All Blacks - New Coach Selection
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Not sure about MacIntosh over Ryan, or other way. Perhaps new coach will want someone with new ideas and have other coach in mind? Wallabies have seemed to have had Laurie Fisher forever and a day, while seemingly a good coach, not sure they wouldn't kick on more with fresh ideas.
I know we have ideas for head coach who is best technical coach, not sure we want best technical coach, just the best coach and technical ones below? Always thought the likes og Wayne Smith etc were better as assistants rather than head coach. -
@taniwharugby said in All Blacks - New Coach Selection:
@reprobate yeah Razor really missed a huge opportunity to hit the ground running and.stamp his.mark.on things, instead he pretty much trotted out the same.side with a worse game plan.
He missed the chance to really.take some risks early on too, so disappointing when you think how he was seemingly so innovative and from a different mould.
Could understand that in Year 1 while he found his feet, but not in Year 2. Expected some risk-taking last year. - esp. from a coach with a record 7 SR titles in a row under his belt.
New coach will need to hit the ground running and won't have the luxury of an extended timescale. Wonder if a 2 year contract is a bit short-sighted by NZR - maybe better to go for 4 with extension to be confirmed after the next RWC?
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Darren Shand suggests getting the head coach to put a prospective backroom team together before even getting the job not a good idea. Thinks that failed both Foster and Robertson.
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@Victor-Meldrew people on here been saying that for a fair old while.
Should appoint coach and go from there, seems wrong they have to build a team to present in interview.
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@frugby said in All Blacks - New Coach Selection:
I guess the concern any coach might have here, is you take the job, and with a lack of time to implement your ideas you lose the Springboks Tour, and then go out to the Boks in the World Cup QF, and you are out of the job.
This is the point.
Things could go very badly from here.
Lose the SA series, lose the SA RWC QF.
That is guna put the HC in a not so good position.
Hence i'd be hopin that NZR would already be thinkin about what to do in that scenario.But if I was a HC condidate i'd be lookin at it a bit different.
Not six years, but almost a caretaker role for 18 mths
Cos, win the series and win the QF (and the cup); and you are f'n hero, forever!
And a with a new four year contract for after the RWC, you'd be able to name your price.
And if it all turns to shit; well, you said it, I didn't have enough time to implement my ideas, excuses are already there. -
@mohikamo said in All Blacks - New Coach Selection:
@frugby said in All Blacks - New Coach Selection:
I guess the concern any coach might have here, is you take the job, and with a lack of time to implement your ideas you lose the Springboks Tour, and then go out to the Boks in the World Cup QF, and you are out of the job.
This is the point.
Things could go very badly from here.
Lose the SA series, lose the SA RWC QF.
That is guna put the HC in a not so good position.
Hence i'd be hopin that NZR would already be thinkin about what to do in that scenario.But if I was a HC condidate i'd be lookin at it a bit different.
Not six years, but almost a caretaker role for 18 mths
Cos, win the series and win the QF (and the cup); and you are f'n hero, forever!
And a with a new four year contract for after the RWC, you'd be able to name your price.
And if it all turns to shit; well, you said it, I didn't have enough time to implement my ideas, excuses are already there.Now that's plausible deniability! Anyone who expects miracles from our current situation is dreaming
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@mohikamo said in All Blacks - New Coach Selection:
@frugby said in All Blacks - New Coach Selection:
I guess the concern any coach might have here, is you take the job, and with a lack of time to implement your ideas you lose the Springboks Tour, and then go out to the Boks in the World Cup QF, and you are out of the job.
This is the point.
Things could go very badly from here.
Lose the SA series, lose the SA RWC QF.
That is guna put the HC in a not so good position.
Hence i'd be hopin that NZR would already be thinkin about what to do in that scenario.But if I was a HC condidate i'd be lookin at it a bit different.
Not six years, but almost a caretaker role for 18 mths
Cos, win the series and win the QF (and the cup); and you are f'n hero, forever!
And a with a new four year contract for after the RWC, you'd be able to name your price.
And if it all turns to shit; well, you said it, I didn't have enough time to implement my ideas, excuses are already there.Maybe the best option for NZR is a HC on a 2+2 yr contract with experienced assistants (Hansen? Foster?) to navigate the next 2 years - which are going to be pretty intense - and then renew with new assistants.if progress is being made
Personally, I don't mind a few losses if we are trying new things and making progress . NZR and the public would probably be OK with that after the shit show of the last 2-3 years.
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The next two years are not going to be "normal" years, and it'll be only the next 18 months by the time the next HC is in place.
Those 18 months are guna be mega.
The coaches (and the players) will be fully cognizant; no time for building for the future, it'll be win NOW.After that tho; it should be reasonably straight-forward to put the preferred coaching team together.
Contracts will be ending at the 27 end of cycle, and they should be able to get whomever (Brown) they prefer. -
@Dan54 said in All Blacks - New Coach Selection:
Not sure about MacIntosh over Ryan, or other way. Perhaps new coach will want someone with new ideas and have other coach in mind? Wallabies have seemed to have had Laurie Fisher forever and a day, while seemingly a good coach, not sure they wouldn't kick on more with fresh ideas.
I know we have ideas for head coach who is best technical coach, not sure we want best technical coach, just the best coach and technical ones below? Always thought the likes og Wayne Smith etc were better as assistants rather than head coach.I agree Dan. Best man manager at the top. Best technical guys underneath... getting the chemistry right between them all is key too after the last couple of years of comings and goings...
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@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks - New Coach Selection:
Personally, I don't mind a few losses if we are trying new things and making progress . NZR and the public would probably be OK with that after the shit show of the last 2-3 years.
Unfortunately that is what should have been happening for the last two years.
(hard to be sure, but I think they were actually trying old things which we all knew were not going to work anymore)But for the next 18 months its guna be, just win.
Then in two years time we can go back to trying new things and making progress, for a couple of seasons. -
@canefan said in All Blacks - New Coach Selection:
Anyone who expects miracles from our current situation is dreaming
Another sport but . . . .
SB this weekend
Pats . . . Vrabel . . . first year HC
Hawks . . . Macdonald . . . second year HC
the turnaround can be quick! -
@mohikamo said in All Blacks - New Coach Selection:
But for the next 18 months its guna be, just win.
Pragmatism - which would be trying something new
Then in two years time we can go back to trying new things and making progress, for a couple of seasons.
Pretty much my thinking
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@mohikamo said in All Blacks - New Coach Selection:
@canefan said in All Blacks - New Coach Selection:
Anyone who expects miracles from our current situation is dreaming
Another sport but . . . .
SB this weekend
Pats . . . Vrabel . . . first year HC
Hawks . . . Macdonald . . . second year HC
the turnaround can be quick!It's not like we don't the cattle. We have played below ourselves for 2 years. Make basic changes and we could roar back
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@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks - New Coach Selection:
@taniwharugby said in All Blacks - New Coach Selection:
@reprobate yeah Razor really missed a huge opportunity to hit the ground running and.stamp his.mark.on things, instead he pretty much trotted out the same.side with a worse game plan.
He missed the chance to really.take some risks early on too, so disappointing when you think how he was seemingly so innovative and from a different mould.
Could understand that in Year 1 while he found his feet, but not in Year 2. Expected some risk-taking last year. - esp. from a coach with a record 7 SR titles in a row under his belt.
New coach will need to hit the ground running and won't have the luxury of an extended timescale. Wonder if a 2 year contract is a bit short-sighted by NZR - maybe better to go for 4 with extension to be confirmed after the next RWC?
Any head coach coming into the ABs will want a 4 yr contract due to the timing and circumstance of their appointment. It would be unfair to be judged on an outcome which is less than 2 years away when the governing body deemed that the ABs were essentially in crisis mode and need a get well plan -
That's why I think a 2+2 (or poss. 2+4) contract is the way to go - essentially a 4 year gig.
Look at the first two years as taking over a bit of a disaster and getting things under control and then extend with different assessment criteria.
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While no loss is acceptable, we know some will be inevitable, but the manner of the losses, the way we play is equally as important.
For me there are 2 games, or more accurately 2 halves of.rugby that stick out as totally unacceptable: 2nd half of Test 2 v Ireland and last years 2nd half v SA.
Oddly, both abominations for different reasons.
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@taniwharugby I'd go a bit further, England under Borthwick are not the power they could be, France C should have been roundly dispatched.
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@taniwharugby I've seen shit performances,thru the years - individually and by the team as a whole.
But I've never seen an AB team simply give up like they did against SA in Wellington last year. Absolute low point.
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@mohikamo said in All Blacks - New Coach Selection:
@canefan said in All Blacks - New Coach Selection:
Anyone who expects miracles from our current situation is dreaming
Another sport but . . . .
SB this weekend
Pats . . . Vrabel . . . first year HC
Hawks . . . Macdonald . . . second year HC
the turnaround can be quick!Coaches can inspire fans too. I'd run through a brick wall for Dan Campbell. Deep authenticity
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@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks - New Coach Selection:
@taniwharugby I've seen shit performances,thru the years - individually and by the team as a whole.
But I've never seen an AB team simply give up like they did against SA in Wellington last year. Absolute low point.
That's a unique viewpoint.
