Frizell assaults woman
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@dan54 said in All Blacks 2021:
I know it old fashioned etc, but I was under the impression until you actually found guilty you were presumed innocent, maybe that was just before internet forums etc
Correct, but he has accepted diversion which you would only do if you think you would be found guilty in a trial. If you think you're guilty, then you probably are!
@machpants So does he have a conviction against him now? I not sure how diversion etc works.
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@machpants So does he have a conviction against him now? I not sure how diversion etc works.
@dan54 Diversion is a scheme operated by the police that allows first-time offenders to take responsibility for their offending outside the court system and avoid getting a criminal record.
There is typically anger management, reparation payments etc involved instead.
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@machpants So does he have a conviction against him now? I not sure how diversion etc works.
@dan54 said in All Blacks 2021:
@machpants So does he have a conviction against him now? I not sure how diversion etc works.
Nope, that's the point. Stops one fuck up giving you a record, like being drunk and pissing on a police car, as mentioned up thread.
What is diversion?
Diversion is a scheme operated by the police that allows first-time offenders to take responsibility for their offending outside the court system and avoid getting a criminal record. The purpose is to prevent you re-offending and to help you understand your own past behaviour and choices and the impact this had on the victim of your offending.
It is targeted at reparation for the victim and rehabilitation for you. Your rehabilitation conditions might include things like going to an alcohol and drug programme or a violence-prevention course.
If you think you will get off the charge you wouldn't take diversion, or publicly apologised for the harm you've caused, like frizzle did
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@dan54 said in All Blacks 2021:
@machpants So does he have a conviction against him now? I not sure how diversion etc works.
Nope, that's the point. Stops one fuck up giving you a record, like being drunk and pissing on a police car, as mentioned up thread.
What is diversion?
Diversion is a scheme operated by the police that allows first-time offenders to take responsibility for their offending outside the court system and avoid getting a criminal record. The purpose is to prevent you re-offending and to help you understand your own past behaviour and choices and the impact this had on the victim of your offending.
It is targeted at reparation for the victim and rehabilitation for you. Your rehabilitation conditions might include things like going to an alcohol and drug programme or a violence-prevention course.
If you think you will get off the charge you wouldn't take diversion, or publicly apologised for the harm you've caused, like frizzle did
@machpants said in All Blacks 2021:
If you think you will get off the charge you wouldn't take diversion
That's simply not true.
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@nostrildamus said in All Blacks 2021:
@booboo I wonder from your question if
a. they (the posters you refer to) believe Foster has slapped him with a moist bus ticket or
b. you question whether Foster is actually in charge.. or
c. you don't think this is the remit of the coach...C. Discipline is an employment issue, to be handled by NZR.
Although you could argue that perhaps Foster could impose his own selection policy around "better people etc".
@booboo said in All Blacks 2021:
@nostrildamus said in All Blacks 2021:
@booboo I wonder from your question if
a. they (the posters you refer to) believe Foster has slapped him with a moist bus ticket or
b. you question whether Foster is actually in charge.. or
c. you don't think this is the remit of the coach...C. Discipline is an employment issue, to be handled by NZR.
Although you could argue that perhaps Foster could impose his own selection policy around "better people etc".
Ah I see. Thank you both. Well people wanted a hard-nosed, bruising 6..
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I know it old fashioned etc, but I was under the impression until you actually found guilty you were presumed innocent, maybe that was just before internet forums etc
@dan54 said in All Blacks 2021:
I know it old fashioned etc, but I was under the impression until you actually found guilty you were presumed innocent, maybe that was just before internet forums etc
So there was no Spanish Inquisition, witch trials, kangaroo court, plea bargaining, or being married to a certain King Henry, back in the old days? Good times!
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@dan54 said in All Blacks 2021:
@machpants So does he have a conviction against him now? I not sure how diversion etc works.
Nope, that's the point. Stops one fuck up giving you a record, like being drunk and pissing on a police car, as mentioned up thread.
What is diversion?
Diversion is a scheme operated by the police that allows first-time offenders to take responsibility for their offending outside the court system and avoid getting a criminal record. The purpose is to prevent you re-offending and to help you understand your own past behaviour and choices and the impact this had on the victim of your offending.
It is targeted at reparation for the victim and rehabilitation for you. Your rehabilitation conditions might include things like going to an alcohol and drug programme or a violence-prevention course.
If you think you will get off the charge you wouldn't take diversion, or publicly apologised for the harm you've caused, like frizzle did
@machpants said in All Blacks 2021:
@dan54 said in All Blacks 2021:
@machpants So does he have a conviction against him now? I not sure how diversion etc works.
Nope, that's the point. Stops one fuck up giving you a record, like being drunk and pissing on a police car, as mentioned up thread.
What is diversion?
Diversion is a scheme operated by the police that allows first-time offenders to take responsibility for their offending outside the court system and avoid getting a criminal record. The purpose is to prevent you re-offending and to help you understand your own past behaviour and choices and the impact this had on the victim of your offending.
It is targeted at reparation for the victim and rehabilitation for you. Your rehabilitation conditions might include things like going to an alcohol and drug programme or a violence-prevention course.
If you think you will get off the charge you wouldn't take diversion, or publicly apologised for the harm you've caused, like frizzle did..
So he'll have to play in the backs now?
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An All Black allegedly slapped a woman in a Dunedin bar then later punched her in the face leaving her with a split lip and a broken tooth.
The woman's mother told the Otago Daily Times last night the family was frustrated 27-year-old Highlanders loose forward Shannon Frizell had "walked away with nothing more than a slap on the hand".
"Her trauma has been disregarded and his full actions have been dismissed," she said.
"The man put fear into my girl and that's been the worse thing to see.""
While Frizell entered no pleas to the charges before the court, a defendant has to accept responsibility before police withdraw a charge under the diversion scheme..
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That herald article also had a brief summary of the victims version of events (via her mother)
The victim's mother, who spoke on condition of anonymity, said the pair had a mutual friend and were out socialising in the Octagon when the incident played out. She said a conversation arose that Frizell did not like, prompting the slap, "to shut [her] up". When the victim returned to confront the rugby player, the second assault occurred. Frizell later sent abusive messages to a third party on social media.A punch that resulted in dental work? I’m even more surprised by the NZR sanction now. Given the small punishment I was assuming the assault was a push or something else relatively insignificant
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That herald article also had a brief summary of the victims version of events (via her mother)
The victim's mother, who spoke on condition of anonymity, said the pair had a mutual friend and were out socialising in the Octagon when the incident played out. She said a conversation arose that Frizell did not like, prompting the slap, "to shut [her] up". When the victim returned to confront the rugby player, the second assault occurred. Frizell later sent abusive messages to a third party on social media.A punch that resulted in dental work? I’m even more surprised by the NZR sanction now. Given the small punishment I was assuming the assault was a push or something else relatively insignificant
@duluth said in All Blacks 2021:
That herald article also had a brief summary of the victims version of events (via her mother)
The victim's mother, who spoke on condition of anonymity, said the pair had a mutual friend and were out socialising in the Octagon when the incident played out. She said a conversation arose that Frizell did not like, prompting the slap, "to shut [her] up". When the victim returned to confront the rugby player, the second assault occurred. Frizell later sent abusive messages to a third party on social media.A punch that resulted in dental work? I’m even more surprised by the NZR sanction now. Given the small punishment I was assuming the assault was a push or something else relatively insignificant
So much for Henry's "Better men make better All Blacks" ethos.
Two match ban for that sort of assault is pathetic.
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@duluth said in All Blacks 2021:
That herald article also had a brief summary of the victims version of events (via her mother)
The victim's mother, who spoke on condition of anonymity, said the pair had a mutual friend and were out socialising in the Octagon when the incident played out. She said a conversation arose that Frizell did not like, prompting the slap, "to shut [her] up". When the victim returned to confront the rugby player, the second assault occurred. Frizell later sent abusive messages to a third party on social media.A punch that resulted in dental work? I’m even more surprised by the NZR sanction now. Given the small punishment I was assuming the assault was a push or something else relatively insignificant
So much for Henry's "Better men make better All Blacks" ethos.
Two match ban for that sort of assault is pathetic.
@kirwan and one of them an already served highlanders game...im a bit embarrassed
lets not underplay the messages after either
After an All Black allegedly slapped and punched a woman in the face in a Dunedin bar he sent threatening messages to a third party saying "f... you b.... tell your friend to hide"this is supposedly when he had had a chance to cool off
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That herald article also had a brief summary of the victims version of events (via her mother)
The victim's mother, who spoke on condition of anonymity, said the pair had a mutual friend and were out socialising in the Octagon when the incident played out. She said a conversation arose that Frizell did not like, prompting the slap, "to shut [her] up". When the victim returned to confront the rugby player, the second assault occurred. Frizell later sent abusive messages to a third party on social media.A punch that resulted in dental work? I’m even more surprised by the NZR sanction now. Given the small punishment I was assuming the assault was a push or something else relatively insignificant
@duluth said in All Blacks 2021:
That herald article also had a brief summary of the victims version of events (via her mother)
The victim's mother, who spoke on condition of anonymity, said the pair had a mutual friend and were out socialising in the Octagon when the incident played out. She said a conversation arose that Frizell did not like, prompting the slap, "to shut [her] up". When the victim returned to confront the rugby player, the second assault occurred. Frizell later sent abusive messages to a third party on social media.A punch that resulted in dental work? I’m even more surprised by the NZR sanction now. Given the small punishment I was assuming the assault was a push or something else relatively insignificant
If what the woman's mother is claiming is true, then Frizell should never play for the ABs again.
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@kirwan and one of them an already served highlanders game...im a bit embarrassed
lets not underplay the messages after either
After an All Black allegedly slapped and punched a woman in the face in a Dunedin bar he sent threatening messages to a third party saying "f... you b.... tell your friend to hide"this is supposedly when he had had a chance to cool off
@kiwiwomble said in All Blacks 2021:
@kirwan and one of them an already served highlanders game...im a bit embarrassed
lets not underplay the messages after either
After an All Black allegedly slapped and punched a woman in the face in a Dunedin bar he sent threatening messages to a third party saying "f... you b.... tell your friend to hide"this is supposedly when he had had a chance to cool off
Yeah, good point
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@duluth said in All Blacks 2021:
That herald article also had a brief summary of the victims version of events (via her mother)
The victim's mother, who spoke on condition of anonymity, said the pair had a mutual friend and were out socialising in the Octagon when the incident played out. She said a conversation arose that Frizell did not like, prompting the slap, "to shut [her] up". When the victim returned to confront the rugby player, the second assault occurred. Frizell later sent abusive messages to a third party on social media.A punch that resulted in dental work? I’m even more surprised by the NZR sanction now. Given the small punishment I was assuming the assault was a push or something else relatively insignificant
If what the woman's mother is claiming is true, then Frizell should never play for the ABs again.
@akan004 definitely, although I guess it can be tempered with the fact there will be some people out there seeing an AB as a payday (not saying it was exaggerated, but it could be for that reason)
Seems a few too many of these incidents happening.
How stupid are these guys to send anything threatening via thier phones?
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Sounds like two different versions of events based off of what the Highlanders CEO said when Frizell was dropped for the Highlanders game
Clark said the Highlanders had completed their own investigation into the incident and had left the issue with police. He added he would be "surprised" if police laid charges on Frizell. "That is just based on what I know. So it is a personal opinion," he said. -
Wasn't the whole better people make better All Black's (i.e. no dickheads) a policy (maybe instigated by Henry) that was picked up the player leadership group? I'm not absolving Foster and let's face it, Robertson wouldn't do any different, but doesn't this point to the AB leadership group letting the team and public down (if true)?
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What sanction do you get for a punching a player in the face with sufficient force to break a tooth? A year? Not one week ...
@tim said in All Blacks 2021:
What sanction do you get for a punching a player in the face with sufficient force to break a tooth? A year? Not one week ...
depends if its Ardie and if he's wearing his mouthguard
