England vs All Blacks
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@akan004 given that white line isnt at the last mans feet anyway...
BUt I thought they changed the rule, was it this year or last year where your body is supposed to be behind the offside line (obviously not exactly policed very well) rather than just standing behind it?
@taniwharugby I'm confused with where the offside line is tbh. My understanding is if it's a ruck, then the offside line is deemed to be at the hindmost point of your own player, but if it's a tackle then it has to be at the hindmost of any player involved. Not sure if this is a tackle or a ruck or whether it started of as a ruck and then became a tackle.
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@taniwharugby I'm confused with where the offside line is tbh. My understanding is if it's a ruck, then the offside line is deemed to be at the hindmost point of your own player, but if it's a tackle then it has to be at the hindmost of any player involved. Not sure if this is a tackle or a ruck or whether it started of as a ruck and then became a tackle.
@akan004 but in both cases, any player or his own, it is to the left of the white line as you can see the English foot/arm on the ground to the left of Lawes' leg.
@Stargazer posted the appropriate rule/law about 24 hours ago in this thread if you feel compelled ot seek it out
Apparently this one is a tackle, not a ruck, so much for Garces to compute; off side, not off side, accidental off side, penalty no penalty, which one do I have deals on :exploding_head:
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@akan004 but in both cases, any player or his own, it is to the left of the white line as you can see the English foot/arm on the ground to the left of Lawes' leg.
@Stargazer posted the appropriate rule/law about 24 hours ago in this thread if you feel compelled ot seek it out
Apparently this one is a tackle, not a ruck, so much for Garces to compute; off side, not off side, accidental off side, penalty no penalty, which one do I have deals on :exploding_head:
@taniwharugby Yeah I saw Stargazer's post and I agree with it if it's deemed to be a tackle. Just wasn't sure if this was a tackle or a ruck. Seems like it's a tackle.
Do you have any idea if they measure the offside from the offside line to where Lawes' right arm is or just his right foot? Cheers.
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My attempt. From the wide angle, as every thing I am seeing is from the deceptive close view, (and it still looks offside)
Deliberately chose yellow for the photo-shopped line ....
Even from a ruck 5m of the halfway line where the camera is positioned. Look at the difference in angles of the halfway line and the mown line. I have tracked the yellow line against the mower line
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@jegga s favourite coach has given us a staggeringly ( for him ) accurate and magnanimous ( once you stop choking from shock ) insight.
The worlds biggest cockwomble coach said they fucked it..... That's good enough for me. Lets move on, when are they naming the team for Ireland ?
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@jegga s favourite coach has given us a staggeringly ( for him ) accurate and magnanimous ( once you stop choking from shock ) insight.
The worlds biggest cockwomble coach said they fucked it..... That's good enough for me. Lets move on, when are they naming the team for Ireland ?
@mn5 said in England vs All Blacks:
@jegga s favourite coach has given us a staggeringly ( for him ) accurate and magnanimous ( once you stop choking from shock ) insight.
The worlds biggest cockwomble coach said they fucked it..... That's good enough for me. Lets move on, when are they naming the team for Ireland ?
Get fucked ,even a stopped clock is right twice a day.
No one in their right mind will hire him as a coach now so he’s trying to make himself into some sort of comments man . Trouble is he looks and sounds like the sort of person who has a freezer in his garden shed full of women’s feet. -
@taniwharugby Yeah I saw Stargazer's post and I agree with it if it's deemed to be a tackle. Just wasn't sure if this was a tackle or a ruck. Seems like it's a tackle.
Do you have any idea if they measure the offside from the offside line to where Lawes' right arm is or just his right foot? Cheers.
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Only just watched my recording of the game. After reading this tgread and various things in the media i was expecting a totally different game.
What i saw was a dreary, wet kick fest. Other than being fired up for 20 mins and taking two chances well England offered fuck all. The two Mauls that ended up with a knock on were the only times they looked remotely threatening.
For the ABs i saw 30 mins of rubbish tactics of kicking everything. Worse still it was poorly executed. Crotty was clearly given a message to take out with him which was stop kicking the fucking thing away.
Nobody really played poorly IMO, kicking aside.
A Smith wasn't as bad as some have said. Poor kicking at times and the pass to Ardie. But Ardie should have caught that or not have been so flat.SBW also gets judge fucking harshly. I was expecting a shocker. He dropped one poor pass and dropped the high ball as he got a white shoulder in his back. There was also a nothing kick but that was clearly a team tactic given everyone was doing it. What exactly did people expect from him? His propensity to get injured half way through a game is a big problem. However that should count Crotty, Squire, Moody and Coles out too.
Crotty in particular showed he is still valuable after being written off on here lately.
Dmac was a bit of a mixed bag. Some good cleaning up and a few good runs but his ball security was poor and he was partly to blame for the first england try.
Anyway hopefully the weather isn't shit for the Ireland game.
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@taniwharugby I'm confused with where the offside line is tbh. My understanding is if it's a ruck, then the offside line is deemed to be at the hindmost point of your own player, but if it's a tackle then it has to be at the hindmost of any player involved. Not sure if this is a tackle or a ruck or whether it started of as a ruck and then became a tackle.
@akan004 said in England vs All Blacks:
@taniwharugby I'm confused with where the offside line is tbh. My understanding is if it's a ruck, then the offside line is deemed to be at the hindmost point of your own player, but if it's a tackle then it has to be at the hindmost of any player involved. Not sure if this is a tackle or a ruck or whether it started of as a ruck and then became a tackle.
One of the problems, at least from my armchair, is that the refs are giving a running commentary on the field - “hands off” “its a ruck” “back number 7”, motioning to players to get back on side etc etc.
I’m not against communication between ref and players and helping the game flow, but I think it’s gone too far and on for too long. So as experimental changes and trials have occurred, the refs are talking more - not less.
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@akan004 said in England vs All Blacks:
@taniwharugby I'm confused with where the offside line is tbh. My understanding is if it's a ruck, then the offside line is deemed to be at the hindmost point of your own player, but if it's a tackle then it has to be at the hindmost of any player involved. Not sure if this is a tackle or a ruck or whether it started of as a ruck and then became a tackle.
One of the problems, at least from my armchair, is that the refs are giving a running commentary on the field - “hands off” “its a ruck” “back number 7”, motioning to players to get back on side etc etc.
I’m not against communication between ref and players and helping the game flow, but I think it’s gone too far and on for too long. So as experimental changes and trials have occurred, the refs are talking more - not less.
@act-crusader said in England vs All Blacks:
I’m not against communication between ref and players and helping the game flow, but I think it’s gone too far and on for too long. So as experimental changes and trials have occurred, the refs are talking more - not less.
The last scrum of the match, a collapsed mess, and Garcess shouting at Underhill to stay bound and actually pushing him back to just a little bit less offside. Had me thinking "how did we get here?" Helicopter refs.
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My attempt. From the wide angle, as every thing I am seeing is from the deceptive close view, (and it still looks offside)
Deliberately chose yellow for the photo-shopped line ....
Even from a ruck 5m of the halfway line where the camera is positioned. Look at the difference in angles of the halfway line and the mown line. I have tracked the yellow line against the mower line
@rapido said in England vs All Blacks:
My attempt. From the wide angle, as every thing I am seeing is from the deceptive close view, (and it still looks offside)
Deliberately chose yellow for the photo-shopped line ....
Even from a ruck 5m of the halfway line where the camera is positioned. Look at the difference in angles of the halfway line and the mown line. I have tracked the yellow line against the mower line
I’d love to know the formulas you used to ensure angles, measurements and scale were accounted for when drawing that yellow line on that 2D image
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@rapido said in England vs All Blacks:
My attempt. From the wide angle, as every thing I am seeing is from the deceptive close view, (and it still looks offside)
Deliberately chose yellow for the photo-shopped line ....
Even from a ruck 5m of the halfway line where the camera is positioned. Look at the difference in angles of the halfway line and the mown line. I have tracked the yellow line against the mower line
I’d love to know the formulas you used to ensure angles, measurements and scale were accounted for when drawing that yellow line on that 2D image
@act-crusader said in England vs All Blacks:
@rapido said in England vs All Blacks:
My attempt. From the wide angle, as every thing I am seeing is from the deceptive close view, (and it still looks offside)
Deliberately chose yellow for the photo-shopped line ....
Even from a ruck 5m of the halfway line where the camera is positioned. Look at the difference in angles of the halfway line and the mown line. I have tracked the yellow line against the mower line
I’d love to know the formulas you used to ensure angles, measurements and scale were accounted for when drawing that yellow line on that 2D image
It's easy to do - draw numerous equally space perpendicular lines. Overlay and warp the corners so that they're pinned at the top (halfway line and 10m line crossing the touch line), adjust at other end so that the outside lines overlay the painted lines on the field.
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I haven't seen any link to GT12s write-up on the front page?
It's an interesting read.
https://www.thesilverfern.com/2018/11/11/phew-abs-escape-on-armistice-day/
Hopefully 'interesting' includes 'good' in some way
I had another rewatch of the first 20 odd minutes, and we really started poorly. We gave them possession in our half twice (BBBR drop, Taylor overthrow), and both times they scored points. On that first try, it looks to me like SBW makes the wrong read and goes back across field, leaving us short to cover the left side. No idea why he did that as it left Rieko lost covering two men.
We missed some luck - if Dmac could have held the Barrett bomb (one of his only contestable kicks in the half), it would have been 8-7 after 16 minutes. Sadly, he dropped it.
It's certainly true that our box kicks were poor, but during that first 20, almost all of the aimless kicks came from Barrett (SBW had one shocker). The missed penalty touch is also a bit unforgivable, given the state of the match. Other errors gave England the ball too - such as Ardie losing the ball in the tackle to Itoje, and I saw another bad line out - looked like a missed lift (by Franks or Read, I couldn't quite see who was meant to be jumping). With the scrum only holding its ground, I'd say that our set piece was actually another contributor to the poor start, and that's probably one reason why Taylor has got no MOTM votes - which is rare for him.
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Only just watched my recording of the game. After reading this tgread and various things in the media i was expecting a totally different game.
What i saw was a dreary, wet kick fest. Other than being fired up for 20 mins and taking two chances well England offered fuck all. The two Mauls that ended up with a knock on were the only times they looked remotely threatening.
For the ABs i saw 30 mins of rubbish tactics of kicking everything. Worse still it was poorly executed. Crotty was clearly given a message to take out with him which was stop kicking the fucking thing away.
Nobody really played poorly IMO, kicking aside.
A Smith wasn't as bad as some have said. Poor kicking at times and the pass to Ardie. But Ardie should have caught that or not have been so flat.SBW also gets judge fucking harshly. I was expecting a shocker. He dropped one poor pass and dropped the high ball as he got a white shoulder in his back. There was also a nothing kick but that was clearly a team tactic given everyone was doing it. What exactly did people expect from him? His propensity to get injured half way through a game is a big problem. However that should count Crotty, Squire, Moody and Coles out too.
Crotty in particular showed he is still valuable after being written off on here lately.
Dmac was a bit of a mixed bag. Some good cleaning up and a few good runs but his ball security was poor and he was partly to blame for the first england try.
Anyway hopefully the weather isn't shit for the Ireland game.
@pukunui said in England vs All Blacks:
Only just watched my recording of the game. After reading this tgread and various things in the media i was expecting a totally different game.
What i saw was a dreary, wet kick fest. Other than being fired up for 20 mins and taking two chances well England offered fuck all. The two Mauls that ended up with a knock on were the only times they looked remotely threatening.
For the ABs i saw 30 mins of rubbish tactics of kicking everything. Worse still it was poorly executed. Crotty was clearly given a message to take out with him which was stop kicking the fucking thing away.
Nobody really played poorly IMO, kicking aside.
A Smith wasn't as bad as some have said. Poor kicking at times and the pass to Ardie. But Ardie should have caught that or not have been so flat.SBW also gets judge fucking harshly. I was expecting a shocker. He dropped one poor pass and dropped the high ball as he got a white shoulder in his back. There was also a nothing kick but that was clearly a team tactic given everyone was doing it. What exactly did people expect from him? His propensity to get injured half way through a game is a big problem. However that should count Crotty, Squire, Moody and Coles out too.
Crotty in particular showed he is still valuable after being written off on here lately.
Dmac was a bit of a mixed bag. Some good cleaning up and a few good runs but his ball security was poor and he was partly to blame for the first england try.
Anyway hopefully the weather isn't shit for the Ireland game.
I seem to recall an earlier post where some wise person pointed out something similar.
But but but favouritism, money, contracts, reputation and being expected to win the match on his own, as opposed to just being effective, a strong ball runner and hole puncher and defensive bulwark, means drop him from as great a height as possible.
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Only just watched my recording of the game. After reading this tgread and various things in the media i was expecting a totally different game.
What i saw was a dreary, wet kick fest. Other than being fired up for 20 mins and taking two chances well England offered fuck all. The two Mauls that ended up with a knock on were the only times they looked remotely threatening.
For the ABs i saw 30 mins of rubbish tactics of kicking everything. Worse still it was poorly executed. Crotty was clearly given a message to take out with him which was stop kicking the fucking thing away.
Nobody really played poorly IMO, kicking aside.
A Smith wasn't as bad as some have said. Poor kicking at times and the pass to Ardie. But Ardie should have caught that or not have been so flat.SBW also gets judge fucking harshly. I was expecting a shocker. He dropped one poor pass and dropped the high ball as he got a white shoulder in his back. There was also a nothing kick but that was clearly a team tactic given everyone was doing it. What exactly did people expect from him? His propensity to get injured half way through a game is a big problem. However that should count Crotty, Squire, Moody and Coles out too.
Crotty in particular showed he is still valuable after being written off on here lately.
Dmac was a bit of a mixed bag. Some good cleaning up and a few good runs but his ball security was poor and he was partly to blame for the first england try.
Anyway hopefully the weather isn't shit for the Ireland game.
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@pukunui said in England vs All Blacks:
Crotty in particular showed he is still valuable after being written off on here lately.
See comments above about Dubs. We fans write people off too early.
@booboo said in England vs All Blacks:
@pukunui said in England vs All Blacks:
Crotty in particular showed he is still valuable after being written off on here lately.
See comments above about Dubs. We fans write people off too early.
Except when we refuse to accept that a guy is actually past it.
See defenders of Julian Savea when it was clear he had lost his pace and was barely Super level.
And, weirdly, the coaches with NMS.
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The scrums weren't set properly all game. There was no engage and I think that helped the white team.
I was screaming at the ref but in the second half he rebuked both front rows for not keeping a space, saying " you guys don't want to keep a gap".
I'm a bit sympathetic (a bit) here because any decent scrum needs buy in from both teams but it really needed sorting out earlier.
We missed a trick there but England held a steady scrum throughout.
