2025 All Blacks v France series
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Following the Mel Gibson school of thought: short men with a big head stand in front and lean towards the camera...
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@KiwiMurph said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
@MN5 said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
Is Holland noted as a ball carrier ?
Not really.
Looks more Luke Romano than Brodie Retallick to me at this stage. I am just not seeing what others keep saying they do.
@ARHS said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
@KiwiMurph said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
@MN5 said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
Is Holland noted as a ball carrier ?
Not really.
Looks more Luke Romano than Brodie Retallick to me at this stage. I am just not seeing what others keep saying they do.
I'll admit, prior to last night I hadn't seen much in Holland. Reckon it shone through last night though.
Immediately become a fanboi.
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The thing that really stood out with Holland is that he absolutely nailed the basics (read: core aspects) of his role all game. The other 14 blokes on the field... not so much. That is so crucial in the test arena, I am a huge fan already.
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@frugby said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
@brodean Depth perception. Kirifi is standing a reasonable distance in front.
He's clearly quite small.
@brodean said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
@frugby said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
@brodean Depth perception. Kirifi is standing a reasonable distance in front.
He's clearly quite small.
Holy shit. Lio Willie is actually bloody little judging by that. Reiko Ioane looks like a giant compared to him.
Hes barely taller than Sevu Reece !!! 189cm my fucken arse
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On Rieko, I thought he looked very dangerous in the first half, and he made a couple of line breaks. One of the breaks was vintage Rieko on the angle through the gap with speed, I got a bit excited at that point thinking we were really going to utilise his strengths, but then play didn't seem to go his way after that. I think he's a lock for one of the wing spots, and the fact he can cover centre to a high standard (especially defensively which is what teams like the Boks prioritse in their 13s) gives us more flexibility with the bench.
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On the loosies, we are really missing Cane. Dalton is the closest thing we have to him at the moment, and a trio of Vaa'i, Dalton and Ardie/Sititi looks better balanced to me. Vaa'i gives the size in close and height in the lineout, Dalton spends all day smacking blokes and hitting rucks, and Ardie/Sititi are more free to roam and really use their running game to full effect.
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On the loosies, we are really missing Cane. Dalton is the closest thing we have to him at the moment, and a trio of Vaa'i, Dalton and Ardie/Sititi looks better balanced to me. Vaa'i gives the size in close and height in the lineout, Dalton spends all day smacking blokes and hitting rucks, and Ardie/Sititi are more free to roam and really use their running game to full effect.
@No-Quarter said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
On the loosies, we are really missing Cane. Dalton is the closest thing we have to him at the moment, and a trio of Vaa'i, Dalton and Ardie/Sititi looks better balanced to me. Vaa'i gives the size in close and height in the lineout, Dalton spends all day smacking blokes and hitting rucks, and Ardie/Sititi are more free to roam and really use their running game to full effect.
Yeah DP is a seven who kind of plays like a six without the lineout ability. Good with ball in hand when he has a go too.
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@ACT-Crusader said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
@nonpartizan said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
@brodean said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
@Bones said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
@brodean said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
We turned the ball over 16 times to their 12
12 seems like a lot of times to turn over the ball for a team with fuck all possession and no BB/WJ.
27 points seems a lot of points for a team to concede when they have 62% possession.
That try Gulliard scored was soft as butter. They made a break and we can only defend 1 forward carry close to the line before he powers over.
Indeed.
Contrast that with the French defence - they did a pretty good job covering and scrambling after line breaks.
Tbh 31 points and 3 disallowed tries is a pretty decent attacking output - it's conceding 27 with France having less than 40% of the ball that was the problem.
Possession stats need to be put into context with territory though. We had a lot of ball it seems in our defensive half. Which comes back to our kicking game - not deep enough etc.
Just wondering if Jordie tweaked something in the warmups given he wasn’t kicking goals and we barely saw him do any field kicking ie stepping into first receiver to use his big boot. There was footage of him practicing goal kicking in the warmup.
Yeah, the kicking strategy seemed pretty hard to figure out.
At the start of the game Roigard was launching box kicks that weren't really being effectively contested - I think one bounced into a crowd of players and flew backwards. I'm not sure who they were targeted to or who was supposed to be contesting. It was pretty messy.
@nonpartizan said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
Yeah, the kicking strategy seemed pretty hard to figure out.
We have a strategy?
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@kiwiinmelb said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
Was that proctors second test ?
If so , that’s two tests , 2 bad misses on the outside, , he needs to tidy that up or his chances of an international career could derail pretty quickly.
I remember a young nonu had similar issues at 13 but he had time on his side and moved to 12 anyway .
Third, but yes, the 2nd test he played against Japan, the same thing happened as last night.
He had a shocker but I'm also happy to see him get another crack.
@African-Monkey said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
He had a shocker but I'm also happy to see him get another crack.
Needs to be handled carefully though if it's a confidence thing. Maybe better on the bench for Frog 2 if confidence is an issue.
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@ARHS said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
@KiwiMurph said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
@MN5 said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
Is Holland noted as a ball carrier ?
Not really.
Looks more Luke Romano than Brodie Retallick to me at this stage. I am just not seeing what others keep saying they do.
I'll admit, prior to last night I hadn't seen much in Holland. Reckon it shone through last night though.
Immediately become a fanboi.
@booboo said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
@ARHS said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
@KiwiMurph said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
@MN5 said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
Is Holland noted as a ball carrier ?
Not really.
Looks more Luke Romano than Brodie Retallick to me at this stage. I am just not seeing what others keep saying they do.
I'll admit, prior to last night I hadn't seen much in Holland. Reckon it shone through last night though.
Immediately become a fanboi.
He was rock-solid - great debut. Unspectacular, but did what he had to do with zero errors. Can't ask more than that.
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@African-Monkey said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
He had a shocker but I'm also happy to see him get another crack.
Needs to be handled carefully though if it's a confidence thing. Maybe better on the bench for Frog 2 if confidence is an issue.
@Victor-Meldrew said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
@African-Monkey said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
He had a shocker but I'm also happy to see him get another crack.
Needs to be handled carefully though if it's a confidence thing. Maybe better on the bench for Frog 2 if confidence is an issue.
I'd start him again. Get him back out there, he would have learnt plenty from the first outing.
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On Rieko, I thought he looked very dangerous in the first half, and he made a couple of line breaks. One of the breaks was vintage Rieko on the angle through the gap with speed, I got a bit excited at that point thinking we were really going to utilise his strengths, but then play didn't seem to go his way after that. I think he's a lock for one of the wing spots, and the fact he can cover centre to a high standard (especially defensively which is what teams like the Boks prioritse in their 13s) gives us more flexibility with the bench.
@No-Quarter this is where I think someone like Reece shines, he goes looking for work.
Ioane did look sharp when we were lioking good in the 2nd half of the 1st half, but as you say play didn't honhis way, we went back to aimless kicking and then he is largely anonymous.
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I've never noticed handling issues from Darry.
Blues really missed him this year. He's a another strong carrier and good close to the line.
@brodean said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
I've never noticed handling issues from Darry.
Blues really missed him this year. He's a another strong carrier and good close to the line.
@brodean said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
@MN5 said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
@Bovidae said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
This photo shows how under-sized our loosies are:
Being the glass is half full fellow that I am it's also a case of a fucken tall prop and a tall lock.
Kirifi is a unit but yes, an undersized one. There's a place for him provided there's bigger options at 6 and 8.
Is Holland noted as a ball carrier ? I thought he went to ground pretty easy a few times last night. Certainly no Eben Etzebeth in that department ( yet )
Lio Willie basically looks the same size as Kirifi in this photo.
@brodean said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
Dalts is a very good lineout jumper.
Your ability to claim excellence in every aspect of every Blues player while belittling every other player is truly impressive mate.
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@brodean said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
I've never noticed handling issues from Darry.
Blues really missed him this year. He's a another strong carrier and good close to the line.
@brodean said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
@MN5 said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
@Bovidae said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
This photo shows how under-sized our loosies are:
Being the glass is half full fellow that I am it's also a case of a fucken tall prop and a tall lock.
Kirifi is a unit but yes, an undersized one. There's a place for him provided there's bigger options at 6 and 8.
Is Holland noted as a ball carrier ? I thought he went to ground pretty easy a few times last night. Certainly no Eben Etzebeth in that department ( yet )
Lio Willie basically looks the same size as Kirifi in this photo.
@brodean said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
Dalts is a very good lineout jumper.
Your ability to claim excellence in every aspect of every Blues player while belittling every other player is truly impressive mate.
@reprobate said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
@brodean said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
I've never noticed handling issues from Darry.
Blues really missed him this year. He's a another strong carrier and good close to the line.
@brodean said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
@MN5 said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
@Bovidae said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
This photo shows how under-sized our loosies are:
Being the glass is half full fellow that I am it's also a case of a fucken tall prop and a tall lock.
Kirifi is a unit but yes, an undersized one. There's a place for him provided there's bigger options at 6 and 8.
Is Holland noted as a ball carrier ? I thought he went to ground pretty easy a few times last night. Certainly no Eben Etzebeth in that department ( yet )
Lio Willie basically looks the same size as Kirifi in this photo.
@brodean said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
Dalts is a very good lineout jumper.
Your ability to claim excellence in every aspect of every Blues player while belittling every other player is truly impressive mate.
Blues players get bagged a lot and I'm just sticking up for them.
Christian Lio Willie is not every other player. The jury is still out on him but given he is little I have my doubts. Most of the players in the squad I support. There's a few selections I think are questionable.
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Using your example, Ma'a Nonu was dropped a few times and yeah I was unhappy about each of those and argued against them on here at the time if I remember correctly.
But each time he got dropped, he came back stronger and more professional. It was interesting reading the other day Ben White (half back for Toulon, Scotland and the British and Irish Lions) say that he's never encountered a more professional Rugby player than Ma'a Nonu.
That's what the brutal All Blacks environment produces. Skilled athletes who are craftsmen.
@sparky said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
Using your example, Ma'a Nonu was dropped a few times and yeah I was unhappy about each of those and argued against them on here at the time if I remember correctly.
But each time he got dropped, he came back stronger and more professional. It was interesting reading the other day Ben White (half back for Toulon, Scotland and the British and Irish Lions) say that he's never encountered a more professional Rugby player than Ma'a Nonu.
That's what the brutal All Blacks environment produces. Skilled athletes who are craftsmen.
Not really. He was given multiple opportunities and dropped multiple times. He was tried at centre and on the wing by multiple AB coaches. Didn’t make the 05 Lions squad after making the ABs in 03 and even starting against the best team in the world at the time. Was dropped for the 07 RWC after featuring in 06.
He eventually became an AB great. Some players just need to be persisted with over longer periods.
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@sparky said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
Using your example, Ma'a Nonu was dropped a few times and yeah I was unhappy about each of those and argued against them on here at the time if I remember correctly.
But each time he got dropped, he came back stronger and more professional. It was interesting reading the other day Ben White (half back for Toulon, Scotland and the British and Irish Lions) say that he's never encountered a more professional Rugby player than Ma'a Nonu.
That's what the brutal All Blacks environment produces. Skilled athletes who are craftsmen.
Not really. He was given multiple opportunities and dropped multiple times. He was tried at centre and on the wing by multiple AB coaches. Didn’t make the 05 Lions squad after making the ABs in 03 and even starting against the best team in the world at the time. Was dropped for the 07 RWC after featuring in 06.
He eventually became an AB great. Some players just need to be persisted with over longer periods.
@ACT-Crusader said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
@sparky said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
Using your example, Ma'a Nonu was dropped a few times and yeah I was unhappy about each of those and argued against them on here at the time if I remember correctly.
But each time he got dropped, he came back stronger and more professional. It was interesting reading the other day Ben White (half back for Toulon, Scotland and the British and Irish Lions) say that he's never encountered a more professional Rugby player than Ma'a Nonu.
That's what the brutal All Blacks environment produces. Skilled athletes who are craftsmen.
Not really. He was given multiple opportunities and dropped multiple times. He was tried at centre and on the wing by multiple AB coaches. Didn’t make the 05 Lions squad after making the ABs in 03 and even starting against the best team in the world at the time. Was dropped for the 07 RWC after featuring in 06.
He eventually became an AB great. Some players just need to be persisted with over longer periods.
I always knew he was special.....
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@ACT-Crusader said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
@sparky said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
Using your example, Ma'a Nonu was dropped a few times and yeah I was unhappy about each of those and argued against them on here at the time if I remember correctly.
But each time he got dropped, he came back stronger and more professional. It was interesting reading the other day Ben White (half back for Toulon, Scotland and the British and Irish Lions) say that he's never encountered a more professional Rugby player than Ma'a Nonu.
That's what the brutal All Blacks environment produces. Skilled athletes who are craftsmen.
Not really. He was given multiple opportunities and dropped multiple times. He was tried at centre and on the wing by multiple AB coaches. Didn’t make the 05 Lions squad after making the ABs in 03 and even starting against the best team in the world at the time. Was dropped for the 07 RWC after featuring in 06.
He eventually became an AB great. Some players just need to be persisted with over longer periods.
I always knew he was special.....
@canefan said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
@ACT-Crusader said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
@sparky said in 2025 All Blacks v France series:
Using your example, Ma'a Nonu was dropped a few times and yeah I was unhappy about each of those and argued against them on here at the time if I remember correctly.
But each time he got dropped, he came back stronger and more professional. It was interesting reading the other day Ben White (half back for Toulon, Scotland and the British and Irish Lions) say that he's never encountered a more professional Rugby player than Ma'a Nonu.
That's what the brutal All Blacks environment produces. Skilled athletes who are craftsmen.
Not really. He was given multiple opportunities and dropped multiple times. He was tried at centre and on the wing by multiple AB coaches. Didn’t make the 05 Lions squad after making the ABs in 03 and even starting against the best team in the world at the time. Was dropped for the 07 RWC after featuring in 06.
He eventually became an AB great. Some players just need to be persisted with over longer periods.
I always knew he was special.....
Once he ditched the hoodie I knew he would be an AB great…..
