Foster, Robertson etc
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@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Frank said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
Foster is a problem and Razor would be a better coach. I am not sure why you are doubting this.
I admire your absolute certainty, I really do. He's a great coach at SR level, but think about where we'd be if Robertson repeats his U20 record with the AB's.
What record are you speaking of exactly?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Zealand_national_under-20_rugby_union_team#Coaches
His 93% win-record across 2015/16 seasons
despite being only 40 & 41 at the time, and only having 2 years of head coaching experience at that stage, Robertson is 48 next month and has now had 11 years of experience as a head coach, in contrast Rennie was already 47 and was already a seasoned coach with 9 years of head coaching experience when he coached the NZ U20's, meanwhile Razor was just starting out & still holds the 2nd best record for long-term NZ U20 coaches, a record a lot better than Chris Boyd (60%) and others.Consider how much better of a coach Razor is now? Coaches typically peak around their late 40's until their mid 50's.
Robertson is a student of the game who's in dialogue with Eddie Jones, Craig Bellamy, Wayne Smith, O'Gara, etc..
He's always looking to improve & seeking alternative viewpoints from NH coaches, learnt & from the best and has genuinely honed his craft since starting off at Sumner. He's at least 3x times a better coach now than he was back in 2016.
@kiwi_expat said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
What record are you speaking of exactly?
His failure to get out of the Pool stages in 2016
....despite being only 40 & 41 at the time
Totally irrelevant - he was good enough to win in 2015 remember
I'm sure he's a student of the game who is in dialogue with other coaches all over the world, who's always looking to improve, and has honed his craft in the last 6 years. Hardly unique - just like every other top level coach in the world.
.
And just like every Test level in the world he can have a great record one year and a crap one the next. -
@Chris said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@kiwi_expat said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Frank said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
Foster is a problem and Razor would be a better coach. I am not sure why you are doubting this.
I admire your absolute certainty, I really do. He's a great coach at SR level, but think about where we'd be if Robertson repeats his U20 record with the AB's.
What record are you speaking of exactly?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Zealand_national_under-20_rugby_union_team#Coaches
His 93% win record across 2015/16
despite being only 40 & 41 at the time, and only having 2 years of head coaching experience at that stage, Robertson is 48 next month and has now had 11 years of experience as a head coach, in contrast Rennie was already 46 and was already a seasoned coach with 9 years of head coaching experience when he coached the NZ U20's, meanwhile Razor was just starting out & still holds the 2nd best record for long-term NZ U20 coaches, a record a lot better than Chris Boyd and others.Consider how much better of a coach Razor is now? Coaches typically peak around their late 40's until their mid 50's.
Robertson is a student of the game who's in dialogue with Eddie Jones, Craig Bellamy, Wayne Smith, O'Gara, etc..
He's always looking to improve & seeking alternative viewpoints from NH coaches, learnt & from the best and has genuinely honed his craft since starting off at Sumner. He's at least 3x times a better coach now than he was back in 2016.
2 u/20 World Cups won 1 out of 2 not the worst record.
And of course u/2os depends on the cycle of players you have year to year.Hardly sane for Victor Meldrew to judge Razor based solely on his results as a 40 year old with 2 years of professional coaching experience, fucking Lol...
@kiwi_expat said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Chris said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@kiwi_expat said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Frank said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
Foster is a problem and Razor would be a better coach. I am not sure why you are doubting this.
I admire your absolute certainty, I really do. He's a great coach at SR level, but think about where we'd be if Robertson repeats his U20 record with the AB's.
What record are you speaking of exactly?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Zealand_national_under-20_rugby_union_team#Coaches
His 93% win record across 2015/16
despite being only 40 & 41 at the time, and only having 2 years of head coaching experience at that stage, Robertson is 48 next month and has now had 11 years of experience as a head coach, in contrast Rennie was already 46 and was already a seasoned coach with 9 years of head coaching experience when he coached the NZ U20's, meanwhile Razor was just starting out & still holds the 2nd best record for long-term NZ U20 coaches, a record a lot better than Chris Boyd and others.Consider how much better of a coach Razor is now? Coaches typically peak around their late 40's until their mid 50's.
Robertson is a student of the game who's in dialogue with Eddie Jones, Craig Bellamy, Wayne Smith, O'Gara, etc..
He's always looking to improve & seeking alternative viewpoints from NH coaches, learnt & from the best and has genuinely honed his craft since starting off at Sumner. He's at least 3x times a better coach now than he was back in 2016.
2 u/20 World Cups won 1 out of 2 not the worst record.
And of course u/2os depends on the cycle of players you have year to year.Hardly sane for Victor Meldrew to judge Razor based solely on his results as a 40 year old with 2 years of professional coaching experience, fucking Lol...
Unaware I was judging him but pointing out his inexperience at Test level and the risk of failure a la 2016 .
But feel free to call anyone who questions the absolutist belief that Robertson is 100% guaranteed to solve all the problems, with zero risk of failure, insane if it make you feel better.
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Old misery guts Meldrew (his did choose his name and avatar btw) is over thinking this entirely. Even Blind Freddie can see that Razor is comfortably better than Foster. Yes there are wider issues within NZR rugby, but if you take the ABs in isolation then there are a number of improvements to be made with a more capable person as head coach, especially one who is regarded as arguably the best coach in the world (I’m not sure if that is true btw) and the hottest coaching ticket in town.
Effectively, Foster has 2 games to save his job (based on Robinsons comments). Win both games and he gets a stay of execution. Lose both and he is out. Has to be.
It is now or never for Foster. He has to pull out every ounce of his coaching ability to keep him in a job
Old misery guts Meldrew (his did choose his name and avatar btw)
Seriously weird comment. Who else did you think chose my name & avatar?
is over thinking this entirely
It's called analysing and debating the problem and discussing potential solutions and risks rather than believing in risk-free magic solutions.
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@kiwi_expat said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Chris said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@kiwi_expat said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Frank said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
Foster is a problem and Razor would be a better coach. I am not sure why you are doubting this.
I admire your absolute certainty, I really do. He's a great coach at SR level, but think about where we'd be if Robertson repeats his U20 record with the AB's.
What record are you speaking of exactly?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Zealand_national_under-20_rugby_union_team#Coaches
His 93% win record across 2015/16
despite being only 40 & 41 at the time, and only having 2 years of head coaching experience at that stage, Robertson is 48 next month and has now had 11 years of experience as a head coach, in contrast Rennie was already 46 and was already a seasoned coach with 9 years of head coaching experience when he coached the NZ U20's, meanwhile Razor was just starting out & still holds the 2nd best record for long-term NZ U20 coaches, a record a lot better than Chris Boyd and others.Consider how much better of a coach Razor is now? Coaches typically peak around their late 40's until their mid 50's.
Robertson is a student of the game who's in dialogue with Eddie Jones, Craig Bellamy, Wayne Smith, O'Gara, etc..
He's always looking to improve & seeking alternative viewpoints from NH coaches, learnt & from the best and has genuinely honed his craft since starting off at Sumner. He's at least 3x times a better coach now than he was back in 2016.
2 u/20 World Cups won 1 out of 2 not the worst record.
And of course u/2os depends on the cycle of players you have year to year.Hardly sane for Victor Meldrew to judge Razor based solely on his results as a 40 year old with 2 years of professional coaching experience, fucking Lol...
Unaware I was judging him but pointing out his inexperience at Test level and the risk of failure a la 2016 .
But feel free to call anyone who questions the absolutist belief that Robertson is 100% guaranteed to solve all the problems, with zero risk of failure, insane if it make you feel better.
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
But feel free to call anyone who questions the absolutist belief that Robertson is 100% guaranteed to solve all the problems, with zero risk of failure, insane if it make you feel better.
I have not read these "absolutists" on here. Perhaps they have a name?
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@kiwi_expat said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Chris said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@kiwi_expat said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Frank said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
Foster is a problem and Razor would be a better coach. I am not sure why you are doubting this.
I admire your absolute certainty, I really do. He's a great coach at SR level, but think about where we'd be if Robertson repeats his U20 record with the AB's.
What record are you speaking of exactly?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Zealand_national_under-20_rugby_union_team#Coaches
His 93% win record across 2015/16
despite being only 40 & 41 at the time, and only having 2 years of head coaching experience at that stage, Robertson is 48 next month and has now had 11 years of experience as a head coach, in contrast Rennie was already 46 and was already a seasoned coach with 9 years of head coaching experience when he coached the NZ U20's, meanwhile Razor was just starting out & still holds the 2nd best record for long-term NZ U20 coaches, a record a lot better than Chris Boyd and others.Consider how much better of a coach Razor is now? Coaches typically peak around their late 40's until their mid 50's.
Robertson is a student of the game who's in dialogue with Eddie Jones, Craig Bellamy, Wayne Smith, O'Gara, etc..
He's always looking to improve & seeking alternative viewpoints from NH coaches, learnt & from the best and has genuinely honed his craft since starting off at Sumner. He's at least 3x times a better coach now than he was back in 2016.
2 u/20 World Cups won 1 out of 2 not the worst record.
And of course u/2os depends on the cycle of players you have year to year.Hardly sane for Victor Meldrew to judge Razor based solely on his results as a 40 year old with 2 years of professional coaching experience, fucking Lol...
Unaware I was judging him but pointing out his inexperience at Test level and the risk of failure a la 2016 .
But feel free to call anyone who questions the absolutist belief that Robertson is 100% guaranteed to solve all the problems, with zero risk of failure, insane if it make you feel better.
But feel free to call anyone who questions the absolutist belief that Robertson is 100% guaranteed to solve all the problems, with zero risk of failure, insane if it make you feel better.
I don’t think anyone would expect Robertson to solve all the problems right away. Heck if he had the job right now he might lose a couple. But I’m confident there would be a change in direction and environment. Of course Rennie would have been good too and perhaps others. Foster was more of the same with Hansen but with less pedigree.
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But feel free to call anyone who questions the absolutist belief that Robertson is 100% guaranteed to solve all the problems, with zero risk of failure, insane if it make you feel better.
I don’t think anyone would expect Robertson to solve all the problems right away. Heck if he had the job right now he might lose a couple. But I’m confident there would be a change in direction and environment. Of course Rennie would have been good too and perhaps others. Foster was more of the same with Hansen but with less pedigree.
@broughie said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
But feel free to call anyone who questions the absolutist belief that Robertson is 100% guaranteed to solve all the problems, with zero risk of failure, insane if it make you feel better.
I don’t think anyone would expect Robertson to solve all the problems right away. Heck if he had the job right now he might lose a couple. But I’m confident there would be a change in direction and environment. Of course Rennie would have been good too and perhaps others. Foster was more of the same with Hansen but with less pedigree.
I agree, and I've argued that Foster should be replaced. At the same time I've argued that the ABs problems might run a wee bit deeper than just one man and NZR set a clear timescale for any new coach to do better than Foster. Also, NZR should have a contingency plan in place to manage the risk if the new bloke - say Robertson with zero Test experience - doesn't improve things
Some people think the idea that there might be a risk from appointing a bloke with zero Test experience and managing that risk is insanity for some reason.
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@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew Why wait until then? Can they not look retroactively at the last 10 games and say, "we phucked up by reappointing Foz. 5 from 10 with 2 coming from the USA and Italy is not good enough and now a series loss is just unacceptable".
That ship has sailed.
Changes must be made. We need new direction, game plans and methodology otherwise the best we can hope for is a QF exit.
We all agree on that. But it's how you best do that which is the issue.
If shouldn't have sailed though.
It has though and that's the reality.
If they draw the series in Africa, Foz over the last 12 tests will still at best hold a 50% record. If they lose 0-2 it will be 42%. That ship should certainly still be in dock and ready take the current coaching group excluding Ryan to the underworld. When is enough, enough?
Selective use of statistics there. E.g. Foster's overall win ratio in 2021 from 15 Tests (losses to Ireland and France and a narrow loss to SA) was 80%.
I still believe we have the best ball players across the park in the world but we can't unify them as one collective force save for 15-20 mins.
No we don't and haven't had for some time. Look at the U20 results and the quality of players in France for example. We don't have all these wonder players you think we have. If we did, the Whitelock & Retallick replacements would be oven-ready.
There's no what ifs. Razor has to come in.
Magic solution which won't solve the deeper issues.
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew Why wait until then? Can they not look retroactively at the last 10 games and say, "we phucked up by reappointing Foz. 5 from 10 with 2 coming from the USA and Italy is not good enough and now a series loss is just unacceptable".
That ship has sailed.
Changes must be made. We need new direction, game plans and methodology otherwise the best we can hope for is a QF exit.
We all agree on that. But it's how you best do that which is the issue.
If shouldn't have sailed though.
It has though and that's the reality.
If they draw the series in Africa, Foz over the last 12 tests will still at best hold a 50% record. If they lose 0-2 it will be 42%. That ship should certainly still be in dock and ready take the current coaching group excluding Ryan to the underworld. When is enough, enough?
Selective use of statistics there. E.g. Foster's overall win ratio in 2021 from 15 Tests (losses to Ireland and France and a narrow loss to SA) was 80%.
I still believe we have the best ball players across the park in the world but we can't unify them as one collective force save for 15-20 mins.
No we don't and haven't had for some time. Look at the U20 results and the quality of players in France for example. We don't have all these wonder players you think we have. If we did, the Whitelock & Retallick replacements would be oven-ready.
There's no what ifs. Razor has to come in.
Magic solution which won't solve the deeper issues.
The reality is, Foz loses 2 in Africa he's out. Selective use of stats? We beat the Wobs, Fiji, the USA and Italy and scraped one against SA. Fudge them all you want. The stats aren't good. We do have the best ball players. If we didn't, as dominant as teams have been against us scorelines are still relatively close with a chance of being in the game. So your solution is to stay with Foster after the drivel we've seen and expect any different? The fact is, with Foster in the coaching setup, this team has been on a downward trend since the end of 2016 and a likley QF exit next year.
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@broughie said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
But feel free to call anyone who questions the absolutist belief that Robertson is 100% guaranteed to solve all the problems, with zero risk of failure, insane if it make you feel better.
I don’t think anyone would expect Robertson to solve all the problems right away. Heck if he had the job right now he might lose a couple. But I’m confident there would be a change in direction and environment. Of course Rennie would have been good too and perhaps others. Foster was more of the same with Hansen but with less pedigree.
I agree, and I've argued that Foster should be replaced. At the same time I've argued that the ABs problems might run a wee bit deeper than just one man and NZR set a clear timescale for any new coach to do better than Foster. Also, NZR should have a contingency plan in place to manage the risk if the new bloke - say Robertson with zero Test experience - doesn't improve things
Some people think the idea that there might be a risk from appointing a bloke with zero Test experience and managing that risk is insanity for some reason.
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@broughie said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
But feel free to call anyone who questions the absolutist belief that Robertson is 100% guaranteed to solve all the problems, with zero risk of failure, insane if it make you feel better.
I don’t think anyone would expect Robertson to solve all the problems right away. Heck if he had the job right now he might lose a couple. But I’m confident there would be a change in direction and environment. Of course Rennie would have been good too and perhaps others. Foster was more of the same with Hansen but with less pedigree.
I agree, and I've argued that Foster should be replaced. At the same time I've argued that the ABs problems might run a wee bit deeper than just one man and NZR set a clear timescale for any new coach to do better than Foster. Also, NZR should have a contingency plan in place to manage the risk if the new bloke - say Robertson with zero Test experience - doesn't improve things
Some people think the idea that there might be a risk from appointing a bloke with zero Test experience and managing that risk is insanity for some reason.
I don't think anybody thinks that. What everybody thinks is that those risks are moot due to the status quo being a steaming pile.
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@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew Why wait until then? Can they not look retroactively at the last 10 games and say, "we phucked up by reappointing Foz. 5 from 10 with 2 coming from the USA and Italy is not good enough and now a series loss is just unacceptable".
That ship has sailed.
Changes must be made. We need new direction, game plans and methodology otherwise the best we can hope for is a QF exit.
We all agree on that. But it's how you best do that which is the issue.
If shouldn't have sailed though.
It has though and that's the reality.
If they draw the series in Africa, Foz over the last 12 tests will still at best hold a 50% record. If they lose 0-2 it will be 42%. That ship should certainly still be in dock and ready take the current coaching group excluding Ryan to the underworld. When is enough, enough?
Selective use of statistics there. E.g. Foster's overall win ratio in 2021 from 15 Tests (losses to Ireland and France and a narrow loss to SA) was 80%.
I still believe we have the best ball players across the park in the world but we can't unify them as one collective force save for 15-20 mins.
No we don't and haven't had for some time. Look at the U20 results and the quality of players in France for example. We don't have all these wonder players you think we have. If we did, the Whitelock & Retallick replacements would be oven-ready.
There's no what ifs. Razor has to come in.
Magic solution which won't solve the deeper issues.
The reality is, Foz loses 2 in Africa he's out. Selective use of stats? We beat the Wobs, Fiji, the USA and Italy and scraped one against SA. Fudge them all you want. The stats aren't good. We do have the best ball players. If we didn't, as dominant as teams have been against us scorelines are still relatively close with a chance of being in the game. So your solution is to stay with Foster after the drivel we've seen and expect any different? The fact is, with Foster in the coaching setup, this team has been on a downward trend since the end of 2016 and a likley QF exit next year.
@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew Why wait until then? Can they not look retroactively at the last 10 games and say, "we phucked up by reappointing Foz. 5 from 10 with 2 coming from the USA and Italy is not good enough and now a series loss is just unacceptable".
That ship has sailed.
Changes must be made. We need new direction, game plans and methodology otherwise the best we can hope for is a QF exit.
We all agree on that. But it's how you best do that which is the issue.
If shouldn't have sailed though.
It has though and that's the reality.
If they draw the series in Africa, Foz over the last 12 tests will still at best hold a 50% record. If they lose 0-2 it will be 42%. That ship should certainly still be in dock and ready take the current coaching group excluding Ryan to the underworld. When is enough, enough?
Selective use of statistics there. E.g. Foster's overall win ratio in 2021 from 15 Tests (losses to Ireland and France and a narrow loss to SA) was 80%.
I still believe we have the best ball players across the park in the world but we can't unify them as one collective force save for 15-20 mins.
No we don't and haven't had for some time. Look at the U20 results and the quality of players in France for example. We don't have all these wonder players you think we have. If we did, the Whitelock & Retallick replacements would be oven-ready.
There's no what ifs. Razor has to come in.
Magic solution which won't solve the deeper issues.
The reality is, Foz loses 2 in Africa he's out. Selective use of stats? We beat the Wobs, Fiji, the USA and Italy and scraped one against SA.
Bit selective. You missed out beating Wales (who beat SA in SA) and a last minute, 2 point loss to SA.
We do have the best ball players. If we didn't, as dominant as teams have been against us scorelines are still relatively close with a chance of being in the game.
Bollocks. We have struggled in loads of positions in the last few years. We've been looking for a quality 6 for 5 years, the Lock cupboard is bare and our midfield has been all over the place for even longer.
So your solution is to stay with Foster after the drivel we've seen and expect any different?
And yet one post up I take the time to write: "I agree, and I've argued that Foster should be replaced." .......
The fact is, with Foster in the coaching setup, this team has been on a downward trend since the end of 2016 and a likley QF exit next year.
Facile to say the AB's problems are all down to him.
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@broughie said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
But feel free to call anyone who questions the absolutist belief that Robertson is 100% guaranteed to solve all the problems, with zero risk of failure, insane if it make you feel better.
I don’t think anyone would expect Robertson to solve all the problems right away. Heck if he had the job right now he might lose a couple. But I’m confident there would be a change in direction and environment. Of course Rennie would have been good too and perhaps others. Foster was more of the same with Hansen but with less pedigree.
I agree, and I've argued that Foster should be replaced. At the same time I've argued that the ABs problems might run a wee bit deeper than just one man and NZR set a clear timescale for any new coach to do better than Foster. Also, NZR should have a contingency plan in place to manage the risk if the new bloke - say Robertson with zero Test experience - doesn't improve things
Some people think the idea that there might be a risk from appointing a bloke with zero Test experience and managing that risk is insanity for some reason.
@Victor-Meldrew I agree on the other problems with the NZRFU and hopefully Silverlake can add pressure to them. The contingency plan would have been a good plan for Foster too although would this be a known thing? Would not be a vote of confidence though. Well we have this crowd for a little longer and perhaps the changes will help. Hope so.
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@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew Why wait until then? Can they not look retroactively at the last 10 games and say, "we phucked up by reappointing Foz. 5 from 10 with 2 coming from the USA and Italy is not good enough and now a series loss is just unacceptable".
That ship has sailed.
Changes must be made. We need new direction, game plans and methodology otherwise the best we can hope for is a QF exit.
We all agree on that. But it's how you best do that which is the issue.
If shouldn't have sailed though.
It has though and that's the reality.
If they draw the series in Africa, Foz over the last 12 tests will still at best hold a 50% record. If they lose 0-2 it will be 42%. That ship should certainly still be in dock and ready take the current coaching group excluding Ryan to the underworld. When is enough, enough?
Selective use of statistics there. E.g. Foster's overall win ratio in 2021 from 15 Tests (losses to Ireland and France and a narrow loss to SA) was 80%.
I still believe we have the best ball players across the park in the world but we can't unify them as one collective force save for 15-20 mins.
No we don't and haven't had for some time. Look at the U20 results and the quality of players in France for example. We don't have all these wonder players you think we have. If we did, the Whitelock & Retallick replacements would be oven-ready.
There's no what ifs. Razor has to come in.
Magic solution which won't solve the deeper issues.
The reality is, Foz loses 2 in Africa he's out. Selective use of stats? We beat the Wobs, Fiji, the USA and Italy and scraped one against SA.
Bit selective. You missed out beating Wales (who beat SA in SA) and a last minute, 2 point loss to SA.
We do have the best ball players. If we didn't, as dominant as teams have been against us scorelines are still relatively close with a chance of being in the game.
Bollocks. We have struggled in loads of positions in the last few years. We've been looking for a quality 6 for 5 years, the Lock cupboard is bare and our midfield has been all over the place for even longer.
So your solution is to stay with Foster after the drivel we've seen and expect any different?
And yet one post up I take the time to write: "I agree, and I've argued that Foster should be replaced." .......
The fact is, with Foster in the coaching setup, this team has been on a downward trend since the end of 2016 and a likley QF exit next year.
Facile to say the AB's problems are all down to him.
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew Why wait until then? Can they not look retroactively at the last 10 games and say, "we phucked up by reappointing Foz. 5 from 10 with 2 coming from the USA and Italy is not good enough and now a series loss is just unacceptable".
That ship has sailed.
Changes must be made. We need new direction, game plans and methodology otherwise the best we can hope for is a QF exit.
We all agree on that. But it's how you best do that which is the issue.
If shouldn't have sailed though.
It has though and that's the reality.
If they draw the series in Africa, Foz over the last 12 tests will still at best hold a 50% record. If they lose 0-2 it will be 42%. That ship should certainly still be in dock and ready take the current coaching group excluding Ryan to the underworld. When is enough, enough?
Selective use of statistics there. E.g. Foster's overall win ratio in 2021 from 15 Tests (losses to Ireland and France and a narrow loss to SA) was 80%.
I still believe we have the best ball players across the park in the world but we can't unify them as one collective force save for 15-20 mins.
No we don't and haven't had for some time. Look at the U20 results and the quality of players in France for example. We don't have all these wonder players you think we have. If we did, the Whitelock & Retallick replacements would be oven-ready.
There's no what ifs. Razor has to come in.
Magic solution which won't solve the deeper issues.
The reality is, Foz loses 2 in Africa he's out. Selective use of stats? We beat the Wobs, Fiji, the USA and Italy and scraped one against SA.
Bit selective. You missed out beating Wales (who beat SA in SA) and a last minute, 2 point loss to SA.
We do have the best ball players. If we didn't, as dominant as teams have been against us scorelines are still relatively close with a chance of being in the game.
Bollocks. We have struggled in loads of positions in the last few years. We've been looking for a quality 6 for 5 years, the Lock cupboard is bare and our midfield has been all over the place for even longer.
So your solution is to stay with Foster after the drivel we've seen and expect any different?
And yet one post up I take the time to write: "I agree, and I've argued that Foster should be replaced." .......
The fact is, with Foster in the coaching setup, this team has been on a downward trend since the end of 2016 and a likley QF exit next year.
Facile to say the AB's problems are all down to him.
Exactly. SA aren't up to snuff and we squeaked passed them.
You're saying it's not down to one man. What the phuck has Foster been doing in the last 6 years and 3 as head coach? Isn't it his primary role to get his players working cohesively as a unit? We've struggled because the won't settle on a side, not because the players ball skills are shit.
-
@Victor-Meldrew I agree on the other problems with the NZRFU and hopefully Silverlake can add pressure to them. The contingency plan would have been a good plan for Foster too although would this be a known thing? Would not be a vote of confidence though. Well we have this crowd for a little longer and perhaps the changes will help. Hope so.
@broughie said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew I agree on the other problems with the NZRFU and hopefully Silverlake can add pressure to them. The contingency plan would have been a good plan for Foster too although would this be a known thing? Would not be a vote of confidence though. Well we have this crowd for a little longer and perhaps the changes will help. Hope so.
Well, in my ideal world they are already looking at options if the RC & EOYT doesn't show any improvements - even if Foster had been sacked for Schmidt, Robertson or ANO - to mitigate an early RWC2023 exit and put a medium term plan in place.
Maybe things will become clearer in a week or two.
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@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew Why wait until then? Can they not look retroactively at the last 10 games and say, "we phucked up by reappointing Foz. 5 from 10 with 2 coming from the USA and Italy is not good enough and now a series loss is just unacceptable".
That ship has sailed.
Changes must be made. We need new direction, game plans and methodology otherwise the best we can hope for is a QF exit.
We all agree on that. But it's how you best do that which is the issue.
If shouldn't have sailed though.
It has though and that's the reality.
If they draw the series in Africa, Foz over the last 12 tests will still at best hold a 50% record. If they lose 0-2 it will be 42%. That ship should certainly still be in dock and ready take the current coaching group excluding Ryan to the underworld. When is enough, enough?
Selective use of statistics there. E.g. Foster's overall win ratio in 2021 from 15 Tests (losses to Ireland and France and a narrow loss to SA) was 80%.
I still believe we have the best ball players across the park in the world but we can't unify them as one collective force save for 15-20 mins.
No we don't and haven't had for some time. Look at the U20 results and the quality of players in France for example. We don't have all these wonder players you think we have. If we did, the Whitelock & Retallick replacements would be oven-ready.
There's no what ifs. Razor has to come in.
Magic solution which won't solve the deeper issues.
The reality is, Foz loses 2 in Africa he's out. Selective use of stats? We beat the Wobs, Fiji, the USA and Italy and scraped one against SA.
Bit selective. You missed out beating Wales (who beat SA in SA) and a last minute, 2 point loss to SA.
We do have the best ball players. If we didn't, as dominant as teams have been against us scorelines are still relatively close with a chance of being in the game.
Bollocks. We have struggled in loads of positions in the last few years. We've been looking for a quality 6 for 5 years, the Lock cupboard is bare and our midfield has been all over the place for even longer.
So your solution is to stay with Foster after the drivel we've seen and expect any different?
And yet one post up I take the time to write: "I agree, and I've argued that Foster should be replaced." .......
The fact is, with Foster in the coaching setup, this team has been on a downward trend since the end of 2016 and a likley QF exit next year.
Facile to say the AB's problems are all down to him.
Exactly. SA aren't up to snuff and we squeaked passed them.
You're saying it's not down to one man. What the phuck has Foster been doing in the last 6 years and 3 as head coach? Isn't it his primary role to get his players working cohesively as a unit? We've struggled because the won't settle on a side, not because the players ball skills are shit.
@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew Why wait until then? Can they not look retroactively at the last 10 games and say, "we phucked up by reappointing Foz. 5 from 10 with 2 coming from the USA and Italy is not good enough and now a series loss is just unacceptable".
That ship has sailed.
Changes must be made. We need new direction, game plans and methodology otherwise the best we can hope for is a QF exit.
We all agree on that. But it's how you best do that which is the issue.
If shouldn't have sailed though.
It has though and that's the reality.
If they draw the series in Africa, Foz over the last 12 tests will still at best hold a 50% record. If they lose 0-2 it will be 42%. That ship should certainly still be in dock and ready take the current coaching group excluding Ryan to the underworld. When is enough, enough?
Selective use of statistics there. E.g. Foster's overall win ratio in 2021 from 15 Tests (losses to Ireland and France and a narrow loss to SA) was 80%.
I still believe we have the best ball players across the park in the world but we can't unify them as one collective force save for 15-20 mins.
No we don't and haven't had for some time. Look at the U20 results and the quality of players in France for example. We don't have all these wonder players you think we have. If we did, the Whitelock & Retallick replacements would be oven-ready.
There's no what ifs. Razor has to come in.
Magic solution which won't solve the deeper issues.
The reality is, Foz loses 2 in Africa he's out. Selective use of stats? We beat the Wobs, Fiji, the USA and Italy and scraped one against SA.
Bit selective. You missed out beating Wales (who beat SA in SA) and a last minute, 2 point loss to SA.
We do have the best ball players. If we didn't, as dominant as teams have been against us scorelines are still relatively close with a chance of being in the game.
Bollocks. We have struggled in loads of positions in the last few years. We've been looking for a quality 6 for 5 years, the Lock cupboard is bare and our midfield has been all over the place for even longer.
So your solution is to stay with Foster after the drivel we've seen and expect any different?
And yet one post up I take the time to write: "I agree, and I've argued that Foster should be replaced." .......
The fact is, with Foster in the coaching setup, this team has been on a downward trend since the end of 2016 and a likley QF exit next year.
Facile to say the AB's problems are all down to him.
Exactly. SA aren't up to snuff and we squeaked passed them.
Weeeell, they have a 2-1 winning record v Wales with only their B team losing and have a 8-5 winning record in 2021 losing only to NZ, Aus, England and the Lions. Only minnow was Georgia. Not altogether shabby.
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@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew Why wait until then? Can they not look retroactively at the last 10 games and say, "we phucked up by reappointing Foz. 5 from 10 with 2 coming from the USA and Italy is not good enough and now a series loss is just unacceptable".
That ship has sailed.
Changes must be made. We need new direction, game plans and methodology otherwise the best we can hope for is a QF exit.
We all agree on that. But it's how you best do that which is the issue.
If shouldn't have sailed though.
It has though and that's the reality.
If they draw the series in Africa, Foz over the last 12 tests will still at best hold a 50% record. If they lose 0-2 it will be 42%. That ship should certainly still be in dock and ready take the current coaching group excluding Ryan to the underworld. When is enough, enough?
Selective use of statistics there. E.g. Foster's overall win ratio in 2021 from 15 Tests (losses to Ireland and France and a narrow loss to SA) was 80%.
I still believe we have the best ball players across the park in the world but we can't unify them as one collective force save for 15-20 mins.
No we don't and haven't had for some time. Look at the U20 results and the quality of players in France for example. We don't have all these wonder players you think we have. If we did, the Whitelock & Retallick replacements would be oven-ready.
There's no what ifs. Razor has to come in.
Magic solution which won't solve the deeper issues.
The reality is, Foz loses 2 in Africa he's out. Selective use of stats? We beat the Wobs, Fiji, the USA and Italy and scraped one against SA.
Bit selective. You missed out beating Wales (who beat SA in SA) and a last minute, 2 point loss to SA.
We do have the best ball players. If we didn't, as dominant as teams have been against us scorelines are still relatively close with a chance of being in the game.
Bollocks. We have struggled in loads of positions in the last few years. We've been looking for a quality 6 for 5 years, the Lock cupboard is bare and our midfield has been all over the place for even longer.
So your solution is to stay with Foster after the drivel we've seen and expect any different?
And yet one post up I take the time to write: "I agree, and I've argued that Foster should be replaced." .......
The fact is, with Foster in the coaching setup, this team has been on a downward trend since the end of 2016 and a likley QF exit next year.
Facile to say the AB's problems are all down to him.
Exactly. SA aren't up to snuff and we squeaked passed them.
You're saying it's not down to one man. What the phuck has Foster been doing in the last 6 years and 3 as head coach? Isn't it his primary role to get his players working cohesively as a unit? We've struggled because the won't settle on a side, not because the players ball skills are shit.
@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew Why wait until then? Can they not look retroactively at the last 10 games and say, "we phucked up by reappointing Foz. 5 from 10 with 2 coming from the USA and Italy is not good enough and now a series loss is just unacceptable".
That ship has sailed.
Changes must be made. We need new direction, game plans and methodology otherwise the best we can hope for is a QF exit.
We all agree on that. But it's how you best do that which is the issue.
If shouldn't have sailed though.
It has though and that's the reality.
If they draw the series in Africa, Foz over the last 12 tests will still at best hold a 50% record. If they lose 0-2 it will be 42%. That ship should certainly still be in dock and ready take the current coaching group excluding Ryan to the underworld. When is enough, enough?
Selective use of statistics there. E.g. Foster's overall win ratio in 2021 from 15 Tests (losses to Ireland and France and a narrow loss to SA) was 80%.
I still believe we have the best ball players across the park in the world but we can't unify them as one collective force save for 15-20 mins.
No we don't and haven't had for some time. Look at the U20 results and the quality of players in France for example. We don't have all these wonder players you think we have. If we did, the Whitelock & Retallick replacements would be oven-ready.
There's no what ifs. Razor has to come in.
Magic solution which won't solve the deeper issues.
The reality is, Foz loses 2 in Africa he's out. Selective use of stats? We beat the Wobs, Fiji, the USA and Italy and scraped one against SA.
Bit selective. You missed out beating Wales (who beat SA in SA) and a last minute, 2 point loss to SA.
We do have the best ball players. If we didn't, as dominant as teams have been against us scorelines are still relatively close with a chance of being in the game.
Bollocks. We have struggled in loads of positions in the last few years. We've been looking for a quality 6 for 5 years, the Lock cupboard is bare and our midfield has been all over the place for even longer.
So your solution is to stay with Foster after the drivel we've seen and expect any different?
And yet one post up I take the time to write: "I agree, and I've argued that Foster should be replaced." .......
The fact is, with Foster in the coaching setup, this team has been on a downward trend since the end of 2016 and a likley QF exit next year.
Facile to say the AB's problems are all down to him.
Exactly. SA aren't up to snuff and we squeaked passed them.
You're saying it's not down to one man. What the phuck has Foster been doing in the last 6 years and 3 as head coach? Isn't it his primary role to get his players working cohesively as a unit? We've struggled because the won't settle on a side, not because the players ball skills are shit.
I pretty much stopped reading when you said Sth Africa aren't up to snuff. Check their recent record & rugby history.
But for the record, no, I don't think all the problems in NZ rugby since 2015 are down to one man, Foster, and I don't believe NZ rugby players are more skilled than anyone else in the world.
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@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew Why wait until then? Can they not look retroactively at the last 10 games and say, "we phucked up by reappointing Foz. 5 from 10 with 2 coming from the USA and Italy is not good enough and now a series loss is just unacceptable".
That ship has sailed.
Changes must be made. We need new direction, game plans and methodology otherwise the best we can hope for is a QF exit.
We all agree on that. But it's how you best do that which is the issue.
If shouldn't have sailed though.
It has though and that's the reality.
If they draw the series in Africa, Foz over the last 12 tests will still at best hold a 50% record. If they lose 0-2 it will be 42%. That ship should certainly still be in dock and ready take the current coaching group excluding Ryan to the underworld. When is enough, enough?
Selective use of statistics there. E.g. Foster's overall win ratio in 2021 from 15 Tests (losses to Ireland and France and a narrow loss to SA) was 80%.
I still believe we have the best ball players across the park in the world but we can't unify them as one collective force save for 15-20 mins.
No we don't and haven't had for some time. Look at the U20 results and the quality of players in France for example. We don't have all these wonder players you think we have. If we did, the Whitelock & Retallick replacements would be oven-ready.
There's no what ifs. Razor has to come in.
Magic solution which won't solve the deeper issues.
The reality is, Foz loses 2 in Africa he's out. Selective use of stats? We beat the Wobs, Fiji, the USA and Italy and scraped one against SA.
Bit selective. You missed out beating Wales (who beat SA in SA) and a last minute, 2 point loss to SA.
We do have the best ball players. If we didn't, as dominant as teams have been against us scorelines are still relatively close with a chance of being in the game.
Bollocks. We have struggled in loads of positions in the last few years. We've been looking for a quality 6 for 5 years, the Lock cupboard is bare and our midfield has been all over the place for even longer.
So your solution is to stay with Foster after the drivel we've seen and expect any different?
And yet one post up I take the time to write: "I agree, and I've argued that Foster should be replaced." .......
The fact is, with Foster in the coaching setup, this team has been on a downward trend since the end of 2016 and a likley QF exit next year.
Facile to say the AB's problems are all down to him.
Exactly. SA aren't up to snuff and we squeaked passed them.
You're saying it's not down to one man. What the phuck has Foster been doing in the last 6 years and 3 as head coach? Isn't it his primary role to get his players working cohesively as a unit? We've struggled because the won't settle on a side, not because the players ball skills are shit.
I pretty much stopped reading when you said Sth Africa aren't up to snuff. Check their recent record & rugby history.
But for the record, no, I don't think all the problems in NZ rugby since 2015 are down to one man, Foster, and I don't believe NZ rugby players are more skilled than anyone else in the world.
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew Why wait until then? Can they not look retroactively at the last 10 games and say, "we phucked up by reappointing Foz. 5 from 10 with 2 coming from the USA and Italy is not good enough and now a series loss is just unacceptable".
That ship has sailed.
Changes must be made. We need new direction, game plans and methodology otherwise the best we can hope for is a QF exit.
We all agree on that. But it's how you best do that which is the issue.
If shouldn't have sailed though.
It has though and that's the reality.
If they draw the series in Africa, Foz over the last 12 tests will still at best hold a 50% record. If they lose 0-2 it will be 42%. That ship should certainly still be in dock and ready take the current coaching group excluding Ryan to the underworld. When is enough, enough?
Selective use of statistics there. E.g. Foster's overall win ratio in 2021 from 15 Tests (losses to Ireland and France and a narrow loss to SA) was 80%.
I still believe we have the best ball players across the park in the world but we can't unify them as one collective force save for 15-20 mins.
No we don't and haven't had for some time. Look at the U20 results and the quality of players in France for example. We don't have all these wonder players you think we have. If we did, the Whitelock & Retallick replacements would be oven-ready.
There's no what ifs. Razor has to come in.
Magic solution which won't solve the deeper issues.
The reality is, Foz loses 2 in Africa he's out. Selective use of stats? We beat the Wobs, Fiji, the USA and Italy and scraped one against SA.
Bit selective. You missed out beating Wales (who beat SA in SA) and a last minute, 2 point loss to SA.
We do have the best ball players. If we didn't, as dominant as teams have been against us scorelines are still relatively close with a chance of being in the game.
Bollocks. We have struggled in loads of positions in the last few years. We've been looking for a quality 6 for 5 years, the Lock cupboard is bare and our midfield has been all over the place for even longer.
So your solution is to stay with Foster after the drivel we've seen and expect any different?
And yet one post up I take the time to write: "I agree, and I've argued that Foster should be replaced." .......
The fact is, with Foster in the coaching setup, this team has been on a downward trend since the end of 2016 and a likley QF exit next year.
Facile to say the AB's problems are all down to him.
Exactly. SA aren't up to snuff and we squeaked passed them.
You're saying it's not down to one man. What the phuck has Foster been doing in the last 6 years and 3 as head coach? Isn't it his primary role to get his players working cohesively as a unit? We've struggled because the won't settle on a side, not because the players ball skills are shit.
I pretty much stopped reading when you said Sth Africa aren't up to snuff. Check their recent record & rugby history.
But for the record, no, I don't think all the problems in NZ rugby since 2015 are down to one man, Foster, and I don't believe NZ rugby players are more skilled than anyone else in the world.
I stopped reading "I".
-
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew Why wait until then? Can they not look retroactively at the last 10 games and say, "we phucked up by reappointing Foz. 5 from 10 with 2 coming from the USA and Italy is not good enough and now a series loss is just unacceptable".
That ship has sailed.
Changes must be made. We need new direction, game plans and methodology otherwise the best we can hope for is a QF exit.
We all agree on that. But it's how you best do that which is the issue.
If shouldn't have sailed though.
It has though and that's the reality.
If they draw the series in Africa, Foz over the last 12 tests will still at best hold a 50% record. If they lose 0-2 it will be 42%. That ship should certainly still be in dock and ready take the current coaching group excluding Ryan to the underworld. When is enough, enough?
Selective use of statistics there. E.g. Foster's overall win ratio in 2021 from 15 Tests (losses to Ireland and France and a narrow loss to SA) was 80%.
I still believe we have the best ball players across the park in the world but we can't unify them as one collective force save for 15-20 mins.
No we don't and haven't had for some time. Look at the U20 results and the quality of players in France for example. We don't have all these wonder players you think we have. If we did, the Whitelock & Retallick replacements would be oven-ready.
There's no what ifs. Razor has to come in.
Magic solution which won't solve the deeper issues.
The reality is, Foz loses 2 in Africa he's out. Selective use of stats? We beat the Wobs, Fiji, the USA and Italy and scraped one against SA.
Bit selective. You missed out beating Wales (who beat SA in SA) and a last minute, 2 point loss to SA.
We do have the best ball players. If we didn't, as dominant as teams have been against us scorelines are still relatively close with a chance of being in the game.
Bollocks. We have struggled in loads of positions in the last few years. We've been looking for a quality 6 for 5 years, the Lock cupboard is bare and our midfield has been all over the place for even longer.
So your solution is to stay with Foster after the drivel we've seen and expect any different?
And yet one post up I take the time to write: "I agree, and I've argued that Foster should be replaced." .......
The fact is, with Foster in the coaching setup, this team has been on a downward trend since the end of 2016 and a likley QF exit next year.
Facile to say the AB's problems are all down to him.
Exactly. SA aren't up to snuff and we squeaked passed them.
You're saying it's not down to one man. What the phuck has Foster been doing in the last 6 years and 3 as head coach? Isn't it his primary role to get his players working cohesively as a unit? We've struggled because the won't settle on a side, not because the players ball skills are shit.
I pretty much stopped reading when you said Sth Africa aren't up to snuff. Check their recent record & rugby history.
But for the record, no, I don't think all the problems in NZ rugby since 2015 are down to one man, Foster, and I don't believe NZ rugby players are more skilled than anyone else in the world.
I stopped reading "I".
@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Joan-Town-Jones said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew Why wait until then? Can they not look retroactively at the last 10 games and say, "we phucked up by reappointing Foz. 5 from 10 with 2 coming from the USA and Italy is not good enough and now a series loss is just unacceptable".
That ship has sailed.
Changes must be made. We need new direction, game plans and methodology otherwise the best we can hope for is a QF exit.
We all agree on that. But it's how you best do that which is the issue.
If shouldn't have sailed though.
It has though and that's the reality.
If they draw the series in Africa, Foz over the last 12 tests will still at best hold a 50% record. If they lose 0-2 it will be 42%. That ship should certainly still be in dock and ready take the current coaching group excluding Ryan to the underworld. When is enough, enough?
Selective use of statistics there. E.g. Foster's overall win ratio in 2021 from 15 Tests (losses to Ireland and France and a narrow loss to SA) was 80%.
I still believe we have the best ball players across the park in the world but we can't unify them as one collective force save for 15-20 mins.
No we don't and haven't had for some time. Look at the U20 results and the quality of players in France for example. We don't have all these wonder players you think we have. If we did, the Whitelock & Retallick replacements would be oven-ready.
There's no what ifs. Razor has to come in.
Magic solution which won't solve the deeper issues.
The reality is, Foz loses 2 in Africa he's out. Selective use of stats? We beat the Wobs, Fiji, the USA and Italy and scraped one against SA.
Bit selective. You missed out beating Wales (who beat SA in SA) and a last minute, 2 point loss to SA.
We do have the best ball players. If we didn't, as dominant as teams have been against us scorelines are still relatively close with a chance of being in the game.
Bollocks. We have struggled in loads of positions in the last few years. We've been looking for a quality 6 for 5 years, the Lock cupboard is bare and our midfield has been all over the place for even longer.
So your solution is to stay with Foster after the drivel we've seen and expect any different?
And yet one post up I take the time to write: "I agree, and I've argued that Foster should be replaced." .......
The fact is, with Foster in the coaching setup, this team has been on a downward trend since the end of 2016 and a likley QF exit next year.
Facile to say the AB's problems are all down to him.
Exactly. SA aren't up to snuff and we squeaked passed them.
You're saying it's not down to one man. What the phuck has Foster been doing in the last 6 years and 3 as head coach? Isn't it his primary role to get his players working cohesively as a unit? We've struggled because the won't settle on a side, not because the players ball skills are shit.
I pretty much stopped reading when you said Sth Africa aren't up to snuff. Check their recent record & rugby history.
But for the record, no, I don't think all the problems in NZ rugby since 2015 are down to one man, Foster, and I don't believe NZ rugby players are more skilled than anyone else in the world.
I stopped reading "I".
Some years ago at a guess.
-
@kiwi_expat said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Chris said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@kiwi_expat said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Frank said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
Foster is a problem and Razor would be a better coach. I am not sure why you are doubting this.
I admire your absolute certainty, I really do. He's a great coach at SR level, but think about where we'd be if Robertson repeats his U20 record with the AB's.
What record are you speaking of exactly?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Zealand_national_under-20_rugby_union_team#Coaches
His 93% win record across 2015/16
despite being only 40 & 41 at the time, and only having 2 years of head coaching experience at that stage, Robertson is 48 next month and has now had 11 years of experience as a head coach, in contrast Rennie was already 46 and was already a seasoned coach with 9 years of head coaching experience when he coached the NZ U20's, meanwhile Razor was just starting out & still holds the 2nd best record for long-term NZ U20 coaches, a record a lot better than Chris Boyd and others.Consider how much better of a coach Razor is now? Coaches typically peak around their late 40's until their mid 50's.
Robertson is a student of the game who's in dialogue with Eddie Jones, Craig Bellamy, Wayne Smith, O'Gara, etc..
He's always looking to improve & seeking alternative viewpoints from NH coaches, learnt & from the best and has genuinely honed his craft since starting off at Sumner. He's at least 3x times a better coach now than he was back in 2016.
2 u/20 World Cups won 1 out of 2 not the worst record.
And of course u/2os depends on the cycle of players you have year to year.Hardly sane for Victor Meldrew to judge Razor based solely on his results as a 40 year old with 2 years of professional coaching experience, fucking Lol...
Unaware I was judging him but pointing out his inexperience at Test level and the risk of failure a la 2016 .
But feel free to call anyone who questions the absolutist belief that Robertson is 100% guaranteed to solve all the problems, with zero risk of failure, insane if it make you feel better.
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
But feel free to call anyone who questions the absolutist belief that Robertson is 100% guaranteed to solve all the problems, with zero risk of failure, insane if it make you feel better.
Straw man argument. No one is saying that.
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Jeff has a point but this is Robertson just being up front. But I personally don't think it put NZR under any more pressure
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Jeff has a point but this is Robertson just being up front. But I personally don't think it put NZR under any more pressure
@Winger said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
Jeff has a point but this is Robertson just being up front. But I personally don't think it put NZR under any more pressure
Yeah I disagree with Jeff as well. Razor is perfectly entitled to talk his aspirations and potential job opportunities.
It's just coaching, they aren't curing cancer. If there was a little bit more plain talk instead of all this corporate bullshit, perhaps we would be performing better and making better hiring choices.
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@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
But feel free to call anyone who questions the absolutist belief that Robertson is 100% guaranteed to solve all the problems, with zero risk of failure, insane if it make you feel better.
Straw man argument. No one is saying that.
@Frank said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster must go / Assistant Coach changes:
But feel free to call anyone who questions the absolutist belief that Robertson is 100% guaranteed to solve all the problems, with zero risk of failure, insane if it make you feel better.
Straw man argument. No one is saying that.
I wasn't making an argument. I was offering advice.
