Foster, Robertson etc
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@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
@Kirwan said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
Pretty funny justifications going on here for Taylor. How many Tests does it take to learn to take a half step and throw it down the middle?
Was kinda important.
If there is any accountability left in selection he’d be gone. Stunk up the joint for 35 minutes.
Also - wasn't it an all Crusaders tight 5 when he came on (and wasn't that the point)?
So then it comes back to...what are the Crusaders doing differently to the ABs that make them so successful? They look a million $ in the red and black...
@Joans-Town-Jones said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
They look a million $ in the red and black
Big difference between Super Rugby and Test Rugby though.
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@Joans-Town-Jones said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
They look a million $ in the red and black
Big difference between Super Rugby and Test Rugby though.
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
@Joans-Town-Jones said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
They look a million $ in the red and black
Big difference between Super Rugby and Test Rugby though.
Absolutely but how is it Razor appears to get them working cohesively as a unit where Fozzie can't get more than 40 mins out of them? Lets not forget, it's not like Argentina have a domestic comp to build cohesion from.
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@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
@Joans-Town-Jones said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
They look a million $ in the red and black
Big difference between Super Rugby and Test Rugby though.
Absolutely but how is it Razor appears to get them working cohesively as a unit where Fozzie can't get more than 40 mins out of them? Lets not forget, it's not like Argentina have a domestic comp to build cohesion from.
@Joans-Town-Jones said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
Absolutely but how is it Razor appears to get them working cohesively as a unit where Fozzie can't get more than 40 mins out of them?
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Different level of intensity at Test level. George Bridge can look a million dollars at SR level.
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Perhaps the Forwards coaching isn't up to par or needs more work.
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@Machpants Exactly. He’s really good when we have front foot ball and space but there’s no space and we haven’t earned the right to go wide. Maybe he can change his game and try to run around the rucks a little bit more, little kicks over the top etc to change things up. The opposition knows he is going to pass.
Addition if the others outside him I’m going to get out the game plan then as the first distributor he can change that right?
I hate to say it but a Marshall type player maybe the type of player we need right now.
Give me Marshall, Jimmy Cowan or Byron Kelleher tucking it under the arm and pumping the legs into contact. yes boiiiii
@Machpants Exactly. He’s really good when we have front foot ball and space but there’s no space and we haven’t earned the right to go wide. Maybe he can change his game and try to run around the rucks a little bit more, little kicks over the top etc to change things up. The opposition knows he is going to pass.
Addition if the others outside him I’m going to get out the game plan then as the first distributor he can change that right?
I hate to say it but a Marshall type player maybe the type of player we need right now.
Give me Marshall, Jimmy Cowan or Byron Kelleher tucking it under the arm and pumping the legs into contact. yes boiiiii
BK was exceptional at sniping from the base. Will Genia gave me the shits because of this. Problem is though, if Nuggy snipes, will we have two big oaks up his ass cleaning out? I'm not so sure.
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@Joans-Town-Jones said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
Absolutely but how is it Razor appears to get them working cohesively as a unit where Fozzie can't get more than 40 mins out of them?
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Different level of intensity at Test level. George Bridge can look a million dollars at SR level.
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Perhaps the Forwards coaching isn't up to par or needs more work.
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
@Joans-Town-Jones said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
Absolutely but how is it Razor appears to get them working cohesively as a unit where Fozzie can't get more than 40 mins out of them?
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Different level of intensity at Test level. George Bridge can look a million dollars at SR level.
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Perhaps the Forwards coaching isn't up to par or needs more work.
He also had Hansen version 4 and Foster as an ABs head coach so there's that.
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@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
@Joans-Town-Jones said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
Absolutely but how is it Razor appears to get them working cohesively as a unit where Fozzie can't get more than 40 mins out of them?
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Different level of intensity at Test level. George Bridge can look a million dollars at SR level.
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Perhaps the Forwards coaching isn't up to par or needs more work.
He also had Hansen version 4 and Foster as an ABs head coach so there's that.
@Joans-Town-Jones said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
@Joans-Town-Jones said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
Absolutely but how is it Razor appears to get them working cohesively as a unit where Fozzie can't get more than 40 mins out of them?
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Different level of intensity at Test level. George Bridge can look a million dollars at SR level.
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Perhaps the Forwards coaching isn't up to par or needs more work.
He also had Hansen version 4 and Foster as an ABs head coach so there's that.
Bit silly to blame the coach for the gap between Test & Super Rugby. It's like arguing Razor's a shit coach because every player who's outstanding at NPC level doesn't become a Crusaders superstar.
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@Joans-Town-Jones said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
@Joans-Town-Jones said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
Absolutely but how is it Razor appears to get them working cohesively as a unit where Fozzie can't get more than 40 mins out of them?
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Different level of intensity at Test level. George Bridge can look a million dollars at SR level.
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Perhaps the Forwards coaching isn't up to par or needs more work.
He also had Hansen version 4 and Foster as an ABs head coach so there's that.
Bit silly to blame the coach for the gap between Test & Super Rugby. It's like arguing Razor's a shit coach because every player who's outstanding at NPC level doesn't become a Crusaders superstar.
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
@Joans-Town-Jones said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
@Joans-Town-Jones said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
Absolutely but how is it Razor appears to get them working cohesively as a unit where Fozzie can't get more than 40 mins out of them?
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Different level of intensity at Test level. George Bridge can look a million dollars at SR level.
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Perhaps the Forwards coaching isn't up to par or needs more work.
He also had Hansen version 4 and Foster as an ABs head coach so there's that.
Bit silly to blame the coach for the gap between Test & Super Rugby. It's like arguing Razor's a shit coach because every player who's outstanding at NPC level doesn't become a Crusaders superstar.
? Are we not arguing the opposite? Razor seems to get players playing well for him?
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@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
@Joans-Town-Jones said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
@Joans-Town-Jones said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
Absolutely but how is it Razor appears to get them working cohesively as a unit where Fozzie can't get more than 40 mins out of them?
-
Different level of intensity at Test level. George Bridge can look a million dollars at SR level.
-
Perhaps the Forwards coaching isn't up to par or needs more work.
He also had Hansen version 4 and Foster as an ABs head coach so there's that.
Bit silly to blame the coach for the gap between Test & Super Rugby. It's like arguing Razor's a shit coach because every player who's outstanding at NPC level doesn't become a Crusaders superstar.
? Are we not arguing the opposite? Razor seems to get players playing well for him?
@Joans-Town-Jones said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
@Joans-Town-Jones said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
@Joans-Town-Jones said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
Absolutely but how is it Razor appears to get them working cohesively as a unit where Fozzie can't get more than 40 mins out of them?
-
Different level of intensity at Test level. George Bridge can look a million dollars at SR level.
-
Perhaps the Forwards coaching isn't up to par or needs more work.
He also had Hansen version 4 and Foster as an ABs head coach so there's that.
Bit silly to blame the coach for the gap between Test & Super Rugby. It's like arguing Razor's a shit coach because every player who's outstanding at NPC level doesn't become a Crusaders superstar.
? Are we not arguing the opposite? Razor seems to get players playing well for him?
Considering that you could argue Foster has never gotten the best out of his teams, I think that point about Razor is quite important. It remains to be seen if he can translate it to test level. But at least he's won stuff
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@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
@Joans-Town-Jones said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
@Joans-Town-Jones said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
Absolutely but how is it Razor appears to get them working cohesively as a unit where Fozzie can't get more than 40 mins out of them?
-
Different level of intensity at Test level. George Bridge can look a million dollars at SR level.
-
Perhaps the Forwards coaching isn't up to par or needs more work.
He also had Hansen version 4 and Foster as an ABs head coach so there's that.
Bit silly to blame the coach for the gap between Test & Super Rugby. It's like arguing Razor's a shit coach because every player who's outstanding at NPC level doesn't become a Crusaders superstar.
? Are we not arguing the opposite? Razor seems to get players playing well for him?
@Joans-Town-Jones said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
Razor seems to get players playing well for him?
So does the bloke who coaches the Bodmin 2nd XV. Doesn't mean those players would succeed at 6N level....
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@Joans-Town-Jones said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
Razor seems to get players playing well for him?
So does the bloke who coaches the Bodmin 2nd XV. Doesn't mean those players would succeed at 6N level....
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
@Joans-Town-Jones said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
Razor seems to get players playing well for him?
So does the bloke who coaches the Bodmin 2nd XV. Doesn't mean those players would succeed at 6N level....
So what, Foster's coaching is fine but we just don't have the cattle to beat Argentina at home all of a sudden?
Because our players are only good at super level? As opposed to the all time greats littered through the Argentinian, South African and Irish sides? -
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
@Kirwan said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
Pretty funny justifications going on here for Taylor. How many Tests does it take to learn to take a half step and throw it down the middle?
Was kinda important.
If there is any accountability left in selection he’d be gone. Stunk up the joint for 35 minutes.
Also - wasn't it an all Crusaders tight 5 when he came on (and wasn't that the point)?
So then it comes back to...what are the Crusaders doing differently to the ABs that make them so successful? They look a million $ in the red and black...
@Joans-Town-Jones said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
@Kirwan said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
Pretty funny justifications going on here for Taylor. How many Tests does it take to learn to take a half step and throw it down the middle?
Was kinda important.
If there is any accountability left in selection he’d be gone. Stunk up the joint for 35 minutes.
Also - wasn't it an all Crusaders tight 5 when he came on (and wasn't that the point)?
So then it comes back to...what are the Crusaders doing differently to the ABs that make them so successful? They look a million $ in the red and black...
Not always though. And super rugby teams don't seem to be as strong overall as they were in the past.
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@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
@Joans-Town-Jones said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
Razor seems to get players playing well for him?
So does the bloke who coaches the Bodmin 2nd XV. Doesn't mean those players would succeed at 6N level....
So what, Foster's coaching is fine but we just don't have the cattle to beat Argentina at home all of a sudden?
Because our players are only good at super level? As opposed to the all time greats littered through the Argentinian, South African and Irish sides?@reprobate said in Foster:
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
@Joans-Town-Jones said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
Razor seems to get players playing well for him?
So does the bloke who coaches the Bodmin 2nd XV. Doesn't mean those players would succeed at 6N level....
So what, Foster's coaching is fine but we just don't have the cattle to beat Argentina at home all of a sudden?
Nope. Nothing to do with coaching. But everything go do with their being big differences between playerd performing at Test level and a lower level.
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Sorry there's bollox being spoken here NZR ******* up and continue to do so
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@antipodean said in Foster:
@Joans-Town-Jones said in Foster:
Aaron Smith coming off with 20 to go was poor as well. He was playing OK, but more to the point what we needed was experience and cool heads, not a guy with basically no experience.
He was playing dog shit by then. Like the rest of 'em. Christie needs a start now.
Not on the form he displayed this year. Like an excitable puppy with the passing to match.
Give Christie a start. Can it be worse that what it is right now?
@Joans-Town-Jones said in Foster:
@antipodean said in Foster:
@Joans-Town-Jones said in Foster:
Aaron Smith coming off with 20 to go was poor as well. He was playing OK, but more to the point what we needed was experience and cool heads, not a guy with basically no experience.
He was playing dog shit by then. Like the rest of 'em. Christie needs a start now.
Not on the form he displayed this year. Like an excitable puppy with the passing to match.
Give Christie a start. Can it be worse that what it is right now?
The passing and direction from rucks would be. Granted he might run more, but that's not enough to compensate based on his form this year.
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@reprobate said in Foster:
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
@Joans-Town-Jones said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
Razor seems to get players playing well for him?
So does the bloke who coaches the Bodmin 2nd XV. Doesn't mean those players would succeed at 6N level....
So what, Foster's coaching is fine but we just don't have the cattle to beat Argentina at home all of a sudden?
Nope. Nothing to do with coaching. But everything go do with their being big differences between playerd performing at Test level and a lower level.
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster:
@reprobate said in Foster:
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
@Joans-Town-Jones said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
Razor seems to get players playing well for him?
So does the bloke who coaches the Bodmin 2nd XV. Doesn't mean those players would succeed at 6N level....
So what, Foster's coaching is fine but we just don't have the cattle to beat Argentina at home all of a sudden?
Nope. Nothing to do with coaching. But everything go do with their being big differences between playerd performing at Test level and a lower level.
Gotcha coaches don't matter, I hope NZR see this and sack the lot, save us a lot of money for keeping our players here.
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Gregor Paul is slightly speculating that Razor would want a mass-cleanout, but it is probably a pretty good educated guess.
I think if the ABs keep losing, NZR will try and persuade Schmidt to take over.
Schmidt would likely keep everyone else on. The fact Schmidt is there lowers Razor's chances of becoming head coach.This might be acceptable looking ass-covering for those at the top without any mass-cleanout being instituted (upon them)
Gregor Paul is slightly speculating that Razor would want a mass-cleanout, but it is probably a pretty good educated guess.
I think if the ABs keep losing, NZR will try and persuade Schmidt to take over.
Schmidt would likely keep everyone else on. The fact Schmidt is there lowers Razor's chances of becoming head coach.This might be acceptable looking ass-covering for those at the top without any mass-cleanout being instituted (upon them)
His comment is also a bit overstated regarding the number of people that need cleaning out. Things like masseurs are ad-hoc pay as you go contractors and not formal parts of the set ups.
Would seem silly to wipe out positions like bag man etc and make them re-apply. That kind of thing is dick swinging and has no positives.
Coaches/Team Management etc are the ones that affect the team so fair enough with them. -
Gregor Paul is slightly speculating that Razor would want a mass-cleanout, but it is probably a pretty good educated guess.
I think if the ABs keep losing, NZR will try and persuade Schmidt to take over.
Schmidt would likely keep everyone else on. The fact Schmidt is there lowers Razor's chances of becoming head coach.This might be acceptable looking ass-covering for those at the top without any mass-cleanout being instituted (upon them)
His comment is also a bit overstated regarding the number of people that need cleaning out. Things like masseurs are ad-hoc pay as you go contractors and not formal parts of the set ups.
Would seem silly to wipe out positions like bag man etc and make them re-apply. That kind of thing is dick swinging and has no positives.
Coaches/Team Management etc are the ones that affect the team so fair enough with them.Gregor Paul is slightly speculating that Razor would want a mass-cleanout, but it is probably a pretty good educated guess.
I think if the ABs keep losing, NZR will try and persuade Schmidt to take over.
Schmidt would likely keep everyone else on. The fact Schmidt is there lowers Razor's chances of becoming head coach.This might be acceptable looking ass-covering for those at the top without any mass-cleanout being instituted (upon them)
His comment is also a bit overstated regarding the number of people that need cleaning out. Things like masseurs are ad-hoc pay as you go contractors and not formal parts of the set ups.
Would seem silly to wipe out positions like bag man etc and make them re-apply. That kind of thing is dick swinging and has no positives.
Coaches/Team Management etc are the ones that affect the team so fair enough with them.I assume that Shand and some of the been there forever and might be a bit too comfortable with it crew (e.g., Enoka) would be in the firing line.
To be honest, I'd be happy with a clean-out from the CEO all the way down.
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@Joans-Town-Jones said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
@Joans-Town-Jones said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
Absolutely but how is it Razor appears to get them working cohesively as a unit where Fozzie can't get more than 40 mins out of them?
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Different level of intensity at Test level. George Bridge can look a million dollars at SR level.
-
Perhaps the Forwards coaching isn't up to par or needs more work.
He also had Hansen version 4 and Foster as an ABs head coach so there's that.
Bit silly to blame the coach for the gap between Test & Super Rugby. It's like arguing Razor's a shit coach because every player who's outstanding at NPC level doesn't become a Crusaders superstar.
@Victor-Meldrew I think that coach of the National side needs to work with the Super coaches, working how to best prep players for the step up, while the super coach balances this with his aspirations or winning the comp.
The fact that our front row forwards circa 2015 were pretty much the envy of the world, where had had skillful players that were strong at thier core roles...ffd a few years and our skills started to drop off, as did our scrum dominance, ffd more years, losing the regular games with SA Super teams and now we are selecting guys who we are told are thier for scrummaging, and they do little else, and even at scrum time arent much cop so we are injecting young players again with skillsets we used to have in abundance.
Fozzie has been part of the set up for what, a decade now...he is at the pointy end of things, in terms of seeing the game change, innovation, yet in his time he hasnt managed to notice the decline in these other skills so crucial to the modern game, along with a slide in the core skills of props too, and help look to rectify it down the chain, until it has become such a big problem.
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Gregor Paul is slightly speculating that Razor would want a mass-cleanout, but it is probably a pretty good educated guess.
I think if the ABs keep losing, NZR will try and persuade Schmidt to take over.
Schmidt would likely keep everyone else on. The fact Schmidt is there lowers Razor's chances of becoming head coach.This might be acceptable looking ass-covering for those at the top without any mass-cleanout being instituted (upon them)
His comment is also a bit overstated regarding the number of people that need cleaning out. Things like masseurs are ad-hoc pay as you go contractors and not formal parts of the set ups.
Would seem silly to wipe out positions like bag man etc and make them re-apply. That kind of thing is dick swinging and has no positives.
Coaches/Team Management etc are the ones that affect the team so fair enough with them.I assume that Shand and some of the been there forever and might be a bit too comfortable with it crew (e.g., Enoka) would be in the firing line.
To be honest, I'd be happy with a clean-out from the CEO all the way down.
I assume that Shand and some of the been there forever and might be a bit too comfortable with it crew (e.g., Enoka) would be in the firing line.
IIRC they made some changes to the management structure a few years back so that Foster, as the AB coach, reports to Shand now. That likely wouldn't change with a new coach, even if Shand was also replaced.
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@reprobate said in Foster:
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
@Joans-Town-Jones said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
Razor seems to get players playing well for him?
So does the bloke who coaches the Bodmin 2nd XV. Doesn't mean those players would succeed at 6N level....
So what, Foster's coaching is fine but we just don't have the cattle to beat Argentina at home all of a sudden?
Nope. Nothing to do with coaching. But everything go do with their being big differences between playerd performing at Test level and a lower level.
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster:
@reprobate said in Foster:
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
@Joans-Town-Jones said in All Blacks v Pumas 1:
Razor seems to get players playing well for him?
So does the bloke who coaches the Bodmin 2nd XV. Doesn't mean those players would succeed at 6N level....
So what, Foster's coaching is fine but we just don't have the cattle to beat Argentina at home all of a sudden?
Nope. Nothing to do with coaching. But everything go do with their being big differences between playerd performing at Test level and a lower level.
Well then we're fucked. Keep the same 23 week in week out and hope they win some games along the way. Lock Fozzie in for another 3 RWCs.
