All Blacks 2025
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@nostrildamus said in All Blacks 2025:
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2025:
Nothing to suggest Robertson hasn't got the people he wanted from the start, but with the shambles that is NZR, who knows?
Yes there is, he wanted Tony Brown. You can find sources online.
If we wanted Tony Brown, they should have chosen Jamie Joseph. The fact that Brown went to SA probably says a lot about how other coaches - outside the Crusaders - feel about working with Razor.
My concern is who they could get to come in who would actually be better than what we have...
It's well known that Razor rejected any other role than Head Coach with his team.
Although I believe we need new assistants and we do need change, I'm not sure that we should be looking to change over the assistants - will a new attack coach with no international experience be any better amongst this team than what we have?
The correct strategic choice for the new CEO of NZRU is to do a complete evaluation of the current team.
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@gt12 said in All Blacks 2025:
@nostrildamus said in All Blacks 2025:
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2025:
Nothing to suggest Robertson hasn't got the people he wanted from the start, but with the shambles that is NZR, who knows?
Yes there is, he wanted Tony Brown. You can find sources online.
If we wanted Tony Brown, they should have chosen Jamie Joseph. The fact that Brown went to SA probably says a lot about how other coaches - outside the Crusaders - feel about working with Razor.
My concern is who they could get to come in who would actually be better than what we have...
It's well known that Razor rejected any other role than Head Coach with his team.
Although I believe we need new assistants and we do need change, I'm not sure that we should be looking to change over the assistants - will a new attack coach with no international experience be any better amongst this team than what we have?
The correct strategic choice for the new CEO of NZRU is to do a complete evaluation of the current team.
My recall is Tony Brown believed accepting would not be loyal to Joseph, don't know what he actually thought of Razor et al.
But then he went to work for the Boks... -
@nostrildamus That was my understanding too. I also suspect Razor and Brown would be a bit of a personality clash.
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@nostrildamus said in All Blacks 2025:
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2025:
Nothing to suggest Robertson hasn't got the people he wanted from the start, but with the shambles that is NZR, who knows?
Yes there is, he wanted Tony Brown. You can find sources online.
That was in 2019 for Robertson's pitch to take over from Hansen. He'd already decided to join Sth Africa in 2023.
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@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2025:
That was in 2019 for Robertson's pitch to take over from Hansen. He'd already decided to join Sth Africa in 2023.
He wanted him in 2019 and there's nothing to suggest he would have changed his mind if Brown was still /became available in 2023.
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@frugby said in All Blacks 2025:
@nostrildamus That was my understanding too. I also suspect Razor and Brown would be a bit of a personality clash.
There does seem to be a growing list of good coaches who have personality clashes with Robertson.
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@nostrildamus said in All Blacks 2025:
@gt12 said in All Blacks 2025:
@nostrildamus said in All Blacks 2025:
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2025:
Nothing to suggest Robertson hasn't got the people he wanted from the start, but with the shambles that is NZR, who knows?
Yes there is, he wanted Tony Brown. You can find sources online.
If we wanted Tony Brown, they should have chosen Jamie Joseph. The fact that Brown went to SA probably says a lot about how other coaches - outside the Crusaders - feel about working with Razor.
My concern is who they could get to come in who would actually be better than what we have...
It's well known that Razor rejected any other role than Head Coach with his team.
Although I believe we need new assistants and we do need change, I'm not sure that we should be looking to change over the assistants - will a new attack coach with no international experience be any better amongst this team than what we have?
The correct strategic choice for the new CEO of NZRU is to do a complete evaluation of the current team.
My recall is Tony Brown believed accepting would not be loyal to Joseph, don't know what he actually thought of Razor et al.
But then he went to work for the Boks...The most interesting part is that there doesn't seem to be another respected head coach who wants to work alongside Razor.
His record at the Saders speaks for itself, but that is a worrying point.
For more than 20 years, the ABs have been able to find coaching groups with at least two, often three coaches who could be the head coach of a tier one international team.
Would anyone from the current group would be close to that?
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@gt12 said in All Blacks 2025:
@nostrildamus said in All Blacks 2025:
@gt12 said in All Blacks 2025:
@nostrildamus said in All Blacks 2025:
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2025:
Nothing to suggest Robertson hasn't got the people he wanted from the start, but with the shambles that is NZR, who knows?
Yes there is, he wanted Tony Brown. You can find sources online.
If we wanted Tony Brown, they should have chosen Jamie Joseph. The fact that Brown went to SA probably says a lot about how other coaches - outside the Crusaders - feel about working with Razor.
My concern is who they could get to come in who would actually be better than what we have...
It's well known that Razor rejected any other role than Head Coach with his team.
Although I believe we need new assistants and we do need change, I'm not sure that we should be looking to change over the assistants - will a new attack coach with no international experience be any better amongst this team than what we have?
The correct strategic choice for the new CEO of NZRU is to do a complete evaluation of the current team.
My recall is Tony Brown believed accepting would not be loyal to Joseph, don't know what he actually thought of Razor et al.
But then he went to work for the Boks...The most interesting part is that there doesn't seem to be another respected head coach who wants to work alongside Razor.
O'Gara? Head coach at La Rochelle. Not a national team but I'd hire him.
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@nostrildamus said in All Blacks 2025:
@gt12 said in All Blacks 2025:
@nostrildamus said in All Blacks 2025:
@gt12 said in All Blacks 2025:
@nostrildamus said in All Blacks 2025:
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2025:
Nothing to suggest Robertson hasn't got the people he wanted from the start, but with the shambles that is NZR, who knows?
Yes there is, he wanted Tony Brown. You can find sources online.
If we wanted Tony Brown, they should have chosen Jamie Joseph. The fact that Brown went to SA probably says a lot about how other coaches - outside the Crusaders - feel about working with Razor.
My concern is who they could get to come in who would actually be better than what we have...
It's well known that Razor rejected any other role than Head Coach with his team.
Although I believe we need new assistants and we do need change, I'm not sure that we should be looking to change over the assistants - will a new attack coach with no international experience be any better amongst this team than what we have?
The correct strategic choice for the new CEO of NZRU is to do a complete evaluation of the current team.
My recall is Tony Brown believed accepting would not be loyal to Joseph, don't know what he actually thought of Razor et al.
But then he went to work for the Boks...The most interesting part is that there doesn't seem to be another respected head coach who wants to work alongside Razor.
O'Gara? Head coach at La Rochelle. Not a national team but I'd hire him.
Would be an upgrade. Would he come?
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This post is deleted!
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@gt12 said in All Blacks 2025:
O'Gara? Head coach at La Rochelle. Not a national team but I'd hire him.
Would be an upgrade. Would he come?
I think last year or earlier he indicated some interest to returning to NZ in some form, but, and an EU/Irish poster can provide more info, wasn't there mention of him as a potential future Irish head coach?
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Why not Vern Cotter? He went overseas, did his time, and has come back a better coach. We should be rewarding this IMO.
He managed to turn the Blues into a talented but soft team, into a side that barely went backwards and grinded out tough wins. He turned two players in Hoskins & Akira (who we are told are uncoachable) into being the best in their positions in NZ. Ofa had his best year ever. Helped turn Darry into an AB. Beehre, Fusitua, Cam Christie are growing into future ABs.
Maybe if he got to work with the likes of Parker, Lakai, Vaa'i, etc. he could help them reach their full potential as he's proven to do with many other players...
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@hikastags said in All Blacks 2025:
Why not Vern Cotter? He went overseas, did his time, and has come back a better coach. We should be rewarding this IMO.
He managed to turn the Blues into a talented but soft team, into a side that barely went backwards and grinded out tough wins. He turned two players in Hoskins & Akira (who we are told are uncoachable) into being the best in their positions in NZ. Ofa had his best year ever. Helped turn Darry into an AB. Beehre, Fusitua, Cam Christie are growing into future ABs.
Maybe if he got to work with the likes of Parker, Lakai, Vaa'i, etc. he could help them reach their full potential as he's proven to do with many other players...
Good points, but I can't see him and Ryan being in the same coaching team though, can you?
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@nostrildamus said in All Blacks 2025:
@hikastags said in All Blacks 2025:
Why not Vern Cotter? He went overseas, did his time, and has come back a better coach. We should be rewarding this IMO.
He managed to turn the Blues into a talented but soft team, into a side that barely went backwards and grinded out tough wins. He turned two players in Hoskins & Akira (who we are told are uncoachable) into being the best in their positions in NZ. Ofa had his best year ever. Helped turn Darry into an AB. Beehre, Fusitua, Cam Christie are growing into future ABs.
Maybe if he got to work with the likes of Parker, Lakai, Vaa'i, etc. he could help them reach their full potential as he's proven to do with many other players...
Good points, but I can't see him and Ryan being in the same coaching team though, can you?
Probably not. But NZRU needs to put their foot down here. (which I have no faith in)
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@hikastags said in All Blacks 2025:
@nostrildamus said in All Blacks 2025:
@hikastags said in All Blacks 2025:
Why not Vern Cotter? He went overseas, did his time, and has come back a better coach. We should be rewarding this IMO.
He managed to turn the Blues into a talented but soft team, into a side that barely went backwards and grinded out tough wins. He turned two players in Hoskins & Akira (who we are told are uncoachable) into being the best in their positions in NZ. Ofa had his best year ever. Helped turn Darry into an AB. Beehre, Fusitua, Cam Christie are growing into future ABs.
Maybe if he got to work with the likes of Parker, Lakai, Vaa'i, etc. he could help them reach their full potential as he's proven to do with many other players...
Good points, but I can't see him and Ryan being in the same coaching team though, can you?
Probably not. But NZRU needs to put their foot down here. (which I have no faith in)
I’m really not sure why people think Jamie Joseph and Vern Crotter are viable alternatives. Between them they have one domestic title and tier 2 international experience (yes Scotland when vern crotter was coaching them may have well be tier 2).
If you think Robertson wasn’t ready for international coaching, not sure how those two qualify
Crotter had a great squad in Scotland and turned it into a muddling mess and wasted a great generation of players. One super rugby season doesn’t mean a lot I’m afraid
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@nostrildamus said in All Blacks 2025:
@hikastags said in All Blacks 2025:
Why not Vern Cotter? He went overseas, did his time, and has come back a better coach. We should be rewarding this IMO.
He managed to turn the Blues into a talented but soft team, into a side that barely went backwards and grinded out tough wins. He turned two players in Hoskins & Akira (who we are told are uncoachable) into being the best in their positions in NZ. Ofa had his best year ever. Helped turn Darry into an AB. Beehre, Fusitua, Cam Christie are growing into future ABs.
Maybe if he got to work with the likes of Parker, Lakai, Vaa'i, etc. he could help them reach their full potential as he's proven to do with many other players...
Good points, but I can't see him and Ryan being in the same coaching team though, can you?
Ryan literally starting out working at the international level with Cotter...
