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RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy

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  • Dan54D Dan54

    @reprobate said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

    @Victor-Meldrew said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

    @reprobate said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

    @Victor-Meldrew said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

    @Tim said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

    Poor coaching, as is the standard.

    Same coaching set-up when he was getting game-time and being so bloody effective coming off the bench. Weird.

    Foster has always preferred Taylor, even when it was blindingly obvious that he was playing terribly and Samisoni was playing great. IIRC he dropped Samisoni despite being our best forward for the Irish decider, then continued using Taylor while our lineout and his general play was dogshit all last season. Taylor is a decent player, but his form last year was arguably the worst I've seen an AB get away with and keep being selected - and that's not when the cupboard was bare, but when we had another option who was clearly better. It is just shit selection.
    Samisoni should be a bolted on starter by now. Taylor or Coles should be the bench guy, or if we were better at handling young players, Aumua could have been ready in time.
    We all sit around bemoaning Super rugby and our lack of grunt up front - and we have that guy right fucking there and they won't fucking pick him!

    If what you say is true - and it may be - you have to question what value Ryan actually adds, don't you?

    Not really. Foster's preference for Taylor and Taylor's terrible form pre-dates Ryan being involved.
    Has Ryan changed that? No. Has he tried? No idea.
    Buck stops with the head coach.

    Well personally I would be starting with Taylor, I a ST fan , but we need a bloody solid set piece going forward, and hence Taylor probably gets the nod. Would make no difference anyway, we all got our players we like and lo and behold any coach or coaches who don't put our players on field.

    R Offline
    R Offline
    reprobate
    wrote on last edited by
    #388

    @Dan54 said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

    @reprobate said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

    @Victor-Meldrew said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

    @reprobate said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

    @Victor-Meldrew said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

    @Tim said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

    Poor coaching, as is the standard.

    Same coaching set-up when he was getting game-time and being so bloody effective coming off the bench. Weird.

    Foster has always preferred Taylor, even when it was blindingly obvious that he was playing terribly and Samisoni was playing great. IIRC he dropped Samisoni despite being our best forward for the Irish decider, then continued using Taylor while our lineout and his general play was dogshit all last season. Taylor is a decent player, but his form last year was arguably the worst I've seen an AB get away with and keep being selected - and that's not when the cupboard was bare, but when we had another option who was clearly better. It is just shit selection.
    Samisoni should be a bolted on starter by now. Taylor or Coles should be the bench guy, or if we were better at handling young players, Aumua could have been ready in time.
    We all sit around bemoaning Super rugby and our lack of grunt up front - and we have that guy right fucking there and they won't fucking pick him!

    If what you say is true - and it may be - you have to question what value Ryan actually adds, don't you?

    Not really. Foster's preference for Taylor and Taylor's terrible form pre-dates Ryan being involved.
    Has Ryan changed that? No. Has he tried? No idea.
    Buck stops with the head coach.

    Well personally I would be starting with Taylor, I a ST fan , but we need a bloody solid set piece going forward, and hence Taylor probably gets the nod. Would make no difference anyway, we all got our players we like and lo and behold any coach or coaches who don't put our players on field.

    If you were to check line-out stats for last year, Samisoni would have been miles better than Taylor, yet they wouldn't drop Taylor and wouldn't start Samisoni. Taylor fucked up critical throws on multiple occasions. He was terrible, and his head clearly wasn't right but htey wouldn't rest him. He's been better again this year, but it's not an exaggeration to say that it lost us games last year, and it clearly has had a negative impact on Samisoni - why wouldn't it?
    Assessing the scrum is not straightforward, because there are so many different combinations.
    Assessing the impact in open play is obvious: Samisoni is the power man, Taylor and Coles the speed men. That to me says Samisoni starts, and the others impact.

    Dan54D 1 Reply Last reply
    2
    • mariner4lifeM mariner4life

      @Chris said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

      Stevenson

      haven't you heard? Unlike all the players currently in the squad, he makes errors.

      nostrildamusN Offline
      nostrildamusN Offline
      nostrildamus
      wrote on last edited by
      #389

      @mariner4life said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

      @Chris said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

      Stevenson

      haven't you heard? Unlike all the players currently in the squad, he makes errors.

      Ouch, that burns.

      1 Reply Last reply
      0
      • FrankF Frank

        Confused. Is Richie Mounga not playing vs Italy? Link?

        DuluthD Offline
        DuluthD Offline
        Duluth
        wrote on last edited by
        #390

        @Frank said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

        Confused. Is Richie Mounga not playing vs Italy? Link?

        He looked injured at the last training. Bandage on his thigh and had a bit of a limp climbing some stairs

        Who knows? It might be minor and he can play. Nothing official yet

        1 Reply Last reply
        1
        • ChrisC Chris

          @mariner4life

          With teams kicking long in this WC, It would be great to have a Stevenson/Sullivan type FB with a big boot to counter it.

          O Offline
          O Offline
          Old Samurai Jack
          wrote on last edited by
          #391

          @Chris said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

          @mariner4life

          With teams kicking long in this WC, It would be great to have a Stevenson/Sullivan type FB with a big boot to counter it.

          Would love to see Jordan and Stevenson been given a go together next year to develop. Both a roving fullback and wing role. Stevenson has a great boot on him and he mixes it up well. DMac and him could control the territory game as they have shown for the Chiefs.

          1 Reply Last reply
          3
          • BovidaeB Offline
            BovidaeB Offline
            Bovidae
            wrote on last edited by
            #392

            Stevenson needs to re-sign with NZR first. Robertson should be having a word in his ear.

            antipodeanA 1 Reply Last reply
            2
            • Rancid SchnitzelR Rancid Schnitzel

              Just on the DM/BB axis. Have we seen that in a big test? I'm quite excited to see how it goes. Hopefully another injury forced "master stroke".

              KiwiMurphK Offline
              KiwiMurphK Offline
              KiwiMurph
              wrote on last edited by KiwiMurph
              #393

              @Rancid-Schnitzel said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

              Just on the DM/BB axis. Have we seen that in a big test? I'm quite excited to see how it goes. Hopefully another injury forced "master stroke".

              First test of the year away in Argentina they certainly looked good

              But no we must persist with the failed Mo'unga-BB axis that hasn't worked since implemented in 2019.....

              mariner4lifeM DuluthD 2 Replies Last reply
              2
              • KiwiMurphK KiwiMurph

                @Rancid-Schnitzel said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                Just on the DM/BB axis. Have we seen that in a big test? I'm quite excited to see how it goes. Hopefully another injury forced "master stroke".

                First test of the year away in Argentina they certainly looked good

                But no we must persist with the failed Mo'unga-BB axis that hasn't worked since implemented in 2019.....

                mariner4lifeM Offline
                mariner4lifeM Offline
                mariner4life
                wrote on last edited by
                #394

                @KiwiMurph said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                @Rancid-Schnitzel said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                Just on the DM/BB axis. Have we seen that in a big test? I'm quite excited to see how it goes. Hopefully another injury forced "master stroke".

                First test of the year away in Argentina they certainly looked good

                But no we must persist with the failed Mo'unga-BB axis that hasn't worked since implemented in 2019.....

                just like my punting...

                IT'S DUE!!

                1 Reply Last reply
                3
                • mariner4lifeM mariner4life

                  The thing that makes Ireland so good at the moment is they are so comfortable doing not much for long stretches of the game. Maybe some phases if we are in the right part of the field, but they wait for their chance and they are happy to stay in teh grind

                  I watched that SA v Ireland game and kept thinking "Barrett or Mo'unga would have got bored by now and tried something risky to break the game open"

                  bayimportsB Do not disturb
                  bayimportsB Do not disturb
                  bayimports
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #395

                  @mariner4life said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                  The thing that makes Ireland so good at the moment is they are so comfortable doing not much for long stretches of the game. Maybe some phases if we are in the right part of the field, but they wait for their chance and they are happy to stay in teh grind

                  I watched that SA v Ireland game and kept thinking "Barrett or Mo'unga would have got bored by now and tried something risky to break the game open"

                  Very much like a good league team that gets into the grind and is happy to let the opposition make the mistake and then pounce.

                  Ironically I still think we could employ the same tactic successfully and be better at it, because I think we have more players that could exploit the mistake.

                  1 Reply Last reply
                  1
                  • KiwiMurphK KiwiMurph

                    @Rancid-Schnitzel said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                    Just on the DM/BB axis. Have we seen that in a big test? I'm quite excited to see how it goes. Hopefully another injury forced "master stroke".

                    First test of the year away in Argentina they certainly looked good

                    But no we must persist with the failed Mo'unga-BB axis that hasn't worked since implemented in 2019.....

                    DuluthD Offline
                    DuluthD Offline
                    Duluth
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #396

                    @KiwiMurph said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                    First test of the year away in Argentina they certainly looked good

                    A clear separation of roles. BB was playing like a traditional ten in our own half. They swapped when we were on attack and then McKenzie played extremely flat, handled the ball constantly and BB picked great lines.

                    McKenzie at full pace looping around outside the JB/RI midfield was a highlight. So many questions for the defence to answer

                    Very disappointed we didn't see it again in one of the Tests v SA

                    1 Reply Last reply
                    7
                    • mariner4lifeM Offline
                      mariner4lifeM Offline
                      mariner4life
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #397

                      i know it was only Namibia, but in the last game it also looks like BB is far happier deferring to DMac when he is at 10, and DMac is in the middle of everything.

                      Perhaps that all changes if we are under pressure or behind though.

                      R Dan54D 2 Replies Last reply
                      3
                      • BovidaeB Bovidae

                        Stevenson needs to re-sign with NZR first. Robertson should be having a word in his ear.

                        antipodeanA Offline
                        antipodeanA Offline
                        antipodean
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #398

                        @Bovidae said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                        Stevenson needs to re-sign with NZR first. Robertson should be having a word in his ear.

                        Coaches should be having a word in his ear about defending. That would do wonders for his ability to wear the black jersey again.

                        O 1 Reply Last reply
                        8
                        • R reprobate

                          @Dan54 said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                          @reprobate said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                          @Victor-Meldrew said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                          @reprobate said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                          @Victor-Meldrew said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                          @Tim said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                          Poor coaching, as is the standard.

                          Same coaching set-up when he was getting game-time and being so bloody effective coming off the bench. Weird.

                          Foster has always preferred Taylor, even when it was blindingly obvious that he was playing terribly and Samisoni was playing great. IIRC he dropped Samisoni despite being our best forward for the Irish decider, then continued using Taylor while our lineout and his general play was dogshit all last season. Taylor is a decent player, but his form last year was arguably the worst I've seen an AB get away with and keep being selected - and that's not when the cupboard was bare, but when we had another option who was clearly better. It is just shit selection.
                          Samisoni should be a bolted on starter by now. Taylor or Coles should be the bench guy, or if we were better at handling young players, Aumua could have been ready in time.
                          We all sit around bemoaning Super rugby and our lack of grunt up front - and we have that guy right fucking there and they won't fucking pick him!

                          If what you say is true - and it may be - you have to question what value Ryan actually adds, don't you?

                          Not really. Foster's preference for Taylor and Taylor's terrible form pre-dates Ryan being involved.
                          Has Ryan changed that? No. Has he tried? No idea.
                          Buck stops with the head coach.

                          Well personally I would be starting with Taylor, I a ST fan , but we need a bloody solid set piece going forward, and hence Taylor probably gets the nod. Would make no difference anyway, we all got our players we like and lo and behold any coach or coaches who don't put our players on field.

                          If you were to check line-out stats for last year, Samisoni would have been miles better than Taylor, yet they wouldn't drop Taylor and wouldn't start Samisoni. Taylor fucked up critical throws on multiple occasions. He was terrible, and his head clearly wasn't right but htey wouldn't rest him. He's been better again this year, but it's not an exaggeration to say that it lost us games last year, and it clearly has had a negative impact on Samisoni - why wouldn't it?
                          Assessing the scrum is not straightforward, because there are so many different combinations.
                          Assessing the impact in open play is obvious: Samisoni is the power man, Taylor and Coles the speed men. That to me says Samisoni starts, and the others impact.

                          Dan54D Offline
                          Dan54D Offline
                          Dan54
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #399

                          @reprobate said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                          @Dan54 said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                          @reprobate said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                          @Victor-Meldrew said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                          @reprobate said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                          @Victor-Meldrew said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                          @Tim said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                          Poor coaching, as is the standard.

                          Same coaching set-up when he was getting game-time and being so bloody effective coming off the bench. Weird.

                          Foster has always preferred Taylor, even when it was blindingly obvious that he was playing terribly and Samisoni was playing great. IIRC he dropped Samisoni despite being our best forward for the Irish decider, then continued using Taylor while our lineout and his general play was dogshit all last season. Taylor is a decent player, but his form last year was arguably the worst I've seen an AB get away with and keep being selected - and that's not when the cupboard was bare, but when we had another option who was clearly better. It is just shit selection.
                          Samisoni should be a bolted on starter by now. Taylor or Coles should be the bench guy, or if we were better at handling young players, Aumua could have been ready in time.
                          We all sit around bemoaning Super rugby and our lack of grunt up front - and we have that guy right fucking there and they won't fucking pick him!

                          If what you say is true - and it may be - you have to question what value Ryan actually adds, don't you?

                          Not really. Foster's preference for Taylor and Taylor's terrible form pre-dates Ryan being involved.
                          Has Ryan changed that? No. Has he tried? No idea.
                          Buck stops with the head coach.

                          Well personally I would be starting with Taylor, I a ST fan , but we need a bloody solid set piece going forward, and hence Taylor probably gets the nod. Would make no difference anyway, we all got our players we like and lo and behold any coach or coaches who don't put our players on field.

                          If you were to check line-out stats for last year, Samisoni would have been miles better than Taylor, yet they wouldn't drop Taylor and wouldn't start Samisoni. Taylor fucked up critical throws on multiple occasions. He was terrible, and his head clearly wasn't right but htey wouldn't rest him. He's been better again this year, but it's not an exaggeration to say that it lost us games last year, and it clearly has had a negative impact on Samisoni - why wouldn't it?
                          Assessing the scrum is not straightforward, because there are so many different combinations.
                          Assessing the impact in open play is obvious: Samisoni is the power man, Taylor and Coles the speed men. That to me says Samisoni starts, and the others impact.

                          MateI don't assess scrums, as you have to be out there to do it. I don't make my opinions from reading stats, because basically the ones we get a not all that reflective of a game, I just old fashioned type of fella that makes his opinions (as I did when coaching etc) from watching. As I say I a ST fan anyway, just at this stage I not convinced he best option (though to be fair if coached said he was after watching games and trainings) I would have absolutely no probs, thay would have feedback aetc on scrum etc as well.

                          R mariner4lifeM 2 Replies Last reply
                          0
                          • mariner4lifeM mariner4life

                            i know it was only Namibia, but in the last game it also looks like BB is far happier deferring to DMac when he is at 10, and DMac is in the middle of everything.

                            Perhaps that all changes if we are under pressure or behind though.

                            R Offline
                            R Offline
                            reprobate
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #400

                            @mariner4life said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                            i know it was only Namibia, but in the last game it also looks like BB is far happier deferring to DMac when he is at 10, and DMac is in the middle of everything.

                            Perhaps that all changes if we are under pressure or behind though.

                            Hard to know because we haven't tried it enough and haven't given Mckenzie enough opportunity in pressure games.
                            From the limited stuff we have seen, it seems to work far better if Mckenzie is one of the dual playmakers, with either BB or RM as the other. IMO that's very clearly because they play similarly, and he plays differently.

                            1 Reply Last reply
                            4
                            • Dan54D Dan54

                              @reprobate said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                              @Dan54 said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                              @reprobate said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                              @Victor-Meldrew said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                              @reprobate said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                              @Victor-Meldrew said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                              @Tim said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                              Poor coaching, as is the standard.

                              Same coaching set-up when he was getting game-time and being so bloody effective coming off the bench. Weird.

                              Foster has always preferred Taylor, even when it was blindingly obvious that he was playing terribly and Samisoni was playing great. IIRC he dropped Samisoni despite being our best forward for the Irish decider, then continued using Taylor while our lineout and his general play was dogshit all last season. Taylor is a decent player, but his form last year was arguably the worst I've seen an AB get away with and keep being selected - and that's not when the cupboard was bare, but when we had another option who was clearly better. It is just shit selection.
                              Samisoni should be a bolted on starter by now. Taylor or Coles should be the bench guy, or if we were better at handling young players, Aumua could have been ready in time.
                              We all sit around bemoaning Super rugby and our lack of grunt up front - and we have that guy right fucking there and they won't fucking pick him!

                              If what you say is true - and it may be - you have to question what value Ryan actually adds, don't you?

                              Not really. Foster's preference for Taylor and Taylor's terrible form pre-dates Ryan being involved.
                              Has Ryan changed that? No. Has he tried? No idea.
                              Buck stops with the head coach.

                              Well personally I would be starting with Taylor, I a ST fan , but we need a bloody solid set piece going forward, and hence Taylor probably gets the nod. Would make no difference anyway, we all got our players we like and lo and behold any coach or coaches who don't put our players on field.

                              If you were to check line-out stats for last year, Samisoni would have been miles better than Taylor, yet they wouldn't drop Taylor and wouldn't start Samisoni. Taylor fucked up critical throws on multiple occasions. He was terrible, and his head clearly wasn't right but htey wouldn't rest him. He's been better again this year, but it's not an exaggeration to say that it lost us games last year, and it clearly has had a negative impact on Samisoni - why wouldn't it?
                              Assessing the scrum is not straightforward, because there are so many different combinations.
                              Assessing the impact in open play is obvious: Samisoni is the power man, Taylor and Coles the speed men. That to me says Samisoni starts, and the others impact.

                              MateI don't assess scrums, as you have to be out there to do it. I don't make my opinions from reading stats, because basically the ones we get a not all that reflective of a game, I just old fashioned type of fella that makes his opinions (as I did when coaching etc) from watching. As I say I a ST fan anyway, just at this stage I not convinced he best option (though to be fair if coached said he was after watching games and trainings) I would have absolutely no probs, thay would have feedback aetc on scrum etc as well.

                              R Offline
                              R Offline
                              reprobate
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #401

                              @Dan54 I haven't checked the stats either mate, I just know what I saw - and it was clear enough that I know the stats would back it up. not-straights are one of the few stats that are clear-cut.

                              1 Reply Last reply
                              0
                              • M Machpants

                                @Snowy said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                                I have only just realised that Carley is the ref, and now I have an extra 2 hours to do something other than watch rugby on Saturday morning.

                                Sad that my someone's lifelongspan love of rugby has been diminished to by that point.

                                Busy day for the basement.

                                But man that is sad, I can't believe you won't watch the abs cos of that. I want to see them play so well it doesn't matter

                                SnowyS Offline
                                SnowyS Offline
                                Snowy
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #402

                                @Machpants said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                                @Snowy said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                                I have only just realised that Carley is the ref, and now I have an extra 2 hours to do something other than watch rugby on Saturday morning.

                                Sad that my someone's lifelongspan love of rugby has been diminished to by that point.

                                Busy day for the basement.

                                But man that is sad, I can't believe you won't watch the abs cos of that. I want to see them play so well it doesn't matter

                                I keep basement room for people like Carley, but unfortunately I don't go to RWC anymore. Wayne Barnes was responsible for that.

                                The problem with watching it would be that I wouldn't actually be seeing the ABs play. It would be 2 hours of a pedantic prick, with no feel for the game, running around shouting "look at me" with some brief interruptions by the other 30 blokes on the field that I actually want to see. Even that is dependent on the unlikely event that he lets all 30 of them stay on the field at once.

                                1 Reply Last reply
                                3
                                • mariner4lifeM mariner4life

                                  i know it was only Namibia, but in the last game it also looks like BB is far happier deferring to DMac when he is at 10, and DMac is in the middle of everything.

                                  Perhaps that all changes if we are under pressure or behind though.

                                  Dan54D Offline
                                  Dan54D Offline
                                  Dan54
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #403

                                  @mariner4life said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                                  i know it was only Namibia, but in the last game it also looks like BB is far happier deferring to DMac when he is at 10, and DMac is in the middle of everything.

                                  Perhaps that all changes if we are under pressure or behind though.

                                  I still think it's who is at 10, RMo if he is 10 calls shots, and if wants to be first receiver he should be saying so!
                                  I always remember Bryn Hall talking about how Crusaders operated while he was playing, and said they almost always used Havili as first receiver (and most other super teams did similar) until game reall broke up.

                                  antipodeanA 1 Reply Last reply
                                  0
                                  • Dan54D Dan54

                                    @mariner4life said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                                    i know it was only Namibia, but in the last game it also looks like BB is far happier deferring to DMac when he is at 10, and DMac is in the middle of everything.

                                    Perhaps that all changes if we are under pressure or behind though.

                                    I still think it's who is at 10, RMo if he is 10 calls shots, and if wants to be first receiver he should be saying so!
                                    I always remember Bryn Hall talking about how Crusaders operated while he was playing, and said they almost always used Havili as first receiver (and most other super teams did similar) until game reall broke up.

                                    antipodeanA Offline
                                    antipodeanA Offline
                                    antipodean
                                    wrote on last edited by
                                    #404

                                    @Dan54 said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                                    @mariner4life said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                                    i know it was only Namibia, but in the last game it also looks like BB is far happier deferring to DMac when he is at 10, and DMac is in the middle of everything.

                                    Perhaps that all changes if we are under pressure or behind though.

                                    I still think it's who is at 10, RMo if he is 10 calls shots, and if wants to be first receiver he should be saying so!
                                    I always remember Bryn Hall talking about how Crusaders operated while he was playing, and said they almost always used Havili as first receiver (and most other super teams did similar) until game reall broke up.

                                    Just what you want in a modern five-eighth. An appearance in the last quarter.

                                    1 Reply Last reply
                                    4
                                    • antipodeanA antipodean

                                      @Bovidae said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                                      Stevenson needs to re-sign with NZR first. Robertson should be having a word in his ear.

                                      Coaches should be having a word in his ear about defending. That would do wonders for his ability to wear the black jersey again.

                                      O Offline
                                      O Offline
                                      Old Samurai Jack
                                      wrote on last edited by
                                      #405

                                      @antipodean said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                                      @Bovidae said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                                      Stevenson needs to re-sign with NZR first. Robertson should be having a word in his ear.

                                      Coaches should be having a word in his ear about defending. That would do wonders for his ability to wear the black jersey again.

                                      Is it an individual problem or a systematic problem? Does he have defending issues with the Chiefs or just the ABs? Genuine question because just about every outside back has defending problems in the AB system.

                                      antipodeanA 1 Reply Last reply
                                      0
                                      • Dan54D Dan54

                                        @reprobate said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                                        @Dan54 said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                                        @reprobate said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                                        @Victor-Meldrew said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                                        @reprobate said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                                        @Victor-Meldrew said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                                        @Tim said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                                        Poor coaching, as is the standard.

                                        Same coaching set-up when he was getting game-time and being so bloody effective coming off the bench. Weird.

                                        Foster has always preferred Taylor, even when it was blindingly obvious that he was playing terribly and Samisoni was playing great. IIRC he dropped Samisoni despite being our best forward for the Irish decider, then continued using Taylor while our lineout and his general play was dogshit all last season. Taylor is a decent player, but his form last year was arguably the worst I've seen an AB get away with and keep being selected - and that's not when the cupboard was bare, but when we had another option who was clearly better. It is just shit selection.
                                        Samisoni should be a bolted on starter by now. Taylor or Coles should be the bench guy, or if we were better at handling young players, Aumua could have been ready in time.
                                        We all sit around bemoaning Super rugby and our lack of grunt up front - and we have that guy right fucking there and they won't fucking pick him!

                                        If what you say is true - and it may be - you have to question what value Ryan actually adds, don't you?

                                        Not really. Foster's preference for Taylor and Taylor's terrible form pre-dates Ryan being involved.
                                        Has Ryan changed that? No. Has he tried? No idea.
                                        Buck stops with the head coach.

                                        Well personally I would be starting with Taylor, I a ST fan , but we need a bloody solid set piece going forward, and hence Taylor probably gets the nod. Would make no difference anyway, we all got our players we like and lo and behold any coach or coaches who don't put our players on field.

                                        If you were to check line-out stats for last year, Samisoni would have been miles better than Taylor, yet they wouldn't drop Taylor and wouldn't start Samisoni. Taylor fucked up critical throws on multiple occasions. He was terrible, and his head clearly wasn't right but htey wouldn't rest him. He's been better again this year, but it's not an exaggeration to say that it lost us games last year, and it clearly has had a negative impact on Samisoni - why wouldn't it?
                                        Assessing the scrum is not straightforward, because there are so many different combinations.
                                        Assessing the impact in open play is obvious: Samisoni is the power man, Taylor and Coles the speed men. That to me says Samisoni starts, and the others impact.

                                        MateI don't assess scrums, as you have to be out there to do it. I don't make my opinions from reading stats, because basically the ones we get a not all that reflective of a game, I just old fashioned type of fella that makes his opinions (as I did when coaching etc) from watching. As I say I a ST fan anyway, just at this stage I not convinced he best option (though to be fair if coached said he was after watching games and trainings) I would have absolutely no probs, thay would have feedback aetc on scrum etc as well.

                                        mariner4lifeM Offline
                                        mariner4lifeM Offline
                                        mariner4life
                                        wrote on last edited by
                                        #406

                                        @Dan54 said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                                        @reprobate said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                                        @Dan54 said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                                        @reprobate said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                                        @Victor-Meldrew said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                                        @reprobate said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                                        @Victor-Meldrew said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                                        @Tim said in RWC Week 4: All Blacks v Italy:

                                        Poor coaching, as is the standard.

                                        Same coaching set-up when he was getting game-time and being so bloody effective coming off the bench. Weird.

                                        Foster has always preferred Taylor, even when it was blindingly obvious that he was playing terribly and Samisoni was playing great. IIRC he dropped Samisoni despite being our best forward for the Irish decider, then continued using Taylor while our lineout and his general play was dogshit all last season. Taylor is a decent player, but his form last year was arguably the worst I've seen an AB get away with and keep being selected - and that's not when the cupboard was bare, but when we had another option who was clearly better. It is just shit selection.
                                        Samisoni should be a bolted on starter by now. Taylor or Coles should be the bench guy, or if we were better at handling young players, Aumua could have been ready in time.
                                        We all sit around bemoaning Super rugby and our lack of grunt up front - and we have that guy right fucking there and they won't fucking pick him!

                                        If what you say is true - and it may be - you have to question what value Ryan actually adds, don't you?

                                        Not really. Foster's preference for Taylor and Taylor's terrible form pre-dates Ryan being involved.
                                        Has Ryan changed that? No. Has he tried? No idea.
                                        Buck stops with the head coach.

                                        Well personally I would be starting with Taylor, I a ST fan , but we need a bloody solid set piece going forward, and hence Taylor probably gets the nod. Would make no difference anyway, we all got our players we like and lo and behold any coach or coaches who don't put our players on field.

                                        If you were to check line-out stats for last year, Samisoni would have been miles better than Taylor, yet they wouldn't drop Taylor and wouldn't start Samisoni. Taylor fucked up critical throws on multiple occasions. He was terrible, and his head clearly wasn't right but htey wouldn't rest him. He's been better again this year, but it's not an exaggeration to say that it lost us games last year, and it clearly has had a negative impact on Samisoni - why wouldn't it?
                                        Assessing the scrum is not straightforward, because there are so many different combinations.
                                        Assessing the impact in open play is obvious: Samisoni is the power man, Taylor and Coles the speed men. That to me says Samisoni starts, and the others impact.

                                        MateI don't assess scrums, as you have to be out there to do it. I don't make my opinions from reading stats, because basically the ones we get a not all that reflective of a game, I just old fashioned type of fella that makes his opinions (as I did when coaching etc) from watching. As I say I a ST fan anyway, just at this stage I not convinced he best option (though to be fair if coached said he was after watching games and trainings) I would have absolutely no probs, thay would have feedback aetc on scrum etc as well.

                                        lol what? your whole argument is set piece, but you are ignoring one set piece
                                        And then you are ignoring stats in favour of "your eyes"
                                        Eyes that you would then ignore if the coaches told you different?

                                        That's not an opinion, that's you basically saying "well the coaches pick Taylor so he is obviously better"

                                        Dan54D 1 Reply Last reply
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                                        • nostrildamusN Offline
                                          nostrildamusN Offline
                                          nostrildamus
                                          wrote on last edited by
                                          #407
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