All Blacks 2023
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@Bones said in All Blacks 2023:
@frugby said in All Blacks 2023:
@Kiwiwomble said in All Blacks 2023:
i really hope he doesnt just walk back into the crusaders/AB's, Id hope over 4 years we have the next our guys coming through, come back and earn it...great? come back and handed it because no one else has stepped up? worrying
I don't necessarily think it is as simple as that, but if you look at the current 10s, who will be the ones we are looking at over the next four years, I don't have any great conviction in any of them.
Blues:
Perofeta - Is he a 10? Is he good enough anyway?
Sullivan - Quality potential, but again, is he a 10?
Cashmore - Not seen enough, but unlikely to be that goodChiefs:
McKenzie - Will get first crack, and will in theory be the man in the interim, but how will he go when he loses a yard of pace... massively reliant on it
Ioane - No
Trask - Don't think soHurricanes:
Morgan - No
Cameron - Maybe? Hasn't really done it yet, perhaps next year is his year, but hardly strikes confidence, and isn't actually that youngCrusaders:
Burke - Potential, needs a big Super season, then we will see. Could be a squad option, but doesn't give me the vibe of a top All Black 10
Kemara - The fact the Chiefs didn't really want him might well speak volumes
Reihana - NoHighlanders:
Millar - Similar to Burke, but obviously less proven, and can't stay fit
Faleafaga - Reads the game exceptionally well, and is probably the best running 10 of any of the real up and comers, but his kicking game is massively lackingObviously there are Jacombs and others, but we are talking about a guy to be the All Black first five. Look at the recent All Black 10s, then look at those ones. Think it is entirely possible nobody fills the void, Mo'unga comes back, and has a good Super season, and fairly waltzs back in.
David Havili.
Absolutely would not discount it.
@frugby said in All Blacks 2023:
@Bones said in All Blacks 2023:
@frugby said in All Blacks 2023:
@Kiwiwomble said in All Blacks 2023:
i really hope he doesnt just walk back into the crusaders/AB's, Id hope over 4 years we have the next our guys coming through, come back and earn it...great? come back and handed it because no one else has stepped up? worrying
I don't necessarily think it is as simple as that, but if you look at the current 10s, who will be the ones we are looking at over the next four years, I don't have any great conviction in any of them.
Blues:
Perofeta - Is he a 10? Is he good enough anyway?
Sullivan - Quality potential, but again, is he a 10?
Cashmore - Not seen enough, but unlikely to be that goodChiefs:
McKenzie - Will get first crack, and will in theory be the man in the interim, but how will he go when he loses a yard of pace... massively reliant on it
Ioane - No
Trask - Don't think soHurricanes:
Morgan - No
Cameron - Maybe? Hasn't really done it yet, perhaps next year is his year, but hardly strikes confidence, and isn't actually that youngCrusaders:
Burke - Potential, needs a big Super season, then we will see. Could be a squad option, but doesn't give me the vibe of a top All Black 10
Kemara - The fact the Chiefs didn't really want him might well speak volumes
Reihana - NoHighlanders:
Millar - Similar to Burke, but obviously less proven, and can't stay fit
Faleafaga - Reads the game exceptionally well, and is probably the best running 10 of any of the real up and comers, but his kicking game is massively lackingObviously there are Jacombs and others, but we are talking about a guy to be the All Black first five. Look at the recent All Black 10s, then look at those ones. Think it is entirely possible nobody fills the void, Mo'unga comes back, and has a good Super season, and fairly waltzs back in.
David Havili.
Absolutely would not discount it.
Chuck him in the highlanders list.
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@frugby said in All Blacks 2023:
@Bones said in All Blacks 2023:
@frugby said in All Blacks 2023:
@Kiwiwomble said in All Blacks 2023:
i really hope he doesnt just walk back into the crusaders/AB's, Id hope over 4 years we have the next our guys coming through, come back and earn it...great? come back and handed it because no one else has stepped up? worrying
I don't necessarily think it is as simple as that, but if you look at the current 10s, who will be the ones we are looking at over the next four years, I don't have any great conviction in any of them.
Blues:
Perofeta - Is he a 10? Is he good enough anyway?
Sullivan - Quality potential, but again, is he a 10?
Cashmore - Not seen enough, but unlikely to be that goodChiefs:
McKenzie - Will get first crack, and will in theory be the man in the interim, but how will he go when he loses a yard of pace... massively reliant on it
Ioane - No
Trask - Don't think soHurricanes:
Morgan - No
Cameron - Maybe? Hasn't really done it yet, perhaps next year is his year, but hardly strikes confidence, and isn't actually that youngCrusaders:
Burke - Potential, needs a big Super season, then we will see. Could be a squad option, but doesn't give me the vibe of a top All Black 10
Kemara - The fact the Chiefs didn't really want him might well speak volumes
Reihana - NoHighlanders:
Millar - Similar to Burke, but obviously less proven, and can't stay fit
Faleafaga - Reads the game exceptionally well, and is probably the best running 10 of any of the real up and comers, but his kicking game is massively lackingObviously there are Jacombs and others, but we are talking about a guy to be the All Black first five. Look at the recent All Black 10s, then look at those ones. Think it is entirely possible nobody fills the void, Mo'unga comes back, and has a good Super season, and fairly waltzs back in.
David Havili.
Absolutely would not discount it.
Chuck him in the highlanders list.
@Bones said in All Blacks 2023:
@frugby said in All Blacks 2023:
@Bones said in All Blacks 2023:
@frugby said in All Blacks 2023:
@Kiwiwomble said in All Blacks 2023:
i really hope he doesnt just walk back into the crusaders/AB's, Id hope over 4 years we have the next our guys coming through, come back and earn it...great? come back and handed it because no one else has stepped up? worrying
I don't necessarily think it is as simple as that, but if you look at the current 10s, who will be the ones we are looking at over the next four years, I don't have any great conviction in any of them.
Blues:
Perofeta - Is he a 10? Is he good enough anyway?
Sullivan - Quality potential, but again, is he a 10?
Cashmore - Not seen enough, but unlikely to be that goodChiefs:
McKenzie - Will get first crack, and will in theory be the man in the interim, but how will he go when he loses a yard of pace... massively reliant on it
Ioane - No
Trask - Don't think soHurricanes:
Morgan - No
Cameron - Maybe? Hasn't really done it yet, perhaps next year is his year, but hardly strikes confidence, and isn't actually that youngCrusaders:
Burke - Potential, needs a big Super season, then we will see. Could be a squad option, but doesn't give me the vibe of a top All Black 10
Kemara - The fact the Chiefs didn't really want him might well speak volumes
Reihana - NoHighlanders:
Millar - Similar to Burke, but obviously less proven, and can't stay fit
Faleafaga - Reads the game exceptionally well, and is probably the best running 10 of any of the real up and comers, but his kicking game is massively lackingObviously there are Jacombs and others, but we are talking about a guy to be the All Black first five. Look at the recent All Black 10s, then look at those ones. Think it is entirely possible nobody fills the void, Mo'unga comes back, and has a good Super season, and fairly waltzs back in.
David Havili.
Absolutely would not discount it.
Chuck him in the highlanders list.
Him and Ennor as rotating 10s.
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@Bones said in All Blacks 2023:
@frugby said in All Blacks 2023:
@Bones said in All Blacks 2023:
@frugby said in All Blacks 2023:
@Kiwiwomble said in All Blacks 2023:
i really hope he doesnt just walk back into the crusaders/AB's, Id hope over 4 years we have the next our guys coming through, come back and earn it...great? come back and handed it because no one else has stepped up? worrying
I don't necessarily think it is as simple as that, but if you look at the current 10s, who will be the ones we are looking at over the next four years, I don't have any great conviction in any of them.
Blues:
Perofeta - Is he a 10? Is he good enough anyway?
Sullivan - Quality potential, but again, is he a 10?
Cashmore - Not seen enough, but unlikely to be that goodChiefs:
McKenzie - Will get first crack, and will in theory be the man in the interim, but how will he go when he loses a yard of pace... massively reliant on it
Ioane - No
Trask - Don't think soHurricanes:
Morgan - No
Cameron - Maybe? Hasn't really done it yet, perhaps next year is his year, but hardly strikes confidence, and isn't actually that youngCrusaders:
Burke - Potential, needs a big Super season, then we will see. Could be a squad option, but doesn't give me the vibe of a top All Black 10
Kemara - The fact the Chiefs didn't really want him might well speak volumes
Reihana - NoHighlanders:
Millar - Similar to Burke, but obviously less proven, and can't stay fit
Faleafaga - Reads the game exceptionally well, and is probably the best running 10 of any of the real up and comers, but his kicking game is massively lackingObviously there are Jacombs and others, but we are talking about a guy to be the All Black first five. Look at the recent All Black 10s, then look at those ones. Think it is entirely possible nobody fills the void, Mo'unga comes back, and has a good Super season, and fairly waltzs back in.
David Havili.
Absolutely would not discount it.
Chuck him in the highlanders list.
Him and Ennor as rotating 10s.
@frugby said in All Blacks 2023:
@Bones said in All Blacks 2023:
@frugby said in All Blacks 2023:
@Bones said in All Blacks 2023:
@frugby said in All Blacks 2023:
@Kiwiwomble said in All Blacks 2023:
i really hope he doesnt just walk back into the crusaders/AB's, Id hope over 4 years we have the next our guys coming through, come back and earn it...great? come back and handed it because no one else has stepped up? worrying
I don't necessarily think it is as simple as that, but if you look at the current 10s, who will be the ones we are looking at over the next four years, I don't have any great conviction in any of them.
Blues:
Perofeta - Is he a 10? Is he good enough anyway?
Sullivan - Quality potential, but again, is he a 10?
Cashmore - Not seen enough, but unlikely to be that goodChiefs:
McKenzie - Will get first crack, and will in theory be the man in the interim, but how will he go when he loses a yard of pace... massively reliant on it
Ioane - No
Trask - Don't think soHurricanes:
Morgan - No
Cameron - Maybe? Hasn't really done it yet, perhaps next year is his year, but hardly strikes confidence, and isn't actually that youngCrusaders:
Burke - Potential, needs a big Super season, then we will see. Could be a squad option, but doesn't give me the vibe of a top All Black 10
Kemara - The fact the Chiefs didn't really want him might well speak volumes
Reihana - NoHighlanders:
Millar - Similar to Burke, but obviously less proven, and can't stay fit
Faleafaga - Reads the game exceptionally well, and is probably the best running 10 of any of the real up and comers, but his kicking game is massively lackingObviously there are Jacombs and others, but we are talking about a guy to be the All Black first five. Look at the recent All Black 10s, then look at those ones. Think it is entirely possible nobody fills the void, Mo'unga comes back, and has a good Super season, and fairly waltzs back in.
David Havili.
Absolutely would not discount it.
Chuck him in the highlanders list.
Him and Ennor as rotating 10s.
You took it too far. 🤮
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A comment, if I may
IMO the past 7 days is the best the ABs have looked since 2015. Everything looks so together and accurate
And, I also think it's different to even July. The attack has a different shape, the defence is definitely different. We're not "playing the same but better", we're playing different to be better.
And while yes, it's different, with hindsight you can see.thr building blocks from earlier. The selections, the tactics. Dry powder is a running joke, but I'm starting to believe it's real. We (and I doubt it's just us) do little bits of the ultimate plan with a longer game in mind.
We've bemoaned endless seemingly pointless phases. And here we are using thrm to wear out defences and kill the rush. We've bemoaned the passive defence but here it is, soaking attack, frustrating attacks that have been prepared to unlock the rush. The passive kick chase is clearly a tactic, I don't understand it, but the players very much do.
There has been a long game played here. We've learned what works and what doesn't. The teams who set out their stall years ago turned up (by the barest of margins) and got found out.
The coaches clearly played a long game. A long game that has pissed us off, but they have stuck to it. They've learned lessons, made necessary changes, adapted, and not shown the world how until last Saturday. I think Ireland last year was the catalyst.
Now look, it might all get pulled apart next week, because south africa are fucking good, and sometimes you just get beat. But I think some credit is due here.
I'm not sure how I feel about it TBH, but if they pull this off, then I need to eat shit tons of.humble pie
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A comment, if I may
IMO the past 7 days is the best the ABs have looked since 2015. Everything looks so together and accurate
And, I also think it's different to even July. The attack has a different shape, the defence is definitely different. We're not "playing the same but better", we're playing different to be better.
And while yes, it's different, with hindsight you can see.thr building blocks from earlier. The selections, the tactics. Dry powder is a running joke, but I'm starting to believe it's real. We (and I doubt it's just us) do little bits of the ultimate plan with a longer game in mind.
We've bemoaned endless seemingly pointless phases. And here we are using thrm to wear out defences and kill the rush. We've bemoaned the passive defence but here it is, soaking attack, frustrating attacks that have been prepared to unlock the rush. The passive kick chase is clearly a tactic, I don't understand it, but the players very much do.
There has been a long game played here. We've learned what works and what doesn't. The teams who set out their stall years ago turned up (by the barest of margins) and got found out.
The coaches clearly played a long game. A long game that has pissed us off, but they have stuck to it. They've learned lessons, made necessary changes, adapted, and not shown the world how until last Saturday. I think Ireland last year was the catalyst.
Now look, it might all get pulled apart next week, because south africa are fucking good, and sometimes you just get beat. But I think some credit is due here.
I'm not sure how I feel about it TBH, but if they pull this off, then I need to eat shit tons of.humble pie
@mariner4life haha yep, we've been watching the ABs battle with connect 4, while Fozzie and his team have been playing chess with a singular end game.
While I still hate alot of the past 4 years, given 3 or 4 weeks back, there were people saying we'd be lucky to get out of our pool, we might lose to Italy, we will get smacked by Ireland...
Now, after these 2 games, there is definitely a change, we have played some code worthy of making, and winning the RWC final
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A comment, if I may
IMO the past 7 days is the best the ABs have looked since 2015. Everything looks so together and accurate
And, I also think it's different to even July. The attack has a different shape, the defence is definitely different. We're not "playing the same but better", we're playing different to be better.
And while yes, it's different, with hindsight you can see.thr building blocks from earlier. The selections, the tactics. Dry powder is a running joke, but I'm starting to believe it's real. We (and I doubt it's just us) do little bits of the ultimate plan with a longer game in mind.
We've bemoaned endless seemingly pointless phases. And here we are using thrm to wear out defences and kill the rush. We've bemoaned the passive defence but here it is, soaking attack, frustrating attacks that have been prepared to unlock the rush. The passive kick chase is clearly a tactic, I don't understand it, but the players very much do.
There has been a long game played here. We've learned what works and what doesn't. The teams who set out their stall years ago turned up (by the barest of margins) and got found out.
The coaches clearly played a long game. A long game that has pissed us off, but they have stuck to it. They've learned lessons, made necessary changes, adapted, and not shown the world how until last Saturday. I think Ireland last year was the catalyst.
Now look, it might all get pulled apart next week, because south africa are fucking good, and sometimes you just get beat. But I think some credit is due here.
I'm not sure how I feel about it TBH, but if they pull this off, then I need to eat shit tons of.humble pie
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2023:
A comment, if I may
IMO the past 7 days is the best the ABs have looked since 2015. Everything looks so together and accurate
And, I also think it's different to even July. The attack has a different shape, the defence is definitely different. We're not "playing the same but better", we're playing different to be better.
And while yes, it's different, with hindsight you can see.thr building blocks from earlier. The selections, the tactics. Dry powder is a running joke, but I'm starting to believe it's real. We (and I doubt it's just us) do little bits of the ultimate plan with a longer game in mind.
We've bemoaned endless seemingly pointless phases. And here we are using thrm to wear out defences and kill the rush. We've bemoaned the passive defence but here it is, soaking attack, frustrating attacks that have been prepared to unlock the rush. The passive kick chase is clearly a tactic, I don't understand it, but the players very much do.
There has been a long game played here. We've learned what works and what doesn't. The teams who set out their stall years ago turned up (by the barest of margins) and got found out.
The coaches clearly played a long game. A long game that has pissed us off, but they have stuck to it. They've learned lessons, made necessary changes, adapted, and not shown the world how until last Saturday. I think Ireland last year was the catalyst.
Now look, it might all get pulled apart next week, because south africa are fucking good, and sometimes you just get beat. But I think some credit is due here.
I'm not sure how I feel about it TBH, but if they pull this off, then I need to eat shit tons of.humble pie
I can accept them building towards something. But some of the rugby we've played has been absolute dross, we've lost a bunch of tests which we are not accustomed to do, and if this was all part of the plan it took a man and group with an incredibly thick skin and a stubborn attitude to stay the course
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I'm starting to think Ian Foster is a massive player and fucked your wives
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I'm starting to think Ian Foster is a massive player and fucked your wives
@mariner4life It's not cool in this country to give him and Sam Cane credit.
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I'm starting to think Ian Foster is a massive player and fucked your wives
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2023:
I'm starting to think Ian Foster is a massive player and fucked your wives
Every time he did the wives gave him a cookie
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@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2023:
I'm starting to think Ian Foster is a massive player and fucked your wives
Every time he did the wives gave him a cookie
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks 2023:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2023:
I'm starting to think Ian Foster is a massive player and fucked your wives
Every time he did the wives gave him a cookie
All time sledge
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@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks 2023:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2023:
I'm starting to think Ian Foster is a massive player and fucked your wives
Every time he did the wives gave him a cookie
All time sledge
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@mariner4life classless
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@mariner4life sledging, media been telling us all week sledging is classless
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@mariner4life sledging, media been telling us all week sledging is classless
@taniwharugby said in All Blacks 2023:
@mariner4life sledging, media been telling us all week sledging is classless
The real lesson here is
Rugby men are good winners and bad losers.
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So how many of this squad either will play thier last game in black, or already have?
Coles, Whitelock, Retallick, Frizzel, Smith, Mounga, Beaudie...
Sure some may come back, but too often that never works.
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So how many of this squad either will play thier last game in black, or already have?
Coles, Whitelock, Retallick, Frizzel, Smith, Mounga, Beaudie...
Sure some may come back, but too often that never works.
@taniwharugby said in All Blacks 2023:
So how many of this squad either will play thier last game in black, or already have?
Coles, Whitelock, Retallick, Frizzel, Smith, Mounga, Beaudie...
Sure some may come back, but too often that never works.
Yeah, it's going to be really weird seeing the ABs without Whitelock, Retallick, Smith and BB.
I hate this part of the cycle. 4 guys all in the conversation for all-time AB 23s all going.
Fuuuck I hope they go out like the 2015 guys. But not everyone gets a fairytale.Sobs
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@taniwharugby said in All Blacks 2023:
So how many of this squad either will play thier last game in black, or already have?
Coles, Whitelock, Retallick, Frizzel, Smith, Mounga, Beaudie...
Sure some may come back, but too often that never works.
Yeah, it's going to be really weird seeing the ABs without Whitelock, Retallick, Smith and BB.
I hate this part of the cycle. 4 guys all in the conversation for all-time AB 23s all going.
Fuuuck I hope they go out like the 2015 guys. But not everyone gets a fairytale.Sobs
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2023:
@taniwharugby said in All Blacks 2023:
So how many of this squad either will play thier last game in black, or already have?
Coles, Whitelock, Retallick, Frizzel, Smith, Mounga, Beaudie...
Sure some may come back, but too often that never works.
Yeah, it's going to be really weird seeing the ABs without Whitelock, Retallick, Smith and BB.
I hate this part of the cycle. 4 guys all in the conversation for all-time AB 23s all going.
Fuuuck I hope they go out like the 2015 guys. But not everyone gets a fairytale.Sobs
As long as they don't believe they deserve a fairy tale ending, then they're in with a pretty good chance
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@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2023:
@taniwharugby said in All Blacks 2023:
So how many of this squad either will play thier last game in black, or already have?
Coles, Whitelock, Retallick, Frizzel, Smith, Mounga, Beaudie...
Sure some may come back, but too often that never works.
Yeah, it's going to be really weird seeing the ABs without Whitelock, Retallick, Smith and BB.
I hate this part of the cycle. 4 guys all in the conversation for all-time AB 23s all going.
Fuuuck I hope they go out like the 2015 guys. But not everyone gets a fairytale.Sobs
As long as they don't believe they deserve a fairy tale ending, then they're in with a pretty good chance
@Machpants said in All Blacks 2023:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2023:
@taniwharugby said in All Blacks 2023:
So how many of this squad either will play thier last game in black, or already have?
Coles, Whitelock, Retallick, Frizzel, Smith, Mounga, Beaudie...
Sure some may come back, but too often that never works.
Yeah, it's going to be really weird seeing the ABs without Whitelock, Retallick, Smith and BB.
I hate this part of the cycle. 4 guys all in the conversation for all-time AB 23s all going.
Fuuuck I hope they go out like the 2015 guys. But not everyone gets a fairytale.Sobs
As long as they don't believe they deserve a fairy tale ending, then they're in with a pretty good chance
Somehow I think, looking at body language, that thought isn't in anyone's heads
