All Blacks 2023
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@frugby said in All Blacks 2023:
By your argument, Sam Whitelock and Aaron Smith are like for like because they're both proven and highly experienced.
No, they're not. They play in different positions. Stop twisting my words.
@Stargazer said in All Blacks 2023:
@frugby said in All Blacks 2023:
By your argument, Sam Whitelock and Aaron Smith are like for like because they're both proven and highly experienced.
No, they're not. They play in different positions. Stop twisting my words.
By like for like, I was quite clearly referring to play style. Nothing to do with experience.
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God i hope Havili doesn't go
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2023:
God i hope Havili doesn't go
I am sorry my son, but David is a near certainty. You may pray for something else, though.
I know what you mean. He would be extremely handy for the Mako.
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They're like for like in that they are big bodies that can run it straight, jordie has a more full court game. He's played every position in the abs beyond 9, and has a lot of strings to how bow. McLeod and Tup not so much
@Machpants said in All Blacks 2023:
They're like for like in that they are big bodies that can run it straight, jordie has a more full court game. He's played every position in the abs beyond 9, and has a lot of strings to how bow. McLeod and Tup not so much
Absolutely correct. That's why I originally said, if they want a hard ball-carrier, which to me has been the most important part of Barrett's game this year, then the other two are more like for like than Havili.
The most like for like in the other regard would be Sam Gilbert, but he is very much a Jordie Barrett lite, who does everything Barrett does, except slightly worse, barring the fact he is the greatest goal kicker of all time.
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@Stargazer said in All Blacks 2023:
@frugby said in All Blacks 2023:
By your argument, Sam Whitelock and Aaron Smith are like for like because they're both proven and highly experienced.
No, they're not. They play in different positions. Stop twisting my words.
By like for like, I was quite clearly referring to play style. Nothing to do with experience.
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@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2023:
God i hope Havili doesn't go
I am sorry my son, but David is a near certainty. You may pray for something else, though.
I know what you mean. He would be extremely handy for the Mako.
@Chris-B said in All Blacks 2023:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2023:
God i hope Havili doesn't go
I am sorry my son, but David is a near certainty. You may pray for something else, though.
I know what you mean. He would be extremely handy for the Mako.
i think so too, but it's a wasted spot IMO
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@frugby Yes, but you made the comment in relation to a "backdoor entrance", so a spot in the RWC squad. And that's unlikely to happen for the reasons I mentioned.
@Stargazer said in All Blacks 2023:
@frugby Yes, but you made the comment in relation to a "backdoor entrance", so a spot in the RWC squad. And that's unlikely to happen for the reasons I mentioned.
Once again, did you read what I said? If they have now decided they want a hard ball-carrier, then it is entirely possible they opt for Tupaea over Havili - which would be a backdoor entrance into the World Cup squad.
You're disputing the likelihood of the overall scenario, not the statement. I literally have said several times I think Havili will go to the World Cup, I'm just suggesting another possibility.
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They're like for like in that they are big bodies that can run it straight, jordie has a more full court game. He's played every position in the abs beyond 9, and has a lot of strings to how bow. McLeod and Tup not so much
@Machpants said in All Blacks 2023:
jordie has a more full court game
not convinced of the distribution yet, but the carries are so effective. The game plan on the weekend especially meant he spent most of the time keeping us on the front foot rather than releasing the outsides.
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@Chris-B said in All Blacks 2023:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2023:
God i hope Havili doesn't go
I am sorry my son, but David is a near certainty. You may pray for something else, though.
I know what you mean. He would be extremely handy for the Mako.
i think so too, but it's a wasted spot IMO
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2023:
@Chris-B said in All Blacks 2023:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2023:
God i hope Havili doesn't go
I am sorry my son, but David is a near certainty. You may pray for something else, though.
I know what you mean. He would be extremely handy for the Mako.
i think so too, but it's a wasted spot IMO
Dave's alright - just needs to be reined in to be a role player in that backline if he happens to be required in a big match.
If we had better options, they should have pushed him out already.
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@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2023:
@Chris-B said in All Blacks 2023:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2023:
God i hope Havili doesn't go
I am sorry my son, but David is a near certainty. You may pray for something else, though.
I know what you mean. He would be extremely handy for the Mako.
i think so too, but it's a wasted spot IMO
Dave's alright - just needs to be reined in to be a role player in that backline if he happens to be required in a big match.
If we had better options, they should have pushed him out already.
@Chris-B said in All Blacks 2023:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2023:
@Chris-B said in All Blacks 2023:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2023:
God i hope Havili doesn't go
I am sorry my son, but David is a near certainty. You may pray for something else, though.
I know what you mean. He would be extremely handy for the Mako.
i think so too, but it's a wasted spot IMO
Dave's alright - just needs to be reined in to be a role player in that backline if he happens to be required in a big match.
If we had better options, they should have pushed him out already.
Lol the only reason jordie use there is because of injury, despite him being carried for by all and sundry. Once you aware ensconced in a foster team, you're in. See the front row for another example
He's a fine midfielder, but not how foster ABs use 12s. Closer to Owen Farrell, then nonu or jordie
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@Chris-B said in All Blacks 2023:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2023:
God i hope Havili doesn't go
I am sorry my son, but David is a near certainty. You may pray for something else, though.
I know what you mean. He would be extremely handy for the Mako.
i think so too, but it's a wasted spot IMO
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2023:
@Chris-B said in All Blacks 2023:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2023:
God i hope Havili doesn't go
I am sorry my son, but David is a near certainty. You may pray for something else, though.
I know what you mean. He would be extremely handy for the Mako.
i think so too, but it's a wasted spot IMO
Given our draw, I don’t see any need for his versatility. He should be picked as the number 4 midfielder and I’m not sure he is - ALB is more Jordie and Ennor is a Roane replacement. Maybe if they take 5…
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@Stargazer said in All Blacks 2023:
@frugby Yes, but you made the comment in relation to a "backdoor entrance", so a spot in the RWC squad. And that's unlikely to happen for the reasons I mentioned.
Once again, did you read what I said? If they have now decided they want a hard ball-carrier, then it is entirely possible they opt for Tupaea over Havili - which would be a backdoor entrance into the World Cup squad.
You're disputing the likelihood of the overall scenario, not the statement. I literally have said several times I think Havili will go to the World Cup, I'm just suggesting another possibility.
@frugby said in All Blacks 2023:
@Stargazer said in All Blacks 2023:
@frugby Yes, but you made the comment in relation to a "backdoor entrance", so a spot in the RWC squad. And that's unlikely to happen for the reasons I mentioned.
Once again, did you read what I said? If they have now decided they want a hard ball-carrier, then it is entirely possible they opt for Tupaea over Havili - which would be a backdoor entrance into the World Cup squad.
You're disputing the likelihood of the overall scenario, not the statement. I literally have said several times I think Havili will go to the World Cup, I'm just suggesting another possibility.
If you are debating the merits of Havili with Stargazer, you should put in it your schedule as you’ll be here for a while.
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@frugby said in All Blacks 2023:
@Stargazer said in All Blacks 2023:
@frugby Yes, but you made the comment in relation to a "backdoor entrance", so a spot in the RWC squad. And that's unlikely to happen for the reasons I mentioned.
Once again, did you read what I said? If they have now decided they want a hard ball-carrier, then it is entirely possible they opt for Tupaea over Havili - which would be a backdoor entrance into the World Cup squad.
You're disputing the likelihood of the overall scenario, not the statement. I literally have said several times I think Havili will go to the World Cup, I'm just suggesting another possibility.
If you are debating the merits of Havili with Stargazer, you should put in it your schedule as you’ll be here for a while.
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Given the way we play, Havili doesn't fit at 12. He's not in the running as centre. Doesn't play wing and never plays fullback, where he may have been able to make a case over the last few years.
But even there he's behind the obvious targets.
TBH I'm not thrilled with taking any player that's been in rehab more than they've played minutes on the field this year.
Except Lord.
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Of the current midfielders in the squad, and with a realistic chance of going to France (so not McLeod), Ennor might have the physicality to replicate JB.
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@Machpants World Cup team is being named on Monday.
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@Machpants World Cup team is being named on Monday.
@Canes4life said in All Blacks 2023:
@Machpants World Cup team is being named on Monday.
I know, just ABs media being shit again
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Given the way we play, Havili doesn't fit at 12. He's not in the running as centre. Doesn't play wing and never plays fullback, where he may have been able to make a case over the last few years.
But even there he's behind the obvious targets.
TBH I'm not thrilled with taking any player that's been in rehab more than they've played minutes on the field this year.
Except Lord.
@antipodean said in All Blacks 2023:
Given the way we play, Havili doesn't fit at 12. He's not in the running as centre. Doesn't play wing and never plays fullback, where he may have been able to make a case over the last few years.
But even there he's behind the obvious targets.
TBH I'm not thrilled with taking any player that's been in rehab more than they've played minutes on the field this year.
Except Lord.
Dave's alright on your last point. He appears to have played nine times for the Crusaders this year.
Thing is - if you don't take Dave who are you going to take?
They're not going to take someone who's never played before - so the likes of Nankivell and, unless he has an absolute blinder on Saturday, McLeod.
Tupaea hasn't played in a year - may have his first start this weekend, but Dave was generally preferred to Quinn when they were both fit.
Goodhue hasn't played for the ABs for nearly three years and there's an obvious issue with his speed. I'd be happy enough with him, though.
Or Ennor. If Dave gives you the heebie-jeebies when he's playing, you must shit your pants with Braydon. He makes me very, very nervous.
