2020 Māori All Blacks
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@kiwiinmelb I also don't have the answer, but my guess would be that a player must have New Zealand Maori heritage, not just Maori heritage. I don't think citizenship changes that. Cook Islands and NZ are still different countries, despite Cook Islanders being entitled to NZ citizenship.
@Yeetyaah said in 2020 Māori All Blacks:
@kiwiinmelb no. Imagine saying all Pākeha are eligible for selection for the English team? It's a completely different country and the languages do have differences.
Not all Pakeha. Not all of them have English or even UK heritage, but I'm inclined to agree with the "no".
@Stargazer said in 2020 Māori All Blacks:
Not all Pakeha. Not all of them have English or even UK heritage
Part of my point.
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pretty sweet jersey
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@Yeetyaah said in 2020 Māori All Blacks:
@kiwiinmelb no. Imagine saying all Pākeha are eligible for selection for the English team? It's a completely different country and the languages do have differences.
So does a Cook Islands Maori have Maori whakapapa ?
Genuine question because I don’t know , not saying you are wrong by the way.
My understanding is he must have that plus be a representative of New Zealand rugby union and have Maori whakapapa .
Very different to English selection
@kiwiinmelb said in 2020 Māori All Blacks:
@Yeetyaah said in 2020 Māori All Blacks:
@kiwiinmelb no. Imagine saying all Pākeha are eligible for selection for the English team? It's a completely different country and the languages do have differences.
So does a Cook Islands Maori have Maori whakapapa ?
Genuine question because I don’t know , not saying you are wrong by the way.
My understanding is he must have that plus be a representative of New Zealand rugby union and have Maori whakapapa .
Very different to English selection
As @Stargazer notes - no. Don't let the term 'Maori' fool you, best just to think of them as Cook Islanders/Cookies, like Samoans and Tongans.
The only way they're eligible for the NZ Maori team is if they have NZ Maori whakapapa as well.
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So we can scratch Leni Apisai and Josh Ioane from the list of potential Maori All Blacks for this game.
@Stargazer said in 2020 Māori All Blacks:
So we can scratch Leni Apisai and Josh Ioane from the list of potential Maori All Blacks for this game.
I wonder if they got to choose or if they were assigned one squad or the other?
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That's a bloody good Pacifica team they've put together!!!
It's a wonder that they don't also pick a 'NZ European' or 'safe skinny white boy' team to give the Maori All Blacks another game.... probably don't want to risk being seen as racist though huh?
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His Wellington profile doesn't provide any info. On his Highlanders profile (in the video), he says that he's from Raratonga, Cook Islands, but that he grew up in Auckland.
On his Facebook profile, home is Cook Islands.
On his Instagram profile, he only has the Cook Island flag.I haven't been able to find an official profile (from a team or his) that says he's (NZ) Maori.
I guess we'll have to wait and see.@Stargazer said in 2020 Māori All Blacks:
His Wellington profile doesn't provide any info. On his Highlanders profile (in the video), he says that he's from Raratonga, Cook Islands, but that he grew up in Auckland.
On his Facebook profile, home is Cook Islands.
On his Instagram profile, he only has the Cook Island flag.I haven't been able to find an official profile (from a team or his) that says he's (NZ) Maori.
I guess we'll have to wait and see.Checked with my Rarotongan flatmate last night and he has recanted on TBN's eligibility just a smidgeon. He did say that TBN's great grandfather (or probably great great grandfather) was a NZ Maori that went to the Cook Islands in the late 1800s/early 1900s to help draft some sort of legal document assigning the Cook Islands people to the right to have NZ Citizenship etc. When questioned why, he (my flatmate is currently doing some sort of doctorate on the history of the Cook Islands) did say that the NZ Maori language and the CI native language is quite similar. So there it is TBN does have some NZ Maori heritage if my mate is to be believed.
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That's a bloody good Pacifica team they've put together!!!
It's a wonder that they don't also pick a 'NZ European' or 'safe skinny white boy' team to give the Maori All Blacks another game.... probably don't want to risk being seen as racist though huh?
@Gunner said in 2020 Māori All Blacks:
That's a bloody good Pacifica team they've put together!!!
It's a wonder that they don't also pick a 'NZ European' or 'safe skinny white boy' team to give the Maori All Blacks another game.... probably don't want to risk being seen as racist though huh?
I'd like to see a Non Maori/PI team to complete as well - I'm not sure why it would be seen as anymore "racist" than the current teams. Hell, they could just call it a NZ Baabaas team?
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@Stargazer said in 2020 Māori All Blacks:
His Wellington profile doesn't provide any info. On his Highlanders profile (in the video), he says that he's from Raratonga, Cook Islands, but that he grew up in Auckland.
On his Facebook profile, home is Cook Islands.
On his Instagram profile, he only has the Cook Island flag.I haven't been able to find an official profile (from a team or his) that says he's (NZ) Maori.
I guess we'll have to wait and see.Checked with my Rarotongan flatmate last night and he has recanted on TBN's eligibility just a smidgeon. He did say that TBN's great grandfather (or probably great great grandfather) was a NZ Maori that went to the Cook Islands in the late 1800s/early 1900s to help draft some sort of legal document assigning the Cook Islands people to the right to have NZ Citizenship etc. When questioned why, he (my flatmate is currently doing some sort of doctorate on the history of the Cook Islands) did say that the NZ Maori language and the CI native language is quite similar. So there it is TBN does have some NZ Maori heritage if my mate is to be believed.
@Higgins said in 2020 Māori All Blacks:
So there it is TBN does have some NZ Maori heritage if my mate is to be believed.
think they still need to be able to prove thier Whakapapa though, Ranger's whanau had claimed Maori heritage but I believe they couldnt prove it, making him ineligible.
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@Higgins said in 2020 Māori All Blacks:
So there it is TBN does have some NZ Maori heritage if my mate is to be believed.
think they still need to be able to prove thier Whakapapa though, Ranger's whanau had claimed Maori heritage but I believe they couldnt prove it, making him ineligible.
@taniwharugby said in 2020 Māori All Blacks:
@Higgins said in 2020 Māori All Blacks:
So there it is TBN does have some NZ Maori heritage if my mate is to be believed.
think they still need to be able to prove thier Whakapapa though, Ranger's whanau had claimed Maori heritage but I believe they couldnt prove it, making him ineligible.
If they know who the great great grandfather is then it should be pretty easy to prove.
Was Ranger's issue that they don't know his real parentage?
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@taniwharugby said in 2020 Māori All Blacks:
@Higgins said in 2020 Māori All Blacks:
So there it is TBN does have some NZ Maori heritage if my mate is to be believed.
think they still need to be able to prove thier Whakapapa though, Ranger's whanau had claimed Maori heritage but I believe they couldnt prove it, making him ineligible.
If they know who the great great grandfather is then it should be pretty easy to prove.
Was Ranger's issue that they don't know his real parentage?
@Nepia said in 2020 Māori All Blacks:
Ranger's issue that they don't know his real parentage?
no idea, was years back, just remember reading that it was all go but then they couldnt prove his Whakapapa.
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@Gunner said in 2020 Māori All Blacks:
That's a bloody good Pacifica team they've put together!!!
It's a wonder that they don't also pick a 'NZ European' or 'safe skinny white boy' team to give the Maori All Blacks another game.... probably don't want to risk being seen as racist though huh?
I'd like to see a Non Maori/PI team to complete as well - I'm not sure why it would be seen as anymore "racist" than the current teams. Hell, they could just call it a NZ Baabaas team?
@Nepia said in 2020 Māori All Blacks:
@Gunner said in 2020 Māori All Blacks:
That's a bloody good Pacifica team they've put together!!!
It's a wonder that they don't also pick a 'NZ European' or 'safe skinny white boy' team to give the Maori All Blacks another game.... probably don't want to risk being seen as racist though huh?
I'd like to see a Non Maori/PI team to complete as well - I'm not sure why it would be seen as anymore "racist" than the current teams. Hell, they could just call it a NZ Baabaas team?
My comment about being racist was a bit tongue in cheek
But seriously though, why not?
Who would make that team?
Contenders that I can quickly think of:- ????? Whoppa
- Coltman/Olsen
- ????? The long haired Otago prop
- Goodhue/Dickson
- Pierce
- Robinson
- Hunt/Boshier
- Matich
- Christie/Roe
- Smith/Gatland
- Gregory
- Collins
- Hyland
I'll be missing some obvious choices, as I say that was very quickly off the top of my head (and probably biased towards Northland)
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@Stargazer maybe because hes played for the ABS?
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@Nepia said in 2020 Māori All Blacks:
@Gunner said in 2020 Māori All Blacks:
That's a bloody good Pacifica team they've put together!!!
It's a wonder that they don't also pick a 'NZ European' or 'safe skinny white boy' team to give the Maori All Blacks another game.... probably don't want to risk being seen as racist though huh?
I'd like to see a Non Maori/PI team to complete as well - I'm not sure why it would be seen as anymore "racist" than the current teams. Hell, they could just call it a NZ Baabaas team?
My comment about being racist was a bit tongue in cheek
But seriously though, why not?
Who would make that team?
Contenders that I can quickly think of:- ????? Whoppa
- Coltman/Olsen
- ????? The long haired Otago prop
- Goodhue/Dickson
- Pierce
- Robinson
- Hunt/Boshier
- Matich
- Christie/Roe
- Smith/Gatland
- Gregory
- Collins
- Hyland
I'll be missing some obvious choices, as I say that was very quickly off the top of my head (and probably biased towards Northland)
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@Nepia said in 2020 Māori All Blacks:
@Gunner said in 2020 Māori All Blacks:
That's a bloody good Pacifica team they've put together!!!
It's a wonder that they don't also pick a 'NZ European' or 'safe skinny white boy' team to give the Maori All Blacks another game.... probably don't want to risk being seen as racist though huh?
I'd like to see a Non Maori/PI team to complete as well - I'm not sure why it would be seen as anymore "racist" than the current teams. Hell, they could just call it a NZ Baabaas team?
My comment about being racist was a bit tongue in cheek
But seriously though, why not?
Who would make that team?
Contenders that I can quickly think of:- ????? Whoppa
- Coltman/Olsen
- ????? The long haired Otago prop
- Goodhue/Dickson
- Pierce
- Robinson
- Hunt/Boshier
- Matich
- Christie/Roe
- Smith/Gatland
- Gregory
- Collins
- Hyland
I'll be missing some obvious choices, as I say that was very quickly off the top of my head (and probably biased towards Northland)
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@kiwiinmelb said in 2020 Māori All Blacks:
@Yeetyaah said in 2020 Māori All Blacks:
@kiwiinmelb no. Imagine saying all Pākeha are eligible for selection for the English team? It's a completely different country and the languages do have differences.
So does a Cook Islands Maori have Maori whakapapa ?
Genuine question because I don’t know , not saying you are wrong by the way.
My understanding is he must have that plus be a representative of New Zealand rugby union and have Maori whakapapa .
Very different to English selection
As @Stargazer notes - no. Don't let the term 'Maori' fool you, best just to think of them as Cook Islanders/Cookies, like Samoans and Tongans.
The only way they're eligible for the NZ Maori team is if they have NZ Maori whakapapa as well.
@Nepia thank you, that was my understanding.
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The Māori All Blacks squad is (with Province, Super Rugby Club, and Iwi):
*asterisk denotes new caps
Props
Josh Hohneck, Otago, Ngāti Manuhiri/Ngāti Whātua
Pouri Rakete-Stones, Hawkes Bay/Hurricanes, Ngāpuhi
Marcel Renata, Auckland/Blues, Ngāti Whānaunga/Ngāi Takoto
*Tamaiti Williams, Canterbury, NgāpuhiHookers
Ash Dixon (c), Hawkes Bay/Highlanders, Ngāti Tahinga
*Kurt Eklund, Bay of Plenty/Blues, NgāpuhiLocks
*Manaaki Selby-Rickit, Southland/Highlanders, Ngāti Raukawa
Isaia Walker-Leawere, Hawkes Bay/Hurricanes, Ngāti PorouLoose Forwards
Billy Harmon, Canterbury/Crusaders, Ngāi Tahu
Reed Prinsep, Canterbury/Hurricanes, Te Rārawa
Liam Messam, Waikato, Ngāi Tuhoe
Whetukamokamo Douglas, Canterbury/Crusaders, Ngāti Porou/Ngāti Whakaue
*Ethan Roots, North Harbour/Crusaders, Ngāti KahungunuHalf Backs
Bryn Hall, North Harbour/Crusaders, Ngāti Ranginui
Te Toiroa Tahuriorangi, Bay of Plenty/Chiefs, Ngāti PikiaoFirst five-eighths
Otere Black, Bay of Plenty/Blues, Ngāi Tuhoe/Te Whānau ā Apanui/Ngāti Tūwharetoa
Fletcher Smith, Waikato/Hurricanes, Ngāti KahungunuMidfield
*Billy Proctor, Wellington/Hurricanes, Ngai Te Rangi/Ngāpuhi
*Rameka Poihipi, Canterbury, Ngāti Whakaue
*Quinn Tupaea, Waikato/Chiefs, Waikato/TainuiOutside Backs
Sean Wainui, Taranaki/Chiefs, Ngāi Tuhoe/Te Āitanga a Māhaki/Ngā Arikikaiputahi/Ngāti Porou
Shaun Stevenson, North Harbour/Chiefs, Ngāpuhi
Jonah Lowe, Hawkes Bay/Hurricanes, Ngāti Pikiao
*Kaleb Trask, Bay of Plenty/Chiefs, Ngāpuhi
Head Coach: Clayton, McMillan, Ngāi Te Rangi/Ngāi Tamawhariua/Te Rangaihouhiri
Assistant Coaches: Roger Randle, Ngāti Awa; Tony Brown (Ngāpuhi)https://www.allblacks.com/news/maori-all-blacks-squad-announced-to-play-moana-pasifika-in-hamilton/
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The biggest surprises to me are Eklund and Trask, because I didn't know they have Maori ancestry.
