All Blacks 2022
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@Crucial isn't Fakatava out for 9-12 months again regardless? or is it possible he'll feature in Super?
@FakatavaAllBlack IIRC the latest update stated that they were waiting for scans to determine whether he needed surgery. If he needed surgery, it could take about 8 months. I remember reading something that they were hoping - in that case - he could feature for the Highlanders at the end of the season, but obviously that also depends on whether the Highlanders make the play-offs. If he doesn't need surgery, the time frame for his return could be shorter. I don't remember reading anywhere that he's had surgery or will have surgery.
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@nzzp said in All Blacks 2022:
@Crucial said in All Blacks 2022:
They obviously aren’t fixed on the other two halfback spots yet so want to keep options open.
I think they are - but this is for the first injury cap off the rank. Christie has played enough to have a good track record in Black, recent game aside. Fakatava is clearly one for the future, and while his form this year hasn't been as good, you can see why they want him there.
You haven't watched most Highlanders game, have you? He came back from a terrible ACL injury that kept him out of the game for 9-10 months, so the first SRP games obviously he lacked match fitness. But he got better every game he played and was really pushing Smith (to Smith's own admission) near the end of the SRP season. He was excellent! He struggled a bit in his two short outings in black with his decision-making, but it's not fair to judge him on those performances as he was thrown into the deep end in that 2nd Irish test when the ABs were already trailing and playing terrible as a squad. Not sure how a 22-year old rookie was supposed to "fix" that. The ABs weren't any better in the 3rd test, as we all know.
I've found Christie only just adequate in his outings.
@Stargazer I don't disagree with any of that just not convinced that the coaching team have him nailed in.
That could be because of injury and the time it will take to get going again. The lack of high level experience because of that situation. Maybe he had a lot of work ons coming through at training. I don't really know.
That could mean that TJ, Weber and Christie are now the focus and they are trying to give each a fair chance of stating their case. -
@Stargazer I don't disagree with any of that just not convinced that the coaching team have him nailed in.
That could be because of injury and the time it will take to get going again. The lack of high level experience because of that situation. Maybe he had a lot of work ons coming through at training. I don't really know.
That could mean that TJ, Weber and Christie are now the focus and they are trying to give each a fair chance of stating their case.@Crucial I'm convinced it's because of the injury and that he'd have had game time (maybe even a start v Scotland) during the EOYT if he had been available. Japan, Wales, Scotland would have been excellent opportunities for him, but that bloody ACL just ruined it. Fakatava just brings something different to the other halfbacks. He's fast and physical, good on defence. Those skills are all there and only need polishing; the decision-making is something that will improve with experience.
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@Crucial I'm convinced it's because of the injury and that he'd have had game time (maybe even a start v Scotland) during the EOYT if he had been available. Japan, Wales, Scotland would have been excellent opportunities for him, but that bloody ACL just ruined it. Fakatava just brings something different to the other halfbacks. He's fast and physical, good on defence. Those skills are all there and only need polishing; the decision-making is something that will improve with experience.
@Stargazer said in All Blacks 2022:
@Crucial I'm convinced it's because of the injury and that he'd have had game time (maybe even a start v Scotland) during the EOYT if he had been available. Japan, Wales, Scotland would have been excellent opportunities for him, but that bloody ACL just ruined it. Fakatava just brings something different to the other halfbacks. He's fast and physical, good on defence. Those skills are all there and only need polishing; the decision-making is something that will improve with experience.
He just doesn't have much chance to get experience now.
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@Stargazer said in All Blacks 2022:
@Crucial I'm convinced it's because of the injury and that he'd have had game time (maybe even a start v Scotland) during the EOYT if he had been available. Japan, Wales, Scotland would have been excellent opportunities for him, but that bloody ACL just ruined it. Fakatava just brings something different to the other halfbacks. He's fast and physical, good on defence. Those skills are all there and only need polishing; the decision-making is something that will improve with experience.
He just doesn't have much chance to get experience now.
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i have to say im really struggling with those willing to forgive a halfback having even an average pass for the other things they might bring.....he's a fucking halfback...good passing is a huge part of his job...this is how we end up with hookers that cant throw or props who cant scrummage
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i have to say im really struggling with those willing to forgive a halfback having even an average pass for the other things they might bring.....he's a fucking halfback...good passing is a huge part of his job...this is how we end up with hookers that cant throw or props who cant scrummage
@Kiwiwomble said in All Blacks 2022:
i have to say im really struggling with those willing to forgive a halfback having even an average pass for the other things they might bring.....he's a fucking halfback...good passing is a huge part of his job...this is how we end up with hookers that cant throw or props who cant scrummage
Justin Marshall has entered the chat.
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@Kiwiwomble said in All Blacks 2022:
i have to say im really struggling with those willing to forgive a halfback having even an average pass for the other things they might bring.....he's a fucking halfback...good passing is a huge part of his job...this is how we end up with hookers that cant throw or props who cant scrummage
Justin Marshall has entered the chat.
@gt12 i feel sick....and very conflicted....am i a bad guy?
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Our potential 23 for next year's world cup is looking a bit clearer now isn't it?
Groot, Sami, Lomax, Rettalick, Whitelock, Barrett, Cane, Savea, Smith, Mo'unga, Clarke, J.Barrett, R.Ioane, Jordan, B.Barrett.
Taylor, Tu'ungafasi, Newell, Vaa'i, Papali'i, Fakatava, Lienert-Brown, Havili/Reece.
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Our potential 23 for next year's world cup is looking a bit clearer now isn't it?
Groot, Sami, Lomax, Rettalick, Whitelock, Barrett, Cane, Savea, Smith, Mo'unga, Clarke, J.Barrett, R.Ioane, Jordan, B.Barrett.
Taylor, Tu'ungafasi, Newell, Vaa'i, Papali'i, Fakatava, Lienert-Brown, Havili/Reece.
@kiwi_expat said in All Blacks 2022:
Our potential 23 for next year's world cup is looking a bit clearer now isn't it?
Groot, Sami, Lomax, Rettalick, Whitelock, Barrett, Cane, Savea, Smith, Mo'unga, Clarke, J.Barrett, R.Ioane, Jordan, B.Barrett.
Taylor, Tu'ungafasi, Newell, Vaa'i, Papali'i, Fakatava, Lienert-Brown, Havili/Reece.
As mentioned, just a question mark on Fakatava due to experience and coming back from injury, plus they haven't shown confidence in him being in the 23 yet.
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@kiwi_expat said in All Blacks 2022:
Our potential 23 for next year's world cup is looking a bit clearer now isn't it?
Groot, Sami, Lomax, Rettalick, Whitelock, Barrett, Cane, Savea, Smith, Mo'unga, Clarke, J.Barrett, R.Ioane, Jordan, B.Barrett.
Taylor, Tu'ungafasi, Newell, Vaa'i, Papali'i, Fakatava, Lienert-Brown, Havili/Reece.
As mentioned, just a question mark on Fakatava due to experience and coming back from injury, plus they haven't shown confidence in him being in the 23 yet.
@Crucial yeah, i think he would have to have a pretty impressive super rugby campaign and we're not even sure how much of one he'll get
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Our potential 23 for next year's world cup is looking a bit clearer now isn't it?
Groot, Sami, Lomax, Rettalick, Whitelock, Barrett, Cane, Savea, Smith, Mo'unga, Clarke, J.Barrett, R.Ioane, Jordan, B.Barrett.
Taylor, Tu'ungafasi, Newell, Vaa'i, Papali'i, Fakatava, Lienert-Brown, Havili/Reece.
@kiwi_expat Joe Moody will have a say at loosehead.
Despite a small handful of naysayers, Fern Favourite Shannon Frizell has the inside track at 6. Loosies are more balanced with AIoane on the bench - along with SBarrett.
Right now, I'd be a bit surprised if Fakatava makes the squad. I'd pick Smith, Weber and Christie as my halfbacks, but I said similar at the start of this year and that proved wrong.
I've still got question-marks about Clarke, but if Beauden is at fullback I don't like Reece also being in the back 3.
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@kiwi_expat Joe Moody will have a say at loosehead.
Despite a small handful of naysayers, Fern Favourite Shannon Frizell has the inside track at 6. Loosies are more balanced with AIoane on the bench - along with SBarrett.
Right now, I'd be a bit surprised if Fakatava makes the squad. I'd pick Smith, Weber and Christie as my halfbacks, but I said similar at the start of this year and that proved wrong.
I've still got question-marks about Clarke, but if Beauden is at fullback I don't like Reece also being in the back 3.
@Chris-B said in All Blacks 2022:
@kiwi_expat Joe Moody will have a say at loosehead.
Despite a small handful of naysayers, Fern Favourite Shannon Frizell has the inside track at 6.
3 locks is the way to go for international sides in the modern game, the reason they didn't stick with Barrett at 6 after Eden Park test was Rettalick got injured. Scott Barrett at 6 was hugely influential for ABs in their dominant performance, 1st test against Ireland.
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@kiwi_expat Joe Moody will have a say at loosehead.
Despite a small handful of naysayers, Fern Favourite Shannon Frizell has the inside track at 6. Loosies are more balanced with AIoane on the bench - along with SBarrett.
Right now, I'd be a bit surprised if Fakatava makes the squad. I'd pick Smith, Weber and Christie as my halfbacks, but I said similar at the start of this year and that proved wrong.
I've still got question-marks about Clarke, but if Beauden is at fullback I don't like Reece also being in the back 3.
@Chris-B said in All Blacks 2022:
@kiwi_expat Joe Moody will have a say at loosehead.
Despite a small handful of naysayers, Fern Favourite Shannon Frizell has the inside track at 6. Loosies are more balanced with AIoane on the bench - along with SBarrett.
Right now, I'd be a bit surprised if Fakatava makes the squad. I'd pick Smith, Weber and Christie as my halfbacks, but I said similar at the start of this year and that proved wrong.
I've still got question-marks about Clarke, but if Beauden is at fullback I don't like Reece also being in the back 3.
Moody is the past. The game has moved away from him while injured IMO.
We will see how he goes in Super I guess. -
@Chris-B said in All Blacks 2022:
@kiwi_expat Joe Moody will have a say at loosehead.
Despite a small handful of naysayers, Fern Favourite Shannon Frizell has the inside track at 6. Loosies are more balanced with AIoane on the bench - along with SBarrett.
Right now, I'd be a bit surprised if Fakatava makes the squad. I'd pick Smith, Weber and Christie as my halfbacks, but I said similar at the start of this year and that proved wrong.
I've still got question-marks about Clarke, but if Beauden is at fullback I don't like Reece also being in the back 3.
Moody is the past. The game has moved away from him while injured IMO.
We will see how he goes in Super I guess. -
The prop mix will be dependent on whether Ofa is used more as a LH for the ABs. If Moody comes back into the frame it might be at the expense of Bower. I still think that de Groot needs to improve his fitness as he was really blowing late in the 1st half.
There are still question marks over the 5th and 6th props. Laulala might be on his last chance.
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@Crucial Cane is the past too but wouldn't be a surprise to see him back as well. Foster is loyal to a fault if nothing else.
@Old-Samurai-Jack said in All Blacks 2022:
@Crucial Cane is the past too but wouldn't be a surprise to see him back as well. Foster is loyal to a fault if nothing else.
Papali'i is head & shoulders better than Cane it's not funny. It's obvious to everyone but Ian Foster at this point.
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@kiwi_expat Joe Moody will have a say at loosehead.
Despite a small handful of naysayers, Fern Favourite Shannon Frizell has the inside track at 6. Loosies are more balanced with AIoane on the bench - along with SBarrett.
Right now, I'd be a bit surprised if Fakatava makes the squad. I'd pick Smith, Weber and Christie as my halfbacks, but I said similar at the start of this year and that proved wrong.
I've still got question-marks about Clarke, but if Beauden is at fullback I don't like Reece also being in the back 3.
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@kiwi_expat Joe Moody will have a say at loosehead.
Despite a small handful of naysayers, Fern Favourite Shannon Frizell has the inside track at 6. Loosies are more balanced with AIoane on the bench - along with SBarrett.
Right now, I'd be a bit surprised if Fakatava makes the squad. I'd pick Smith, Weber and Christie as my halfbacks, but I said similar at the start of this year and that proved wrong.
I've still got question-marks about Clarke, but if Beauden is at fullback I don't like Reece also being in the back 3.
@Chris-B said in All Blacks 2022:
@kiwi_expat Joe Moody will have a say at loosehead.
Despite a small handful of naysayers, Fern Favourite Shannon Frizell has the inside track at 6. Loosies are more balanced with AIoane on the bench - along with SBarrett.
Right now, I'd be a bit surprised if Fakatava makes the squad. I'd pick Smith, Weber and Christie as my halfbacks, but I said similar at the start of this year and that proved wrong.
I've still got question-marks about Clarke, but if Beauden is at fullback I don't like Reece also being in the back 3.
Pretty much with you on all of that.
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The prop mix will be dependent on whether Ofa is used more as a LH for the ABs. If Moody comes back into the frame it might be at the expense of Bower. I still think that de Groot needs to improve his fitness as he was really blowing late in the 1st half.
There are still question marks over the 5th and 6th props. Laulala might be on his last chance.
@Bovidae said in All Blacks 2022:
I still think that de Groot needs to improve his fitness as he was really blowing late in the 1st half.
Agree. I noticed he was slow to get off the ground for a period of time too. He needs to get it sorted.
