RWC QF: All Blacks v Ireland
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Hope they realised how thier lack of physicality was a major issue then, as it has been on and mostly off for the past 4 years.
There is a special line from Retallick in this for you @mariner4life
Retallick says he has enjoyed the atmosphere the Irish fans have brought to the tournament, particularly the renditions of the 1990s pop song 'Zombie'.
"I think that's one of the awesome parts about a World Cup, the enthusiasm the crowd bring," he added. "I've seen them singing the Cranberries, it's a great song, but hopefully they're not singing it on Saturday."
@taniwharugby said in RWC QF: All Blacks v Ireland:
Retallick says he has enjoyed the atmosphere the Irish fans have brought to the tournament, particularly the renditions of the 1990s pop song 'Zombie'.
"I think that's one of the awesome parts about a World Cup, the enthusiasm the crowd bring," he added. "I've seen them singing the Cranberries, it's a great song, but hopefully they're not singing it on Saturday."
Hardly a song about Irish unity and creativity! As has been pointed out, "Ireland are very metronomic and robotic in how they play" so strange then the Irish fans have borrowed it (but the history and controversy is interesting if you look it up)...
What can the AB fans do? A reverse chant, borrowed from Georgie G and the Wattles?
"Four more years
Four more years
Get on the beers
You'll need four more years"
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@Victor-Meldrew you mean like allowing them to score a try in the first 5 mins like they did in the NZ series in 2022?
Eddie Jones laid the blueprint in 2018/2019 to play the current ABs. Score first and force the ABs to play catch up. Sometimes they can (vs England in 2019, Ire in test 1 2022) but sometimes they can’t (vs Fra 2021, Ire in 2021, 2022, SA test 1 in 2022 2019).
Ireland haven’t been behind so far in this World Cup, have they? We don’t know how they react to scoreboard pressure.
@stodders said in All Blacks 2023:
Ireland haven’t been behind so far in this World Cup, have they? We don’t know how they react to scoreboard pressure.
So this is the straw we need to grasp? That unlike Ireland the ABs know how to lose and get dominated on a regular basis?! Well, that really puts my mind at rest, I'm sure?!
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@reprobate said in RWC QF: All Blacks v Ireland:
- the ruck. this is where they are the best in the world. We need to disrupt without being penalised, and stop them from doing the same to us. Ireland have realised that rucks are more frequent than any other contest for possession, and the biggest source of turnovers and penalties in almost every single game, and this is where their focus is. i find it really disturbing that so many comments above on 'how we can win it' talk about every bloody other thing and don't mention this: everything else is secondary.
- they obstruct terribly and get away with it, and chase well when the ball is in the air. this is the other area where they are clearly better than us, and it ought to be brought up with the referees in advance and worked on heavily by us, as it isn't that hard - just needs people to know what their roles are.
- discipline. it's hard enough to beat them without going down to 14 men.
One thing I noticed watching Jocks go down, was how often an Irish tackler hangs on by tackled player’s foot, thus placing him full length right behind attacking ruck. They roll away lethargically sometimes away from halfback and sometimes towards him.
For example, at 11.38 Irish 5 rolls back into Price’s feet.
All teams do it but I’m sure Paddies in double figures, so a tactic.
For me it’s an automatic penalty unless obvious that genuine attempt made to avoid disruption.
Rassie video required?
@pakman yeah they do all that right on the fringes, slowly.
Probably the smartest team going at present, gaming the rules to perfection, but its thier discipline to stay in thier systems that separates them, thier excellent rushing d-line is almost always off side, but with a whole line of players moving at the same time it is alot harder to see (although surely the AR should pick this easier than the ref in his peripheral)
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@rustycruiser you assume you’ll win your semi
@stodders I fear Ireland, France and New Zealand more than either England or Fiji.
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@Victor-Meldrew you mean like allowing them to score a try in the first 5 mins like they did in the NZ series in 2022?
Eddie Jones laid the blueprint in 2018/2019 to play the current ABs. Score first and force the ABs to play catch up. Sometimes they can (vs England in 2019, Ire in test 1 2022) but sometimes they can’t (vs Fra 2021, Ire in 2021, 2022, SA test 1 in 2022 2019).
Ireland haven’t been behind so far in this World Cup, have they? We don’t know how they react to scoreboard pressure.
@stodders they were briefly v SA?
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@pakman yeah they do all that right on the fringes, slowly.
Probably the smartest team going at present, gaming the rules to perfection, but its thier discipline to stay in thier systems that separates them, thier excellent rushing d-line is almost always off side, but with a whole line of players moving at the same time it is alot harder to see (although surely the AR should pick this easier than the ref in his peripheral)
@taniwharugby said in RWC QF: All Blacks v Ireland:
@pakman yeah they do all that right on the fringes, slowly.
Probably the smartest team going at present, gaming the rules to perfection, but its thier discipline to stay in thier systems that separates them, thier excellent rushing d-line is almost always off side, but with a whole line of players moving at the same time it is alot harder to see (although surely the AR should pick this easier than the ref in his peripheral)
Never been a ref, but if far AR lines himself up with back foot of ruck he can see offside by line of sight. So why not do it?
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@taniwharugby said in RWC QF: All Blacks v Ireland:
@pakman yeah they do all that right on the fringes, slowly.
Probably the smartest team going at present, gaming the rules to perfection, but its thier discipline to stay in thier systems that separates them, thier excellent rushing d-line is almost always off side, but with a whole line of players moving at the same time it is alot harder to see (although surely the AR should pick this easier than the ref in his peripheral)
Never been a ref, but if far AR lines himself up with back foot of ruck he can see offside by line of sight. So why not do it?
@pakman at club footy the AR sets the off side line, it would seem quite simple to police.
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@stodders said in All Blacks 2023:
Ireland haven’t been behind so far in this World Cup, have they? We don’t know how they react to scoreboard pressure.
So this is the straw we need to grasp? That unlike Ireland the ABs know how to lose and get dominated on a regular basis?! Well, that really puts my mind at rest, I'm sure?!
@nostrildamus Not to labour the point, in 2007, NZ were the form team coming into the tournament and romped through the pool games. It was only under the blowtorch pressure of the QF that the systems that had looked so good fell apart.
Scotland tried to put the Irish under pressure last night. Irish shut them down because so much goes through Finn Russell and Kinghorn got injured early. Ireland coughed up penalties in the first 20 mins and Scotland did not take the points when offered. Irish defence was v good, but I would expect NZ to take the points and trust their systems to get them back down into the red zone.
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@game_film said in RWC QF: All Blacks v Ireland:
I’m just looking forward to the images of Sexton on the bench in the 72nd minute, with his eyes glazed over, channeling 2007 DC with a thousand-yard stare.
would this be the biggest choke ever if Ireland continued to never win a knockout game with this team, and this level of international dominance?
Let's go Black - hoping for the best, but fearful of what a properly disciplined team will do against us.
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@nzzp Hmmmm. Guess it would depend on how the game played out. There’s losing …and there’s losing. But yeah. Difference between getting a statue or not. Jeeez, that’s a good line for an AB to use this week.
@game_film I honestly would be surprised if Ireland won 13+, or NZ won 13+. So much uncertainty.
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https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby-world-cup-2023/300985239/rugby-world-cup-all-blacks-coach-ian-foster-ramps-up-quarterfinal-pressure-on-ireland
Foster: “They've got a group of players … this is probably their moment. If they’re ever going to win a World Cup, they’ll probably feel like it’s now, and as a team we’re kinda in the same mode. So it’s pretty exciting.”In the same mode??
So this is the only possible time the ABs can win the RWC or the only possible time in the near future? Or maybe I just don't understand Ian Foster logic. -
https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby-world-cup-2023/300985239/rugby-world-cup-all-blacks-coach-ian-foster-ramps-up-quarterfinal-pressure-on-ireland
Foster: “They've got a group of players … this is probably their moment. If they’re ever going to win a World Cup, they’ll probably feel like it’s now, and as a team we’re kinda in the same mode. So it’s pretty exciting.”In the same mode??
So this is the only possible time the ABs can win the RWC or the only possible time in the near future? Or maybe I just don't understand Ian Foster logic.@nostrildamus guess plenty are at the end of thier time in this team, so this is thier time too?
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@nostrildamus guess plenty are at the end of thier time in this team, so this is thier time too?
@taniwharugby said in RWC QF: All Blacks v Ireland:
@nostrildamus guess plenty are at the end of thier time in this team, so this is thier time too?
if that is what he meant, but how many of the oldtimers have won an RWC gold medal or two? Probably quite a few!
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@taniwharugby said in RWC QF: All Blacks v Ireland:
@nostrildamus guess plenty are at the end of thier time in this team, so this is thier time too?
if that is what he meant, but how many of the oldtimers have won an RWC gold medal or two? Probably quite a few!
@nostrildamus who is left from 2015? Retallick, Whitelock, Smith, Taylor, Coles, BB, SB?
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@mariner4life said in RWC QF: All Blacks v Ireland:
The fucking carry on after every little thing that goes their way
You mean doesn’t go their way right? Curiously does Hawkes Bay have a large Irish heritage?
@bayimports said in RWC QF: All Blacks v Ireland:
@mariner4life said in RWC QF: All Blacks v Ireland:
The fucking carry on after every little thing that goes their way
You mean doesn’t go their way right? Curiously does Hawkes Bay have a large Irish heritage?
Whadda ya talking about? Everything's going our way. We've got the shield (well, we're letting Wellington repair it for us over summer), we're the best at shield partying, we won the battle of the bays and knocked Of Plenty out of the finals on the same day.
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@Bones said in RWC QF: All Blacks v Ireland:
Swap Havili for Kirifi and send him out on a mission.
Yep, call him up before this weekend's NPC semifinal. :grinning_face_with_big_eyes:
Just to let him hold the tackle pads though.@Stargazer said in RWC QF: All Blacks v Ireland:
@Bones said in RWC QF: All Blacks v Ireland:
Swap Havili for Kirifi and send him out on a mission.
Yep, call him up before this weekend's NPC semifinal. :grinning_face_with_big_eyes:
Just to let him hold the tackle pads though.Not sure if I endorse that, I'm relying on him giving away dumb penalties.
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@nostrildamus who is left from 2015? Retallick, Whitelock, Smith, Taylor, Coles, BB, SB?
@taniwharugby said in RWC QF: All Blacks v Ireland:
@nostrildamus who is left from 2015? Retallick, Whitelock, Smith, Taylor, Coles, BB, SB?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2015_Rugby_World_Cup_squads#New_Zealand
not sure what is currently happening with Moody but good guesses!
Cane of course, and JB. I count 9.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_Rugby_World_Cup_squads#Pool_A
Just one. -
The All Blacks don't win this game if it is an arm-wrestle. It doesn't suit us. We've got to back our expansive gameplan - will it look ugly if it doesn't work? Sure, but trying to beat Ireland at their own game is unlikely to work either.
@frugby said in RWC QF: All Blacks v Ireland:
The All Blacks don't win this game if it is an arm-wrestle. It doesn't suit us. We've got to back our expansive gameplan - will it look ugly if it doesn't work? Sure, but trying to beat Ireland at their own game is unlikely to work either.
in a boxing analogy , we are the dangerous fighter with the fast powerful explosive hands, but with a few more technical flaws ,
And they are the more rounded technically correct boxer ,
Yeah trying to outbox them is probably not going to work .
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@frugby said in RWC QF: All Blacks v Ireland:
The All Blacks don't win this game if it is an arm-wrestle. It doesn't suit us. We've got to back our expansive gameplan - will it look ugly if it doesn't work? Sure, but trying to beat Ireland at their own game is unlikely to work either.
in a boxing analogy , we are the dangerous fighter with the fast powerful explosive hands, but with a few more technical flaws ,
And they are the more rounded technically correct boxer ,
Yeah trying to outbox them is probably not going to work .
@kiwiinmelb said in RWC QF: All Blacks v Ireland:
@frugby said in RWC QF: All Blacks v Ireland:
The All Blacks don't win this game if it is an arm-wrestle. It doesn't suit us. We've got to back our expansive gameplan - will it look ugly if it doesn't work? Sure, but trying to beat Ireland at their own game is unlikely to work either.
in a boxing analogy , we are the dangerous boxer with the fast explosive hands with a few more technical flaws ,
And they are the more rounded technically correct fighter,
Yeah trying to outbox them is probably not going to work .
We’re Earnie Shavers, they’re Larry Holmes.
