Blues 2018
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@crucial It indicates that his selections are questionable, which is completely obvious from what I wrote.
Beaver, Te Rure, and Marty MacKenzie are all better. I'd rather have Plummer too.
@tim said in Blues 2018:
@crucial It indicates that his selections are questionable, which is completely obvious from what I wrote.
Beaver, Te Rure, and Marty MacKenzie are all better. I'd rather have Plummer too.
Experience is light already, having Plummer in there would be very risky. MMac is on a par with Kirkpatrick. His training gear all comes from journeymen'R'us.
I suspect that Beaver has something more lucrative lined up and would rather play a last season or two than be a dirty dirty. Te Rure also not experienced enough.
I am guessing that the thought is to get someone that is going to get you through a couple of games if absolutely necessary. -
stoked for Tamati Tua, is a very good prospect, shame he was injured so early as the mid-field of him and Goodhue was so promising.
Has bulked up this season (after WTG for Blues and NZ U20) but also seems to have added a little pace to his game too...love stories of these kids who rise through the ranks given in 2015 he was playing club rugby in Kaitaia as a teen!
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Hasn't Te Rure just come back from a professional contract up your way Crucial. I know I saw him and Otere Black play for Manawatu against Wellington in pre-season match at the Hutt Rec about four years ago and he looked the better of the two then. Jamie Booth also played that day and also impressed me. Sadly he (Booth) has not really kicked in nor had the breaks others have had. He remains a decent player though and could still get his chance sometime.
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Hasn't Te Rure just come back from a professional contract up your way Crucial. I know I saw him and Otere Black play for Manawatu against Wellington in pre-season match at the Hutt Rec about four years ago and he looked the better of the two then. Jamie Booth also played that day and also impressed me. Sadly he (Booth) has not really kicked in nor had the breaks others have had. He remains a decent player though and could still get his chance sometime.
@higgins said in Blues 2018:
Hasn't Te Rure just come back from a professional contract up your way Crucial. I know I saw him and Otere Black play for Manawatu against Wellington in pre-season match at the Hutt Rec about four years ago and he looked the better of the two then. Jamie Booth also played that day and also impressed me. Sadly he has not really kicked in nor had the breaks others have had.
You could well be right about Te Rure. The debate is getting away from my original point which was commenting on whinging about letting West go for Kirkpatrick when quite obviously a lot of effort has been going into first five recruitment only for it to come adrift through injury.
Taking a lowly third spot on basic salary is not the right path for talking a good player in e.g. Beaver can do better in Japan. Te Rure may want to hold out one more year and try and crack something better. -
Hasn't Te Rure just come back from a professional contract up your way Crucial. I know I saw him and Otere Black play for Manawatu against Wellington in pre-season match at the Hutt Rec about four years ago and he looked the better of the two then. Jamie Booth also played that day and also impressed me. Sadly he (Booth) has not really kicked in nor had the breaks others have had. He remains a decent player though and could still get his chance sometime.
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@higgins said in Blues 2018:
Hasn't Te Rure just come back from a professional contract up your way Crucial. I know I saw him and Otere Black play for Manawatu against Wellington in pre-season match at the Hutt Rec about four years ago and he looked the better of the two then. Jamie Booth also played that day and also impressed me. Sadly he has not really kicked in nor had the breaks others have had.
You could well be right about Te Rure. The debate is getting away from my original point which was commenting on whinging about letting West go for Kirkpatrick when quite obviously a lot of effort has been going into first five recruitment only for it to come adrift through injury.
Taking a lowly third spot on basic salary is not the right path for talking a good player in e.g. Beaver can do better in Japan. Te Rure may want to hold out one more year and try and crack something better.@crucial As a paying customer since 1996 and having seen a decade of poor selection and recruitment from the Blues organisation,I think I reserve the right to whinge..!
I could write a book about the poor recruitment decisions this organisation has made.
In my opinion,Kirkpatricks ceiling is Mitre 10 cup,although given Garden Bachop turned out to be Lions starting first five,I do wonder..!
This same organisation back in 2009 picked Toby Morland who was the 2nd string halfback at Otago for the Blues.
Sitting in the Wider training squad was Aaron Smith,oh by the way,he was totally inexperienced...!.
But I guess we know how that turned out...! -
@crucial As a paying customer since 1996 and having seen a decade of poor selection and recruitment from the Blues organisation,I think I reserve the right to whinge..!
I could write a book about the poor recruitment decisions this organisation has made.
In my opinion,Kirkpatricks ceiling is Mitre 10 cup,although given Garden Bachop turned out to be Lions starting first five,I do wonder..!
This same organisation back in 2009 picked Toby Morland who was the 2nd string halfback at Otago for the Blues.
Sitting in the Wider training squad was Aaron Smith,oh by the way,he was totally inexperienced...!.
But I guess we know how that turned out...!I'm always keen to criticise the poor selection by the Blues but i'm not going to bash them here for Kirkpatrick.
He is clearly a stop-gap with Otere Black returning next season and Harry Plummer potentially ready for a Super Rugby spot after 12 months of development.
In a years time the Blues will have options at 10 of Black, Perofeta, Gatland and probably Plummer (Gatland is on a one year deal so may or may not be around in 2019). That's about as good of a situation at number 10 for the Blues in a very very long time. I'm not buying that Te Rure (who no one has ever selected at Super Rugby level) is the answer.
Usually there are some glaring poor non-selections by the Blues (Fatialofa, Seu, Aso, Alaimalo etc etc) but this year I can't see one jumping out. The closest would be Vaega but he's been around the traps for a while and has been more there or thereabouts rather than a star.
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I'm always keen to criticise the poor selection by the Blues but i'm not going to bash them here for Kirkpatrick.
He is clearly a stop-gap with Otere Black returning next season and Harry Plummer potentially ready for a Super Rugby spot after 12 months of development.
In a years time the Blues will have options at 10 of Black, Perofeta, Gatland and probably Plummer (Gatland is on a one year deal so may or may not be around in 2019). That's about as good of a situation at number 10 for the Blues in a very very long time. I'm not buying that Te Rure (who no one has ever selected at Super Rugby level) is the answer.
Usually there are some glaring poor non-selections by the Blues (Fatialofa, Seu, Aso, Alaimalo etc etc) but this year I can't see one jumping out. The closest would be Vaega but he's been around the traps for a while and has been more there or thereabouts rather than a star.
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I'm always keen to criticise the poor selection by the Blues but i'm not going to bash them here for Kirkpatrick.
He is clearly a stop-gap with Otere Black returning next season and Harry Plummer potentially ready for a Super Rugby spot after 12 months of development.
In a years time the Blues will have options at 10 of Black, Perofeta, Gatland and probably Plummer (Gatland is on a one year deal so may or may not be around in 2019). That's about as good of a situation at number 10 for the Blues in a very very long time. I'm not buying that Te Rure (who no one has ever selected at Super Rugby level) is the answer.
Usually there are some glaring poor non-selections by the Blues (Fatialofa, Seu, Aso, Alaimalo etc etc) but this year I can't see one jumping out. The closest would be Vaega but he's been around the traps for a while and has been more there or thereabouts rather than a star.
@kiwimurph This year, rather than being about recruiting "name" players, it's really about the younger Blues stepping up.
Hodgman (24) was one of the best props in the NPC, and could be an All Black. Ofa T (25) has made big steps, but needs to show regular set piece form. Tuipulotu (24) is back in the ABs, but needs to show consistent form. We all know about Akira Ioane (22), if he continues maturing then he could dominant week in, week out. Goodhue (22) needs to show consistent set piece ability, and demand minutes. It must be make or break for him this year.
In the backs, the obvious one is Nock (21) - can he show a commanding streak, and a running game? He hasn't so far. Big years from Faiane (22), and Nanai (24) would really make a difference to a team that had a lot of narrow losses.
It really is a young team.
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@tim Sure - but he hasnt been picked up by anyone else - he's been in the Blues for 3 years so they know him well - they've essentially selected Tua over him - Tua has come through the Blues development team so they know him well too.
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@kiwimurph Well, I suspect that Matty Johnson was picked over him. It's telling that no one else picked him, but given how well the Harbour backline went, it's a bit surprising.
Would you take Moala over him?
@tim Agreed on the youngsters growing.
I think they need some strong leadership. They need the likes of Tuipulotu, Ofa, Scrafton in the forwards, Pulu, SBW and Duffie in the backs - to help Kaino and Parsons with the leadership - on and off the field.
I'm realistic - I expect another season just like the last two under Tana - but at least this season they have a real talent at 10 - and that's exciting.
Yes Moala is an interesting case - as some of the suggested 23s above note, I'd like to see him have a bench role where he can come off the pine and provide some impact. He's not quick enough for a winger but he doesn't have the distribution (vision or skills) for midfield. I'm hoping he gets pushed by the other midfielders for game time but not that confident in Tana to get the mix right.
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@tim Agreed on the youngsters growing.
I think they need some strong leadership. They need the likes of Tuipulotu, Ofa, Scrafton in the forwards, Pulu, SBW and Duffie in the backs - to help Kaino and Parsons with the leadership - on and off the field.
I'm realistic - I expect another season just like the last two under Tana - but at least this season they have a real talent at 10 - and that's exciting.
Yes Moala is an interesting case - as some of the suggested 23s above note, I'd like to see him have a bench role where he can come off the pine and provide some impact. He's not quick enough for a winger but he doesn't have the distribution (vision or skills) for midfield. I'm hoping he gets pushed by the other midfielders for game time but not that confident in Tana to get the mix right.
@kiwimurph If he can't make the playoffs, and finish 4th or higher in the NZ conference, then he will rightly be fired. Three years is plenty of time to put together a decent team. All future coaches must have a big win under their belt before applying.
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@kiwimurph If he can't make the playoffs, and finish 4th or higher in the NZ conference, then he will rightly be fired. Three years is plenty of time to put together a decent team. All future coaches must have a big win under their belt before applying.
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@kiwimurph If he can't make the playoffs, and finish 4th or higher in the NZ conference, then he will rightly be fired. Three years is plenty of time to put together a decent team. All future coaches must have a big win under their belt before applying.
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@tim Normally I'd say that's tough given the dog squads the Blues can pull together these days, but I think that the Chiefs and Highlanders have a drop off in squad strength which makes top 4 a realistic goal for the Blues.
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@kiwimurph If he can't make the playoffs, and finish 4th or higher in the NZ conference, then he will rightly be fired. Three years is plenty of time to put together a decent team. All future coaches must have a big win under their belt before applying.
@tim I think Tana will be given plenty of latitude, not least because the Blues will be looking at stability given the chopping and changing of coaches over recent years, barring a major capitulation (losing to Sunwolves again...) and finishing in the bottom few, I cant see him getting the flick.
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@tim said in Blues 2018:
Likely XXIII:
- Hodgman
- Parsons
- Tu'ungafasi
- Tuipulotu
- Scrafton
- Kaino
- Gibson
- Ioane
- Pulu
- Perofeta
-- now the speculation starts -- - Ioane
- Faiane
- SBW
- Nanai
- Duffie
-- reserves are more predictable -- - Moulds
- Manu
- Tamoaieta
- Cowley-Tuioti
- Pryor/Papali'i/Taramai
- Nock
- Gatland
- Moala
Key question for the starting line-up: when is Scrafton back from injury. We rely on him heavily for set piece proficiency and organisation. We need an able replacement for that role.
I really like those tight-five replacements to put some heat on at set-piece in the 2nd half. It'd be great to have a ball-carrying 8 on the bench, especially with Kaino likely to have a lighter workload.
Midfield combo will be a big selection question. A lot of talent outside them.
Pulu's form may be the key. Really hoping for a big year from Nock.
Tana Umaga will surely include Collins somewhere.
@cgrant said in Blues 2018:
@tim said in Blues 2018:
Likely XXIII:
- Hodgman
- Parsons
- Tu'ungafasi
- Tuipulotu
- Scrafton
- Kaino
- Gibson
- Ioane
- Pulu
- Perofeta
-- now the speculation starts -- - Ioane
- Faiane
- SBW
- Nanai
- Duffie
-- reserves are more predictable -- - Moulds
- Manu
- Tamoaieta
- Cowley-Tuioti
- Pryor/Papali'i/Taramai
- Nock
- Gatland
- Moala
Key question for the starting line-up: when is Scrafton back from injury. We rely on him heavily for set piece proficiency and organisation. We need an able replacement for that role.
I really like those tight-five replacements to put some heat on at set-piece in the 2nd half. It'd be great to have a ball-carrying 8 on the bench, especially with Kaino likely to have a lighter workload.
Midfield combo will be a big selection question. A lot of talent outside them.
Pulu's form may be the key. Really hoping for a big year from Nock.
Tana Umaga will surely include Collins somewhere.
Yup. With Collins in there, I would go with:
- Nanai
- SBW
- Ioane
- Duffie
- Collins
Hopefully Collins will improve like Duffie.
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Maybe the selectors see in Ofa T a LHP rather than a THP as the cupboard is rather bare on the left side of the scrum (Moody, Hames and an ageing Crockett) while there are best THP than him (Franks, Laulala with Moli and Fidow developping well).
Hodgman should have a great year and I expect him to make the ABs very soon.
Salmon is a good prospect. He did well when Ta$man had their first choice THP injured. He's far more athletic than Tamoaieta and Mafileo who don't look suited to the rythm of SR. -
Reserve judgement on the last two until you see what training full time in a professional environment under close supervision by the trainers can do. You can see the super players are a fair way ahead fitness and physique-wise of the standard Mitre10 Cup players during that competition so give them a chance please.
