Foster, Robertson etc
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@nostrildamus said in Foster, Robertson etc:
Robertson has won 6/6 super titles has he not? Given some of his crusaders have not always played to the same level in the ABs and the ABs now have one of his coaches is it not fair to say he is a good coach? Unbeaten Barbarians coach!
Then again, what is the influence and impact of Ronan O'Gara? But only at the Crusaders 2018-2019?Um hate to be the one to break it to you, he's not undefeated as Barbarians coach they got pummelled by Harlequins 73-28, funnuly enough not reported much in NZ.
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@nostrildamus said in Foster, Robertson etc:
Robertson has won 6/6 super titles has he not? Given some of his crusaders have not always played to the same level in the ABs and the ABs now have one of his coaches is it not fair to say he is a good coach? Unbeaten Barbarians coach!
Then again, what is the influence and impact of Ronan O'Gara? But only at the Crusaders 2018-2019?Um hate to be the one to break it to you, he's not undefeated as Barbarians coach they got pummelled by Harlequins 73-28, funnuly enough not reported much in NZ.
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@TheMojoman said in Foster, Robertson etc:
https://www.sarugbymag.co.za/razor-edge-england-job/
Hopefully this is rumor because I'd be gutted if we allow our best coach to slip through our fingers and coach England.
Henry just retired.
@Kirwan said in Foster, Robertson etc:
@TheMojoman said in Foster, Robertson etc:
https://www.sarugbymag.co.za/razor-edge-england-job/
Hopefully this is rumor because I'd be gutted if we allow our best coach to slip through our fingers and coach England.
Henry just retired.
Best coach Wayne Smith just retired ..
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@TheMojoman jamie joseph enters the room
@ploughboy same applies to him, you hope NZR have reached out to him...although from the outside where he is, it probably looks like a done deal, again...
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@TheMojoman said in Foster, Robertson etc:
https://www.sarugbymag.co.za/razor-edge-england-job/
Hopefully this is rumor because I'd be gutted if we allow our best coach to slip through our fingers and coach England.
Henry just retired.
@Kirwan said in Foster, Robertson etc:
@TheMojoman said in Foster, Robertson etc:
https://www.sarugbymag.co.za/razor-edge-england-job/
Hopefully this is rumor because I'd be gutted if we allow our best coach to slip through our fingers and coach England.
Henry just retired.
Henry was crap - he lost Test matches. Robertson's never lost one yet.
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@Dan54 reality smeality... still has a better record!
@nostrildamus said in Foster, Robertson etc:
@Dan54 reality smeality... still has a better record!
Lol mate, better record than who? I not sure what your point is, you giving him credit for beating Leon MacDonald coached team, but shrugging your shoulders when his team gets absolutely flogged againt Harlequins.
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@Dan54 actually I did know this but it didn't seem a serious game to me-a friendly. Plus they had Marler!
@nostrildamus said in Foster, Robertson etc:
@Dan54 actually I did know this but it didn't seem a serious game to me-a friendly. Plus they had Marler!
So Marler was why Baabaas won first game? But you right no Baabaas game is serious in that they have a couple of traing runs a few beers and then play.
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I'm not sure if it has been mentioned previously in the thread but I find talk of a 'snub' by NZR a bit hard to take even knowing how useless NZR are.
Razor signed with them in full knowledge that the big job wouldn't come up until after RWC.
NZ, Eng, Oz, whoever are all in the same boat as far as timings go it is just that Eng and Oz don't go through selection process the same way NZ do and will happily throw out a contract to whoever they want.
He hasn't been stiffed by anyone.
The Foster mess in the middle of the year was badly handled if he was told to be ready as opposed to being sounded out.
Personally I think if he goes with England it smacks of being selfish and entitled. He simply had bad luck with timing just as many players do in their career. Even then he has still taken an NZR pay cheque up until the time his chance would come anyway. -
I'm not sure if it has been mentioned previously in the thread but I find talk of a 'snub' by NZR a bit hard to take even knowing how useless NZR are.
Razor signed with them in full knowledge that the big job wouldn't come up until after RWC.
NZ, Eng, Oz, whoever are all in the same boat as far as timings go it is just that Eng and Oz don't go through selection process the same way NZ do and will happily throw out a contract to whoever they want.
He hasn't been stiffed by anyone.
The Foster mess in the middle of the year was badly handled if he was told to be ready as opposed to being sounded out.
Personally I think if he goes with England it smacks of being selfish and entitled. He simply had bad luck with timing just as many players do in their career. Even then he has still taken an NZR pay cheque up until the time his chance would come anyway. -
I'm not sure if it has been mentioned previously in the thread but I find talk of a 'snub' by NZR a bit hard to take even knowing how useless NZR are.
Razor signed with them in full knowledge that the big job wouldn't come up until after RWC.
NZ, Eng, Oz, whoever are all in the same boat as far as timings go it is just that Eng and Oz don't go through selection process the same way NZ do and will happily throw out a contract to whoever they want.
He hasn't been stiffed by anyone.
The Foster mess in the middle of the year was badly handled if he was told to be ready as opposed to being sounded out.
Personally I think if he goes with England it smacks of being selfish and entitled. He simply had bad luck with timing just as many players do in their career. Even then he has still taken an NZR pay cheque up until the time his chance would come anyway.@Crucial said in Foster, Robertson etc:
I'm not sure if it has been mentioned previously in the thread but I find talk of a 'snub' by NZR a bit hard to take even knowing how useless NZR are.
Razor signed with them in full knowledge that the big job wouldn't come up until after RWC.
NZ, Eng, Oz, whoever are all in the same boat as far as timings go it is just that Eng and Oz don't go through selection process the same way NZ do and will happily throw out a contract to whoever they want.
He hasn't been stiffed by anyone.
The Foster mess in the middle of the year was badly handled if he was told to be ready as opposed to being sounded out.
Personally I think if he goes with England it smacks of being selfish and entitled. He simply had bad luck with timing just as many players do in their career. Even then he has still taken an NZR pay cheque up until the time his chance would come anyway.I don't understand how going with England would be entitled. Selfish yes, but it can be argued we are all selfish no matter what decision we make, so I don't see that as a bad thing.
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@Crucial said in Foster, Robertson etc:
I'm not sure if it has been mentioned previously in the thread but I find talk of a 'snub' by NZR a bit hard to take even knowing how useless NZR are.
Razor signed with them in full knowledge that the big job wouldn't come up until after RWC.
NZ, Eng, Oz, whoever are all in the same boat as far as timings go it is just that Eng and Oz don't go through selection process the same way NZ do and will happily throw out a contract to whoever they want.
He hasn't been stiffed by anyone.
The Foster mess in the middle of the year was badly handled if he was told to be ready as opposed to being sounded out.
Personally I think if he goes with England it smacks of being selfish and entitled. He simply had bad luck with timing just as many players do in their career. Even then he has still taken an NZR pay cheque up until the time his chance would come anyway.I don't understand how going with England would be entitled. Selfish yes, but it can be argued we are all selfish no matter what decision we make, so I don't see that as a bad thing.
@Crazy-Horse said in Foster, Robertson etc:
@Crucial said in Foster, Robertson etc:
I'm not sure if it has been mentioned previously in the thread but I find talk of a 'snub' by NZR a bit hard to take even knowing how useless NZR are.
Razor signed with them in full knowledge that the big job wouldn't come up until after RWC.
NZ, Eng, Oz, whoever are all in the same boat as far as timings go it is just that Eng and Oz don't go through selection process the same way NZ do and will happily throw out a contract to whoever they want.
He hasn't been stiffed by anyone.
The Foster mess in the middle of the year was badly handled if he was told to be ready as opposed to being sounded out.
Personally I think if he goes with England it smacks of being selfish and entitled. He simply had bad luck with timing just as many players do in their career. Even then he has still taken an NZR pay cheque up until the time his chance would come anyway.I don't understand how going with England would be entitled. Selfish yes, but it can be argued we are all selfish no matter what decision we make, so I don't see that as a bad thing.
@Crazy-Horse said in Foster, Robertson etc:
@Crucial said in Foster, Robertson etc:
I'm not sure if it has been mentioned previously in the thread but I find talk of a 'snub' by NZR a bit hard to take even knowing how useless NZR are.
Razor signed with them in full knowledge that the big job wouldn't come up until after RWC.
NZ, Eng, Oz, whoever are all in the same boat as far as timings go it is just that Eng and Oz don't go through selection process the same way NZ do and will happily throw out a contract to whoever they want.
He hasn't been stiffed by anyone.
The Foster mess in the middle of the year was badly handled if he was told to be ready as opposed to being sounded out.
Personally I think if he goes with England it smacks of being selfish and entitled. He simply had bad luck with timing just as many players do in their career. Even then he has still taken an NZR pay cheque up until the time his chance would come anyway.I don't understand how going with England would be entitled. Selfish yes, but it can be argued we are all selfish no matter what decision we make, so I don't see that as a bad thing.
It is just my opinion and I am sure others here view things differently.
I'm just getting the vibe that he feels entitled to a big job right now and is approaching unions on that basis.
Somewhere like England would actually work for him better than NZ IMO as well. I still still him as a very skilled strategist and planner that needs an equally excellent support team. RFU will give him that whereas his selection in NZ may be slightly limited. -
@Crazy-Horse said in Foster, Robertson etc:
@Crucial said in Foster, Robertson etc:
I'm not sure if it has been mentioned previously in the thread but I find talk of a 'snub' by NZR a bit hard to take even knowing how useless NZR are.
Razor signed with them in full knowledge that the big job wouldn't come up until after RWC.
NZ, Eng, Oz, whoever are all in the same boat as far as timings go it is just that Eng and Oz don't go through selection process the same way NZ do and will happily throw out a contract to whoever they want.
He hasn't been stiffed by anyone.
The Foster mess in the middle of the year was badly handled if he was told to be ready as opposed to being sounded out.
Personally I think if he goes with England it smacks of being selfish and entitled. He simply had bad luck with timing just as many players do in their career. Even then he has still taken an NZR pay cheque up until the time his chance would come anyway.I don't understand how going with England would be entitled. Selfish yes, but it can be argued we are all selfish no matter what decision we make, so I don't see that as a bad thing.
@Crazy-Horse said in Foster, Robertson etc:
@Crucial said in Foster, Robertson etc:
I'm not sure if it has been mentioned previously in the thread but I find talk of a 'snub' by NZR a bit hard to take even knowing how useless NZR are.
Razor signed with them in full knowledge that the big job wouldn't come up until after RWC.
NZ, Eng, Oz, whoever are all in the same boat as far as timings go it is just that Eng and Oz don't go through selection process the same way NZ do and will happily throw out a contract to whoever they want.
He hasn't been stiffed by anyone.
The Foster mess in the middle of the year was badly handled if he was told to be ready as opposed to being sounded out.
Personally I think if he goes with England it smacks of being selfish and entitled. He simply had bad luck with timing just as many players do in their career. Even then he has still taken an NZR pay cheque up until the time his chance would come anyway.I don't understand how going with England would be entitled. Selfish yes, but it can be argued we are all selfish no matter what decision we make, so I don't see that as a bad thing.
It is just my opinion and I am sure others here view things differently.
I'm just getting the vibe that he feels entitled to a big job right now and is approaching unions on that basis.
Somewhere like England would actually work for him better than NZ IMO as well. I still still him as a very skilled strategist and planner that needs an equally excellent support team. RFU will give him that whereas his selection in NZ may be slightly limited.@Crucial said in Foster, Robertson etc:
@Crazy-Horse said in Foster, Robertson etc:
@Crucial said in Foster, Robertson etc:
I'm not sure if it has been mentioned previously in the thread but I find talk of a 'snub' by NZR a bit hard to take even knowing how useless NZR are.
Razor signed with them in full knowledge that the big job wouldn't come up until after RWC.
NZ, Eng, Oz, whoever are all in the same boat as far as timings go it is just that Eng and Oz don't go through selection process the same way NZ do and will happily throw out a contract to whoever they want.
He hasn't been stiffed by anyone.
The Foster mess in the middle of the year was badly handled if he was told to be ready as opposed to being sounded out.
Personally I think if he goes with England it smacks of being selfish and entitled. He simply had bad luck with timing just as many players do in their career. Even then he has still taken an NZR pay cheque up until the time his chance would come anyway.I don't understand how going with England would be entitled. Selfish yes, but it can be argued we are all selfish no matter what decision we make, so I don't see that as a bad thing.
@Crazy-Horse said in Foster, Robertson etc:
@Crucial said in Foster, Robertson etc:
I'm not sure if it has been mentioned previously in the thread but I find talk of a 'snub' by NZR a bit hard to take even knowing how useless NZR are.
Razor signed with them in full knowledge that the big job wouldn't come up until after RWC.
NZ, Eng, Oz, whoever are all in the same boat as far as timings go it is just that Eng and Oz don't go through selection process the same way NZ do and will happily throw out a contract to whoever they want.
He hasn't been stiffed by anyone.
The Foster mess in the middle of the year was badly handled if he was told to be ready as opposed to being sounded out.
Personally I think if he goes with England it smacks of being selfish and entitled. He simply had bad luck with timing just as many players do in their career. Even then he has still taken an NZR pay cheque up until the time his chance would come anyway.I don't understand how going with England would be entitled. Selfish yes, but it can be argued we are all selfish no matter what decision we make, so I don't see that as a bad thing.
It is just my opinion and I am sure others here view things differently.
I'm just getting the vibe that he feels entitled to a big job right now and is approaching unions on that basis.
Somewhere like England would actually work for him better than NZ IMO as well. I still still him as a very skilled strategist and planner that needs an equally excellent support team. RFU will give him that whereas his selection in NZ may be slightly limited.I think he wants a promotion and thinks he deserves one. Can't blame him for that because he has been successful in his current role. Like anybody else wanting a promotion he is considering all options. If you are wanting a promotion and your current employer is dithering or doesn't have a spot open it makes sense to consider other options.
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@nostrildamus said in Foster, Robertson etc:
@Dan54 reality smeality... still has a better record!
Lol mate, better record than who? I not sure what your point is, you giving him credit for beating Leon MacDonald coached team, but shrugging your shoulders when his team gets absolutely flogged againt Harlequins.
@Dan54 said in Foster, Robertson etc:
@nostrildamus said in Foster, Robertson etc:
@Dan54 reality smeality... still has a better record!
Lol mate, better record than who? I not sure what your point is, you giving him credit for beating Leon MacDonald coached team, but shrugging your shoulders when his team gets absolutely flogged againt Harlequins.
Harlequins was labelled a friendly and didn't seem to have the same coaching effort as opposed to against say NZ XV.
And the lack of media attention seems to agree with me.
I don't shrug my shoulders Ireland A and Z XV were the targets IMHO to gauge the coaching. Not shrugged shoulders.
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I'm not sure if it has been mentioned previously in the thread but I find talk of a 'snub' by NZR a bit hard to take even knowing how useless NZR are.
Razor signed with them in full knowledge that the big job wouldn't come up until after RWC.
NZ, Eng, Oz, whoever are all in the same boat as far as timings go it is just that Eng and Oz don't go through selection process the same way NZ do and will happily throw out a contract to whoever they want.
He hasn't been stiffed by anyone.
The Foster mess in the middle of the year was badly handled if he was told to be ready as opposed to being sounded out.
Personally I think if he goes with England it smacks of being selfish and entitled. He simply had bad luck with timing just as many players do in their career. Even then he has still taken an NZR pay cheque up until the time his chance would come anyway.@Crucial SR applied for AB coach job and says it is still his preference. His workon allegedly is int. experience and England scouts think he is worthy candidate. He has coached and won at the Crusaders six times?
I don't see what is selfish.
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@Crucial said in Foster, Robertson etc:
@Crazy-Horse said in Foster, Robertson etc:
@Crucial said in Foster, Robertson etc:
I'm not sure if it has been mentioned previously in the thread but I find talk of a 'snub' by NZR a bit hard to take even knowing how useless NZR are.
Razor signed with them in full knowledge that the big job wouldn't come up until after RWC.
NZ, Eng, Oz, whoever are all in the same boat as far as timings go it is just that Eng and Oz don't go through selection process the same way NZ do and will happily throw out a contract to whoever they want.
He hasn't been stiffed by anyone.
The Foster mess in the middle of the year was badly handled if he was told to be ready as opposed to being sounded out.
Personally I think if he goes with England it smacks of being selfish and entitled. He simply had bad luck with timing just as many players do in their career. Even then he has still taken an NZR pay cheque up until the time his chance would come anyway.I don't understand how going with England would be entitled. Selfish yes, but it can be argued we are all selfish no matter what decision we make, so I don't see that as a bad thing.
@Crazy-Horse said in Foster, Robertson etc:
@Crucial said in Foster, Robertson etc:
I'm not sure if it has been mentioned previously in the thread but I find talk of a 'snub' by NZR a bit hard to take even knowing how useless NZR are.
Razor signed with them in full knowledge that the big job wouldn't come up until after RWC.
NZ, Eng, Oz, whoever are all in the same boat as far as timings go it is just that Eng and Oz don't go through selection process the same way NZ do and will happily throw out a contract to whoever they want.
He hasn't been stiffed by anyone.
The Foster mess in the middle of the year was badly handled if he was told to be ready as opposed to being sounded out.
Personally I think if he goes with England it smacks of being selfish and entitled. He simply had bad luck with timing just as many players do in their career. Even then he has still taken an NZR pay cheque up until the time his chance would come anyway.I don't understand how going with England would be entitled. Selfish yes, but it can be argued we are all selfish no matter what decision we make, so I don't see that as a bad thing.
It is just my opinion and I am sure others here view things differently.
I'm just getting the vibe that he feels entitled to a big job right now and is approaching unions on that basis.
Somewhere like England would actually work for him better than NZ IMO as well. I still still him as a very skilled strategist and planner that needs an equally excellent support team. RFU will give him that whereas his selection in NZ may be slightly limited.I think he wants a promotion and thinks he deserves one. Can't blame him for that because he has been successful in his current role. Like anybody else wanting a promotion he is considering all options. If you are wanting a promotion and your current employer is dithering or doesn't have a spot open it makes sense to consider other options.
@Crazy-Horse said in Foster, Robertson etc:
I think he wants a promotion and thinks he deserves one.
I'm not so sure it even falls in that category.
He has achieved all he can for the Crusaders, bar 'just another' title, so he is wanting to take the next step, which for him is International rugby which will present a new challenge.
Most workplaces have people who are happy in thier roles with no desire for advancement, while you will always have those keen to advance, improve and challenge themselves.
Would also be odd if other International teams are keen on Razor with his current experience level, yet if NZR were to cite his lack of International experience as an issue....
As above, I really hope NZR have actually starting thier process now, contacting possible candidates of the upcoming role.
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I'm not sure if it has been mentioned previously in the thread but I find talk of a 'snub' by NZR a bit hard to take even knowing how useless NZR are.
Razor signed with them in full knowledge that the big job wouldn't come up until after RWC.
NZ, Eng, Oz, whoever are all in the same boat as far as timings go it is just that Eng and Oz don't go through selection process the same way NZ do and will happily throw out a contract to whoever they want.
He hasn't been stiffed by anyone.
The Foster mess in the middle of the year was badly handled if he was told to be ready as opposed to being sounded out.
Personally I think if he goes with England it smacks of being selfish and entitled. He simply had bad luck with timing just as many players do in their career. Even then he has still taken an NZR pay cheque up until the time his chance would come anyway.@Crucial said in Foster, Robertson etc:
I'm not sure if it has been mentioned previously in the thread but I find talk of a 'snub' by NZR a bit hard to take even knowing how useless NZR are.
Razor signed with them in full knowledge that the big job wouldn't come up until after RWC.
NZ, Eng, Oz, whoever are all in the same boat as far as timings go it is just that Eng and Oz don't go through selection process the same way NZ do and will happily throw out a contract to whoever they want.
He hasn't been stiffed by anyone.
The Foster mess in the middle of the year was badly handled if he was told to be ready as opposed to being sounded out.
Personally I think if he goes with England it smacks of being selfish and entitled. He simply had bad luck with timing just as many players do in their career. Even then he has still taken an NZR pay cheque up until the time his chance would come anyway.im not sure its that cut and dry, fozzie wasn;t originally signed through to the next WRC, and then even after being resigned there was a review, so those things along with the average performances over the years (a few first ever losses), i dont think he would be out of line thinking he had to be close
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Not sure why people are posting Razor is selfish and entitled.
Every major international coaching Job will be locked in before the WC and coaches need to take opportunities before there is none left.
Rennie has also said the same thing to the Australian RU he needs to know by May if they are interested in him after the WC.
Joseph,Brown,Jones will all be locked in somewhere mid 2023.
Only the NZR expect all the top coaches to sit and wait until after the WC and decline other jobs just in case the get the call.For me it is a pretty scary scenario if a Coach like Razor is not given any indication by the NZR if he is wanted or not and Ends up as England coach where he has the most money and Resources in World Rugby backing him.
As for he needs the right set up around him, Jason Ryan,Scott Hansen had no major coaching experience but really grew under Razor at Canterbury and the Crusaders,Andrew Goodman too came as Assistant coach at Ta$man no real experience,O'Gara also had not a lot of Coaching under his belt before coming to coach under Razor.
And came away saying the learnt a lot under Razor and it changed his thinking patterns as a Coach,Plenty of articles quoting O'Gara saying these things.
Tamiti Ellison another one who seems to have grown as coach under Razor.Just maybe Razor is a great mentor for young coaches as well as being a great winning coach.
If this current coaching team fail at the WC which is a real possibility the AB's will be left with who McDonald who has won nothing and has no international coaching experience which apparently is paramount in some peoples eyes.
Or Foster for 4 more years or Schmidt who if the don't have a great WC would not be a great option,
But I suppose there is always Fred from the local u12 team ready to jump in. -
Not sure why people are posting Razor is selfish and entitled.
Every major international coaching Job will be locked in before the WC and coaches need to take opportunities before there is none left.
Rennie has also said the same thing to the Australian RU he needs to know by May if they are interested in him after the WC.
Joseph,Brown,Jones will all be locked in somewhere mid 2023.
Only the NZR expect all the top coaches to sit and wait until after the WC and decline other jobs just in case the get the call.For me it is a pretty scary scenario if a Coach like Razor is not given any indication by the NZR if he is wanted or not and Ends up as England coach where he has the most money and Resources in World Rugby backing him.
As for he needs the right set up around him, Jason Ryan,Scott Hansen had no major coaching experience but really grew under Razor at Canterbury and the Crusaders,Andrew Goodman too came as Assistant coach at Ta$man no real experience,O'Gara also had not a lot of Coaching under his belt before coming to coach under Razor.
And came away saying the learnt a lot under Razor and it changed his thinking patterns as a Coach,Plenty of articles quoting O'Gara saying these things.
Tamiti Ellison another one who seems to have grown as coach under Razor.Just maybe Razor is a great mentor for young coaches as well as being a great winning coach.
If this current coaching team fail at the WC which is a real possibility the AB's will be left with who McDonald who has won nothing and has no international coaching experience which apparently is paramount in some peoples eyes.
Or Foster for 4 more years or Schmidt who if the don't have a great WC would not be a great option,
But I suppose there is always Fred from the local u12 team ready to jump in.@Chris said in Foster, Robertson etc:
Not sure why people are posting Razor is selfish and entitled.
Every major international coaching Job will be locked in before the WC and coaches need to take opportunities before there is none left.
Rennie has also said the same thing to the Australian RU he needs to know by May if they are interested in him after the WC.
Joseph,Brown,Jones will all be locked in somewhere mid 2023.
Only the NZR expect all the top coaches to sit and wait until after the WC and decline other jobs just in case the get the call.For me it is a pretty scary scenario if a Coach like Razor is not given any indication by the NZR if he is wanted or not and Ends up as England coach where he has the most money and Resources in World Rugby backing him.
As for he needs the right set up around him, Jason Ryan,Scott Hansen had no major coaching experience but really grew under Razor at Canterbury and the Crusaders,Andrew Goodman too came as Assistant coach at Ta$man no real experience,O'Gara also had not a lot of Coaching under his belt before coming to coach under Razor.
And came away saying the learnt a lot under Razor and it changed his thinking patterns as a Coach,Plenty of articles quoting O'Gara saying these things.
Tamiti Ellison another one who seems to have grown as coach under Razor.Just maybe Razor is a great mentor for young coaches as well as being a great winning coach.
If this current coaching team fail at the WC which is a real possibility the AB's will be left with who McDonald who has won nothing and has no international coaching experience which apparently is paramount in some peoples eyes.
Or Foster for 4 more years or Schmidt who if the don't have a great WC would not be a great option,
But I suppose there is always Fred from the local u12 team ready to jump in.Yup. The fact that we credit Jason Ryan for much of the ABs recent improvement says something about Razor's ability to build a coaching team doesn't it?
