All Blacks 2022
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I think we just need to use our props better rather than it being about ball running. Owen wasn’t a big ball runner (might surprise a few on here), but he had good hands so he would get in at first receiver and make pop passes to our locks or loosies to vary the attack, plus he was there for the next clean out. It was pretty effective for our go forward.
Sure they will be called upon to carry and provide something there, but there are other positive ways to use them without compromising our set piece.
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I think we just need to use our props better rather than it being about ball running. Owen wasn’t a big ball runner (might surprise a few on here), but he had good hands so he would get in at first receiver and make pop passes to our locks or loosies to vary the attack, plus he was there for the next clean out. It was pretty effective for our go forward.
Sure they will be called upon to carry and provide something there, but there are other positive ways to use them without compromising our set piece.
@ACT-Crusader said in All Blacks 2022:
I think we just need to use our props better rather than it being just about ball running. Owen wasn’t a big ball runner (might surprise a few on here), but he had good hands so he would get in at first receiver and make pop passes to our locks or loosies to vary the attack, plus he was there for the next clean out. It was pretty effective for our go forward.
Sure they will be called upon to carry and provide something there, but there are other positive ways to use them without compromising our set piece.
Owen shifted bodies at rucks beautifully. If our props aren't used for carrying, they need to be told their job is to get there quick and shift the opposition to give us the quick ball our game needs.
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@Stargazer said in All Blacks 2022:
@WillieTheWaiter Maybe it's just for the July Series, and they may go for a different selection for the Rugby Championship/Bledisloe Cup?
its a consideration the question would be why tho?!
only 18 games til the WC
@WillieTheWaiter said in All Blacks 2022:
@Stargazer said in All Blacks 2022:
@WillieTheWaiter Maybe it's just for the July Series, and they may go for a different selection for the Rugby Championship/Bledisloe Cup?
its a consideration the question would be why tho?!
only 18 games til the WC
Because there's very little time to prepare for the Steinlager Series?
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I think we just need to use our props better rather than it being about ball running. Owen wasn’t a big ball runner (might surprise a few on here), but he had good hands so he would get in at first receiver and make pop passes to our locks or loosies to vary the attack, plus he was there for the next clean out. It was pretty effective for our go forward.
Sure they will be called upon to carry and provide something there, but there are other positive ways to use them without compromising our set piece.
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@ACT-Crusader those pop passes are getting too predictable and would prefer to see the fatties hitting the line a relative pace. Always liked how the Aussie props run onto then ball.
@broughie said in All Blacks 2022:
@ACT-Crusader those pop passes are getting too predictable and would prefer to see the fatties hitting the line a relative pace. Always liked how the Aussie props run onto then ball.
We’ve hardly used the pop pass in the last two years. Fatties running on to the ball is only good after quick ball or else they are just running into a wall and most do not have an offload game.
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I'm not a Bower fan, but anyone who thinks he can't run, should have a look at the highlights of the Crusaders v Chiefs SF. That's just one example and there have been more, but he can run with the ball. Unfortunately, he also suffers from the occasional flair-up of BradShieditis (translation: soap on his hands).
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What the absolute fuck. Karl T plays 60 minutes all season and gets in ahead of De Groot and Hodgman. Absoute bullshit.
@number9 agree about Karl T, his form has been patchy and he’s heading overseas
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On Angus Ta’avao, I don’t believe he’s an international class tighthead prop , thought he was average when he first made the Blues, improved when he went to the Warratahs, but in my opinion is no better than super level ..would get eaten by most international loose head props ..De Groot and Fletcher Newall would have been in my team ..
Callum Grace who has been the best lineout forward on his own ball is bloody unlucky , been superb at number 8. -
QUESTIONS!
Who do you think will be in the 23 for the first test if everyone is available?
Who would you pick from this squad for the 23 for the first test if everyone is available?
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@broughie said in All Blacks 2022:
@ACT-Crusader those pop passes are getting too predictable and would prefer to see the fatties hitting the line a relative pace. Always liked how the Aussie props run onto then ball.
We’ve hardly used the pop pass in the last two years. Fatties running on to the ball is only good after quick ball or else they are just running into a wall and most do not have an offload game.
@ACT-Crusader I don’t think the pop pass has gone away. Spent plenty of time yelling at the TV over its use or overuse. And their job, in my book, is to dent the line so perhaps, quick ball or not, they need to get their sorry asses in position. The Aussies can do it.
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@Kirwan said in All Blacks 2022:
@Chris said in All Blacks 2022:
With those prop selections we don't seem to be addressing the lack of ball running ability problem from last season.
Is this going to be more of the same the backs taken out of the game by us not getting over the gain line up front.
PGS there for that I suppose but won't start ahead of Ardie,RTS,LF will not get much game time it looks a lot like last year to me.The 23 looks like it will not change from last season.PGS will be the backup six to Akira, IMO. If they start ST instead of Taylor, and with Ofa's improved ball running/fitness (probably from the bench) you have two great ball running options just from the front row.
Akira/Ardie/Cane with Dalton on the bench gives good options there too. Really the locks that have to up that area of the game, so a lot resting on Scott Barrett IMO.
Maybe, I just don't have much faith in Fosters and co's selections when it comes to the 23.I can see better options in the squad than what they might actually pick.
It will be interesting to see that first 23 for the first test v Ireland.
I think Barret is probably the no.1 lock ATM.@Chris said in All Blacks 2022:
@Kirwan said in All Blacks 2022:
@Chris said in All Blacks 2022:
With those prop selections we don't seem to be addressing the lack of ball running ability problem from last season.
Is this going to be more of the same the backs taken out of the game by us not getting over the gain line up front.
PGS there for that I suppose but won't start ahead of Ardie,RTS,LF will not get much game time it looks a lot like last year to me.The 23 looks like it will not change from last season.PGS will be the backup six to Akira, IMO. If they start ST instead of Taylor, and with Ofa's improved ball running/fitness (probably from the bench) you have two great ball running options just from the front row.
Akira/Ardie/Cane with Dalton on the bench gives good options there too. Really the locks that have to up that area of the game, so a lot resting on Scott Barrett IMO.
Maybe, I just don't have much faith in Fosters and co's selections when it comes to the 23.I can see better options in the squad than what they might actually pick.
It will be interesting to see that first 23 for the first test v Ireland.
I think Barret is probably the no.1 lock ATM.That he might be, but not much use to the team when he is sitting down for ten or twenty minutes thanks to the inevitable carding.
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With Bower, the problem is his inconsistent scrummaging, not what he does around the field. It will be interesting to see which LH props are selected for the 1st test. Tu'inukuafe has to start, or not be in the 23.
@Bovidae said in All Blacks 2022:
With Bower, the problem is his inconsistent scrummaging, not what he does around the field. It will be interesting to see which LH props are selected for the 1st test. Tu'inukuafe has to start, or not be in the 23.
I'm thinking a fairly conservative start with the bench options to see what difference can be made. May as well take last year's lot, see how they stack up and provide some opportunities for others. If all goes well can change things up next time with the starters (eg RM or SB) and bench (eg Sotutu)
Karl Tu’inukuafe, Samisoni Taukeiaho, Nepo Laulala,
Brodie Retallick, Sam Whitelock
Sam Cane (c), Akira Ioane, Ardie Savea,
Aaron Smith
Beauden Barrett
David Havili/ Quinn Tupaea, Rieko Ioane
Jordie Barrett, Caleb Clarke, Will Jordan
Bench: Aidan Ross, Ofa Tuungafasi, Codie Taylor, Tupou Vaa'i, Dalton Papalii, Folau Fakatava, Stephen Perofeta, Sevu Reece
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@number9 agree about Karl T, his form has been patchy and he’s heading overseas
️.
On Angus Ta’avao, I don’t believe he’s an international class tighthead prop , thought he was average when he first made the Blues, improved when he went to the Warratahs, but in my opinion is no better than super level ..would get eaten by most international loose head props ..De Groot and Fletcher Newall would have been in my team ..
Callum Grace who has been the best lineout forward on his own ball is bloody unlucky , been superb at number 8.@Steven-Harris said in All Blacks 2022:
@number9 agree about Karl T, his form has been patchy and he’s heading overseas
️.
On Angus Ta’avao, I don’t believe he’s an international class tighthead prop , thought he was average when he first made the Blues, improved when he went to the Warratahs, but in my opinion is no better than super level ..would get eaten by most international loose head props ..Other than Australians I guess?
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@Chris said in All Blacks 2022:
@Kirwan said in All Blacks 2022:
@Chris said in All Blacks 2022:
With those prop selections we don't seem to be addressing the lack of ball running ability problem from last season.
Is this going to be more of the same the backs taken out of the game by us not getting over the gain line up front.
PGS there for that I suppose but won't start ahead of Ardie,RTS,LF will not get much game time it looks a lot like last year to me.The 23 looks like it will not change from last season.PGS will be the backup six to Akira, IMO. If they start ST instead of Taylor, and with Ofa's improved ball running/fitness (probably from the bench) you have two great ball running options just from the front row.
Akira/Ardie/Cane with Dalton on the bench gives good options there too. Really the locks that have to up that area of the game, so a lot resting on Scott Barrett IMO.
Maybe, I just don't have much faith in Fosters and co's selections when it comes to the 23.I can see better options in the squad than what they might actually pick.
It will be interesting to see that first 23 for the first test v Ireland.
I think Barret is probably the no.1 lock ATM.That he might be, but not much use to the team when he is sitting down for ten or twenty minutes thanks to the inevitable carding.
@Higgins said in All Blacks 2022:
@Chris said in All Blacks 2022:
@Kirwan said in All Blacks 2022:
@Chris said in All Blacks 2022:
With those prop selections we don't seem to be addressing the lack of ball running ability problem from last season.
Is this going to be more of the same the backs taken out of the game by us not getting over the gain line up front.
PGS there for that I suppose but won't start ahead of Ardie,RTS,LF will not get much game time it looks a lot like last year to me.The 23 looks like it will not change from last season.PGS will be the backup six to Akira, IMO. If they start ST instead of Taylor, and with Ofa's improved ball running/fitness (probably from the bench) you have two great ball running options just from the front row.
Akira/Ardie/Cane with Dalton on the bench gives good options there too. Really the locks that have to up that area of the game, so a lot resting on Scott Barrett IMO.
Maybe, I just don't have much faith in Fosters and co's selections when it comes to the 23.I can see better options in the squad than what they might actually pick.
It will be interesting to see that first 23 for the first test v Ireland.
I think Barret is probably the no.1 lock ATM.That he might be, but not much use to the team when he is sitting down for ten or twenty minutes thanks to the inevitable carding.
he seems to have adjusted the tackling technique for one, I noticed last week all his 20 plus tackles were below the hips.
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@Steven-Harris said in All Blacks 2022:
@number9 agree about Karl T, his form has been patchy and he’s heading overseas
️.
On Angus Ta’avao, I don’t believe he’s an international class tighthead prop , thought he was average when he first made the Blues, improved when he went to the Warratahs, but in my opinion is no better than super level ..would get eaten by most international loose head props ..Other than Australians I guess?
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@Crucial I would be nervous as hell going into RWC ,QF,Semi or Final with Angus on the bench no matter whom we were up against ..
@Steven-Harris You could say the same about Ofa as he regularly gets penalised in the scrum.
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Karl T, ST, Laulala
Whitelock, SB
AI, Sotutu, Paps
Smith
BB, RTS, RI
Jordan, JB, ReeceOT, Ta'avao, Coles, BBBR, Savea, Tupaea, Fakatava, Mounga
Unlikely to be anywhere close to the 23 but given the squad that is the team I would put out there.
Hardest part was cover for RI should he go down early, who goes to 13? That made the reserves a bit tricky as Goodhue is the obvious cover but lacks pace and not sure the impact so went with Tupaea.
Also should probably have Cane in there but not sure he is back to full fitness mentally and in body.
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Karl T, ST, Laulala
Whitelock, SB
AI, Sotutu, Paps
Smith
BB, RTS, RI
Jordan, JB, ReeceOT, Ta'avao, Coles, BBBR, Savea, Tupaea, Fakatava, Mounga
Unlikely to be anywhere close to the 23 but given the squad that is the team I would put out there.
Hardest part was cover for RI should he go down early, who goes to 13? That made the reserves a bit tricky as Goodhue is the obvious cover but lacks pace and not sure the impact so went with Tupaea.
Also should probably have Cane in there but not sure he is back to full fitness mentally and in body.
@chimoaus said in All Blacks 2022:
Karl T, ST, Laulala
Whitelock, SB
AI, Sotutu, Paps
Smith
BB, RTS, RI
Jordan, JB, ReeceOT, Ta'avao, Coles, BBBR, Savea, Tupaea, Fakatava, Mounga
Unlikely to be anywhere close to the 23 but given the squad that is the team I would put out there.
Hardest part was cover for RI should he go down early, who goes to 13? That made the reserves a bit tricky as Goodhue is the obvious cover but lacks pace and not sure the impact so went with Tupaea.
Also should probably have Cane in there but not sure he is back to full fitness mentally and in body.
Why mentally? Seems an odd comment.
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@chimoaus said in All Blacks 2022:
Karl T, ST, Laulala
Whitelock, SB
AI, Sotutu, Paps
Smith
BB, RTS, RI
Jordan, JB, ReeceOT, Ta'avao, Coles, BBBR, Savea, Tupaea, Fakatava, Mounga
Unlikely to be anywhere close to the 23 but given the squad that is the team I would put out there.
Hardest part was cover for RI should he go down early, who goes to 13? That made the reserves a bit tricky as Goodhue is the obvious cover but lacks pace and not sure the impact so went with Tupaea.
Also should probably have Cane in there but not sure he is back to full fitness mentally and in body.
Why mentally? Seems an odd comment.
@Crucial said in All Blacks 2022:
@chimoaus said in All Blacks 2022:
Karl T, ST, Laulala
Whitelock, SB
AI, Sotutu, Paps
Smith
BB, RTS, RI
Jordan, JB, ReeceOT, Ta'avao, Coles, BBBR, Savea, Tupaea, Fakatava, Mounga
Unlikely to be anywhere close to the 23 but given the squad that is the team I would put out there.
Hardest part was cover for RI should he go down early, who goes to 13? That made the reserves a bit tricky as Goodhue is the obvious cover but lacks pace and not sure the impact so went with Tupaea.
Also should probably have Cane in there but not sure he is back to full fitness mentally and in body.
Why mentally? Seems an odd comment.
Dunno, just seems since his injury last year I just don't feel he has reached peak Cane and not sure if he believes it either. No evidence, just an armchair observation. I also found it very odd he was on the bench in a semi-final.
