Springboks vs All Blacks 2
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@canefan said in Springboks vs All Blacks 2:
@MiketheSnow said in Springboks vs All Blacks 2:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Springboks vs All Blacks 2:
@mariner4life said in Springboks vs All Blacks 2:
Fuck the backs
A complete lack of penetration out wide - poor passing, positioning and shit running angles. One of the least effective attacking AB backline performances I've seen.
At least Ratima has tested the "all we need is quick ball to our 10 to slice them apart" hypothesis to destruction.
Said it more than once
Not lying deep enough
Sitting a metre or two further back now that you have the scrum half to pass the ball will give both DMac and JB the time to kick longer (neither of them have quick leg speed when they punt)
It will also create more doubt in the defenders because it will give DMac the time to read what's in front of him and fix the defences
Gives JB the chance to come up to battering ram speed
Putting ALB in at first five allows you to line up flatter. He's quicker off the mark forwards as well as laterally
Gives your back row the time to get to the breakdown and secure quick ruck ball. None of them are lightning
How about putting in a 10 who excels in creating space for his outsides?
Who the fuck is that in NZ rugby at the moment?
Also, one of DMac's key strengths for the Chiefs is his creating space for his outsides, what's different about the AB tactics that negates this from his game?
@Nepia And I would throw Rieko into that as well
TJ slower ball then a 12 and 13 only looking for contact.
If they looked up Dmac is one of the best at putting guys into space but they have to want it- there is times when a crash ball is necessary but not every time - vary the lines make the defense panic and have to adjust. -
Is Scott Robertson the worst All Blacks coach of all time?
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Is Scott Robertson the worst All Blacks coach of all time?
@Yeahtheboys said in Springboks vs All Blacks 2:
Is Scott Robertson the worst All Blacks coach of all time?
Dunno, but you saying that after he has been in charge for 2 months, has you in the running for worst AB supporter of all time.
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@kpkanz “razor wins each one of them” based on fucking what? He lost to Argentina at home?
@Yeahtheboys said in Springboks vs All Blacks 2:
@kpkanz “razor wins each one of them” based on fucking what? He lost to Argentina at home?
I'm sure the likes of Ireland and Argentina would both admit that they felt a lot more confident playing the All Blacks following their historic wins. Something about getting that monkey off the backs. Those historic defeats (which, Foster is only responsible for Argentina, of course) have seismically affected NZ's mental advantage over the opposition.
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@Yeahtheboys said in Springboks vs All Blacks 2:
@kpkanz “razor wins each one of them” based on fucking what? He lost to Argentina at home?
I'm sure the likes of Ireland and Argentina would both admit that they felt a lot more confident playing the All Blacks following their historic wins. Something about getting that monkey off the backs. Those historic defeats (which, Foster is only responsible for Argentina, of course) have seismically affected NZ's mental advantage over the opposition.
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@kpkanz “razor wins each one of them” based on fucking what? He lost to Argentina at home?
@Yeahtheboys said in Springboks vs All Blacks 2:
@kpkanz “razor wins each one of them” based on fucking what? He lost to Argentina at home?
Because I'm comparing the rugby we're playing under Razor to the rugby we played under Foster??
Which was the worst I have ever seen the All Blacks play in decades of watching?Our Argentina loss this year we were up 20-8 and threw the game away where we basically handed 2 free tries and collapsed. A game we blew.
Do you not remember the Argentina losses under Foster?
In those games we were genuinely dominated from minute 1 to minute 80. At NO point in those entire games did we look like winning.That has not happened once in Razors first year. All 3 losses we had a legitimate chance for victory, 2 of them where we had no right to lose from the position we were in.
So yes this is magnitudes better than Fosters first 2 years before Schmidt/Ryan joined.
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Sorry but you can't just gloss over conceding a record number of points at home to fucking Argentina. That was one of the worst matches I can remember as an AB supporter. The way we just crumpled was embarrassing stuff. Razor has a lot to learn at test level - will he get there? We all hope so buy the jury is out still.
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@Yeahtheboys said in Springboks vs All Blacks 2:
@kpkanz “razor wins each one of them” based on fucking what? He lost to Argentina at home?
Because I'm comparing the rugby we're playing under Razor to the rugby we played under Foster??
Which was the worst I have ever seen the All Blacks play in decades of watching?Our Argentina loss this year we were up 20-8 and threw the game away where we basically handed 2 free tries and collapsed. A game we blew.
Do you not remember the Argentina losses under Foster?
In those games we were genuinely dominated from minute 1 to minute 80. At NO point in those entire games did we look like winning.That has not happened once in Razors first year. All 3 losses we had a legitimate chance for victory, 2 of them where we had no right to lose from the position we were in.
So yes this is magnitudes better than Fosters first 2 years before Schmidt/Ryan joined.
@kpkanz said in Springboks vs All Blacks 2:
So yes this is magnitudes better than Fosters first 2 years before Schmidt/Ryan joined.
If you were a wallaby fan, you'd be arguing for being up 20-3 being a good thing, before shipping a record number of points in the last quarter against the Pumas (who have quietly over-achieved this year by the way).
Reality is we should win those games. I think the leadership and mindset isn't there - the group of Scott/Ardie/Jordie is fine, but clearly not getting the team mindset int he right place.
How much do we miss SWhitelock? Massively!
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On the game, it's the same problems as the previous week really, some of which are problems created by squad selection which falls squarely on Razor's shoulders.
Our tight 5 is very good, and can match it with any other team. Really happy with the way we have developed there, particularly the locks which looks a position of strength for us now and will be bolstered again when Holland becomes available.
Our loosies are a big weakness still, this has been the most disappointing area by far, and Razor is the man in charge of this space. Cane did was Cane does, but is older, slower, and less effective than he was in the past. Not bad, but nothing standout either. Sititi played well for an 8, but played that game at 6 meaning we didn't have a 6 on the park doing the hard yards on defense and at ruck time. Ardie continued his form slump and was mostly ineffective. Just to play my broken record once more, a trio of Arkia-Cane-Sititi would be potent as fuck but will never happen under this coaching team which is insane to me.
On the backs, we seriously lacked any threat out wide which made defending us a lot easier. We looked better when Rieko was moved to wing as we actually had a threat out wide after that. Reece and Telea are great SR players but are not really test standard, both are a huge step down from Jordan and Clarke on the wings. Moving Jordan to fullback was dumb when he has been so effective on the wing. At fullback we're going to need to give Perofeta and Love game time there as the replacements for Beauden who is obviously in the twilight of his career and has been too inconsistent recently.
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ok, watched the replay
agree with a lot of stuff re individuals, old guys looked bad, young guys looked good
a couple of things that really stood out about HOW were still playing...still tackling too high too often...yes, if you know your part of a two man tackle then try and wrap up the ball....otherwise go low and fold a fluffybunny....we're standing up and if we dont get penalised its allowing their support to get there and drive a couple of meters....its weak
on attack...we're so flat footed...i lost count of how may times guys would get the ball standing on their heels...do a little two step...then fall into contact....hit the ball at fucking pace
structure falls apart after a couple of phases and or broken play....club rugby teams try and get back in shape after broken play, work to an edge, re group...but we dont seem to even try...broken play...dont break the line...kick
really seems like basics we're either not coaching or the players are not implementing
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@kpkanz said in Springboks vs All Blacks 2:
So yes this is magnitudes better than Fosters first 2 years before Schmidt/Ryan joined.
If you were a wallaby fan, you'd be arguing for being up 20-3 being a good thing, before shipping a record number of points in the last quarter against the Pumas (who have quietly over-achieved this year by the way).
Reality is we should win those games. I think the leadership and mindset isn't there - the group of Scott/Ardie/Jordie is fine, but clearly not getting the team mindset int he right place.
How much do we miss SWhitelock? Massively!
@nzzp said in Springboks vs All Blacks 2:
@kpkanz said in Springboks vs All Blacks 2:
So yes this is magnitudes better than Fosters first 2 years before Schmidt/Ryan joined.
If you were a wallaby fan, you'd be arguing for being up 20-3 being a good thing, before shipping a record number of points in the last quarter against the Pumas (who have quietly over-achieved this year by the way).
Reality is we should win those games. I think the leadership and mindset isn't there - the group of Scott/Ardie/Jordie is fine, but clearly not getting the team mindset int he right place.
How much do we miss SWhitelock? Massively!
I mean I wouldn't argue for any positives if we lost by 40 points.
I was merely stating every loss this year we were in a good position to win it before collapsing.
I'm not HAPPY with collapsing. I was merely comparing it to the feeling of complete despair at some of the bad losses last era. Where we didn't even have an opportunity to collapse because we were that dreadful we were never even in the game.
Yes I agree, our leadership is severely lacking. Almost as if we have so many captains/vice captains they're all looking to each other as to what to do without someone actually just taking charge themselves.
Its quite concerning.
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@stodders said in Springboks vs All Blacks 2:
@nostrildamus he’s playing 7 for Auckland, so play him there. If Cane doesn’t go on EOYT, 7s should be DP, Segner and Savea to cover if needed.
Segner in front of Lakai?
Am not of the Canes Mafia, but I'd be leaning Lakai.
@booboo said in Springboks vs All Blacks 2:
@stodders said in Springboks vs All Blacks 2:
@nostrildamus he’s playing 7 for Auckland, so play him there. If Cane doesn’t go on EOYT, 7s should be DP, Segner and Savea to cover if needed.
Segner in front of Lakai?
Am not of the Canes Mafia, but I'd be leaning Lakai.
Yeah Lakai is definitely the next in line, they brought him into camp earlier in the season for a reason. He's a solid body aswell through his African/Tongan heritage, plus he's effective on both sides of the ball which we are missing. I can't wait until Lakai and Sititi become a regular combo and I wouldn't be surprised if they both started at the next WC. Lakai has been quite obviously dominant in the NPC after a very strong Super season. It's not a case of if he'll be an AB, it's more a case of when. Hopefully sooner rather than later based on our options atm.
Segner isn't close to being in the ABs yet, he needs to standout at Super level first and for me he hasn't really matched up physically on a consistent basis.
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@Yeahtheboys said in Springboks vs All Blacks 2:
@kpkanz “razor wins each one of them” based on fucking what? He lost to Argentina at home?
Because I'm comparing the rugby we're playing under Razor to the rugby we played under Foster??
Which was the worst I have ever seen the All Blacks play in decades of watching?Our Argentina loss this year we were up 20-8 and threw the game away where we basically handed 2 free tries and collapsed. A game we blew.
Do you not remember the Argentina losses under Foster?
In those games we were genuinely dominated from minute 1 to minute 80. At NO point in those entire games did we look like winning.That has not happened once in Razors first year. All 3 losses we had a legitimate chance for victory, 2 of them where we had no right to lose from the position we were in.
So yes this is magnitudes better than Fosters first 2 years before Schmidt/Ryan joined.
@kpkanz Kpkanz the Razor apologist. Take off the eye patch
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@booboo said in Springboks vs All Blacks 2:
@stodders said in Springboks vs All Blacks 2:
@nostrildamus he’s playing 7 for Auckland, so play him there. If Cane doesn’t go on EOYT, 7s should be DP, Segner and Savea to cover if needed.
Segner in front of Lakai?
Am not of the Canes Mafia, but I'd be leaning Lakai.
Yeah Lakai is definitely the next in line, they brought him into camp earlier in the season for a reason. He's a solid body aswell through his African/Tongan heritage, plus he's effective on both sides of the ball which we are missing. I can't wait until Lakai and Sititi become a regular combo and I wouldn't be surprised if they both started at the next WC. Lakai has been quite obviously dominant in the NPC after a very strong Super season. It's not a case of if he'll be an AB, it's more a case of when. Hopefully sooner rather than later based on our options atm.
Segner isn't close to being in the ABs yet, he needs to standout at Super level first and for me he hasn't really matched up physically on a consistent basis.
@Canes4life Lakai is hugely promising. With his speed he's got a bit of the young Michael Jones about him!
Didn't have a great Super semi, if I recall correctly, which might have cost him a place in the current squad - but, a good chance of EOYT.
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@Canes4life Lakai is hugely promising. With his speed he's got a bit of the young Michael Jones about him!
Didn't have a great Super semi, if I recall correctly, which might have cost him a place in the current squad - but, a good chance of EOYT.
@Chris-B unfortunately the Canes season unraveled in the first 10 mins of that game, definitely a game Lakai would have learnt from aswell along with the majority of the rest of the players out there that day. He hasn't put a foot wrong so far in the NPC so signs are promising, he'll have another opportunity to show what he's made of this Sunday in a big Shield game against quality opposition.
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@Chris-B unfortunately the Canes season unraveled in the first 10 mins of that game, definitely a game Lakai would have learnt from aswell along with the majority of the rest of the players out there that day. He hasn't put a foot wrong so far in the NPC so signs are promising, he'll have another opportunity to show what he's made of this Sunday in a big Shield game against quality opposition.
@Canes4life Yep - Razor needs to get gametime into all of those Mako boys - it will be gross incompetence if he doesn't release Lomax, Blackadder, Hotham, Havili and Jordan for that game.
Lomax might be over-egging the pudding. The other four all need game time!
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@Canes4life Yep - Razor needs to get gametime into all of those Mako boys - it will be gross incompetence if he doesn't release Lomax, Blackadder, Hotham, Havili and Jordan for that game.
Lomax might be over-egging the pudding. The other four all need game time!
@Chris-B said in Springboks vs All Blacks 2:
@Canes4life Yep - Razor needs to get gametime into all of those Mako boys - it will be gross incompetence if he doesn't release Lomax, Blackadder, Hotham, Havili and Jordan for that game.
Lomax might be over-egging the pudding. Thye other four all need game time!
Razor better release Aumua, Perenara, Savea, Proctor and Love then.
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@Chris-B said in Springboks vs All Blacks 2:
@Canes4life Yep - Razor needs to get gametime into all of those Mako boys - it will be gross incompetence if he doesn't release Lomax, Blackadder, Hotham, Havili and Jordan for that game.
Lomax might be over-egging the pudding. Thye other four all need game time!
Razor better release Aumua, Perenara, Savea, Proctor and Love then.
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@Canes4life Actually, he should release Proctor and Love - and maybe Aumua.
@Chris-B said in Springboks vs All Blacks 2:
@Canes4life Actually, he should release Proctor and Love - and maybe Aumua.
I wouldn't mind everyone getting a crack. As long as it's fair and he releases everyone.
Hopefully it's a sellout, that would be pretty awesome.
