Five Greatest ABs of the past 50 years
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@antipodean said in Five Greatest ABs of the past 50 years:
@mariner4life said in Five Greatest ABs of the past 50 years:
Lomu was rugby's first global super star. Surely in.
First global superstar, certainly. Apart from 1995 RWC and 99 against France I'm not sure he did enough consistently to be among the top five. If only he hadn't had got sick.
Fitzy makes the list because there's been no better captain. And that's high praise considering the august nature of that club.
GOAT, obviously.
DC because there's been no more complete five-eighth.
I have to think harder about the remaining two.
Meads, obviously.
Lochore. Based on footage and reports. And if nothing else, leaving a note.
@antipodean said in Five Greatest ABs of the past 50 years:
And if nothing else, leaving a note.
Nice.
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The forgotten man of these conversations is Dougie Howlett.
Not saying he would end up in my selection but certainly worth a mention as the record try scorer in black. Considering that players like Cully, Rok, Wilson, Bender and Lomu are below him on the table and even BB after way more tests is going to be stretching to catch him I just find it interesting that his name doesn’t get mentioned -
@Crucial Probably because he was just on the end of the chain scoring try’s. Never saw him run over anyone, tackle with any amount of venom or do something amazing. Just fast and hence meh.
@broughie said in Five Greatest ABs of the past 50 years:
@Crucial Probably because he was just on the end of the chain scoring try’s. Never saw him run over anyone, tackle with any amount of venom or do something amazing. Just fast and hence meh.
Are we back to talking Dougie?
I never said he was in contention for the final list, just that he never seems to get mentioned in wider discussions despite holding a record that many good players have failed to match.
He did a bit more than catch the ball, run and fall over. I seem to remember some very skilled chip and re-gathers for example. Also had a very consistent strike rate. Wasn't too many games where he didn't score (whereas others have their records boosted by multiple scores in one game against minnows)
Anyway, probably a discussion for another time, -
@broughie said in Five Greatest ABs of the past 50 years:
@Crucial Probably because he was just on the end of the chain scoring try’s. Never saw him run over anyone, tackle with any amount of venom or do something amazing. Just fast and hence meh.
Are we back to talking Dougie?
I never said he was in contention for the final list, just that he never seems to get mentioned in wider discussions despite holding a record that many good players have failed to match.
He did a bit more than catch the ball, run and fall over. I seem to remember some very skilled chip and re-gathers for example. Also had a very consistent strike rate. Wasn't too many games where he didn't score (whereas others have their records boosted by multiple scores in one game against minnows)
Anyway, probably a discussion for another time, -
@Crucial being in the right place at the right time to take the last pass, no matter what part of the field, is a massively underrated outside back skill. Dougie was the fucking master.
@mariner4life said in Five Greatest ABs of the past 50 years:
@Crucial being in the right place at the right time to take the last pass, no matter what part of the field, is a massively underrated outside back skill. Dougie was the fucking master.
The Dougster was so good he got rested for the Quarter against France 2007. Remember - we played Sivi and Roks (from memory), with the expectation that he'd be played in the Semi. Arrogance much?
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@mariner4life said in Five Greatest ABs of the past 50 years:
@Crucial being in the right place at the right time to take the last pass, no matter what part of the field, is a massively underrated outside back skill. Dougie was the fucking master.
The Dougster was so good he got rested for the Quarter against France 2007. Remember - we played Sivi and Roks (from memory), with the expectation that he'd be played in the Semi. Arrogance much?
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@mariner4life said in Five Greatest ABs of the past 50 years:
@Crucial being in the right place at the right time to take the last pass, no matter what part of the field, is a massively underrated outside back skill. Dougie was the fucking master.
The Dougster was so good he got rested for the Quarter against France 2007. Remember - we played Sivi and Roks (from memory), with the expectation that he'd be played in the Semi. Arrogance much?
@nzzp said in Five Greatest ABs of the past 50 years:
Arrogance much?
If i am fair, i was looking ahead to the semi final as well.
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@antipodean said in Five Greatest ABs of the past 50 years:
@mariner4life said in Five Greatest ABs of the past 50 years:
Lomu was rugby's first global super star. Surely in.
First global superstar, certainly. Apart from 1995 RWC and 99 against France I'm not sure he did enough consistently to be among the top five. If only he hadn't had got sick.
Fitzy makes the list because there's been no better captain. And that's high praise considering the august nature of that club.
GOAT, obviously.
DC because there's been no more complete five-eighth.
I have to think harder about the remaining two.
Meads, obviously.
Lochore. Based on footage and reports. And if nothing else, leaving a note.
@antipodean Mead was a tough bastard. Loved the game, loved the niggle, loved the beers afterwards but Lochore was more of a legend for me.
Not the greatest #8 we have ever had, but his contribution to NZ Rugby as player, Captain, Coach, Selector, Manager, Mentor is probably unparalleled. Reckon he would have adapted to the modern game more successfuly than Meads.
Says a lot about the man that as a relatively raw player, Fred Allen chose him ahead of established AB's who had years of provincial captaincy and were very strong characters in their own rights. Guys like Meads and Tremaine. Yet they were totally on board with the decision and idolised the guy. Very likely our greatest captain ever. Certainly the bedst I have seen. Perfect foil for the Needles coaching. Together they revolutionised the game and ushered in one of our golden eras.
McCaw, Carter, Jonah, Fitzy, BJ. Fitzy the one I have most doubts over now.
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@antipodean Mead was a tough bastard. Loved the game, loved the niggle, loved the beers afterwards but Lochore was more of a legend for me.
Not the greatest #8 we have ever had, but his contribution to NZ Rugby as player, Captain, Coach, Selector, Manager, Mentor is probably unparalleled. Reckon he would have adapted to the modern game more successfuly than Meads.
Says a lot about the man that as a relatively raw player, Fred Allen chose him ahead of established AB's who had years of provincial captaincy and were very strong characters in their own rights. Guys like Meads and Tremaine. Yet they were totally on board with the decision and idolised the guy. Very likely our greatest captain ever. Certainly the bedst I have seen. Perfect foil for the Needles coaching. Together they revolutionised the game and ushered in one of our golden eras.
McCaw, Carter, Jonah, Fitzy, BJ. Fitzy the one I have most doubts over now.
@dogmeat I'm looking forward to being an old bastard and talking to young fullas about watching Jonah, Cully etc
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with all the talk of Jonah in here, I couldnt see any mention on a quick scan of posts...5 years ago today.
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If Michael Jones ain't in the top 5 I'm going to burn this fucken place down!!!
It's only longevity and leadership that makes it a contest with McCaw
For the young and impressionable, the iceman changed the way a 7 can be. He can't be discarded with bright and shiny Smiths or Retallicks
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If Michael Jones ain't in the top 5 I'm going to burn this fucken place down!!!
It's only longevity and leadership that makes it a contest with McCaw
For the young and impressionable, the iceman changed the way a 7 can be. He can't be discarded with bright and shiny Smiths or Retallicks
@Siam said in Five Greatest ABs of the past 50 years:
If Michael Jones ain't in the top 5 I'm going to burn this fucken place down!!!
It's only longevity and leadership that makes it a contest with McCaw
For the young and impressionable, the iceman changed the way a 7 can be. He can't be discarded with bright and shiny Smiths or Retallicks
@Nepia is currently jerking it to this post
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@Crucial said in Five Greatest ABs of the past 50 years:
@hydro11 said in Five Greatest ABs of the past 50 years:
@Crucial said in Five Greatest ABs of the past 50 years:
The forgotten man of these conversations is Dougie Howlett.
Not saying he would end up in my selection but certainly worth a mention as the record try scorer in black. Considering that players like Cully, Rok, Wilson, Bender and Lomu are below him on the table and even BB after way more tests is going to be stretching to catch him I just find it interesting that his name doesn’t get mentionedHonestly, I would take Rococoko ahead of Howlett. Savea had a better strike rate than Howlett but he isn't in the conversation.
He wouldn’t be in my top five ABs just find it interesting that our record try scorer gets pretty much ignored even when people widen their lists
I think it’s probably cos people realise scoring tries isn’t everything. Shit, even Caleb Ralph got nine of them at test level.
@MN5 said in Five Greatest ABs of the past 50 years:
@Crucial said in Five Greatest ABs of the past 50 years:
@hydro11 said in Five Greatest ABs of the past 50 years:
@Crucial said in Five Greatest ABs of the past 50 years:
The forgotten man of these conversations is Dougie Howlett.
Not saying he would end up in my selection but certainly worth a mention as the record try scorer in black. Considering that players like Cully, Rok, Wilson, Bender and Lomu are below him on the table and even BB after way more tests is going to be stretching to catch him I just find it interesting that his name doesn’t get mentionedHonestly, I would take Rococoko ahead of Howlett. Savea had a better strike rate than Howlett but he isn't in the conversation.
He wouldn’t be in my top five ABs just find it interesting that our record try scorer gets pretty much ignored even when people widen their lists
I think it’s probably cos people realise scoring tries isn’t everything. Shit, even Caleb Ralph got nine of them at test level.
And Mark Ellis got like 6 in one game.
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@Siam said in Five Greatest ABs of the past 50 years:
If Michael Jones ain't in the top 5 I'm going to burn this fucken place down!!!
It's only longevity and leadership that makes it a contest with McCaw
For the young and impressionable, the iceman changed the way a 7 can be. He can't be discarded with bright and shiny Smiths or Retallicks
@Nepia is currently jerking it to this post
@mariner4life said in Five Greatest ABs of the past 50 years:
@Siam said in Five Greatest ABs of the past 50 years:
If Michael Jones ain't in the top 5 I'm going to burn this fucken place down!!!
It's only longevity and leadership that makes it a contest with McCaw
For the young and impressionable, the iceman changed the way a 7 can be. He can't be discarded with bright and shiny Smiths or Retallicks
@Nepia is currently jerking it to this post
I've already eaten the biscuit
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The call for no Jonah is extraordinary. The bloke changed the game. Would be the left wing in nearly everybody world wide's All Time XV. Was our stand out player at two world cups. Did shit no one had ever done before, or really has done since.
Every big winger is "the next Jonah". The guy is a phenom. Definitely in.
As for my "not sure about Carter" thing. I guess i was clouded by 2007, and 2011. And a sabbatical. But the guy was a freak. And he looked like that too. So not fair.
The one that kills me is Jeff Wilson is my favourite player ever and i am not even considering him.
@mariner4life said in Five Greatest ABs of the past 50 years:
The one that kills me is Jeff Wilson is my favourite player ever and i am not even considering him.
I think there are a lot of wingers in the Goldie category when it comes to discussions like this.
If you look at selections so far it appears for outside backs there’s Lomu out on his own with most selecting him in their top 5.
Then there’s the next tier of Cullen, JK, who get a few mentions.
Then there’s a bunch of really good players that might make a top 10 list eg Goldie, Howlett, Rok, Umaga, Mils, Ozzy, Stu Wilson
Man we’ve had some quality.
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If Michael Jones ain't in the top 5 I'm going to burn this fucken place down!!!
It's only longevity and leadership that makes it a contest with McCaw
For the young and impressionable, the iceman changed the way a 7 can be. He can't be discarded with bright and shiny Smiths or Retallicks
@Siam MJ makes a great 6th man on my list
I know many will scoff but for me it was a line ball call between MJ and Zinzan.
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@Siam MJ makes a great 6th man on my list
I know many will scoff but for me it was a line ball call between MJ and Zinzan.
@ACT-Crusader said in Five Greatest ABs of the past 50 years:
@Siam MJ makes a great 6th man on my list
I know many will scoff but for me it was a line ball call between MJ and Zinzan.
To paraphrase McConaughy in A Time To Kill - just imagine him in red and black jersey.
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@Siam MJ makes a great 6th man on my list
I know many will scoff but for me it was a line ball call between MJ and Zinzan.
@ACT-Crusader said in Five Greatest ABs of the past 50 years:
@Siam MJ makes a great 6th man on my list
I know many will scoff but for me it was a line ball call between MJ and Zinzan.
Zinny was the man.
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@ACT-Crusader said in Five Greatest ABs of the past 50 years:
@Siam MJ makes a great 6th man on my list
I know many will scoff but for me it was a line ball call between MJ and Zinzan.
Zinny was the man.
@mariner4life said in Five Greatest ABs of the past 50 years:
@ACT-Crusader said in Five Greatest ABs of the past 50 years:
@Siam MJ makes a great 6th man on my list
I know many will scoff but for me it was a line ball call between MJ and Zinzan.
Zinny was the man.
Zinny and JK are in my middle 5 along with Kaino, BBBR and whoever of Cullen or Fitzy missed out on the 5th spot.
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Maybe it was because of my age that Zinny’s freakish talent and skills for a number 8 had more of an impact on me than MJ’s game.
