dropped for Barrett.
From the outside looking in, it just seems a bit all over the place
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@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2025:
Would genuinely be stoked if we had a 12 step out of the shaows @Canes4life , just at this stage, I haven't seen anyone.
Who knows if he'll get enough time to prove himself.. but Zarn Sullivan is going to spend some time in the midfield for the Blues
A big body and a second playmaker skillset
@Duluth said in All Blacks 2025:
@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2025:
Would genuinely be stoked if we had a 12 step out of the shaows @Canes4life , just at this stage, I haven't seen anyone.
Who knows if he'll get enough time to prove himself.. but Zarn Sullivan is going to spend some time in the midfield for the Blues
A big body and a second playmaker skillset
Absolutely smoked Tavatavanawai last season too, that's enough to convince me he's genuinely hard as nails as well.
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@WoodysRFC said in All Blacks 2025:
Want to see more of Lam, Tupaea, and McLeod at 12.
McLeod is a poor man’s Jordie Barrett. Agree on Lam though.
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@WoodysRFC said in All Blacks 2025:
Want to see more of Lam, Tupaea, and McLeod at 12.
McLeod is a poor man’s Jordie Barrett. Agree on Lam though.
@Canes4life said in All Blacks 2025:
Agree on Lam though
He could be a really useful squad member. Doing the role that Ennor never quite fulfilled
