Exodus
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On the NPC, I don't have that much of a romantic attachment of it - in my younger days we were always bum fucking around in the 2nd Div and all our good players went to Dunedin. My romantic attachment is with the Magpies as a team I guess.
But, I see the NPC as a development comp and I think it does that job decently. I think that recently most teams have also learnt to balance their budgets which is a good thing. And I remember reading somewhere that Sky are happy with the viewing figures. I don't need the ABs in it all the time. Maybe that's due to coming from a Union that doesn't have lots of ABs every year and if I was from Canterbury or Auckland maybe I'd feel different?
Personally I've never been in favour of a year long NRL competition, not because I'm old but because it doesn't appeal to me. I like watching Super, the big tests, then NPC, the EOYT. Maybe I'm conditioned to that, but maybe if I got to watch the Magpies for 24 matches a year I'd change my tune.
At any rate this has been an interesting discussion and a welcome change from Fozzie bad.
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I think the romantic idea of an enlarged NPC comp and no super is just that, a romantic idea.
I make no bones I prefer the NPC even now to super, but fully understand why super is needed. If we had a 9-10 team comp, I doubt whether wages would stop more players going overseas. You will still probably keep ABs, but with reduced wages you will then lose a hell of a lot more of next tier players that now play super (and hance get more money).
Would certainly take a lot more players out of club rugby, as club rugby is also played when super is on, and you need the players playing a decent standard before test season. Could also tke us out of any world club comp consideration as weaker teams, if this idea goes ahead we need to be involved or lose more players unfortunately.. As i said earlier we on the pro merry go round now!I think the romantic idea of an enlarged NPC comp and no super is just that, a romantic idea.
I make no bones I prefer the NPC even now to super, but fully understand why super is needed. If we had a 9-10 team comp, I doubt whether wages would stop more players going overseas. You will still probably keep ABs, but with reduced wages you will then lose a hell of a lot more of next tier players that now play super (and hance get more money).
Would certainly take a lot more players out of club rugby, as club rugby is also played when super is on, and you need the players playing a decent standard before test season. Could also tke us out of any world club comp consideration as weaker teams, if this idea goes ahead we need to be involved or lose more players unfortunately.. As i said earlier we on the pro merry go round now!just addressing specific points, isn't that as easy as club rugby moves to winter/spring rather than autumn/winter....so all the best players in the country play in the same comp during the first half of the year....then we have mid year internationals/RC...then the AB's prep for and go on end of year tour
if anything we might actually get some more of the guys that only just miss out on the AB's playing club rugby then we do now
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I think the romantic idea of an enlarged NPC comp and no super is just that, a romantic idea.
I make no bones I prefer the NPC even now to super, but fully understand why super is needed. If we had a 9-10 team comp, I doubt whether wages would stop more players going overseas. You will still probably keep ABs, but with reduced wages you will then lose a hell of a lot more of next tier players that now play super (and hance get more money).
Would certainly take a lot more players out of club rugby, as club rugby is also played when super is on, and you need the players playing a decent standard before test season. Could also tke us out of any world club comp consideration as weaker teams, if this idea goes ahead we need to be involved or lose more players unfortunately.. As i said earlier we on the pro merry go round now!just addressing specific points, isn't that as easy as club rugby moves to winter/spring rather than autumn/winter....so all the best players in the country play in the same comp during the first half of the year....then we have mid year internationals/RC...then the AB's prep for and go on end of year tour
if anything we might actually get some more of the guys that only just miss out on the AB's playing club rugby then we do now
@Kiwiwomble said in Exodus:
I think the romantic idea of an enlarged NPC comp and no super is just that, a romantic idea.
I make no bones I prefer the NPC even now to super, but fully understand why super is needed. If we had a 9-10 team comp, I doubt whether wages would stop more players going overseas. You will still probably keep ABs, but with reduced wages you will then lose a hell of a lot more of next tier players that now play super (and hance get more money).
Would certainly take a lot more players out of club rugby, as club rugby is also played when super is on, and you need the players playing a decent standard before test season. Could also tke us out of any world club comp consideration as weaker teams, if this idea goes ahead we need to be involved or lose more players unfortunately.. As i said earlier we on the pro merry go round now!just addressing specific points, isn't that as easy as club rugby moves to winter/spring rather than autumn/winter....so all the best players in the country play in the same comp during the first half of the year....then we have mid year internationals/RC...then the AB's prep for and go on end of year tour
if anything we might actually get some more of the guys that only just miss out on the AB's playing club rugby then we do now
Yep mate, but you would destroy rugby in the places where farming is big part. Club rugby is designed around NZ farming, and most area's country clubs would fold, as spring is calving/lambing time. To be honest I forgot until I returned to live.
When covid caused season to start late last year, comp was made shorter as it had to finish before calving. Micheal Bent who played for Ireland this year from Hawera, couldn't play for the Naki last year because of farm. Would be similar in any rural areas, so would kill club rugby, the fabric of our game.
The idea has merit, but would I think maybe too big a problem outside of cities, and think it shows how many things have to be taken into consideration when setting up comps, guess mid year tour etc have to be taken into account too.
And I add would be great to get ABs on fringe back to clubs though. -
I just can'rt really see how the season would/should be changed apart from that.
because like @Duluth said you aren't thinking past tweaking what exists right now
which kinda sucks, and actually works against the ABs as well
i would love one professional comp taht runs from March to October.
Possibly with a side "Pacific Cup" tournament@mariner4life Yep that actually sounds good too Mariner, long comp, but would be end of inbound tours and RC as such wouldn't it.
I would prefer that super was shorter and started later, but understand why RA wants it started early to get a few games in before NRL and AFL starts. -
@mariner4life Yep that actually sounds good too Mariner, long comp, but would be end of inbound tours and RC as such wouldn't it.
I would prefer that super was shorter and started later, but understand why RA wants it started early to get a few games in before NRL and AFL starts. -
I think professional comp alongside club comp works. It like the feeder clubs in rugby league. Everyone is game ready.
Atm guys who aren't playing npc have nothing to get them game ready underneath it. Guys coming up and down into club teams would really add buy in rural cities. I know it happens alot in the super towns.
It streamlines everything imo.
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@Kiwiwomble said in Exodus:
I think the romantic idea of an enlarged NPC comp and no super is just that, a romantic idea.
I make no bones I prefer the NPC even now to super, but fully understand why super is needed. If we had a 9-10 team comp, I doubt whether wages would stop more players going overseas. You will still probably keep ABs, but with reduced wages you will then lose a hell of a lot more of next tier players that now play super (and hance get more money).
Would certainly take a lot more players out of club rugby, as club rugby is also played when super is on, and you need the players playing a decent standard before test season. Could also tke us out of any world club comp consideration as weaker teams, if this idea goes ahead we need to be involved or lose more players unfortunately.. As i said earlier we on the pro merry go round now!just addressing specific points, isn't that as easy as club rugby moves to winter/spring rather than autumn/winter....so all the best players in the country play in the same comp during the first half of the year....then we have mid year internationals/RC...then the AB's prep for and go on end of year tour
if anything we might actually get some more of the guys that only just miss out on the AB's playing club rugby then we do now
Yep mate, but you would destroy rugby in the places where farming is big part. Club rugby is designed around NZ farming, and most area's country clubs would fold, as spring is calving/lambing time. To be honest I forgot until I returned to live.
When covid caused season to start late last year, comp was made shorter as it had to finish before calving. Micheal Bent who played for Ireland this year from Hawera, couldn't play for the Naki last year because of farm. Would be similar in any rural areas, so would kill club rugby, the fabric of our game.
The idea has merit, but would I think maybe too big a problem outside of cities, and think it shows how many things have to be taken into consideration when setting up comps, guess mid year tour etc have to be taken into account too.
And I add would be great to get ABs on fringe back to clubs though.@Kiwiwomble said in Exodus:
I think the romantic idea of an enlarged NPC comp and no super is just that, a romantic idea.
I make no bones I prefer the NPC even now to super, but fully understand why super is needed. If we had a 9-10 team comp, I doubt whether wages would stop more players going overseas. You will still probably keep ABs, but with reduced wages you will then lose a hell of a lot more of next tier players that now play super (and hance get more money).
Would certainly take a lot more players out of club rugby, as club rugby is also played when super is on, and you need the players playing a decent standard before test season. Could also tke us out of any world club comp consideration as weaker teams, if this idea goes ahead we need to be involved or lose more players unfortunately.. As i said earlier we on the pro merry go round now!just addressing specific points, isn't that as easy as club rugby moves to winter/spring rather than autumn/winter....so all the best players in the country play in the same comp during the first half of the year....then we have mid year internationals/RC...then the AB's prep for and go on end of year tour
if anything we might actually get some more of the guys that only just miss out on the AB's playing club rugby then we do now
Yep mate, but you would destroy rugby in the places where farming is big part. Club rugby is designed around NZ farming, and most area's country clubs would fold, as spring is calving/lambing time. To be honest I forgot until I returned to live.
When covid caused season to start late last year, comp was made shorter as it had to finish before calving. Micheal Bent who played for Ireland this year from Hawera, couldn't play for the Naki last year because of farm. Would be similar in any rural areas, so would kill club rugby, the fabric of our game.
The idea has merit, but would I think maybe too big a problem outside of cities, and think it shows how many things have to be taken into consideration when setting up comps, guess mid year tour etc have to be taken into account too.
And I add would be great to get ABs on fringe back to clubs though.That’s fair and not something I’d thought about, might it still be better for rural and urban comps to be at different times then for the professional comps to be so messed up
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I think professional comp alongside club comp works. It like the feeder clubs in rugby league. Everyone is game ready.
Atm guys who aren't playing npc have nothing to get them game ready underneath it. Guys coming up and down into club teams would really add buy in rural cities. I know it happens alot in the super towns.
It streamlines everything imo.
@muddyriver said in Exodus:
I think professional comp alongside club comp works. It like the feeder clubs in rugby league. Everyone is game ready.
Atm guys who aren't playing npc have nothing to get them game ready underneath it. Guys coming up and down into club teams would really add buy in rural cities. I know it happens alot in the super towns.
It streamlines everything imo.
Not sure I understand you correctly, but parallel to the NPC, there are development team, age grade and other representative competitions. NPC players who aren't in the match day 23, and players on the NPC fringes, will play for teams taking part in those competitions.
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@Kiwiwomble said in Exodus:
I think the romantic idea of an enlarged NPC comp and no super is just that, a romantic idea.
I make no bones I prefer the NPC even now to super, but fully understand why super is needed. If we had a 9-10 team comp, I doubt whether wages would stop more players going overseas. You will still probably keep ABs, but with reduced wages you will then lose a hell of a lot more of next tier players that now play super (and hance get more money).
Would certainly take a lot more players out of club rugby, as club rugby is also played when super is on, and you need the players playing a decent standard before test season. Could also tke us out of any world club comp consideration as weaker teams, if this idea goes ahead we need to be involved or lose more players unfortunately.. As i said earlier we on the pro merry go round now!just addressing specific points, isn't that as easy as club rugby moves to winter/spring rather than autumn/winter....so all the best players in the country play in the same comp during the first half of the year....then we have mid year internationals/RC...then the AB's prep for and go on end of year tour
if anything we might actually get some more of the guys that only just miss out on the AB's playing club rugby then we do now
Yep mate, but you would destroy rugby in the places where farming is big part. Club rugby is designed around NZ farming, and most area's country clubs would fold, as spring is calving/lambing time. To be honest I forgot until I returned to live.
When covid caused season to start late last year, comp was made shorter as it had to finish before calving. Micheal Bent who played for Ireland this year from Hawera, couldn't play for the Naki last year because of farm. Would be similar in any rural areas, so would kill club rugby, the fabric of our game.
The idea has merit, but would I think maybe too big a problem outside of cities, and think it shows how many things have to be taken into consideration when setting up comps, guess mid year tour etc have to be taken into account too.
And I add would be great to get ABs on fringe back to clubs though.That’s fair and not something I’d thought about, might it still be better for rural and urban comps to be at different times then for the professional comps to be so messed up
@Kiwiwomble I must admit to be a traditionalist and liking things similar etc, but mare than that I think you need all club comps basically running same time so rep rugby etc can take place. It kind of makes you pause and think many of us have good ideas etc, but maybe don't actually have to then get out ideas to work. All comps I imagine have to be worked to allow for seasons (obviously), rep rugby (and all age stuff), and goes further up to top level. There are a lot of people with conficting interests etc involved.
I always remember years ago when parents/coaches would complain about how they felt their kids were having to many away games on Saturday mornings (comp was spread over 5 towns) and I sat down as an exercise and tried to work out how I would do a draw, it was a nightmare.. Gave even more credit to fella that did it. -
@muddyriver said in Exodus:
I think professional comp alongside club comp works. It like the feeder clubs in rugby league. Everyone is game ready.
Atm guys who aren't playing npc have nothing to get them game ready underneath it. Guys coming up and down into club teams would really add buy in rural cities. I know it happens alot in the super towns.
It streamlines everything imo.
Not sure I understand you correctly, but parallel to the NPC, there are development team, age grade and other representative competitions. NPC players who aren't in the match day 23, and players on the NPC fringes, will play for teams taking part in those competitions.
@Stargazer they last for 4 weeks of the season these days. And it's unorganized rubbish rugby for the most part.
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@mariner4life said in Exodus:
inbound tours and RC as such wouldn't it.
no, just a re-think
The november tours and 6-nations exist up north and their season is like 11 months long
Yep , needs complete global season change more than a rethink. WR has test windows set. But I think we need to shorten season length as ours is basically as long , from Feb to to beginning of Dec, too long. I would like it if we started in March and finished Oct/early Nov. We hammering (and by we I mean rugby in general) miles too much.
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@Stargazer they last for 4 weeks of the season these days. And it's unorganized rubbish rugby for the most part.
@muddyriver said in Exodus:
@Stargazer they last for 4 weeks of the season these days. And it's unorganized rubbish rugby for the most part.
Only unorganised rubbish for you maybe muddy, but very important to development of our younger players etc. I know the Naki development (B) team plays through to Oct, same as U20s etc, who have quite a good set comp, first in Chiefs area , then qualifiers play winners from other super areas.
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@Stargazer they last for 4 weeks of the season these days. And it's unorganized rubbish rugby for the most part.
@muddyriver I think this years programme for the Northland dev side, but more so some of the age grade stuff was the best they have had for years, but still too inconsistent and lack of variety of opposition to get real value...hopefully they can keep working on this.
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@muddyriver said in Exodus:
@Stargazer they last for 4 weeks of the season these days. And it's unorganized rubbish rugby for the most part.
Only unorganised rubbish for you maybe muddy, but very important to development of our younger players etc. I know the Naki development (B) team plays through to Oct, same as U20s etc, who have quite a good set comp, first in Chiefs area , then qualifiers play winners from other super areas.
@Dan54 Yep, in the Hurricanes region also a lot of work has been/is being done in that respect, although - thus far - it has resulted in a better programme for the Wellington teams (due to their much bigger numbers and - probably - closer proximity) than for the other provinces in the region, but as @taniwharugby says, if they continue to work on the programme for both age grade and dev teams, it has the potential of being something really good. It's definitely not "unorganized rubbish".
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@Dan54 Yep, in the Hurricanes region also a lot of work has been/is being done in that respect, although - thus far - it has resulted in a better programme for the Wellington teams (due to their much bigger numbers and - probably - closer proximity) than for the other provinces in the region, but as @taniwharugby says, if they continue to work on the programme for both age grade and dev teams, it has the potential of being something really good. It's definitely not "unorganized rubbish".
@Stargazer TBF, I think the programmes up here, have def not been great, but we have a new guy that has returned from Auckland who is certainly trying to get that aspect a bit more organised, and if I recall correctly, @Muddyriver has also had a bit of experience in both Northland and Auckland scenes so not just an off the cuff comment, but probably more specific to his expericnes.
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@Stargazer TBF, I think the programmes up here, have def not been great, but we have a new guy that has returned from Auckland who is certainly trying to get that aspect a bit more organised, and if I recall correctly, @Muddyriver has also had a bit of experience in both Northland and Auckland scenes so not just an off the cuff comment, but probably more specific to his expericnes.
@taniwharugby said in Exodus:
@Stargazer TBF, I think the programmes up here, have def not been great, but we have a new guy that has returned from Auckland who is certainly trying to get that aspect a bit more organised, and if I recall correctly, @Muddyriver has also had a bit of experience in both Northland and Auckland scenes so not just an off the cuff comment, but probably more specific to his expericnes.
The same really in the Crusaders region it has been ok and worked well for the Crusaders.
But there is a real effort to grow it in the region to be even more meaningful.The Crusaders academy has been running for quite while now and now there are decent structures underneath 70% of new players for the Crusaders come straight out of the Academy every season.
They flow straight in to the academy from all-round the country the Crusaders have had a extremely good scouting group watching school rugby for a while now.
And we are starting to see that at all the SR franchises. -
@taniwharugby said in Exodus:
@Stargazer TBF, I think the programmes up here, have def not been great, but we have a new guy that has returned from Auckland who is certainly trying to get that aspect a bit more organised, and if I recall correctly, @Muddyriver has also had a bit of experience in both Northland and Auckland scenes so not just an off the cuff comment, but probably more specific to his expericnes.
The same really in the Crusaders region it has been ok and worked well for the Crusaders.
But there is a real effort to grow it in the region to be even more meaningful.The Crusaders academy has been running for quite while now and now there are decent structures underneath 70% of new players for the Crusaders come straight out of the Academy every season.
They flow straight in to the academy from all-round the country the Crusaders have had a extremely good scouting group watching school rugby for a while now.
And we are starting to see that at all the SR franchises.@Chris Yep Chris they got a good scouting group, a No 10 from Southport School a team I watched a few years back came over to Crusaders Academy, had a few games for Ta$man, though last I heard he was signed by the Force, his parents live over there, and rumours coming through from Qld he was missing them a fair bit.
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@Chris Yep Chris they got a good scouting group, a No 10 from Southport School a team I watched a few years back came over to Crusaders Academy, had a few games for Ta$man, though last I heard he was signed by the Force, his parents live over there, and rumours coming through from Qld he was missing them a fair bit.
@Chris Yep Chris they got a good scouting group, a No 10 from Southport School a team I watched a few years back came over to Crusaders Academy, had a few games for Ta$man, though last I heard he was signed by the Force, his parents live over there, and rumours coming through from Qld he was missing them a fair bit.
Yep Campbell Parata
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@Chris Yep Chris they got a good scouting group, a No 10 from Southport School a team I watched a few years back came over to Crusaders Academy, had a few games for Ta$man, though last I heard he was signed by the Force, his parents live over there, and rumours coming through from Qld he was missing them a fair bit.
Yep Campbell Parata
@Chris Yep Chris they got a good scouting group, a No 10 from Southport School a team I watched a few years back came over to Crusaders Academy, had a few games for Ta$man, though last I heard he was signed by the Force, his parents live over there, and rumours coming through from Qld he was missing them a fair bit.
Yep Campbell Parata
Yep, and you know when I replied I couldn't remember his name-------bloody old age huh!
